|This is the talk page for discussing improvements to the Tempeh article.
This is not a forum for general discussion of the article's subject.
|WikiProject Indonesia||(Rated B-class, Mid-importance)|
|WikiProject Food and drink||(Rated B-class, Mid-importance)|
The article says that tempeh is a good source of dietary fiber, however, I checked nutritiondata.com, and that indicated that there was NO dietary fiber. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 188.8.131.52 (talk) 16:39, 25 September 2008 (UTC)
Tempeh turns brown in a few days in the refrigerator. What is this? --Sobolewski 19:48, 13 Feb 2005 (UTC)
- I think that's the culture that caused it to turn from plain soybeans into tempeh in the first place - it's just continuing to grow. As far as I know, it's fine to eat the parts with the spots; never had any trouble. CDC (talk) 05:49, 14 Feb 2005 (UTC)
- It is either damp or fungus grow. If you fried them, it'll be okay. But since I'm in Indonesia, I wouldn't touch it, and buy a new one.
imagine if the soybean and fungus going from white, then brownish then greyish, then black. for photo, can't have it right now. i'm in bandung 06:47, 25 June 2007 (UTC)
It's microorganism/bacteria that grown over fungus that is slowly dead, causing slimy juices and bad odor. Store Tempeh you just buy directly/quickly to FREEZER to extend its lifetime much longer (1-2 months), from a shy 1-2 days in room temp (3-5 days in refrigz). Put fresh Tempeh into a strong flexible plastic bag after you cut it to desired sizes (in 1-2 cm cubical form, for example), tightly close it then store the plastic bag into freezer. After fully frozen, take the strong-flexible plastic bag out then hold+smash it to wall to break the 'ice-glued' frozen Tempeh cubes (and/or use your punch, etc to break it further), then store it back to freezer. Finished! You can use it anytime you want, by frying, simmering, or else. [-TaZeR-] — Preceding unsigned comment added by 184.108.40.206 (talk) 03:11, 18 November 2012 (UTC)
lethal dose to human of this bongkrek acid???. needed foto tempe bongkrek.Daimond 17:13, 1 October 2006 (UTC)
Tempe similar to Soy sauce making process
I think it is absurd to say "Tempeh is unique among major traditional soy-foods in that it is the only one that did not originate in China or Japan." There is no history trace about soybean in Indonesia. You can't say it is "unique" since the plant are not Indonesia origin.
In addition, the tempe fermentation process are similar to Soy sauce making process. Where the soybean are cooked and mixed with grains flour to promote microorganism growth during the fermentation process. Soy sauce are made from soaking fermented soybean into salt water. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 220.127.116.11 (talk) 11:41, 21 April 2010 (UTC)
Similarity does not mean they are the same. The type of fungus used to make soy sauce is also different. Soybean does not originate from indonesia but tempeh is a uniquely indonesian food. You seem a little confused. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 18.104.22.168 (talk) 16:47, 16 December 2010 (UTC)
Agree.. Tempeh (or tempe) is originated from Indonesia, but it's main ingredient, soybean (Glycine max sp.), is not originated from Indonesia. If the soybean plant were really originated from China and spread to its surrounding countries (Korea/Japan, etc) then to global via trade routes & colonializations, as the rice plant utilization for staple food and planting techniques spread across the country and its nearbies (Korea/Japan, including Indo-China region: Vietnam/Thai/Laos/etc), then it's possible that some (12th century or earlier) Chinese traders have made trade contacts to Indonesian natives and introduced the soybean in Indonesia and taught how to plant and use them as food (such as tofu-making, which is so old even most Indonesians thought it's their own local food like those Chinese noodles (Indo: mie, bihun [rice noodle]), Chinese meat-balls (Indo: bakso), Chinese eggrolls (Indo: lumpia), or dim-sum cakes (Indo: siomay), to mention some, until the cheap-access of internet-age show them the contrary. Many of these Chinese foods were adapted to local-taste and culture in the process, no wonder they didn't know the real origin of those foods). I think, some of the Chinese traders were settled down in a region of Indonesia and opens a Chinese restaurant or a food store and making+selling tofu, but some of the cooked/boiled soybeans were left on open air for long period by accident. Possibly, the air were contaminated with spores of the 'tempeh fungus' which is so many on Indonesia soil and settled down on the 'culture' base, which is the warm full-of-nutrition cooked soybeans. The person who's responsible for making tofu by sudden need to take a break (possibly taking a dump almost forever :D) and forgot to continue the tofu-making process and left it over for 1 night. The next day, he just found out that he forgot it and run to the soybeans he left yesterday and found out that it's already has white threads all over the