Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Josh fight
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I'm nominating this article for deletion per WP:NOTNEWS. This is a single incident that fits in the category of transient "odd-but-true" entertainment-style "news" that has no encyclopedic or historical value. Yes, it has sufficient reliable sources and significant (recent) coverage. I can find as many reliable sources and significant coverage for an article on a dog rescued from the ice[1][2][3][4][5][6][7][8][9][10] which illustrates that just having reliable sources isn't sufficient for an encyclopedia article. WP:GNG says significant coverage in reliable sources creates an assumption, not a guarantee, that a subject merits its own article. A more in-depth discussion might conclude that the topic actually should not have a stand-alone article—perhaps because it violates what Wikipedia is not, particularly the rule that Wikipedia is not an indiscriminate collection of information
. I believe this article fits into what Wikipedia is not. Schazjmd (talk) 19:44, 25 April 2021 (UTC)
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- I believe this article DOES indeed fit, due to the nature of articles such as the Crichton Leprechaun, Storm Area 51 Raid, and other notable comedic events that took place in modern history, that received significant media coverage existing without contest on Wikipedia. ~~DaneLawlor~~ [1][2] ~~DaneLawlor~~ [3] — Preceding unsigned comment added by 173.3.221.107 (talk • contribs) — 173.3.221.107 (talk) has made few or no other edits outside this topic.
- I oppose deletion, as per what a few above have said, we have articles for the Area 51 raid, among others. Awesomelink234, the Super Cool Gamer (talk) 20:06, 25 April 2021 (UTC)
- See WP:OTHERSTUFFEXISTS.--v/r - TP 20:13, 25 April 2021 (UTC)
- Delete No lasting notability can be determined at this time. While it basically meets WP:GNG, yes, but all of the sources are within 2 days. This is a flash-in-the-pan. If it's still being talked about in a year, create an article then.--v/r - TP 20:13, 25 April 2021 (UTC)
- Delete per nom and TParis. If this doesn't fall off within a few months, then we can reconsider, but for now it seems a touch too soon. It's also very hard to take the article seriously with things like "Decisive Josh victory", a listing of belligerents ("1 Josh", "Hundreds of Joshes" etc), and the use of {{Infobox military conflict}} for a meme that was decidedly not a military conflict. PCN02WPS (talk | contribs) 20:32, 25 April 2021 (UTC)
- The ("1 Josh", "Hundreds of Joshes" etc) was newly–added vandalism. MainPeanut (talk) 20:37, 25 April 2021 (UTC)
- Fully agreed that the use of that infobox was unconstructive, and I've changed it back. I don't think it should be regarded as relevant to this AfD either way. Ganesha811 (talk) 20:39, 25 April 2021 (UTC)
- The ("1 Josh", "Hundreds of Joshes" etc) was newly–added vandalism. MainPeanut (talk) 20:37, 25 April 2021 (UTC)
- Keep as article creator. I agree that the article has grown too long, and it should definitely be trimmed back to a more reasonable length. But WP:EVENT states that an event shouldn't be considered less notable just because it is recent. I think the widespread (including national) coverage of this event in reliable sources shows that it clearly passes the WP:GNG, as mentioned above. Wikipedia's coverage of Internet culture has remained sparse even as it has grown in importance in mainstream society. I think a short, well-sourced article is appropriate. Ganesha811 (talk) 20:36, 25 April 2021 (UTC)
- I would also note that the higher-than-average potential for this article to be the subject of unconstructive editing and vandalism, while annoying, should not be held against its notability. I created it in good faith and other Wikipedians have contributed in that spirit as well. Ganesha811 (talk) 21:19, 25 April 2021 (UTC)
- Just so you know, Ganesha811, my nomination has nothing to do with the quality of the article or sources. I think you wrote a good neutral article. Schazjmd (talk) 21:27, 25 April 2021 (UTC)
- Schazjmd, totally understood, your nomination is very fair and grounded in policy. I think there's cause for legitimate disagreement, so I'm not fussed. Just don't want to see the article deleted for the wrong reasons. Ganesha811 (talk) 21:30, 25 April 2021 (UTC)
- Just so you know, Ganesha811, my nomination has nothing to do with the quality of the article or sources. I think you wrote a good neutral article. Schazjmd (talk) 21:27, 25 April 2021 (UTC)
