Talk:Harry Houdini

Huh?

>BRIAN]] • 2006-01-15 23:21

Also, "For example, Houdini's name plus Bessies' name and subtracting Houdini's favourite number is equal to eleven, (7+5-2=11)" doesn't count as logical. Ezradf 05:29, 25 January 2006 (UTC)

Whitehead a Boxer?

Was Whitehead on the boxing team at McGill? If not the "boxer" reference should be removed. Cafe Nervosa 01:43, 7 November 2005 (UTC)

Why is is considered relevant to this article to mention that Sidney Hollis Radner, the person holding the official seance each year, is a "Jewish Homosexual" ? This should be removed. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 71.96.122.135 (talk) 15:50, 25 September 2008 (UTC)

2001

in the section listing the references throughout the years, for the year 2001 there are several references taking place not in the year 2001, such as the naming of buster keaton, and the founding of a museum. someone should fix it. 76.22.61.43 00:19, 16 November 2007 (UTC)

Please Help us out! the_undertow ^talk 00:23, 16 November 2007 (UTC)

Harry?

I remember clearly reading somewhere that Houdini picked the name "Harry" in honor of Harry Kellar, who was a famous magician before him. Should we change this in the article?<<Coburn_Pharr>> 17:59, 3 August 2005 (UTC)

• No, the most thourough biography of Houdini (Houdini!!! by Kenneth Silvers) says that it was a variant on Ehrie. It seems unlikely that at the young age Ehrich was when he first chose Harry Houdini as his name that he would have known Kellar, though they did become friends later. Ezradf 05:31, 25 January 2006 (UTC)

Not so, He named himself after The Great French Magician Houdin, who was used by the french in the war in Africa. He added the I at the end because he believed it meant "like".Combatant (talk) 22:09, 20 October 2008 (UTC)

Moved a soliciation for aid in proving Jaqueline Beaumont's claims here in order to preserve NPOV in this article.

Oprah Winfrey and Time Magazine have been contacted. Should these media entities not be interested - other mediums have shown great interest including the Publisher that employs this poor Journalist - Michael Wakefield.

Any comments, suggestions, assistance of proof or aid should be sent to Jacquie at brumby@swirvemail.com

All information courtesy of an interview with Jacqueline Beaumont - all rights to interview and informtion reserved.

The submitter added that all information from that interview is reserved, which is rather ambiguous. Does this mean that we can't use it for the Wikipedia? I removed it from the article, but put it back if you disagree. (Though IMO it doesn't fit into the existing article very well.) -- CYD

I agree with CYD: it doesn't fit. The paragraph submitted by Lir is nice and succinct, and should be sufficient, don't you think? Stormwriter

houdini plane ride

is it true that harry houdini was the first person to make a successful plane flight over the australian continent? my info says it was on 3/6/1910.

I don't know about the date, but it is true according to Houdini!!! by Kenneth Silverman, which also has pictures of the event.

Yes, it is true. It's also given extensive coverage in the new Secret Life of Houdini book by William Kalush. 66.9.173.242 22:12, 10 January 2007 (UTC)

Ehrich Weiss/Erik Weisz

So, why does it say "Ehrich Weiss (born Weiss Erik in the native Hungarian)", as it using "Ehrich" in the English, and "Erik" in the Hungarian? Which is the correct spelling for Houdini's real name? nroose Talk 10:31, 8 Sep 2004 (UTC)

I have a related question. He was born in Hungary with the name Erik Weisz. He moved to the USA and eventually became Harry Houdini. Was Ehrich Weiss ever his legal name, or did he ever use that name informally? I always understood that he remained Erik Weisz until he changed to Houdini, but that American journalists had trouble with the Hungarian name so they just put it into a more familar sounding German version, as they were wont to do in those days. Is this true? If so, we should remove almost all references to "Ehrich Weiss", but have a sentence saying that although he is sometimes referred to by that spelling, this was not his name. JackofOz 09:45, 16 November 2005 (UTC)

Search Google for "Ehrich Weiss" versus "Erik Weisz", and you'll understand what is inaccurate about saying that he is "sometimes referred to" by the former spelling. The more common spelling in English (as this is the English Wikipedia) is by far Ehrich Weiss, and so we should use that spelling. And, yes, he did use that spelling, as can be seen by his own handwriting. — BRIAN0918 • 2005-11-16 10:00

Thank you for that very quick reply. So he did use Ehrich Weiss. Do we know when he switched from Erick Weisz, and whether he used Ehrich Weiss consistently thereafer?