soybeans. Normally, it's regarded as a process failure (spoilt beans) and should be thrown away, but the maker is so poor and instead of dumping it, he just packing it using tofu frame that is used for prssing bean curd 'dough' into tofu shape, and wrapped it with cloth just like tofu-making. He left it on the storage for a moment until he ready to cook it, and when he opened it, he found the soybeans+fungus pack have been turned into what we know now as 'tempeh form'. He tasted it, and seems palatable to him, even feels a bit 'earthy'-taste. He cooked it (either boiling/simmering it like tofu or frying/saute it like green beans, we don't know at this moment, including which is the 1st done) and seems edible and can be enjoyed like a normal food. On the next day, after he didn't feel sick by the 'tempeh' consuming, then he introduced the food to his friend/colleagues, and seemed they "[√] Like it!" (it's reaching over 1 trillion clicks on FB site alone! :D). Whether, 'he' is the native Indonesian labor/servant/cook trained by the Chinese boss or the Chinese person itself (they have been long known to be boss+servant in one, usually on middle-lower class in any jobs/occupations, be it merchant/trader/farmer/teacher/etc, esp. when no help is available at the moment - nowadays, by local/modern culture absorption effects we may see less of this 'weird' combo on them) is unknown. What we knew that from incomplete history of 'tempeh' the predicted-around 12th century kingdoms in Indonesia seems liked the new food introduced to them by 'him' (the word 'tempe' and 'kedelai' were mentioned in some old scripts). The lack of mentioned the 'inventor' of tempeh may be attributed to the lack of honoring for the lower class servants/people and settled-down foreigners when found something new to the mass in those nearly-illiterate 'old monarchial' days (usually only those important royal-blooded or respected by the kingdom ones got recorded), not mentioning to the non-standard simple archiving methods and archive storage techniques, that may lead some credible important documentations to 'tempe' may be lost in storage or in transfer process. But one thing is logical, not until someone (possibly Chinese traders by ships or land traders [Chinese or Indo-Chinese] via Thai-Vietnam regions) brought the edible soybeans to Indonesia land (Java island in particular), Indonesia wouldn't have its own unique food from soybeans called 'tempe' natively (or 'tempeh' in English). The Chinese traders seem reluctant to bring 'tempe' to China mainland, may be when they heard the process is similar to 'packing & baking spoilt soybeans' they thought it's a rejected food in China (original tofu-making needs fresh unspoilt soybeans), why would they bring it to China on the way back (later on, many years after, some japanese+korean people will love those spoilt soybeans 'rejected' products so much, even those smell foul, badly & slimy ones :D), may be that's why China never have 'tempe' food in their soybean-based food product list and its people almost never have heard of it in a correct way, other than the 'spoilt soybeans pack/bake from Indonesia', which is when processed correctly and consumed before really spoilt, will taste so fresh & good (if ever spoilt, i usually throw it to my alligators, they seems like it so much, thinking it's a rotten meat may be...). WCh1974 13:39, 13 September 2011 (UTC)
Amusing tale, young chap. Though, not all tempeh were made from soy, it just happens that tempeh kedelai (soy tempeh) is the most famous type. It's more plausible that the natives discovered how to make tempeh from other food materials, then applied the knowledge to make soybean tempeh when soybean became more common. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 22.214.171.124 (talk) 03:55, 25 May 2012 (UTC)
Amusing (false) claim w/o clear distinct proof as well.. It's more plausible the otherwise, since soybean is not easily plantable anywhere and quality is not similar for all plantation grounds (sometimes you have to import it if locally-produced soybean quality is not quite acceptable for making a good soybean tempeh and even often fail to make it for some reasons) and may be quite expensive to obtain it (either by growing/importing), people in an area that is scarce of soybean may apply the tempeh-making technique to anything they found quite easily and cheaper in the area. The Bongkrek-tempeh case is a good example where (poor) people doing trial-n-error with soybean replacement process (and using impure fungal culture, contaminated with other microorganisms) and found it out later that it's not safely edible (death after eating it is not uncommon) but either because of poverty or the special taste of 'Bongkrek' some people still making and eating it until today. So, to me, neither story of you two above are valid nor invalid, since no exact evidence have been found today. In essence, the fungal contamination to soybean (or other 'bean' base) and ended to tempeh product is not relevant to how poor (native?) or rich (immigrant/importer?) the