- @Ganesha811: WP:EVENT also says, "However, it is also not an indiscriminate collection of information or a news service. Wikinews offers a place where editors can document current news events, but not every incident that gains media coverage will have or should have a Wikipedia article. A rule of thumb for creating a Wikipedia article is whether the event is of lasting, historical significance, and the scope of reporting (national or global reporting is preferred)."--v/r - TP 21:51, 25 April 2021 (UTC)
- I would also note that the higher-than-average potential for this article to be the subject of unconstructive editing and vandalism, while annoying, should not be held against its notability. I created it in good faith and other Wikipedians have contributed in that spirit as well. Ganesha811 (talk) 21:19, 25 April 2021 (UTC)
- Delete Yet another sporadic internet meme event with no lasting significance. Some expected "human interest" or "good news that a four-year-old had fun 'winning'" sort of coverage (mostly local) but no enduring encyclopedic notability or reason to provide details for a brief WP:NEWS event. Sources are largely churnalism with negligible original reporting in most, reusing the same images and quotes. Reywas92Talk 20:48, 25 April 2021 (UTC)
- Keep (for now) Perfectly fine to keep it as per WP:EVENT and falls within the other guidelines as other editors have pointed out. This holds greater signification and wider interest+foreknowledge for a larger amount of the global population than many of the other articles on this site whether it's an indictment on humanity or not. Would not be totally opposed to deletion after a period of time if it does not remain a sustained news story.—Plifal (talk) 21:03, 25 April 2021 (UTC)
- Keep Agree with those who argue that if Storm Area 51 gets an article, so should this one. While the bar for Internet meme coverage is very high on Wikipedia, this one has strong significance for Internet culture; Internet culture has become increasingly impactful. Andymii (talk) 21:55, 25 April 2021 (UTC)
- I heard Josh fight referenced and didn’t know what it was. I searched Google and came to this article which explained the reference, which was useful. I’d like the article to remain. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 73.190.153.83 (talk) 22:02, 25 April 2021 (UTC) — 73.190.153.83 (talk) has made few or no other edits outside this topic.
- (edit conflict) Keep per WP:NEVENT. I'd like to note that neither NOTNEWS nor OTHERSTUFFEXISTS apply here. NOTNEWS covers news-style reporting, not "don't write articles about recent events"; OTHERSTUFFEXISTS is...probably the single most subjectively interpretable essay, but quite decisively does not say "when people compare similar articles they're doing something wrong". Vaticidalprophet 22:38, 25 April 2021 (UTC)
- It does not pass the requirements set by NEVENT. There are no lasting effects (failing WP:LASTING), there is no impact over a wide geographic area (failing WP:GEOSCOPE), and the coverage has been in a burst rather than sustained coverage (failing WP:COVERAGE). --Joshua Issac (talk) 00:34, 26 April 2021 (UTC)
- Keep. Clearly passes GNG and substantially covered by major reliable media outlets, both local and on a wider scale such as ESPN. DrewieStewie (talk) 23:14, 25 April 2021 (UTC)
- Keep this event has gotten significant national and worldwide coverage, with outlets like Sky News (United Kingdom),[1] CNN,[2] CTV News (Canada),[3] WION (India)[4] and even an outlet called Mothership based in Singapore.[5] Out of the list of references from the dog being rescued from the ice, 5/10 of them are from Michigan (where the incident happened), 9/10 of them are from the United States, and the only reference that isn't from the United States is from neighboring Canada. I don't believe we can judge something on if it will be notable long–term right now. We should revisit this in 3 or 6 months. MainPeanut (talk) 23:31, 25 April 2021 (UTC)
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- Keep, for reasons that have been listed before in this discussion. Wizzito (talk) 23:35, 25 April 2021 (UTC)
- Keep, per the aforementioned reasons by others. This fight was reported by various news journalism sites, so much so that it would be improper to delete this page. ☞ Rim < Talk | Edits > 23:48, 25 April 2021 (UTC)
- Merge and Keep. Such events are significant historical events, not in isolation but in combination. Keep it in combination with other such gatherings like the Area 51 gathering, as a single combined article. (talk) 01:03, 26 April 2021 (UTC)
