Wikipedia talk:WikiProject Visual arts

Should I create a Commons category "Domestic idyll" in Art by genre?

It seems to me that none of the existing categories included in Commons:Category:Art by genre include a common type of Victorian art of romanticized domestic life, such as these images Commons:Image:Nova Scotia scenery LCCN2002710682.jpg and Commons:File:Sabbath eve in winter LCCN2003654175.jpg (well, that one is a little odd). Although mainly from the Victorian period (and, I think, from the English-speaking world), this genre is still popular, with the work of Thomas Kinkade. Do you support adding this category? I was thinking of calling it "domestic idylls." Is there another term that is used in the art world? Downtowngal (talk) 20:38, 23 September 2021 (UTC)

Oddly, that is called "Genre painting". There is a Hierarchy of genres that you might want to look at. Vexations (talk) 22:01, 23 September 2021 (UTC)

I think there are tons of examples from other countries, but no generally recognised name for them, nor a very precise definition. But, frankly, on Commons, anything goes. Johnbod (talk) 02:11, 24 September 2021 (UTC)

Of course create it, already well thought out enough to form and especially if you feel the topic and want to conceptualize it. Randy Kryn (talk) 02:45, 24 September 2021 (UTC)

Thank you for the responses. Others on Wikipedia have been firm that I should not create a category on my own (as this is original research). I have read Genre art and looked at Commons:Category:Genre_art There is no real category in for romanticized images of the 'white picket fence' house, often with children, alone in the landscape or serving as 'a refuge in the storm.' Now I think the term 'domestic' is too broad. Maybe "Home idyll"? I will create if no opposition.Downtowngal (talk) 15:22, 29 September 2021 (UTC)

Help with improving artist's Wikipedia page

Hello Wikipedia editors. I work with Monique Péan and am here on Wikipedia on her behalf. I have an open request where I've offered some improvements to the Wikipedia page about her, as it is currently missing a lot about Péan's work as an artist. The page also seems to use some sources that don't look ideal. One editor has reviewed the proposed changes and said that it looks good, and I am now looking for others to give feedback and make the edits.

As I have a conflict of interest, I am mindful of following the guidelines and not making changes to the page myself, so I have put everything together in a draft version and made a request on the Talk page. I'd be very appreciative if anyone here can help! KM for Monique Péan (talk) 13:53, 29 September 2021 (UTC)

Hello again. I'm still looking for editors as another set of eyes to look over my draft. Looking above, User:Johnbod, User:Vexations and User:Randy Kryn: you all appear to be very active in this space, is this something you'd be willing to help with? KM for Monique Péan (talk) 17:43, 6 October 2021 (UTC)

I'm going to decline. An essay that largely aligns with my views on assisting paid editors is Wikipedia:Buy one, get one free. Vexations (talk) 17:56, 6 October 2021 (UTC)

And I went the other way and copied your draft to the page, seem okay on this and a previous read but will go over it again soon to spot editorial language. You seem adept at encyclopedic form and writing, hopefully you will edit more on nonpaid pages (although you may be a long time editor, haven't looked at your contribution or even user page as yet. trusting.) Randy Kryn (talk) 18:05, 6 October 2021 (UTC)

p.s. see you've only done COI thing so far. Nice work, this Monique woman hired well. Randy Kryn (talk) 18:18, 6 October 2021 (UTC)

I disagree. I have a hard time appreciating writing like "sustainable materials such as fossils" encyclopedic. Sustainable? Fossils? Like fossil fuels? Vexations (talk) 21:01, 6 October 2021 (UTC)

Not sure if Fashion / Style / Beauty, Purpose and Perspective, and Capitol File are appropriate or not? I don't feel strongly about removing. ---Another Believer _(Talk) 22:35, 6 October 2021 (UTC)

KM for Monique Péan, thanks for following COI rules and seeking editor help here. I hope you don't mind, I made a few mostly minor changes to the article. Happy editing! ---Another Believer _(Talk) 22:54, 6 October 2021 (UTC)

Hello @KM for Monique Péan:. A couple editors did some good work since the page was posted, and to them, thank you, sorry for just tossing it up there on the basis of trust, I actually thought it had checked out so I posted it without doing any legwork. My further apology to @Vexations:, who clearly didn't want to edit the page but ended up rolling up their sleeves and doing a full Wikipedian edit run which has improved the encyclopedic content of the article. I will study each edit of both editors to learn what should have been researched. Thanks to all of you. Now let's get this thing featured! (kidding...unless you all want to try it as a lark. Either way, what's been done so far should get the COI a raise or a Christmas bonus, a nice meteorite or something. It was pretty good writing within Wikipedia yard markers, especially if they've never written here before, hence my urging for them to pick a topic that they love and either write it from scratch or improve an existing page for free as a volunteer Wikipedian, which would be cool. One of us. One of us.). Randy Kryn (talk) 01:39, 7 October 2021 (UTC)

• I rarely work on living artists, so I'll duck out. Johnbod (talk) 00:18, 7 October 2021 (UTC)