people who 'accidentally created' it, since rich people can still get fungal contamination and learns/observes the event to recreate the 'fungal accident' in the same way to make tempeh. It's also still not known exactly by evidence found, either soybean or non-soybean tempeh is made first (you mentioned this 'to make tempeh from other food materials' statement right?) since popularity also can't dictate which one is earlier/later made. The Wright brothers tried to create airplane and finally succeed, this doesn't mean helicopter is made first before airplane (both uses air as travel medium, however helicopter design was 'invented' by Italian 'native' LdV u-know-who, long before working airplane design is invented - the chopper design is bad and wouldn't fly, so airplane design is the winner used in WW2 and later as main 'ground-shattering' force - the working chopper design was invented later after WW2 - now can u tell me which is one the first inventor of tempeh w/o qualified history data? I doubt u can, unless making another false propaganda in desperate move - not to mention your country, Malay, and Indon both have problem in culture-claiming issue, as long-time track-record history can tell us of claiming other country's cultures as its owned ones, including this one - the so-called 'native' people need the TV/media/internet to clear & correct the false claiming happening since many-2 centuries ago - take popular 'meatballs' case for example), since airplane gains popularity after it can flew in the air safely and can carry passangers, later then helicopter was made and can also flew in the air successfully. And please, don't call people 'young chap' so easily before you knew him/her very well - it's rude (the person you refer may be a lady with similar 'Harry-Potter's author story-making ability but with possible actual facts when found someday later, who knows?) - am I right, young Malay chap/lolita? — Preceding unsigned comment added by 126.96.36.199 (talk) 23:19, 23 October 2012 (UTC)
Agree with ya just right above me. The Indon locals, the local Tempeh makers especially, in many times on the TV news interviews have ADMITTED that the IMPORTED Soybeans are MUCH BETTER for producing GOOD tempeh (in both taste and texture), incl. today if you asked them (Indon Tempeh producers/makers) again - or "Indon/local-grown soybeans are SUCK! No good, no way!" in short. That's why soybeans are continuously imported from US, China and other countries, and subject to global market price as result - this causes so much commotions in Indonesia everytime the soybean global price is skyrocketting. This fact alone confirmed the origin of (good) soybean is not from Indonesia, as the original poster was trying to tell us. The tempeh making itself was from Indonesia (Java and Sumatra islands in particular plus nearbies, or Indon-Malay people in general) as the Tempeh fungus can be found in many Indon soils in particular, but it's unknown whether the good soybean from China arrived in Indonesia first then the Tempeh making process is started (including later the soybean-based Tempeh 'spin-offs' using other type of beans as replacement), or the other way (the popularity of Tempeh is started when good soybean is introduced by Chinese/Indo-China traders and someone trying to use it as replacement beans for the 'old suck yuck!' (and can be lethal/toxic for some cases :)) Tempeh and found it's damn tasty later). We need more accurate & verificable historical data for this case. The interesting fact came from the Indon/local Tempeh makers mouth itself (straight from the horse's mouth), stating that producing (soybean) Tempeh is not a guaranteed 99% success (failure is not uncommon, even more if it's taken carelessly in the process of Tempeh making) - meaning he can't ensure you that the procedure of making Tempeh, even done correctly, can end/finish in correct 'Tempeh' product/form as we knew in market. "Only God can tell, we just pray and hope it can formed succesfully as Tempeh on the next day" he said again. Is this another evidence that Tempeh forming/creation is engineered by accident (so the exact correct procedure to make Tempeh cannot be reproduced 99% close and guaranteed to 'original' or depends on the God bless and the Tempeh fungus 'mercy'), not purposely engineered/made by the Indon locals? Just as WCh1974 has mentioned in the 'nice' (hi)story. Still debatable indeed, but for me it's plausible too. Compare this to 'tofu' making procedure (that is a well-know food from China-origin, whose history backed by verified existing historical data to today) that can be guaranteed 99% success ended in 'correct' product when Tofu-making procedure were taken correctly, since it's not involving the Tempeh fungus (that can be found mostly in Indonesia soils in that 'local soybean-based Tempeh popularity' days), that possibly, accidentally 'infected' the strained boiled 'Tofu' soybeans left in open air for over 1 day/night - then its white hypha formed, packing the warm-wet soybeans to 'Tempeh' form, as told in WCh1974-engineered 'history'. I don't know, his (WCh1974) 'story' is making sense much better to me than other 'stories' - when based on the facts I found and I just shared here. (by "Indon local bypasser") — Preceding unsigned comment added by 188.8.131.52 (talk) 02:46, 18 November 2012 (UTC)