- Keep only. Although there are comparisons made between the "Area 51 Raid" and the "Josh Fight" in terms of actual event participation, The "Josh Fight" has no real direct involvement to be included into the "Area 51 Raid" article.DJ Baguio (talk) 01:56, 26 April 2021 (UTC)
- Delete - passing the general notability guideline is not enough when the subject is not encyclopedic. Lots of news events are covered by large news outlets, like the dog example cited by the nominator. Such short bursts of coverage do not establish notability, unlike sustained coverage, which would (WP:SUSTAINED). WP:EVENTCRIT specifically addresses this: "Routine kinds of news events (including [...] viral phenomena) – whether or not [...] widely reported at the time – are usually not notable unless something further gives them additional enduring significance". --Joshua Issac (talk) 00:04, 26 April 2021 (UTC)
- And I am not saying that just because I did not win. --Joshua Issac (talk) 00:07, 26 April 2021 (UTC)
- Keep, as per reasons listed by others. Because of substantial coverage by several WP:RSs, it clearly meets WP:NEVENT and WP:GNG. As per Andymii, if the very similar event Storm Area 51 gets an article for similar reasons, the Josh fight should too. Megalodon90 (talk) 00:05, 26 April 2021 (UTC) — Megalodon90 (talk • contribs) has made few or no other edits outside this topic.
- Keep - This has been covered by multiple international sources, and is very much able to be used as an article. If Area 51's events were worthy of being kept as an article, I see no reason why WP:EVENT doesn't cover the Josh fight. Just because it's recent doesn't make it any less unencyclopedic. VideōEtCorrigō (talk) 00:10, 26 April 2021 (UTC)
- WP:EVENT does cover this event when it says that routine news events like "viral phenomena [...] whether or not [...] widely reported [..] are usually not notable". --Joshua Issac (talk) 00:23, 26 April 2021 (UTC)
- Keep, per aforementioned Imperator Storm (talk) 00:12, 26 April 2021 (UTC)
- Keep, Same reasons given by others. Events that come from viral memes can gain significant coverage (Area 51 storming), and shouldn't be discounted just because they're not groundbreaking or "historically valuable". Alimorel (talk) 00:26, 26 April 2021 (UTC)
- Additionally, I think the fact that it was a fundraiser and food drive, not just a meme, contributes to the event's notability. Alimorel (talk) 00:49, 26 April 2021 (UTC)
- Keep; the wide reporting indicates a high level of interest, and Wikipedia ought to provide a well-sourced summary of the event. Fishal (talk) 00:35, 26 April 2021 (UTC)
- The reporting is a flash in the pan. It has no long term importance at all.--v/r - TP 01:22, 26 April 2021 (UTC)
- That's a fairly sweeping and unsupportable assertion. This strikes me as something that will remain notable at least as an important moment in internet culture. But that's also just a prediction; time will have to tell on this one. Fishal (talk) 02:13, 26 April 2021 (UTC)
- The reporting is a flash in the pan. It has no long term importance at all.--v/r - TP 01:22, 26 April 2021 (UTC)
- Strong Keep. I've seen the Josh Fight mentioned in almost every news source I read. It happened. People will imitate it. Journalists will write about it again and this page will be needed to contextualize copycat events. And merely calling it "unencyclopedic" is a weak, vague argument. Cheeftun (talk) 00:43, 26 April 2021 (UTC)
- Comment - This AfD has been linked from Reddit[4][5], and the article from Reddit[6] and Facebook. --Joshua Issac (talk) 01:11, 26 April 2021 (UTC)
- Yeesh, will probably not be helpful to the discussion. In any case, I suppose it's an opportunity to educate some potential editors on how Wikipedia works. Ganesha811 (talk) 01:16, 26 April 2021 (UTC)
- Closing admin should note that most of the keep voters are from Reddit and have fewer than 50 edits.--v/r - TP 01:21, 26 April 2021 (UTC)
- TParis, I think *most* is a bit strong. This isn't a vote, as we know, but any closing admin should take a look at the actual arguments made and not discount legitimate keep comments because of outside canvassing by others. Ganesha811 (talk) 01:35, 26 April 2021 (UTC)
- I don't speak for the rest of the Keep voters, but because I've been boycotting Reddit for over ten years, you've motivated me to reply: I searched for this article after reading about the event in the New York Daily News. If you have a strong case to make for deleting this article, you should write that here instead of flailing the word "encyclopedic" or ascribing guilt by association. Cheeftun (talk) 01:39, 26 April 2021 (UTC)