In regards to Google, a count of hits merely records the versions that people have written in documents or on web pages, but does not tell you whether either of the alternatives is historically correct. You'll find thousands of hits for all manner of horrible spelling errors on a search engine, but that doesn't mean the words are spelled correctly, it just means the error is common. JackofOz 10:15, 16 November 2005 (UTC)

If you find thousands of hits for a spelling error, you are almost assured to find that the proper spelling has many more thousands of hits. I've never even heard of his name being spelled the Hungarian way before now. The simple fact is that "Erik Weisz" is the Hungarian spelling, and "Ehrich Weiss" is the spelling in English, the language he used through the vast majority of his life, and the language of this encyclopedia. Also, it wasn't the newspapers that decided to rename him. It was the U.S. Immigration Office when his family came to the U.S. — BRIAN0918 • 2005-11-16 16:58

Ah ha !! We should state that fact (about the Immigration authorities renaming his family) in the article. But I dispute the language claims. It was not a question of "Ehrich Weiss" being the spelling in English, since there's no such thing as translating surnames into other languages. (We don't refer to Giuseppe Verdi as Giuseppe Green, or Joseph Green). Weisz seems to be a hungarianised spelling of what was originally a German surname, Weiss. But the origin of his surname is irrelevant, it was Weisz when he was born and Weisz when he landed at (presumably) Ellis Island. What the US Immigration authorities seem to have done is to re-spell Weisz into something that looked more familiar, and German names were more familiar to them than Hungarian names. Which would also explain why Erik became the German Ehrich, rather than the English Eric. JackofOz 04:40, 17 November 2005 (UTC)

His tomb says WEISS prominently. 'Weisz' would have been the Hungarian transliteration as sz is pronounced like English s and s like English sh, for example, Budapest is pronounced boo-duh-pesht. There is, as far as I know, no double s (ss) in Hungarian, so 'Weiss' would have looked strange there, though the family was of German origin.--86.91.42.242 19:33, 5 March 2007 (UTC)

The myth of the name being changed by immigration is oft-repeated but false. INS Immigration officials were not in the business of handing out names; they merely checked them off a list. And at that time a person could use any name they wanted in the new country. Note too that the idea of one standardized spelling of a name is a recent invention. Family names were often spelled differently on various records or even within the same document. Spelling styles varied from decade to decade and a clerk or rabbi would merely record the name as he heard it. In Hungary at that time, societal influences would have dictated whether a Latin, Hungarian, Slovak, or Jewish-style first name was recorded which could also differ from what he was called in daily life. The passenger list for the Fresia entering NY in July of 1878 lists Erich Weiss. Questors 18:30, 23 January 2006 (UTC)

Even pbs.org has the same two names used incorrectly. They say he was born as "Erich Weiss" then just a paragraph down they say the name bacame "Erich Weiss" from "Erich Weisz" when the spelling was changed in the US. [1] Very poor quality control, and I suspect the error is the one that crept into our article. --Richard Arthur Norton (1958- ) 02:41, 26 January 2006 (UTC)

Guys, PLEASE! Everytime I look at this page I see a different spelling. Here are the facts. Houdini was born as Erik Weisz. I'm looking at a copy of his actual birth certificate reprinted in The Houdini Birth Certificate Committee Report (SAM 1972). The most reliable biography, Houdini!!! The Career of Ehrich Weiss by Ken Silverman says on page 8: "Born Erik Weisz in Budapest on March 24, 1974."

As to Ehrich -- I have no idea why people are dropping the first "h". There are dozens of examples of "Ehrich" in Houdini's own hand. To see one, check out page 178 in The Original Houdini Scrapbook by Gibson.

Born: Erik Weisz

Name adopted in America: Ehrich Weiss

Born 1974??????????????? —Preceding unsigned comment added by Combatant (talk • contribs) 22:12, 20 October 2008 (UTC)

--Zencato (talk) 18:34, 3 February 2008 (UTC)

Good. That's settled. Now for a further question. If he was born into the Weisz family in Hungary, how come we're saying:

• His family name, Weiß, is German, meaning "White" in English ... Houdini's father was Mayer (Mayo) Samuel Weiss ... had six siblings: ... Nathan J. Weiss; Gottfried William Weiss; Theodore Weiss; [4] Leopold D. Weiss; and Gladys Carrie Weiss.?

Huh? Surely, regardless of its German origin as Weiss (or Weiß), all his family members had a surname spelled Weisz in Hungary. Or are we talking about the name they had after they left Hungary? -- JackofOz (talk) 13:19, 5 June 2008 (UTC)

Error?

to punch him in the abdomen in order to demonstrate but Houdini

In order to demonstrate what? Some words are probably missing here. Please fix. Paranoid 22:29, 31 Dec 2004 (UTC)

“Psychics” and other charlatons

NPOV? Scott197827

Can you elaborated on that please? What are you tring to say.--mexaguil 02:48, 6 December 2005 (UTC)

Herman Mayer Weiss

As if his name is not enough trouble, the father is listed as "Herman Mayer Weiss" in the pbs.org article for the American Experience. How about if I lokk for him in the census and that way we can have a third opinion. It will be the father telling what he prefered to be called. --Richard Arthur Norton (1958- ) 02:39, 26 January 2006 (UTC)

It must be a typo the name "Herman Mayer Weiss" only appears once in the article and it is the only reference in Google. I think there was just some shoddy editing by PBS in an otherwise fine article. Well, except for the "weiss" Weitz" problem mentioned above... --Richard Arthur Norton (1958- ) 03:27, 26 January 2006 (UTC)

His father's name was Mayer Samuel Weiss. Herman (sometimes called "Armin") was his half brother. That American Experience article has mixed the two. As much as I respect PBS, that American Experience article is a poor source for info. --Zencato (talk) 18:51, 3 February 2008 (UTC)

Would he escape this?