Hello again, everyone. User:Randy Kryn, User:Vexations and User:Another Believer: thank you all for your thoughts and edits. I've left a note on the Monique Péan Talk page to reply to some of the concerns raised and hopefully help fix those issues: would you be able to take a look? As I explain there, I was very surprised the draft was added to the page so quickly and I'm more than happy to help on anything needed to fix anything. A couple of other things I wanted to ask: the autobiography tag on the page says that it "may need editing to conform to Wikipedia's neutral point of view policy", how can I help with that? As well, I saw that a photo is requested and I'm going to work on that. Would one of you be able to help add it once I get one uploaded? Again, I'm very appreciative of all this feedback. KM for Monique Péan (talk) 18:21, 20 October 2021 (UTC)

I don't mind adding an image once uploaded. ---Another Believer _(Talk) 18:25, 20 October 2021 (UTC)

Hah! Take the Money and Run

Take the Money and Run (artwork) ---Another Believer _(Talk) 15:14, 30 September 2021 (UTC)

Draft:Paint mixing

I have a draft underway on paint mixing which covers some aspects that don't seem to fit neatly into other articles (such as the use of paint shakers, which was my initial thought when starting the piece). Any help in getting it mainspace-ready would be appreciated. Cheers! BD2412 T 16:57, 30 September 2021 (UTC)

Requested move at Talk:Sheepherder (painting)#Requested move 27 September 2021

There is a requested move discussion at Talk:Sheepherder (painting)#Requested move 27 September 2021 that may be of interest to members of this WikiProject. ASUKITE 02:55, 6 October 2021 (UTC)

Artwork identification help needed

US National archives Commons mass import included a set of artwork images which have very little information, only "Department of Defense. European Command. Office of Military Government for Germany (U.S.). Property Division. Munich Central Collecting Point". The files have a date of 1977, but I suspect this is an archive date and the images are earlier, possibly from shortly after World War 2.

Is anyone able to identify these?

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   Half done High Family Expecting a Boat by Teniers
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   Half done High Family Expecting a Boat by Teniers
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   Half done High Family Expecting a Boat by Teniers
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   Half done High Family Expecting a Boat by Teniers
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   Half done High Family Expecting a Boat by Teniers
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   Done Relique holder head of St. Thecla, Basel, ca. 1300, gilt bronze
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   Done 4 cocoa cups / Meissen Horoldt? / c. 1725
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   Done 4 cocoa cups / Meissen Horoldt? / c. 1725
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   Done 4 cocoa cups / Meissen Horoldt? / c. 1725
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   Done 4 cocoa cups / Meissen Horoldt? / c. 1725
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   Done 4 cocoa cups / Meissen Horoldt? / c. 1725
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   Done 4 cocoa cups / Meissen Horoldt? / c. 1725
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   Done 4 cocoa cups / Meissen Horoldt? / c. 1725
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   Done 4 cocoa cups / Meissen Horoldt? / c. 1725
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   Done Victor-Jean Nicolle
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   Done Franz Stuck
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The set does include more images with reference numbers etc. but they do not mean anything to me. You can find them here. MKFI (talk) 12:59, 8 October 2021 (UTC)

A few of the images with reference numbers at Commons have additional handwritten inscriptions that are useful. The first five images above are identified as High Family Expecting a Boat by Teniers, a plausible attribution to either David Teniers the Elder or David Teniers the Younger. The 13th image is identified there as "Relique holder head of St. Thecla", Basel, ca. 1300, gilt bronze. The porcelain cups are identified as "4 cocoa cups / Meissen Horoldt? / c. 1725", which looks like a tentative attribution to Johann Gregor Herold. The fourth from last image above is signed Franz Stuck and looks like a pastel. Ewulp (talk) 00:20, 9 October 2021 (UTC)

@Ewulp: thank you for your help. I have updated the gallery descriptions and categorized the images. High Family Expecting a Boat by Teniers paintings have been categorized into c:Category:Teniers family until we can figure out which Tenniers is the painter. MKFI (talk) 06:52, 22 October 2021 (UTC)

• The ruins are (no doubt) by Victor-Jean Nicolle. I've added it to the 44 images Commons already has by this obscure artist. Frankly, these images are too low quality for the majority of uses. Personally, I'd just set up a category for them, & leave it at that. Johnbod (talk) 17:59, 22 October 2021 (UTC)

Francis Bacon infobox

Hi, I would like to invite feedback on the discussion currently taking place at Talk:Francis Bacon (artist) about the introduction of an infobox to the article. JBchrch talk 15:03, 20 October 2021 (UTC)

Abandoned Good article nomination

Is a project member interested in picking up the Good article nomination for Statue of Jefferson Davis (U.S. Capitol), which seems to have been abandoned? ---Another Believer _(Talk) 18:38, 22 October 2021 (UTC)

One of your project's articles has been selected for improvement!