- Closing admin should note that most of the keep voters are from Reddit and have fewer than 50 edits.--v/r - TP 01:21, 26 April 2021 (UTC)
- Yeesh, will probably not be helpful to the discussion. In any case, I suppose it's an opportunity to educate some potential editors on how Wikipedia works. Ganesha811 (talk) 01:16, 26 April 2021 (UTC)
- @Cheeftun: your argument is based on WP:ITSINTHENEWS. I suggest you take a look at the whole page (Wikipedia:Arguments to avoid in deletion discussions) in general, since what you said above (
"People will imitate it. Journalists will write about it again and this page will be needed to contextualize copycat events"
) is WP:ATA#CRYSTAL. ~Styyx Talk? ^-^ 14:21, 26 April 2021 (UTC)
- @Cheeftun: your argument is based on WP:ITSINTHENEWS. I suggest you take a look at the whole page (Wikipedia:Arguments to avoid in deletion discussions) in general, since what you said above (
- Delete nothing significant about this event, despite sporadic coverage. Wikipedia is not a newspaper. --IWI (talk) 01:22, 26 April 2021 (UTC)
- Keep. It's odd, it's peculiar, but it's factual, and it is notable. It is covered by ESPN, USA Today, Insider, and Fox News. Four WP:RS that are independent, and all covers in depth instead of just passing mentions. Passes WP:GNG easily. SunDawn (talk) 01:23, 26 April 2021 (UTC)
- There are plenty of non-notable events that pass GNG. This is a news story with no lasting significance, and this is an encyclopedia. --IWI (talk) 01:25, 26 April 2021 (UTC)
- WP:GNG is only an assumption of notability. It's not a guaranteed pass. With events, you have the consider the long term significance. Do any of these sources talk about it's long term significance? I havent seen it.--v/r - TP 01:26, 26 April 2021 (UTC)
- Strong Keep This is an event that will be remembered for years to come as an internet joke that actually took place. It was widely covered by news sites globally. This very much is something that should stay. Its honestly appalling that this page would even be considered for deletion. Jmchugh131 (talk) 02:14, 26 April 2021 (UTC)
- I wouldn't claim that with SUCH certainty, but we definitely can't assume this will just fade out of memory in a few weeks. YuvalNehemia (talk) 09:48, 26 April 2021 (UTC)
- Keep This event has been covered around the world by the news and is definitely a noteworthy event to keep as many heard of it and its a internet phenomenon not to mention it perfectly follows with WP:EVENT. SuperSkaterDude45 (talk) 02:56, 25 April 2021 (UTC)
- Keep. Not much to say that hasn't already been said. Sure, it's an internet meme, but this article has facts and it is notable. Sure, it's fair to assume that in a few months not many people will be talking about the cultural significance of the Josh fight, because it's a fairly fleeting moment, but it had fairly wide impact and wide coverage by diverse sources as per WP:EVENT. --LivelyRatification (talk) 03:08, 26 April 2021 (UTC)
- Comment I considered nominating this for deletion, but was torn because of wide ranging sources that pass GNG. Per WP:EVENT, it does seem to meet the criteria of depth of coverage and diversity of sources, however, it fails to meet geographic scope and lasting effects. Duration of coverage is still TBD. Natg 19 (talk) 04:34, 26 April 2021 (UTC) (an editor named Josh)
- Delete The subject does not hold lasting significance, and it is premature to assume otherwise. Citations offered to defend the significance of the event are largely fluff pieces by North American publishers. Claims that this event has international significance are overblown, with few examples offered. At least one of the supposed examples of international commentary was an article sourced back to CNN, who were already cited. It should also be noted that some communities, such as Imgur, are actively interested in this story. Users from those communities may be under the false impression that the event generally matters outside of those pockets, and may be inclined to interfere with the deletion process for reasons not in the interest of Wikipedia or its policy and quality standards. Melonbob (talk) 05:23, 26 April 2021 (UTC)
- Delete per the other Delete arguments above... in short, it's a non-notable event. ~EdGl talk 06:24, 26 April 2021 (UTC)
- Keep, as it passes the bar previously established. I personally compare this with Storm Area 51, and while later coverage may dispute these numbers, both events seemed to have had a similar attendance (~1500 vs several hundred to few thousand people). Plus the fight was a charity event, which means it has a lasting effect.