If someone wrapped him up with duct tape from the toes to his neck, would he be able to free himself? 201.23.64.2 23:44, 20 March 2006 (UTC)

As far as I know (and I'm not sure if it's in the article), he actually challenged people to trap him in different ways. - some guy

"One of the...?"

Is it really neccessary to say that he was "one of the" most famous magicians or escapists of all time? Didn't he pioneer the genre to the fame it's at today? I just don't see why you don't just say THE most famous. - just some guy

Well, there are some people who can challenge you on that. ONE OF THE BEST is an opinion open for debate.- Random passer-byer

No, there's no debate. Who else could possibly be the "most famous magician or escapist of all time"? There's no other plausible contender. Tom NM (talk) 19:35, 12 June 2008 (UTC)

A few corrections and additions

I made a few corrections and additions to the Houdini article, but I know these are topics of debate, so I thought I should give my sources.

The first is the correct spelling of Houdini's birth name. I've changed Erik Weiss it to Erik Weisz. I get this from The Houdini Birth Research Committee's Report (1972), which includes a photo copy of the actual birth certificate found in Hungary. As to the spelling of his name after the family came to the U.S., I don't know where that "Erich" spelling came from as there are numerous examples in Houdini's own hand of the "Ehrich" spelling.

I was also able to fill in the birth dates of Houdini's parents from "Houdini: Escape Into Legend" by Manny Weltman, which is THE best reference for all information on Houdini's early life. I'm using the birthdate that appears on Mayer Weiss' tombstone, even though Weltman notes his marriage certificate shows him to be of an age that would suggest he was born earlier. But let's go with the tombstone. (BTW, that same marriage certificate calls Mayer Weiss a "soapmaker", not "Rabbi", but we'll leave that alone for now.)

I've also corrected information on who exactly witnessed the dressing room assault in Montréal. No way was Bess an eyewitness as the article originally stated (maybe this came from the 1976 TV movie which put Bess in the room). Houdini withholding this incident from Bess is well documented. The two witnesses where Jacques Price and Sam Smilovitz (sometimes called Jack Price and Sam Smiley). Both gave accounts of the incident to insurance companies and their accounts generally agreed. A fantastic source on all this is The Man Who Killed Houdini by Don Bell, who tracked down both Smiley and Price, and also uncovered exactly who Whitehead was and what happened to him.

I've also fleshed out the section on Houdini's movies, adding the titles of his films. The original article incorrectly stated that the Houdini Picture Corporation made three films instead of two. I know some list The Soul of Bronze as a HPC Houdini film, but while Houdini appears to have copyrighted this title (hence it appears in some film encyclopedias), there's no evidence the film was ever made. Of course, I would love nothing more to be proven wrong and discover there is a "lost" Houdini film out there!

I also changed the title of the 1976 Paul Michael Glaser biopic from The Great Houdini to The Great Houdinis. This was the title on the movie as it first aired in 1976. For the 1977 repeat, the title was changed to The Great Houdini for some reason. If you need evidence, the novelization carries the original Great Houdinis title. Also on my website, Houdini Lives, I have a pic of the original TV Guide add.

And that's it for now. :) --Zencato 23:43, 14 May 2006 (UTC)

Was he an Atheist?

I've heard him referred to as one before, but I don't know that its true. Is it? --Havermayer 16:37, 7 August 2006 (UTC)

• No. In the Haldeman-Julius Monthly of October 1925 (one year before Houdini's death) Marcet Haldeman-Julius wrote: "Houdini himself, shrewd, clear-headed, refusing to accept any substitutes for truth is, I submit, of the very stuff of which agnostics are fashioned. But I do not presume to doubt his statement that he believes both in God and in a Hereafter."

No - Houdini was an active member of the Masonic fraternity (mbr of St. Cecile Lodge in New York City largely made up of men in show business) and had a Masonic memorial service performed at his death. One of the requisites for mbrship in the fraternity is to have a belief in a Supreme Being; an atheist cannot become a Mason, then or now. (i.e. a Mason may be Christian, jew or Moslem but NOT an atheist). An aside: Sir Arthur Conan Doyle was also a Mason (Dr. Watson's character is a 'Mason' in the Sherlock Holmes series) GAE66 00:48, 3 April 2007 (UTC)

Birthday

many publications list his birthday as April 6th ... ?

• findagrave.com and famousbirthdays.com list his birthday as March 24 1874.

Houdini's birthday was March 24. However, he celebrated it on April 6. In a letter to his brother (reprinted in The Original Houdini Scrapbook, page 174), Houdini says April 6 is his "adopted birthday" as that is the day his mother always wrote to him. --Zencato (talk) 18:56, 3 February 2008 (UTC)

Spy?

