Wikipedia talk:WikiProject Germany

German/Austrian station naming

There has been an issue raging for some time over the naming of German and Austrian central or main stations aka Hauptbahnhöfe. Essentially the debate is over whether we use the English name "Foo Central Station" or leave the article title in German i.e. Foo Hauptbahnhof. The truth is there are arguments both ways, but the debate has polarized opinion and is leading to inconsistency as we change titles based on our own perspectives. I will try to summarize the essentials in an objective a way as possible:

• Many English sources use Foo Hauptbahnhof alone
• Many English sources use Foo Hauptbahnhof and an English translation – either may be in brackets
• Many English sources use "Foo Central Station".
• Quite a number of English sources use "Foo Main Station", for certain stations this is even the most common name used.
• The national railways of Germany and Austria use "Foo Central Station" and Foo Hauptbahnhof (and sometimes both) in English publications and web pages
• Depending on which side of the debate editors lie, "Foo central station" and "Foo main station" may or may not be counted. Those "against" argue these are descriptive, those "for" argue they are proper names.
• Leading and specialist dictionaries recognise that Hauptbahnhof can mean "central station" or "main station". Some editors vehemently oppose the former term (see Talk:Central station).
• There is confusion because "central station" could mean geographically central to the city or operationally central to the railway network.
• In reality the most common name in English sources varies from station to station. It may be Foo Hauptbahnhof "Foo Central Station" or "Foo Main Station".
• For some stations there are few English sources.
• For others, especially the big stations, there are thousands of online English sources.
• There have been at least 4 heated discussions on talk pages to change names. Of these 3 have supported "Foo Central Station" (Nuremberg, Leipzig and Berlin I).
• Following the latest debate, Berlin Central Station was moved to Berlin Hauptbahnhof. There is a proposal to do a mass move back to Foo Hauptbahnhof, possibly following a short RM discussion based on the top few.
• Meanwhile sporadic moves continue.
• Current Wiki practice for ordinary stations is to translate Bahnhof Foo as "Foo station" or "Foo railway station"

I’m not aiming to spark yet another argument over the merits of the different names or to debate the above, which is only intended to indicate the complexities and the need to do some research before forming an opinion. I am really seeking views on the best way forward.

The whole subject is crying out for a proper review of English-language sources. I feel that is best led by WP:WikiProject Trains, with the support of WP:WikiProject Germany and WP:WikiProject Austria. It may also make sense to avoid wasting everyone’s time, that no more moves take place until this is sorted out. Ultimately I don’t mind which way this goes as long as it is based on sources not POV, that there is some consistency amongst articles and that article text recognizes all significant usage, both English and German usage. Bermicourt (talk) 19:52, 19 August 2013 (UTC)

Multi RM

As discussed by among others User:Wheeltapper and User:Bahnfrend at Talk:Central station, the multi-RM for 121 stations is at Talk:Kaiserslautern Central Station. In ictu oculi (talk) 05:15, 20 August 2013 (UTC)

Cornflower

"Cornflower" has been proposed to be renamed, see talk:Cornflower -- 76.65.128.222 (talk) 23:44, 21 August 2013 (UTC)

Dialects

The article German dialects has been tagged for lacking refs since last year. Seems a rather serious gap, unless it's better off merged into something else. — kwami (talk) 07:59, 26 August 2013 (UTC)

{{Countries bordering the Baltic Sea}}

Template:Countries bordering the Baltic Sea (edit | talk | history | links | watch | logs) has been nominated for deletion -- 76.65.128.222 (talk) 05:36, 27 August 2013 (UTC)

Help with an article?

Hey guys, I need some help with an article. The article in question is German Pellets, and as the name suggests it's a German company and most of the sources are in German. I can do a little with Google Translate, but the phrases are pretty advanced and come across a little jumbled with GT even more than usual. Can someone help look for sources and flesh out the article accordingly? I've found a few, one of which mentions a potential court case, but since I don't really understand the full extent of the article I'm hesitant to add any litigation, pending or otherwise. Thanks! Tokyogirl79 (｡◕‿◕｡) 09:50, 3 September 2013 (UTC)

• Also, there is a German language entry here to pull info from. Tokyogirl79 (｡◕‿◕｡) 09:52, 3 September 2013 (UTC)

Free Imperial City of Cologne

What's this all about? We have an article on Cologne, this seems to be a fork from that article although Cologne has no links to it, nor is there a link to it in Cologne. History of Cologne has a link but doesn't really discuss it. Dougweller (talk) 16:14, 3 September 2013 (UTC)

Concerning article on Baunach

The etymology of the name is slightly misleading: "The name Baunach comes from the Indo-Germanic word for river: bunahu". This suggests wrongly that the whole word "bunahu" means river. The following sentence tries to clarify that but sounds more like a contradiction, and it is not clear what the "This" refers to.