The Josh fight could very well disappear from memory in the not-too-distant future, but it's without a doubt too early to tell. In a few weeks/months time we can discuss this again, after the dust had settled down. YuvalNehemia (talk) 07:55, 26 April 2021 (UTC)- I would like to add that after rereading WP:EVENT the fact that this was a charity event, unlike Storm Area 51, is even more fitting to the guidelines. YuvalNehemia (talk) 09:42, 26 April 2021 (UTC)
- Keep: it's sad to think how many events are not known because someone decided not to bother recording them: consider how many things were dismissed as unimportant at the time, but have only now been recognised as significant, and we're mourning the lack of relevant information. All those people saying "delete for now and we'll think about it later", how many of them would even bother to remember? Phil | Talk 08:44, 26 April 2021 (UTC)
- Oh if only those 31st century humans knew about the meeting of the Joshes. How ever will they survived. If only Wikipedia had a policy to protect such important anthropological information. Buuuuut...it doesn't.--v/r - TP 12:44, 26 April 2021 (UTC)
- Keep The nomination is based on WP:NOTNEWS but that discourages routine news about sports and celebrities and we are covering the Oscars regardless. The event in question is more unusual and seems to be reasonably notable and so it passes WP:GNG. It maybe that there's some scope to consolidate this with others meetings of people with the same name but I'm not sure what more we have. Anyway, the applicable policies are WP:ATD, WP:NOTPAPER and WP:PRESERVE and these clearly indicate that deletion is not appropriate. Andrew🐉(talk) 09:20, 26 April 2021 (UTC)
- Keep This article needs polish, but it is an example of a WP:EVENT, and many other memes and joke events (such as the Storm Area 51 meme) have their own pages.
- Keep, This is not just an internet joke its also about the strength off people even during covid times also we have articles on the area 51 raidoffwhiteeditor (talk) — offwhiteeditor (talk • contribs) has made few or no other edits outside this topic.