There was a story today referring to a new biography of Houdini, claiming he was a spy who used his world-traveling magic acts as merely a cover for his spying operations (for Scotland Yard). The story can be found here. I wanted to add this to the page, but I didn't read the book, and these MSN and Yahoo news pages expire after a while, so I didn't. Perhaps someone can read the book and modify the page to include this new interesting claim.--PsychoticClown 08:10, 29 October 2006 (UTC)

I saw a story linked off of Drudge, and looked up the book on Amazon. Here they are in citation template form:

• McShane, Larry (2006-10-28). "Book Paints Escape-Artist Houdini As Spy". AP. Retrieved 2006-10-29.
• Kalush, William (2006-10-31). The Secret Life of Houdini: The Making of America's First Superhero. Atria. pp. 608 pages. ISBN 0743272072. {{cite book}}: Unknown parameter |coauthors= ignored (|author= suggested) (help)

Crockspot 16:39, 29 October 2006 (UTC)

But is this true, or conspiracy theory? Houdini did write fiction involving spying. Could his "diary" have been an imbellishment that he perceived as a possible future book or movie venture? We'll probably need to wait until SY comes out with the version of "the truth" that it wants us to know before we can add this... either way, I've got some reading to do this week! Anonymous 16:39, 29 October 2006 (UTC)

I tend to view this as mentionable in the article as an allegation, but not as solid proven fact. I'm not a regular editor of this article, so I simply added the two refs above into the refs section of the article. You folks work it in as you see appropriate. Crockspot 18:39, 30 October 2006 (UTC)

I think the book also implies that Houdini may have been murdered by these spiritualists that he was debunking. He also got a lot of tail and possibly went both ways. I want to pick this book up, sounds really interesting.

Yes it does - there is a long article here how one would add it in and keep things balanced. It might be worth either adding in a brief mention or waiting until there are rebuttals and fleshing it out a bit. (Emperor 03:16, 14 December 2006 (UTC))

Detailed footnotes for The Secret Life of Houdini can be found here: http://conjuringarts.org/houdini/index.shtml -- I deleted some text that claimed the book had no primary source material. The sections on the spying allegations and debunking spiritualists still needs some rewriting, though. 24.188.182.235 09:25, 7 January 2007 (UTC)

In popular culture

He has appeared as a fictional character in a range of media. Putting this in the "Legacy" section would start to bloat it and experience shows that it starts to make some editors nervous. I recently started: Nikola Tesla in popular culture and Mark Twain in popular culture and have proposed a Thomas Edison one. It strikes me that it would make sense to have one entitled: Harry Houdini in popular culture. I'll start digging around for examples and post them here (the immediate one that springs to mind is Necronauts) but I also wanted to open the floor for other people to add ideas too. (Emperor 19:52, 28 November 2006 (UTC))

Examples:

• Necronauts
• Wonder of the Worlds
• Ragtime (novel) [2]
• The Great Houdini (film)
• Batman/Houdini: The Devil's Workshop
• Houdini: The Man From Beyond by Image Comics [3]
• Abra-Cadaver: The Afterlife Adventures Of Harry Houdini [4]

Anymore? (Emperor 20:34, 28 November 2006 (UTC))

Updated list with some comics. (Emperor 21:10, 28 November 2006 (UTC))

In 1987 film Planes Trains and Automobiles a character complains that a punch to the stomach could have killed him, as it did Houdini. According to snopes.com: http://www.snopes.com/horrors/freakish/houdini.asp Canuckle 17:09, 8 May 2007 (UTC)

Yes we'd not want to include a huge list of people being punched in the guts like Houdini. My list there includes Houdini as a fictional character so we'd be wanting to look at more significant references to Houdini (also people performing any of his classic tricks would be long and largely trivial). (Emperor 17:33, 8 May 2007 (UTC))

• In a epsiode of Cartoon series Ghostbusters the Ghostbusters have to deal with the ghost of Houdini -who keeps breaking out of their Ghost traps; an real Magic Cabinet and a evil magician who has stolen HOudini's secrets. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 134.53.145.98 (talk) 01:43, 27 November 2008 (UTC)

Planes and Movies

The section under 'Magic' about planes and movies really doesn't fit the section and should moved. Perhaps to a new section?65.100.48.231 16:55, 29 November 2006 (UTC)

Magic - Aviation - Movies should all be their own sections. They were originally, but the formatting vanished and they've all run together. It's confusing. I've recreated the sections. --Zencato (talk) 19:13, 3 February 2008 (UTC)

Geoff Barker 23:32, 30 April 2007 (UTC)== Redundancies ==

In the first paragraph under Birth and Emigration, I find it a bit redundant to include both

"(although he claims to have been born in Appleton, Wisconsin but his birth certificate was later found after his death)"

and

"From 1900 onwards Houdini claimed in interviews to have been born in Appleton, Wisconsin on April 6, 1874, but his Hungarian birth certificate was uncovered by researchers after his death."

Also, under the Magic section, I don't think we need

"In 1910, while on a tour of Australia, Houdini brought with him a primitive bi-plane with which he made the first controlled powered aeroplane flight in Australia, at Diggers Rest, Victoria."

and

"He also bought a plane and was the first person to fly in Australia."

I've tried to change both of these, but the article keeps getting reverted. 67.150.212.44 07:22, 30 November 2006 (UTC)

Never mind. Looks like the changes stayed after all.67.150.212.44 07:25, 30 November 2006 (UTC)

Along the same lines, does this sentence even make sense? "Houdini initially focused oral sex acts and at one point grew a penis on his forehead." It makes no sense in isolation and has nothing whatsoever to do with the text following it in the second paragraph under "Magic." Sounds like the result of someone's prank.

