Template:Did you know nominations/Valls Cabinet
- The following is an archived discussion of the DYK nomination of the article below. Please do not modify this page. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as this nomination's talk page, the article's talk page or Wikipedia talk:Did you know), unless there is consensus to re-open the discussion at this page. No further edits should be made to this page.
The result was: promoted by Cas Liber (talk · contribs) 14:25, 14 May 2014 (UTC)
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Valls Cabinet
[edit]- ... that the Valls Cabinet is the first French cabinet with a foreign-born prime minister?
Created by Iselilja (talk). Self nominated at 21:52, 7 April 2014 (UTC).
There appears to be a conflict between the hook and the article. The article says "Valls is the first immigrant French prime minister after 1790", but not being versed in French history, I have no idea if that means "first ever", or if there were cabinets of some form before the French Revolution that did have foreign-born prime ministers. Iselilja, could you clarify this for me? Sven Manguard Wha? 20:16, 13 April 2014 (UTC)
- Right. I see there are multiple problems with the hook. My source said "first prime minister born abroad"; someone else has added 1790 without giving a source (and changed wording to "first immigrant". However, it turns out my first source wasn't fully correct in asserting Valls was the first foreign born prime minister. The title prime minister was introduced in 1958; so before that the head of government had other names, but they may be referred to as prime ministers in English sources. At least one of them was not born as a French citizen: Robert Schuman (German, due to Lorraine being German area when he grew up). Even after 1958, two other prime ministers have been born abroad, but with French parents so they were French citizens at birth. So, either I have to narrow the hook, to saying something like "first prime minister in the fifth republic who was not born a French citizen" or find another hook. I'll think a little about it; it may not be so easy to find something that is catchy. (And I'll adjust the article of course). Regards, Iselilja (talk) 20:51, 13 April 2014 (UTC)
- I don't think we should be focusing on whether or not someone was born a broad -- I think we should respect how the person wants to be known now. We don't want a rehash of the Chelsea Manning thing. EEng (talk) 01:47, 20 April 2014 (UTC)
- So no one thinks I've lost my mind, I point out that when I wrote the above comment the hook read that this person was born abroad. Get it? born abroad ... born a broad? ... Tough crowd, I guess. (It's really not a good idea to change stuff once something's been posted in reference to it -- even if that posting was in jest.) EEng (talk) 21:21, 11 May 2014 (UTC)
Date, length, hook checks out. The hook, ALT1-ified per Iselilja's comment above, ... that the Valls Cabinet is the first government in the French Fifth Republic with a Prime Minister not born a French citizen? , works fine. In Europe this isn't as controversial as in the US, so I don't think there is a BLP concern here. No-one who deny Valls his rights as a citizen depending on his lieu of birth, that is contrary to the logic of citizenship. --Soman (talk) 19:57, 11 May 2014 (UTC)
- I don't think we should be focusing on whether or not someone was born a broad -- I think we should respect how the person wants to be known now. We don't want a rehash of the Chelsea Manning thing. EEng (talk) 01:47, 20 April 2014 (UTC)
