Talk:Si Tjonat

GA Review

This review is transcluded from Talk:Si Tjonat/GA1. The edit link for this section can be used to add comments to the review.

Reviewer: Dwaipayanc (talk · contribs) 18:37, 11 June 2013 (UTC)

• Can we de-pipelink indigenous in the lead, and use the word Native Indonesian?

• I can unlink it, but I am adverse to the term "native Indonesian" as there was no "Indonesia" at the time. — Crisco 1492 (talk) 18:42, 11 June 2013 (UTC)

• Should mention that it was a silent film in the lead.

• Done. — Crisco 1492 (talk) 18:42, 11 June 2013 (UTC)

• "... escapes to the colonial capital at Batavia ". Which colony? wikilink?

• Clarified. — Crisco 1492 (talk) 18:42, 11 June 2013 (UTC)

• One thing I have trouble understanding is the film being aimed at Chinese Indonesian? Were they culturally very distinct from Native Indonesian? Their language different? I mean how would one differentiate a film being aimed at Chinese versus native audience?--Dwaipayan (talk) 18:37, 11 June 2013 (UTC)
  • Not language differences, but cultural ones. How could the film's target be identified? By having Chinese actors, for one. By showing an ethnic Chinese overpowering a native, for two. The political and cultural stratification is covered at Chinese Indonesians. — Crisco 1492 (talk) 18:42, 11 June 2013 (UTC)
    • " an ethnic Chinese overpowering a native"-- who was the ethnic Chinese?--Dwaipayan (talk) 18:45, 11 June 2013 (UTC)
      • Thio Sing Sang. Clarified in text. — Crisco 1492 (talk) 18:47, 11 June 2013 (UTC)
        • Probably irrelevant to this discussion, I see that in Indonesia's 2000 census, 1.2 per cent were ethnically Chinese. Were they so much more at the film's time that a producer would aim them as the target audience?--Dwaipayan (talk) 18:51, 11 June 2013 (UTC)
          • Lower actually. This gives a total population in the Indies of 60.7 million for 1930, and this (cited) graph gives 582,000 ethnic Chinese. So not even 1%. The issue would have been more one of ethnicity and cultural alliances. — Crisco 1492 (talk) 18:58, 11 June 2013 (UTC)
            • Its interesting and intriguing. Targeting just one per cent of the population, and still hoping to profit! --Dwaipayan (talk) 19:07, 11 June 2013 (UTC)
              • The ethnic Chinese had a lot more capital than natives (this is in the new footnote). Note that the only domestic films which could turn a profit during the Depression were all Chinese-oriented (and directed by The Teng Chun). — Crisco 1492 (talk) 19:12, 11 June 2013 (UTC)
• " Jo Eng Sek left the industry... Returning with..." Perhaps clarify his role in his return film? Producer?
  • Yep, done. — Crisco 1492 (talk) 19:12, 11 June 2013 (UTC)
• " Neither Lie A., Tijip... made another film" perhaps " acted" would be a better verb, as they all seem to be actors?
  • Done. — Crisco 1492 (talk) 19:12, 11 June 2013 (UTC)
• Si Ronda, Si Pitoeng need release years.--Dwaipayan (talk) 19:07, 11 June 2013 (UTC)
  • Done. Pitoeng was given earlier. — Crisco 1492 (talk) 19:12, 11 June 2013 (UTC)
• Can we have a English name or translation of the name for the film?--Dwaipayan (talk) 23:55, 11 June 2013 (UTC)
  • It's the same. "Tjonat" is a name (so you can't translate that) and Si is an article used to indicate a person. — Crisco 1492 (talk) 23:57, 11 June 2013 (UTC)
    • Oh, ok.
• That explanatory note on Chinese and native people is excellent. Thanks for it.
• In my opinion, this article meets GA criteria.--Dwaipayan (talk) 00:07, 12 June 2013 (UTC)

PR

Just a few comments I didn't manage to get in before the PR closed. I've made a few tweaks here and there: feel free to revert anything you don't like.

Lead

• "He is captured after kidnapping an ethnic Chinese woman, defeated by her fiancé." A bit clumsy - could do with a re-working
  • Tried. — Crisco 1492 (talk) 09:40, 7 October 2013 (UTC)

Plot

• Tjonat stops supporting his wife and returning home" Ditto
  • Tried. — Crisco 1492 (talk) 09:40, 7 October 2013 (UTC)

Production

• Any chance of a wl or footnote to explain what a "lenong" performance is?
  • Traditional theatre. Will redlink. — Crisco 1492 (talk) 09:40, 7 October 2013 (UTC)
• Ditto for "peranakan"?
  • Linked in plot. — Crisco 1492 (talk) 09:40, 7 October 2013 (UTC)

Images

• Any chance of another images? this one? Or one with both - something with two Wongs would make it right.... (Sorry, couldn't resist the pun!)
  • Three Wongs to make it right, actually, but I haven't found an early enough publication date for that image. — Crisco 1492 (talk) 09:40, 7 October 2013 (UTC)

Cheers - SchroCat (talk) 19:28, 21 September 2013 (UTC)

Name of the film

I enjoy these Indonesian film articles as they are almost completely outside my scope of knowledge. But this one really frustrated me. Having reached para two I got that Tjonat is the central character's name, but never came to what the title meant. So I tried the article Tjerita Si Tjonat, which has a useful translation "The Story of Si Tjonat", so "Si" cannot mean "of", leaving my best guess as at least the loose equivalent of "Mr". But now, on this page, I find it's bit different. Also, there is no relevant explanation at Si. As this is en.wiki shouldn't that explanation be in a footnote from the film title in the Lead? Davidships (talk) 17:04, 13 July 2020 (UTC)