We're talking about the ORIGIN OF TEMPEH here, not the origin of soy bean. Here's a hard fact: There's no doubt tempeh originates from Indonesia, specifically Central Java, so why ramble about other stuff? All those stories are nice to hear but doesn't prove anything and doesn't hold any encyclopedic value does it? All the posters above did was speculate. And talk about "rude", you do realize Indonesians hate being called "Indon" so you should stop calling them that. If you're keen on reading more about the history of tempeh, here's a starter: http://www.soyinfocenter.com/HSS/tempeh1.php — Preceding unsigned comment added by 184.108.40.206 (talk) 18:58, 30 December 2012 (UTC)
That's true brother/sister. Highlight that! We're talking about the TEMPE origin, not the SOYBEAN. Okay soy sauce(fish sauce) comes from China but will you say that SWEET SOY SAUCE (kecap manis) is also from China? The process is introduced by Chinese but sweet soy sauce comes from Indonesia. Similar products are found in Japan, such as natto, but the difference is the use of the mould and the end result. Natto is sticky and smelly. Indonesia has been exposed to fermentation process for a long time and we have traditional fermented foods such as tape, peuyeum, kue mangkok, sweet soy sauce, arak, etc. The person who shouts Indon all the time must be a Malaysian jealous of Indonesian contribution to the world culture and culinary. Satay and rendang are of Indonesian origin, and so are gamelan and keris, which have shamefully been repackaged in Malaysia as Malaysian bla bla bla. Before you spread your jealousy it's better to promote your country's contribution to the world culinary, if any of course. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 220.127.116.11 (talk) 08:50, 17 April 2014 (UTC)
- Is there a reason (policy or something) that there are no recipe links on this page? I'd like to add some but don't want to step on anyone's feet. Bposert 00:21, 12 December 2006 (UTC)
- G'day Bposert, Wikipedia is not a recipe book. However, Wikibooks has a cookbook where recipes are welcome, and we can easily add a link to those recipes. Actually, I've been planning to expand the tempeh page there into a recipe for making tempeh - perhaps you can beat me to it! Feel free to also add recipes for using tempeh, as separate articles. Webaware 04:10, 12 December 2006 (UTC)
- Thanks! Bposert 23:59, 15 December 2006 (UTC)
Details of manufacture
Why does the article title have an additional "h" after "Tempe"? Correct Indonesian spelling for this word is "Tempe" without the "h". Since this is an Indonesian food, Indonesian spelling should be used, as used in the Indonesian version of wikipedia. 18.104.22.168 21:00, 25 July 2007 (UTC)
- I agree with this opinion, but it seems to me that nobody on this side of the wiki cares much for authenticity. 22.214.171.124 08:39, 12 August 2007 (UTC)
- I agree too, although I'm a Persian. But this type of bias is not unique to Tempe, all over wikipedia there is a clear Western bias, particularly on articles involving Asia and Mid-Asian articles. Kamasutra was an ancient Indian view of soul mates and love, out of all the lovely script, only 1 section talked slightly about sex, but now it has turned into a multi-million dollar sex scandal. Kamasutra has almost nothing to do with sex, but instead they choose the text's that emphasize on sex for translation. They don't bother citing Indian's on the subject, but cite dirty minded Israeli and American authors. Quiet opposite to Indian tradition, they wrote "Indian tradition includes following the "four main goals of life", known as the purusharthas: 1). Dharma: Virtuous living. 2). Artha: Material prosperity. 3). Kama: Aesthetic and erotic pleasure. 4). Moksha: Liberation." citing Hopkins. What the f*ck does hopkins know about Indian tradition. Any Indian will tell you the 4 written above are the opposite to Indian tradition. This Wikipedia is more like Westernperspectivepedia. They want to sexualize everything. I won't be suprised if they soon said Tempe helps you with erections. --126.96.36.199 20:43, 22 October 2007 (UTC)
- Hey guys. I care. Is this wording good enough for you? "Tempeh, or Tempe in the original Javanese, …" The thing is, Wikipedia is a Western initiative, and this is the English localisation, so surely you should expect some Western bias? If someone else can think of a better introduction, I'd like to see it (not that I think mine is the pinnacle of all intros, just being honest).--Rfsmit (talk) 23:21, 30 July 2008 (UTC)
- And on another note -- come on, the place to debate the Kamasutra article is on that article's talk page, surely? --Rfsmit (talk) 23:24, 30 July 2008 (UTC)
- I'm in favour for tempe (without "h"), shall we move the page to tempe? (Gunkarta (talk) 12:07, 10 August 2011 (UTC)).