I would translate "bunahu" as "swelling river".

The section "Constituent communities" is even more confusing. It starts with the words "Baunach’s main town and namesake centre". However in the first line of the article Baunach is introduced as " a town". How can a town have a "main town"? This needs to be clarified.

Even more confusingly the name "Baunach" appears again among the "Gemarkungen" two paragraphs later. Is that the same Baunach as the town above?

It is important to differentiate between the administrative unit "Baunach", which consists of different districts, one of which has the character of a town, whereas others are just small villages, farms or even uninhabited.

80.226.24.8 (talk) 06:25, 4 September 2013 (UTC) Michael Mechthold-Jin

Just curious, is there an English expression for the German "Gemarkung"? For a relatively small unit of rural land, that is especially used in land registries ("Katasters") to document its usage (f.e. for taxation)? "District" seems to be used for larger areas - if "district" is OK, we could add a small description of the concept "Gemarkung" in the Germany section of the district-article. GermanJoe (talk) 07:26, 5 September 2013 (UTC)

Romain (legal dictionary) has "local subdistrict", as does Hamblock/Wessels. --Boson (talk) 12:02, 5 September 2013 (UTC)

Added a brief description to district. GermanJoe (talk) 12:25, 5 September 2013 (UTC)

"Gemarkung" and some guidance could be also added to Wikipedia:WikiProject Germany/Conventions. GermanJoe (talk) 07:32, 5 September 2013 (UTC)

"Subdistrict" is not far off IMHO. One of the problems with translating German municipal areas is that there is little consistency and the word "district" tends to get used as the default for pretty much everything including Kreis, Distrikt, Quartier, Bezirk, Amt, Stadtteil and now potentially Gemarkung. It is not helped by the fact that the EU guidelines are far from complete and, in any case, refer to Wikipedia! This project has a guideline on the translation of administrative units here which I have tweaked, but it needs further work to cover all bases in a way that is as accurate and logical as possible. Not an easy task, but I plan to give it a go one day. --Bermicourt (talk) 19:56, 5 September 2013 (UTC)

Ernst Litfaß - 32nd most popular article about Germany?

Any idea why? Seems like a very minor figure. Source: Wikipedia:WikiProject Germany/Popular pages. --_{Piotr Konieczny aka Prokonsul Piotrus| reply here} 06:29, 8 September 2013 (UTC)

Very odd. Views on English Wikipedia went up about 100-fold (on certain days) since February, and have been high since then. The only thing I can think of is that February was the 197th anniversary of his birth; perhaps someone has started working on something for his bicentenary. On the other hand, there seems to have been no equivalent rise on German Wikipedia. Perhaps Google is soon going to come out with an electronic advertising column that reacts to who is looking at it, and hordes of involved Google employees are researching the Litfaßsäule. --Boson (talk) 17:15, 8 September 2013 (UTC)

Merkel-Raute

As the topic has been picked up by non-German media, I thought it'd be a good idea to create that article. What's still missing is a photo of that giant billboard at Berlin Hauptbahnhof. As I won't be there during the next two weeks, I'm posting the matter here; maybe someone who reads this could take and upload one? What is more, I've suggested the article being featured as a DYK item on 22 September, the day of the federal election. The discussion can be found here. I'm aware that one might arrive at the conclusion that this is an attempt of campaigning, so your comments would be very much appreciated. Best regards.--FoxyOrange (talk) 16:08, 8 September 2013 (UTC)

Category:Dames of the Order of Saint Elizabeth

Category:Dames of the Order of Saint Elizabeth has been nominated for deletion -- 70.24.249.39 (talk) 11:06, 15 September 2013 (UTC)

Fauth.jpg

image:Fauth.jpg has been nominated for deletion -- 70.24.249.39 (talk) 11:22, 16 September 2013 (UTC)

Fabian-gerb.gif

image:Fabian-gerb.gif has been nominated for deletion -- 70.24.249.39 (talk) 04:40, 22 September 2013 (UTC)

Heinrich Vogeler 1872-1942-Mädchen mit Katze-1914-Haus im Schluh-Worpswede.jpg

image:Heinrich Vogeler 1872-1942-Mädchen mit Katze-1914-Haus im Schluh-Worpswede.jpg has been nominated for deletion -- 65.92.181.39 (talk) 03:01, 25 September 2013 (UTC)