- Keep per the points raised by Vaticidalprophet, MainPeanut, Cheeftun, and Phil Boswell. The original argument wherein a dog gets rescued from ice is just WP:DOGBITESMAN. So the dog got rescued. Are we supposed to make articles for every single rescue that have equally "miraculous" circumstances? Unlike an uncommon yet still frequent event like "dog rescued after four days", there's not a lot of (and possibly even near zero) instances where multiple people gathered from the continental United States—most of which bearing the name "Josh"—in order to participate in an event sparked from a "meme" as part of internet culture. The circumstances behind the event - mainly the method of how it was initially planned and its (surprisingly positive) outcomes - also warrant its uniqueness, and will likely serve as a basis for future events of similar nature. Chlod (say hi!) 10:16, 26 April 2021 (UTC)
- Wikipedia is not a crystal ball. If the future events happen, and secondary sources link them to this event, then we'll cover it then.--v/r - TP 12:40, 26 April 2021 (UTC)
- "
It may take weeks or months to determine whether or not an event has a lasting effect. This does not, however, mean recent events with unproven lasting effect are automatically non-notable
" per WP:LASTING. Rather than delete at this stage, it's rather worth keeping at this stage to identify the lasting effect. Even if there were no lasting effect, this is not your run-of-the-mill event - much like I said in most of my point above. This just feels like a knee-jerk AfD to another viral internet meme that sparked an event: something that definitely has happened before (with nearly the exact same NOTNEWS, RECENTISM excuse). I guess modern internet culture is just this repulsive to some Wikipedians. Chlod (say hi!) 13:15, 26 April 2021 (UTC)
- "
- Wikipedia is not a crystal ball. If the future events happen, and secondary sources link them to this event, then we'll cover it then.--v/r - TP 12:40, 26 April 2021 (UTC)
- All stated facts are correct, the event did take place, not a fake article, do not delete. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 2001:16b8:2649:3b00:b541:388d:aeaf:fa47 (talk) 10:46, 26 April 2021 (UTC) — 2001:16b8:2649:3b00:b541:388d:aeaf:fa47 (talk) has made few or no other edits outside this topic.
- While the facts may be correct (they are), the event may be real (it is), and the article may be real (it is), that doesn't make it automatically notable. I was born (for real) but that doesn't mean that I deserve an article. Please expand upon your reasoning. Thanks, EDG 543 (message me) 15:31, 26 April 2021 (UTC)
- Delete: per nom, per WP:NOTNEWS, fails WP:GNG CommanderWaterford (talk) 11:39, 26 April 2021 (UTC)
- Keep: as per the aforementioned arguments highlighting its notability and merits of being maintained as a page (very succinctly summarised by people here such as Andrew, SunDawn, and many others), I see no reason to delete what is a perfectly valid wikipedia article and passes the threshold for being preserved. Greenleader(2) (talk) 12:03, 26 April 2021 (UTC)
- Keep. Sure it's a odd but true story but it was something weird that happened. As for "flash in the pan" there are plenty of articles on here that not only are of long forgotten things that basically no one remembers except for the nerdiest of historians. In addition I've noticed it DOES follow rules set forth by the admins. Sure we can trim it but to delete it is a travesty and would have to bring up the question of THOUSANDS of other articles. — Preceding unsigned comment added by All the usernames have been taken by now (talk • contribs) 12:11, 26 April 2021 (UTC)
- Most keep arguments border WP:OTHERSTUFFEXISTS: the fact that we have an article on the Storming of Area 51 is simply not an argument. From what I can see it meets WP:GEOLAND as there are sources from the UK, Canada and India pointed out by MainPeanut. There is one problem: we don’t know if this has lasting effects since the event happened recently, just 2 days ago. Any speculation of it having or not having lasting effects (such as what Cheeftun and Jmchugh131 did) is pure WP:CRYSTAL. WP:NEVENT says
”It may take weeks or months to determine whether or not an event has a lasting effect”
. I’d recommend closing as no consensus and re-nominating a few months later to see if it indeed has lasting effects to be considered a notable event. --~Styyx Talk? ^-^ 12:30, 26 April 2021 (UTC) - Keep: Per MainPeanut, among others. Why has this been nominated so soon after creation? Where's the good faith? We should revisit this discussion in several months time, when its' lasting notability can be more easily ascertained. Sean Stephens (talk) 13:50, 26 April 2021 (UTC)