- Well, I'm from Indonesia too but I have no problem with the English spelling as long as the article also cite the original spelling in Indonesia. This is purely/merely 'advertising' method to popularize this good tasty food to world globally, especially in English-speaking countries. Wikipedia has this topic in Indonesian already for Indonesian readers, so I don't see why are you 'tempeh'-spelling contras ever bother visiting this English site and provoking others (the spelling is correct for English-speaking countries, if 'h' is not appended, they would say something like 'temph' or 'tempee' instead of actual 'tempe' as pronounced in Indonesian, got it? - some sources even mention 'tem-pay' for correct pronounciation in English so it can get as close as Indonesian's pronounciation - it's a matter of phonetic similarity, not text). FYI, this 'tempeh' spelling has been already popular in many countries, such as Belgium, USA, etc. BTW, do you think you Indonesian people has been properly change/call dumbly a 'cell-phone' (original term for cellular-system-based handset) into the stupid 'handphone' (all phone systems we have until today [PSTN, Wireless or Cordless, Cellular] were handled by hand, mind you) and abbreviate it into ridiculous 'HP' where the old very popular IT company is still exist and operational globally today? And nothing done to correct this false call to the device in question? Do you ever think why the Indonesian phone sellers want ever to change the globally known 'cell-phone' device calling into a stupid mindless only-Indo-people-knew-it 'handphone/HP' for no reason? It's purely "Marketing" POS.... but the one done by mindless Indonesian phone sellers is a real pathetic since they've made seemingly irrevocable mess (no telco system reference anymore and local-known [by local market force] only) and more to a commercial popular IT company name with the real stupid abbreviation (a clear display of how less-IT-intelligible the Indonesian people is in overall - Ya never knew HP/Hewlett-Packard' name before using its own very popular initial for marketing? You must be kiddin' me..:D LOL). For those 'tempeh'-spelling contras, "Oh, Behave!".... (Austin Powers puns intended) Correct your own stupid issues 1st, then may be the world will hear your 'protests'... Can you explain to the global IT company in question (that also have a branch in Indonesia) that you're not intentionally hurting their image as global big IT company and preventing them to sell their own-brand cell-phone or similar device since you stupid Indonesian people have taken their brand for a mere generic device calling? Obviously they can't use this "HP baru dari HP" advertising statement since we may think the company has changed its operation mode or field to a new one under the same company name, instead of the intended original message. Luckily, not all Indonesian smart-people follow this stupid calling (some Indonesian smarts & nerds still insisting to use the correct widely/globally-known 'cellular-phone' or 'cell-phone' (or CP in short, even almost hurts nothing but not advised) term instead of the rubbish unclear meaningless non-descriptive 'handphone/HP' term)... Someone has made a joke about this stupid issue, IIRC, a dialogue on an HP service center: "Okay, the HP number is 0875xxxx1234", "Sir? I'm sorry... Is it the cell-phone or the printer serial number?" (normally asked when the digits & format used on both were almost similar, there's no need to ask if there's no stupid new similar clashing abbreviation like this one - it will be even worse if HP even release its own cell-phone series later, would ya call it "HP HP"? No, it's not a typo in this stupid case).. what a needless mess... Final remark: Just face it guys, if you changed theirs, why they can't change yours? Ooops.. I'm sorry... they just add 'h' and still can be traced the original name/call by removing the 'h' suffix... but 'handphone/hp'? I can't trace it back to original name w/o searching on Wikipedia... xome1 11:35, 27 March 2012 (UTC)
- The external link to the FAQ was broken that is why I substituted them for some working links. Someone undid my changes!