I think there is an incorrect spelling of the aeroplane Houdini flew, it should be "Voison" not "Vioson" Geoff Barker 23:32, 30 April 2007 (UTC)Geoff Barker

Siblings

Please be clear on Houdini's siblings; first some of his brothers are mentioned, then a sister, then a name which hasn't come up before (Willi?) —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 62.163.217.119 (talk) 14:03, 22 December 2006 (UTC).

Fictional references

Houdini was featured at least once as a character in the Dark Horse comic book, Spawn.

Should other fictional accounts be included?

69.218.8.5 23:27, 23 December 2006 (UTC) Tony 12/23/6

See the section above. (Emperor 03:41, 24 December 2006 (UTC))

The Secret Life of Houdini

I am just an amateur puzzler, magician and historian. Still, looking into this book briefly, (I am reading something else now) I have observed selective materials which indicate sloopy history, sensationalism, innuendo, fiction and a love of conspiracy. If it is in one place, most likely it is in others. Larry Sloman, one of the two authors, is best known for his collaborations with "shock jock" Howard Stern and David Blaine.User:Kazuba 8 Jan 2007

Did Houdini really grow a penis on his forehead?

That's pretty funny if he did, but I kind of have a feeling that someone was messing with this article. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by Lefthandblack (talk • contribs) 01:50, 10 February 2007 (UTC).

Definitely vandalism. --science4sail ^talkcon 01:52, 10 February 2007 (UTC)

By the way, such odd (in this case, anatomically incorrect) things (unless referenced) are usually nonsense edits.--science4sail ^talkcon 01:53, 10 February 2007 (UTC)

"K-Deini Is Real"?

Can somebody double-check the spelling on this or provide a citation? A Google search on this phrase yields exactly two results: this article, and a strange comment on a YouTube video. Capedia 03:27, 13 February 2007 (UTC)

Well spotted! The edit was made by 68.38.48.89. His only other edit is clearly vandalism. I say this vandalism as well. I've removed it. Sander123 08:25, 13 February 2007 (UTC)

Vandalism Fix

Someone with the IP address 213.106.232.34 has added a strange story that is obviously nothing other than vandalism. I've taken the liberty of reverting the page to remove this (I forgot to sign in. My IP in the history is 72.72.201.246). Popisfizzy 18:58, 14 February 2007 (UTC)

Best source (IMO)

Hello all. I'm a Houdini collector, historian, a member of the Magic Castle, and I run a Houdini website (www.houdini-lives.com). I would strongly encourage the use of Kenneth Silverman's “Houdini!!! The Career of Enrich Weiss” as a primarily source for information and fact checking. Information on Houdini, even info contained in encyclopedias, can be wildly inaccurate, and myths about Houdini continually find their way into modern biographies. I really feel the Silverman book is the best, most accurate Houdini biography ever written. Silverman himself is a Pulitzer Prize winning biographer. The book is also meticulously soured in a second book, "Notes on Houdini!!!" I consider it my "Houdini Bible.” --Zencato 19:54, 22 February 2007 (UTC)

Welcome! Great, that you're working on this. Sander123 08:06, 23 February 2007 (UTC)

Movie career

I've contributed a section on Houdini's movie career, which I consider my specialty. I also think Houdini's brief but noteworthy aviation career deserves its own section, but I will leave this to others (or for myself on another rainy day). I also built up the Wiki article on Houdini’s Chinese Water Torture Cell. --Zencato 00:06, 23 February 2007 (UTC)

Professonal rapist?

Under the 'Magic' subheading it reads, 'In 1892, Weiss became a professional rapist'; really?

European tour/full evening show info

I did a little more work in the Magic section. --Zencato 23:26, 27 February 2007 (UTC)

Cousin married to Moe Howard?

The wikipedia entry for Moe Howard contradicts this and claims it is true.

stephen_trentalange 04:21, 7 March 2007 (UTC)

Messed up trying to undo vandalism

I've messed up trying to undo a long string of vandalism entry by entry. I don't know how to do a single undo back to the last clean entry (guess I need a lesson). Can someone please fix? Thanks. Sorry.

--Zencato 16:20, 14 March 2007 (UTC)

UPDATE: Okay, I think I fixed it. --Zencato 17:21, 14 March 2007 (UTC)

Hungarian

The entry describes Houdini as "Hungarian", but he left when he was four. Why is it not "Hungarian-American" or just "American"?

I agree. Houdini was an American, where he lived all but the first 4 years of his life and was a US citizen. Biographies should describe nationality by citizenship, especially in cases where the subject moved as s very young age. Entry changed to Hungarian-American pending consensus of whether he should be considered solely American of Hungarian descent, or Hungarian-American. Defer to the latter since he was born in Hungary. Piperdown 12:54, 23 March 2007 (UTC)

The last two paragraphs of "Debunking spiritualists" are unclear.

Regarding the second paragraph, was Conan-Doyal once H's friend? The paragraph seems to suggest so.

In the third paragraph, I can't tell what is goind on. Did Ford claim to have received a message from H and his mother? Did he claim to have the code that H gave to Bess? Was the "code" made public at some point? It is all very, very unclear. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by Lporrel@yahoo.com (talk • contribs) 01:08, 23 March 2007 (UTC).