Angela Merkel in popular culture

Hallo enWP, deWP has a now a large (but still contested) article about the topic, named de:Angela Merkel/Öffentliche Wahrnehmung und Inszenierung - ist about scientific background and examples of public insignia, from travelling pantsuit till Merkel-Raute. I assume it would be a nice endeavour to have it translated, but would prefer to have a feedback here. BR Serten (talk) 14:11, 25 September 2013 (UTC)

Wikipedia articles should follow WP:NOTNEWS, their topics should be of "enduring notability" with an encyclopedic, clearly defined scope. I doubt, that Merkel-Raute meets the requirements of this policy and agree with the arguments of the German deletion nomination. Also WP:RECENTISM is only an essay, but has some valuable guidance about such topics. We tend to take actual, current events far too important, instead of judging them in their historical context for an encyclopedic article. GermanJoe (talk) 14:57, 25 September 2013 (UTC)

GermanJoe, I agree completely with the deletion nominations for pressbased minor artikcles like Schlandkette, Merkelraute and the like.

Merkel in popular culture should however be based on the likes of

• Cracking the Highest Glass Ceiling: A Global Comparison of Women's Campaigns for Executive Office, von Rainbow Murray 2010
• The CDU and the Politics of Gender in Germany: Bringing Women to the Party, Sarah Elise Wiliarty, Cambridge University Press, Politik auf dem Boulevard?, a.a.O. 2009, S.96 ff
• Das Populäre Der Gesellschaft:Systemtheorie und Populärkultur Christian Huck, Carsten Zorn, Springer DE, 25.09.2007
• Die Politik der Öffentlichkeit - die Öffentlichkeit der Politik: politische Medialisierung in der Geschichte der Bundesrepublik, Bernd Weisbrod, Thomas Mergel, Wallstein Verlag, 2003
• A woman’s guide to celebrity politics, von Liesbet van Zoonen, University of Amsterdam, doi: 10.1177/1367549406066074 European Journal of Cultural Studies August 2006 vol. 9 no. 3 287-301 The personal, the political and the popular
• ‘Celebrity chav’: Fame, femininity and social class, von ‘Celebrity chav’: Fame, femininity and social class, von Imogen Tyler, doi: 10.1177/1367549410363203 European Journal of Cultural Studies August 2010 vol. 13 no. 3 375-393
• Merkel, Glawischnig und Marie Antoinette fashionable Queens"- Symposium der Unversität Wien 2009

and so on. Thats not the same league. Serten (talk) 17:11, 25 September 2013 (UTC)

Request for Comment regarding merger proposal

There is a request to merge East Germany jokes to German humour; with discussion taking place >>>here<<<. (Since September 2013.) Input welcome. GenQuest ^{"Talk to Me"} 20:32, 14 October 2013 (UTC)

Featured Article Review for Sanssouci

I have nominated Sanssouci for a featured article review here. Please join the discussion on whether this article meets featured article criteria. Articles are typically reviewed for two weeks. If substantial concerns are not addressed during the review period, the article will be moved to the Featured Article Removal Candidates list for a further period, where editors may declare "Keep" or "Delist" the article's featured status. The instructions for the review process are here.--_{Piotr Konieczny aka Prokonsul Piotrus| reply here} 07:15, 25 October 2013 (UTC)

New: Portal:Palatine Forest

I've just created a new portal for the Palatine Forest and intend to steadily add articles, many of which are still red links. Please feel free to help! Regards. --Bermicourt (talk) 13:12, 26 October 2013 (UTC)

B-class review request (Degenerate Art Exhibition)

Would anyone like to review this article and leave comments on its talk? I wonder how close it is to a GA. --_{Piotr Konieczny aka Prokonsul Piotrus| reply here} 02:07, 5 November 2013 (UTC)

Wikipedia talk:Articles for creation/Heinz Maria Lins

Dear Germany experts:

The above article will soon be deleted at Afc as a stale draft. It's a little short on references, and I guess only a German-speaking person could find them. Is this singer notable? —Anne Delong (talk) 15:04, 14 November 2013 (UTC)

A longer article appears at de:Heinz Maria Lins but is also devoid of substantial sources. Google searches (all languages, all countries) fails to produce anything significant. Kudpung กุดผึ้ง (talk) 00:12, 15 November 2013 (UTC)

Okay, I'll let it go then. Thanks. —Anne Delong (talk) 03:04, 15 November 2013 (UTC)

Stub for German politican Lothar Späth linked on Main Page needs expansion

The stub for Lothar Späth is linked on the Main page right now with the Picture of the Day. It could be easily expanded from the German or French versions ... Djembayz (talk) 03:49, 16 November 2013 (UTC)

Down with "Standard German"!

I have my reasons. See this move request. The Holy Four (talk) 11:22, 17 November 2013 (UTC)