On the subject of B12 bioavailability in tempeh: Sorry, I'm taking the "wiki" part of "Wikipedia" literally, and don't have time to learn how to make a full citation (though I'd welcome a tutorial, if anyone can point me there). So, here's a couple of references for someone more familiar with this process to get started with: Liem IT, Steinkraus KH, Cronk TC: Production of vitamin B-12 in tempeh, a fermented soybean food Appl Environ Microbiol 1977 Dec; 34(6):773-6.; Vitamin B12 Activity in Miso and Tempeh Delores D. Truesdell, Nancy R. Green, Phyllis B. Acosta Journal of Food Science Vol.52 No.2 pp.493-494, 1987; FAQ at Tempeh Shop Gainsville ("Does tempeh have B-12?"). Thanks to whoever get around to including these. --Rfsmit (talk) 20:11, 30 July 2008 (UTC)
- Alright, I learnt how to do it. It wasn't as hard as I thought. I've added the papers which support the presence of bioavailable B12, but I don't believe the guy who runs the Gainsville shop can be cited as an accurate reference for the dispute. Over to someone with l33ter Googling skillz...--Rfsmit (talk) 23:16, 30 July 2008 (UTC)
- I believe the mention that tempeh has any active B12 vitamin should be removed, as this can lead people astray into thinking it is true. Tempeh has never been properly tested for the golden test of lowering methyl-malonic acid in blood serum, so until it has been proved otherwise, there is no evidence to suggest that tempeh has any presence of active, bio-available cobalamins. Traditional tempeh as found in Indonesia can have significant amounts of inactive (and perhaps active) analog forms of B12, but this is due to occasional, erratic contamination of analog-producing bacteria (such as Klebsiella pneumoniae). Usually speaking, in Western countries where hygiene standards are often more severe, the same doesn't seem to occur. For more information and sources, please visit http://www.veganhealth.org/b12/plant Cheekychico (talk) 01:05, 18 December 2008 (UTC)Cheekychico
I just added three new sources in response to some "citation needed" tags in the lede. All are viewable in Google Books, and The Book of Tempeh in particular might be worth checking out if anyone's looking for references. - Fullobeans (talk) 19:26, 6 May 2011 (UTC)
The following sentence does not clearly explain what is perhaps intended: In Indonesia, ripe tempeh (two or more days old) is considered a delicacy. Perhaps it is intended to read: Tempeh is usually ready to be eaten after two days. It is considered a delicacy in Indonesia. Does anyone else have suggestions on how this can be corrected? Singkatan (talk) 15:09, 3 October 2012 (UTC)
Toxicity and safe storage
I knew nothing about tempeh until 60 minutes ago, when, curious, I brought home a US commercial package. I had some reasonable idea of how to use it, reading the back of the package.
The product I have, from an upscale market, is Turtle Island Foods "Home-style Tempeh, Spicy Veggie", made with organic soy beans. It's vegan. Is this some sort of fashionable knock-off of a traditional Asian food?
After reading the Wikipedia article, I am utterly confused, most especially about what kind of tempeh is safe to eat, and when. I almost threw my purchase away, to be frank, since it isn't especially fresh. The article lumps together what are obviously several kinds of food with similar names. Some are apparently quote "always highly toxic"??!!! Also the article and talk comments differ considerably about when an otherwise edible tempeh has gone bad.
Types of tempeh
I believed that tempeh only refer to method of preparations, and not exclusive to soybeans. There are other type of bean to produce tempeh as per in Tempeh Books (if there such a thing.) History of Soybeans and Soyfoods in Australia, New Zealand and Oceania (1770 ... Yosri (talk) 02:09, 29 June 2013 (UTC)
In the section Types, I think it is better to separate methods of preparation (goreng, bacem, mendoan, etc.) from types of tempeh (gembus, bongkrèk, bosok, etc.). or better yet, put them under different subsection. (i've never cooked tempeh before, maybe i'll start doing this after i have some resources/recipes.) Sawi-jagung (talk) 08:53, 29 March 2014 (UTC)