Body to be exhumed

Read all about it: [5] - Throw 03:33, 24 March 2007 (UTC)

Locked article

why is this article locked? i read the discussion and found no explanation why it is locked. παράδοξος reality is Wikipedia παράδοξος 04:16, 31 March 2007 (UTC)

deleted the obvious, sorry παράδοξος 04:45, 31 March 2007 (UTC)

My vote is to re-lock this article. Of all the articles I watch, this receives the most vandalism.--Zencato (talk) 19:31, 3 February 2008 (UTC)

I second Zencato's motion. I've noticed the same high degree of vandalism. I monitor many of the political articles (e.g., torture and waterboarding) as well as a number of entries on contentious right and left wing blogs, and Harry Houdini gets hit with more juvenile vandalism than anything I've seen. Given that this isn't really a time sensitive article, and (when it's not in a vandalized state) is pretty mature and well done, from a quality control standpoint I think re-locking is a good idea. -- Quartermaster (talk) 23:00, 20 April 2008 (UTC)

Secret Life

Some suggestions from reading the book Secret Life:

• 1. The shift in birthdates from March to April can be explained by differences in the Julian and Gregorian calendar.
• 2. His influence on pre-WWI aviation could be expanded into its own section.
• 3. The suggestion that he was a spy or worked with US and English secret intelligence services should have its own section
• 4. In Spiritualism: Add anecdote about how early on in his career he and his wife went too far pretending to have spiritual powers, exploited the emotions of a couple grieving for a lost child. His regret over this partly led to his opposition to false mediums.
• 5. Also under Spiritualism, his appearance before Congress and also his interactions with the US President, Theodore Roosevelt, Czar Nicholas II, etc. Canuckle 19:53, 30 April 2007 (UTC)

Candle

Could his wife had [i]really[/i] kept a candle lit for ten years? How big would this candle have to be? Fr0 03:30, 20 June 2007 (UTC)

Did a little work

Hey gang. I did a little work on the page. First, I fleshed out that timeline with info on his career. I thought it was silly to have a timeline that was basically a summery of birth and immigration facts and then, bang, death. While I didn't cite my additions, these are all very well-known major events in Houdini's life and can be confirmed via any biography. Next, I added the info about the famous 1936 final Houdini Seance to the Legacy section. I'm wondering if this section shouldn't be rearranged chronologically by year? It's a bit of a mess right now. Last, I added a new section on Houdini's appearance and voice. Hope this is okay. I do find something like this of interest and value when the subject lived before sound film. I especially think the info on his voice recording is very interesting. --Zencato 20:02, 3 July 2007 (UTC)

Okay, I've done a bit more. I added a section on his aviation career and also on the Mirror challenge, which is possibly the most famous single escape of his career. --Zencato 00:49, 4 July 2007 (UTC)

Legacy section - Wil Wheaton vs. Will Wheaton

Currently, an entry in the Legacy section states: 1985 - Will Wheaton played Houdini in Young Harry Houdini, a made for TV movie which aired on ABC as a "Disney Sunday Movie." The film also featured Jeffrey DeMunn as the adult Houdini. DeMunn first played Houdini in the film version of, Ragtime.[25]

Will Wheaton is a musician; Wil Wheaton is the actor who starred in the movie.

Mliguori333 11:57, 12 July 2007 (UTC)

his clavicle

I heard that his clavicle was not attached to his sternum, which allowed him to escape from straight-jackets. I believe this is actually a relatively common congenital condition. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Tkjazzer (talk • contribs) 06:17, 23 November 2007 (UTC)

Suspected vandalism....

I could be wrong but I have doubts about Houdini being

"a skeptic and investigator of Female Breasts"

Perhaps this should be looked into. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 68.61.98.58 (talk) 20:47, 28 November 2007 (UTC)

death certificate ideosyncracies

Can someone verify the "appendix being on the left side" claim made in the Guardian article currently being cited as a source here? http://www.houdinitribute.com/img/deathcertif.jpg certainly doesn't show any such claim that I can discern, but maybe there's an "extended version" in one of the bios/conspiracy books. Even if it were true, it could have been situs inversus or situs ambiguus, although that will require a separate citation to include in the article. -- nae'blis 16:01, 13 December 2007 (UTC)

Statement at Death

I've heard a rumor somewhere that Harry Houdini, before dying in the hospital, told his wife "If there is a way to contact you from the other side, I will find it."

Is this true?

71.171.126.104 (talk) 22:16, 27 December 2007 (UTC)

heyy???

Harry houdini is cooooollll man. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 150.199.189.1 (talk) 13:56, 10 January 2008 (UTC)

.....no really intelligent

say that Houdini will be remembered more for his adventure in aviation and not as big escaper and magician seems to me such a stupid conclusion...... —Preceding unsigned comment added by 86.144.99.243 (talk) 06:14, 27 February 2008 (UTC)

Houdini is the one who said that back in 1910 and I think it's made clear in the article that it's now an ironic statement. --Zencato (talk) 18:19, 2 March 2008 (UTC)