- Keep: This wasn't just "some silly internet thing", it was an event that raised considerable amounts of money and food for charity. And even if it was just "some silly internet thing", why is that a reason for deletion? Does Wikipedia pride itself on being Olympic-level killjoys? If the Area 51 raid can have an article for recklessly destroying a portion of the desert, then this article and its subject's charitable contributions certainly deserve an article. Jade Phoenix Pence (talk) 14:02, 26 April 2021 (UTC)Jade Phoenix Pence
- Again... Borderline WP:OTHERSTUFFEXISTS. ~Styyx Talk? ^-^ 14:14, 26 April 2021 (UTC)
- The second sentence of that page directly says "These "other stuff exists" arguments can be valid or invalid". You are going to have to find another argument, or at least elaborate, because simply linking that page is not an argument. Jade Phoenix Pence (talk)Jade Phoenix Pence
- Again... Borderline WP:OTHERSTUFFEXISTS. ~Styyx Talk? ^-^ 14:14, 26 April 2021 (UTC)
- Keep: Many others have stated events like Area 51 have been documented on Wikipedia, and I personally think this article is being nominated for deletion due to its very recent nature. Look at the Area 51 event, little people talk about it now, but it was still significant. The same could be said for the Josh fight if given enough time to expand and be properly documented. DavidCostell44 (talk) 14:17, 26 April 2021 (UTC)
- I'm having fun with repeatedly linking WP:OTHERSTUFFEXISTS. ~Styyx Talk? ^-^ 14:25, 26 April 2021 (UTC)
- @DavidCostell44: Having little lasting significance is actually a reason to delete the Area 51 article, not a reason to keep this one.--v/r - TP 14:44, 26 April 2021 (UTC)
- Keep: It just funny, also its a very recent event, of course there won´t be a lot of sources — Preceding unsigned comment added by Thisisahumanboi (talk • contribs) 14:55, 26 April 2021 (UTC)
- Prime example of WP:LULZ. ~Styyx Talk? ^-^ 15:03, 26 April 2021 (UTC)
- Yeah, I'm not sure the incident being either funny or recent is good enough reasoning to keep the article. Thanks, EDG 543 (message me) 15:21, 26 April 2021 (UTC)
- Keep: Isn't wikepedia about documenting history? If so why is there a bias towards events that have happened, stopping them from being retold in the future? There is countless stupid things like this that have been recorded in history, yet we're ignoring today's history, and by deleting today's records, those in the future will have forgotten about this era. — 99.234.172.33 (talk) has made few or no other edits outside this topic.
- Dear IP editor, see Wikipedia:About and Wikipedia:What Wikipedia is not for the answer of your question. And also your arguments are WP:LOSE and WP:ATA#CRYSTAL. ~Styyx Talk? ^-^ 15:40, 26 April 2021 (UTC)
- Wait 2 weeks or so then reevaluate: Coverage at top-level media outlets is continuing into Monday [7]. This has potential to remain notable, so waiting to evaluate the lasting effects or extented coverage (if any) until coverage dies down seems like a better option than preemptively deleting, because Wikipedia is not a crystal ball and can't predict that nothing else will happen here. Its.Trei (talk) 15:42, 26 April 2021 (UTC)
- Keep: There are various reliable sources that have covered this event, and it's notable enough to remain up. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Internetronic (talk • contribs) 15:43, 26 April 2021 (UTC)
- Wait: The heart of the issue is whether the fight has lasting notability. Given that most of the delete arguments (and some of the keep arguments) are WP:ATA#CRYSTAL, I believe we should wait and see if people are still talking about it later. Exactly how long we should wait, I'll leave for more experienced editors to determine. {{u|Bowler the Carmine}} (they/them | talk | contribs) 16:02, 26 April 2021 (UTC)
- Keep: In a difficult year like this the little things that keep us going, Josh fight was not a mere event but the true will of humanity that still hides in fear but that wants everything to return to normal. Josh figh must be remembered for bringing people together in such difficult times. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 189.90.55.78 (talk) 16:30, 26 April 2021 (UTC)
- Nostalgia and your feelings toward the event are irrelevant in the decision on whether to keep this article. Thanks, EDG 543 (message me) 16:41, 26 April 2021 (UTC)
- Comment Both keep and delete have used arguments that are discouraged by WP:ATA#CRYSTAL. We do not know if this event will be forgotten in two weeks, we do not know if it will be remembered in a decade. As several other Wikipedians have suggested here before me, the best course of action would probably be leaving this discussion for now as per no consensus, and have it resurface in a few months time. YuvalNehemia (talk) 16:50, 26 April 2021 (UTC)