Hello, Please note that Postmodernism, which is within this project's scope, has been selected as one of the Articles for improvement. The article is scheduled to appear on Wikipedia's Community portal in the "Articles for improvement" section for one week, beginning today. Everyone is encouraged to collaborate to improve the article. Thanks, and happy editing! Delivered by — MusikBot talk 00:05, 25 October 2021 (UTC) on behalf of the AFI team

Request for Comment on subcategories of Category:Paintings by collection

After multiple WP:CfD nominations produced contradictory results, I've set up a Request for Comment here to try and determine which naming convention should be used for the subcategories of Category:Paintings by collection. Should it be (A) Paintings in [a museum, etc.] or (B) Paintings in the collection of [a museum, etc.]? Resolution is sorely needed so that names elsewhere in the category tree can be cleaned up, so please contribute! Ham II (talk) 08:17, 1 November 2021 (UTC)

retardataire

A number of articles contain the word “retardataire”, which is rarely used – it is e.g. not listed in Merriam-Webster. Is there an article here best suited for them to link to, or should they just link to wikt:retardataire? Wiktionary currently makes no mention of a special meaning in art, but one external page, https://www.lexico.com/definition/retardataire, defines it specifically for art and has a sample sentence referring to art, which nicely illustrates that it is mostly used in a derogative sense, but can be used by some in a positive sense (as, BTW, has happened with other names in art history before): “a mature painter, he is frozen somewhere in the mainstream of the past, his work a quixotic attempt to make a virtue of being retardataire”. If there is no article to link to, should at least the Wiktionary entry be adapted to reflect that meaning? ◅ Sebastian 17:25, 2 November 2021 (UTC)

I'm not don't think there is an article that would make a good target for a link. The OED defines it as "A person who appears behind the times or who is resistant to innovation, a conservative; spec. an artist working in a style characteristic of an earlier period". I suppose we could just edit Wiktionary to improve that entry. Vexations (talk) 19:48, 2 November 2021 (UTC)

Help with draft page on Chris Dorosz

Hello, Visual Arts Project editors. I work with Canadian artist Chris Dororsz and am here on his behalf. I prepared a draft page about him, which I just submitted for review. We're both highly conscious of COI requirements and interested and I work with Canadian artist Chris Dororsz and am here on his behalf. I prepared a draft page about him, which I just submitted for review. We're both highly conscious of COI requirements and want to do things the correct way. Any help or guidance you can provide is welcome. — Preceding unsigned comment added by LO for Chris Dorosz (talk • contribs) 18:34, 2 November 2021 (UTC)

Do you mean you work with Canadian artist Chris Dororsz and am here on his behalf, and you prepared a draft page about him, which you just submitted for review, and you're both highly conscious of COI requirements? Randy Kryn (talk) 18:48, 2 November 2021 (UTC)

Well, there is nothing like making a great first impression. Thanks for bearing with me. LO for Chris Dorosz (talk) 21:23, 23 November 2021 (UTC)

This is probably about User:LO_for_Chris_Dorosz/sandbox. It could be a while before this is reviewed. My first impression is that you've tried refbombing as a strategy. A reviewer who is presented with 43 reference is going to think: "You want me to read all that?" instead of "Wow, forty-three references. Impressive! Let me skip all those and give it a quick pass." Now, as a rule, I always read ALL references, but I usually take a quick look at where they're all from before. Looking at your refs, I'd see artistaday.com, artnet.com,artnet.com, artprwire.wordpress.com, benswilliamson.wordpress.com, designboom.com, findingaids.library.dal.ca, gallerieswest.ca, hafny.org, hifructose.com, icasanjose.org, issuu.com, kqed.org, lca.sfsu.edu, magentafoundation.org, mission17.org, msvuart.ca, murielguepingallery.com, my.academyart.edu,nscad.ca, platformgallery.org, plugin.org, rbcinvestments.com, reg.gg.ca, rosl.org.uk, squarecylinder.com, srcart.com ,theatlantic.com, umanitoba.ca, vimeo.com, youtube.com and I'd think; "are any of these significant coverage in independent, reliable sources? The Atlantic perhaps? They're not really known for their art writing, but let's check them out." And then I'd see "This Content is made possible by our Sponsor; it is not written by and does not necessarily reflect the views of The Atlantic's editorial staff. See our Advertising Guidelines, or email advertising@theatlantic.com to learn more". It's going to be pretty hard to recover from that. In summary, this isn't going to impress anyone and you're better off with three really good sources. If they exist, of course. Vexations (talk) 20:27, 2 November 2021 (UTC)

Thank you for the outstanding feedback. I had the same concerns coming in and am happy to weed out what isn't appropriate. Ref overkill is kind of a default position for me. I almost omitted the Atlantic sponsored content, except it did produce some good exposure for him—but exposure isn't what this is about. If there is anything I can do, or info I can chase, please let me know. LO for Chris Dorosz (talk) 21:23, 23 November 2021 (UTC)

Requested move at Talk:George Vincent (painter)#Requested move 5 November 2021

There is a requested move discussion at Talk:George Vincent (painter)#Requested move 5 November 2021 that may be of interest to members of this WikiProject. SkyWarrior 01:43, 13 November 2021 (UTC)