Garrick vs. Majestic

Someone changed the location of the Detroit theater where Houdini gave his last performance from the Garrick to the Majestic. This is wrong. It was the Garrick, and I've changed it back (check page 511 in The Secret Life of Houdini by Kalush and Soloman if you want a hard source). I think what is happening is someone on eBay has been selling mock-up theater tickets for "Houdini's last performance" and on the tickets he's put Majestic. Either that person doesn't know the name of the actual theater, or choose Majestic for artistic purposes. But it was the Garrick. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Zencato (talk • contribs) 18:27, 2 March 2008 (UTC)

The Mirror Handcuff Challenge

I noticed that the guy apparently who made these handcuffs is shown on Wikipedia,as coming from Hertfordshire in England. I always thought Nathaniel Hart was from Birmingham. How can I find out who put Hertfordshire on the Wikipedia listings? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 84.43.54.142 (talk) 11:34, 8 March 2008 (UTC)

I've changed it back to Birmingham. The Mirror account clearly states the maker was from Birmingham. --Zencato (talk) 21:32, 20 April 2008 (UTC)

The BBC broadcasted a radio special on infamous residents of Hertfordshire and had an entire segment on Nathaniel Hart. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 24.235.158.223 (talk) 14:38, 26 July 2008 (UTC)

Time of Death

Under the category Death there is a contradiction. Houdini’s last performance claims "Houdini died of peritonitis from a ruptured appendix at 1:26 p.m. in Room 401 on October 31 (Halloween), 1926, at the age of 52". Houdini refused medical attention claims "He died at 4:35pm.[26]". What is correct? 193.213.31.248 (talk) 15:57, 18 March 2008 (UTC)

1:26pm is the time on the death certificate. --Zencato (talk) 16:39, 18 March 2008 (UTC)

Peritonitis

Under the category "Death" should the first mention of peritonitis be hyperlinked to its article [[6]]? --Getthebikes (talk) 18:30, 14 July 2008 (UTC)(G/T/B)

Article Cleanup, Please?

I found several inconsistencies and mistakes in this article, right from the get-go:

Harry was born in manzanillo, mexico in 1994 A copy of his birth certificate was found and published in The Houdini Birth Research Committee's Report (1972)...
...Houdini's father was Mayer (Mayo) Samuel Weiss (1829-1892). Weisz was a rabbi;...

There are also many redundancies, as well as contradictions throughout the entry.

March 28th, 2008

Looks like some concerted vandalism. I think I reverted things back to the earliest clean version. -- Quartermaster (talk) 16:41, 28 March 2008 (UTC)

Debunking spiritualists - still unclear

Like the commenter in section The last two paragraphs of "Debunking spiritualists" are unclear above, I find the last paragraph confusing.

• The book The Secret Life of Houdini is mentioned with no explanation, so I added that it is a 2006 book by Kalush and Sloman.
• The paragraph occurs before Houdini's death but describes events after, which confused me. I suggest it be moved to after his death. I added a confusing template.
• Despite references to "in the book" the wording is still unclear as to what happened and more precisely when and which statements are from the book or from elsewhere. Some examples: which seance is meant; "the words she received from her deceased husband" - is this really what Bess wrote or a poor paraphrase; Houdini code is mentioned for the first time, what is it and was it in the seance and why should the reader see Arthur Ford; Houdini code was known months before the seance - dates would be helpful.

-84.223.120.228 (talk) 19:56, 13 April 2008 (UTC)

Grave Desecration

I come from Brooklyn and remember as a child, his tomb being vandalised more than once. I cannot find article about it.Combatant (talk) 21:59, 20 October 2008 (UTC)

I also remember that the Amazing Randi had a copy of the Bust that set atop his grave and that the American Society of Magicians will reach out to him everytime it was vadalized to replace it with his as a mold. Can anybody find old information about this?Combatant (talk) 22:02, 20 October 2008 (UTC)

Re-lock article?

Of all the articles I watch on wiki this one receives the most vandalism. I thought is was a good idea when it was locked a while back. Maybe the powers-that-be should consider re-locking it? --Zencato (talk) 21:35, 20 April 2008 (UTC)

I second Zencato's motion. I've noticed the same high degree of vandalism. I monitor many of the political articles (e.g., torture and waterboarding) as well as a number of entries on contentious right and left wing blogs, and Harry Houdini gets hit with more juvenile vandalism than anything I've seen. Given that this isn't really a time sensitive article, and (when it's not in a vandalized state) is pretty mature and well done, from a quality control standpoint I think re-locking is a good idea. -- Quartermaster (talk) 23:00, 20 April 2008 (UTC)

Just put in a request for protection for this article (following yet another revert due to vandalism). Why this article? I'm mystified. -- Quartermaster (talk) 15:26, 21 April 2008 (UTC)

It should be locked, as Houdini had many detractors in life, on his death it can be free for all to vandalise such an ilustrious artist.Combatant (talk) 22:05, 20 October 2008 (UTC)

Kenneth Silverman

FYI, One of Houdini's biographers won both a Pulitzer prize and a Bancroft prize, and deserves an article on his own and a hot link in this article. 7&6=thirteen (talk) 23:52, 20 April 2008 (UTC) Stan

Done 7&6=thirteen (talk) 00:30, 21 April 2008 (UTC) Stan

American Museum of Magicand other magic museums

I've created this article. It includes a section on other magic museums, of which some of you are knowledgeable. Your help would be appreciated. Thanks. 7&6=thirteen (talk) 17:56, 24 April 2008 (UTC) Stan

Source?

Who put in the line that he could regurgitate keys on command? Also, I would much appreciate a reference and source, I need it for a project. That would be much appreciated!! Thanks!! Bardanskirata (talk) 23:25, 28 April 2008 (UTC)

It is believed that in her mouth was the key to unlock the special handcuff. If she could hide a six inch key in her mouth that is some trick 23:31, 12 July 2008 (UTC) —Preceding unsigned comment added by 86.40.99.85 (talk)

Birth date?

in the box under Houdini's picture it says he was born in 1868, but in the article it says he was born in 1874 (and aged 52 when he died). —Preceding unsigned comment added by 159.91.147.184 (talk) 23:57, 2 May 2008 (UTC)

Good catch. Fixed. --Zencato (talk) 16:52, 18 May 2008 (UTC)

John Gaughan

Could somebody who's allowed to edit the page please add a link to his article under the 'Artifacts' section? --Kgaughan (talk) 20:18, 7 May 2008 (UTC)

Clarification

During the mirror challenge, it states that since the people don't remove the handcuffs, he takes a pen knife out of his pocket and tears it up. I assume this means that he reached into his pocket, while still in the handcuffs, and ripped it up, while still in the handcuffs. Is that what actually happend? Because it seems like it would be difficult to get into a pocket, and rip up a coat while locked into 'the mirror'. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 12.175.211.37 (talk) 03:37, 18 May 2008 (UTC)

Yep, that's what happened. They say he held the knife in his teeth and shredded the coat. There's even an illustration of this in the Mirror account. Maybe I should add the teeth part to the description? --Zencato (talk) 16:44, 18 May 2008 (UTC)

I added it. Also corrected the name of the Mirror representative using Silverman as source. The rep is not called by name in the original sourced newspaper account. --Zencato (talk) 16:54, 18 May 2008 (UTC)

Proposed exhumation

The last sentence of proposed exhumation section contains no subject, and therefore makes no sense. Who opposed the exhumation?

69.212.80.78 (talk) 04:14, 31 May 2008 (UTC)

Found the ref and fixed it, it's the family. Julia Rossi (talk) 00:39, 6 July 2008 (UTC)

Secret Life Book

This article contains too many references to "the secret life of houdini." It reads like an advertising ploy on the part of the authors. The in text citations should changed to end text citations to maintain the neutrality of this article.

69.212.80.78 (talk) 04:14, 31 May 2008 (UTC)

Contradiction

Article states Bess put out candle in 1936 - Under Legacy a storm on top of hotel put it out. What what's the true (cited) story?

Stone Temple Pilots

STP reunion in 2008 is reported as nothing to do with Houdini. Need update (removal).

Hard times

In a documentary Houdini fell on hard times and tried to sell his tricks. There's nothing of this in the article, should there be? Julia Rossi (talk) 00:42, 6 July 2008 (UTC)

Update

A recent reference on exhumation state of play is here[7]. Julia Rossi (talk) 00:42, 6 July 2008 (UTC)

This is the post on the refdesk:

Not exhumed as of 2008-03-04 according to:

Costella, Annmarie (2008-03-04). "Houdini exhumation to test for poison". NYDailyNews.com. Retrieved 2008-07-05. they have yet to file court papers to have Houdini's body exhumed.

-- Jeandré, 2008-07-05t18:26z

physical abilities

wasn't he something of an athlete? Should we mention his abilities?

Tense and Style of Legacy section

Right now the Legacy section has inconsistent tenses -- switching mostly between past and present tense -- it should all be in past tense, and would probably be even better written as prose instead of as a list. I will try to get back here in the next week when I have time and do it, but if any enterprising soul reads this and has the time and the drive and gets to it before I do, that would be great. Brainmouse (talk) 20:57, 20 July 2008 (UTC)

Exhumation points

in the area of the article on Houdini regarding the proposed exhumation I see where facts became arye. George Hardeen is Theo Hardeen's grandson thereby making George Houdini's grandnephew by blood not marriage. George is not related to him through his wife, but his brother. The family disputing it from occurring was his wife's not his. Facts otherwise appear accurate in that area, other than families getting crossed.Looking4knowledge (talk) 04:44, 28 July 2008 (UTC)

Buried alive

I see no mention of his attempt at being buried alive, one of his tricks that almost killed him and which he never attempted again. 78.86.230.62 (talk) 19:08, 5 September 2008 (UTC)

Please, feel free to find a reference, then Be Bold and add add the information. Brainmouse (talk) 00:11, 6 September 2008 (UTC)

The Occult Committee?

There is no source for this new "Occult Committee" section, and even if sourced, it's connection to Houdini seems tangential at best. --Zencato (talk) 20:11, 21 September 2008 (UTC)

Harry Houdini

Harry Houdini the great magition he preformed his first trapeze act at nine years old he was called "The Prince of the Air" so join in find out the great edventure this immigrant did!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

HARRY HOUDINI!!!!!! —Preceding unsigned comment added by 209.143.8.158 (talk) 21:03, 2 October 2008 (UTC)

harry houdini is the bomb digity. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 75.69.58.127 (talk) 21:02, 4 November 2008 (UTC)