Talk:Abu Qatada al-Filistini

This is the talk page for discussing improvements to the Abu Qatada al-Filistini article.
This is not a forum for general discussion of the article's subject.

Put new text under old text. Click here to start a new topic.
New to Wikipedia? Welcome! Learn to edit; get help.

Article policies

Find sources: Google (books · news · scholar · free images · WP refs) · FENS · JSTOR · TWL

This article must adhere to the biographies of living persons (BLP) policy, even if it is not a biography, because it contains material about living persons. Contentious material about living persons that is unsourced or poorly sourced must be removed immediately from the article and its talk page, especially if potentially libellous. If such material is repeatedly inserted, or if you have other concerns, please report the issue to this noticeboard.

If you are a subject of this article, or acting on behalf of one, and you need help, please see this help page.

This article must adhere to the biographies of living persons (BLP) policy, even if it is not a biography, because it contains material about living persons. Contentious material about living persons that is unsourced or poorly sourced must be removed immediately from the article and its talk page, especially if potentially libellous. If such material is repeatedly inserted, or if you have other concerns, please report the issue to this noticeboard.

If you are a subject of this article, or acting on behalf of one, and you need help, please see this help page.

Biography C‑class

	Biography portal This article is within the scope of WikiProject Biography, a collaborative effort to create, develop and organize Wikipedia's articles about people. All interested editors are invited to join the project and contribute to the discussion. For instructions on how to use this banner, please refer to the documentation.BiographyWikipedia:WikiProject BiographyTemplate:WikiProject Biographybiography articles
C	This article has been rated as C-class on Wikipedia's content assessment scale.
	An appropriate infobox may need to be added to this article. Please refer to the list of biography infoboxes for further information.
	An editor has requested that an image or photograph be added to this article.

Jordan C‑class

This article is within the scope of WikiProject Jordan, a collaborative effort to improve the coverage of Jordan on Wikipedia. If you would like to participate, please visit the project page, where you can join the discussion and see a list of open tasks.JordanWikipedia:WikiProject JordanTemplate:WikiProject JordanJordan articles

C

This article has been rated as C-class on Wikipedia's content assessment scale.

???

This article has not yet received a rating on the project's importance scale.

Tasks YOU can help with:

Here are some tasks awaiting attention:

Islam C‑class

	Islam portal This article is within the scope of WikiProject Islam, a collaborative effort to improve the coverage of Islam-related articles on Wikipedia. If you would like to participate, please visit the project page, where you can join the discussion and see a list of open tasks.IslamWikipedia:WikiProject IslamTemplate:WikiProject IslamIslam-related articles
C	This article has been rated as C-class on Wikipedia's content assessment scale.
???	This article has not yet received a rating on the project's importance scale.

Crime and Criminal Biography C‑class

	This article is within the scope of WikiProject Crime and Criminal Biography, a collaborative effort to improve the coverage of Crime and Criminal Biography articles on Wikipedia. If you would like to participate, please visit the project page, where you can join the discussion and see a list of open tasks.Crime and Criminal BiographyWikipedia:WikiProject Crime and Criminal BiographyTemplate:WikiProject Crime and Criminal BiographyCrime-related articles
C	This article has been rated as C-class on Wikipedia's content assessment scale.
???	This article has not yet received a rating on the project's importance scale.

Terrorism C‑class

	This article is within the scope of WikiProject Terrorism, a collaborative effort to improve the coverage of articles on terrorism, individual terrorists, incidents and related subjects on Wikipedia. If you would like to participate, please visit the project page, where you can join the discussion and see a list of open tasks.TerrorismWikipedia:WikiProject TerrorismTemplate:WikiProject TerrorismTerrorism articles
C	This article has been rated as C-class on Wikipedia's content assessment scale.
???	This article has not yet received a rating on the project's importance scale.

United Kingdom C‑class

	United Kingdom portal This article is within the scope of WikiProject United Kingdom, a collaborative effort to improve the coverage of the United Kingdom on Wikipedia. If you would like to participate, please visit the project page, where you can join the discussion and see a list of open tasks.United KingdomWikipedia:WikiProject United KingdomTemplate:WikiProject United KingdomUnited Kingdom articles
C	This article has been rated as C-class on Wikipedia's content assessment scale.
???	This article has not yet received a rating on the project's importance scale.

Expanding article

I have started to redo this piece and bring it up to a standard befitting such a champion of al-Qaeda and Londonistan. LDH 12:51, 10 March 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Patience, folks. More coming.LDH 16:03, 10 March 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Removed an unsourced, unverifiable, and apparently untrue, sentence

I removed this unsourced sentence:

Abu Qatada is frequently cited – always with approval – in the 2004 al-Qaeda policy paper called Management of Savagery.

This looks like original research, since googling for 'Abu Qatada' 'Management of Savagery' comes up with nothing that says that he's mentioned in the paper. It also appears to be a lie, in that I downloaded a pdf copy of Management of Savagery (see the wiki page for links to it), converted it to text and tried grepping for 'Qatada' and 'Omar' and 'Mahmoud' and 'Othman' and found absolutely nothing. If this article is going to be a target for disinformation, I reckon that's a cue for me to come back to this article at a later date and ruthlessly excise anything that isn't properly sourced with page numbers and whatnot.--Aim Here 22:27, 17 June 2007 (UTC)[reply]

More unsourced stuff

I slapped a 'fact' tag on this passage, but I've a sneaking suspicion it might be false, in that I've only found a mere blog posting claiming that he was the editor while someone else issued a fatwa declaring the Algerian people to be 'kufr' [1]. Anyone got any reliable sources that back up the rather sensationalist wording of the article, or even the less exciting version in the blog?

While free in the UK Abu Qatada was the editor-in-chief of GIA's Al-Ansar magazine, and contributed fatwas to that magazine authorizing the indiscriminate mass murder of random Algerians. (Mustafa Setmariam Nasar was an editor and contributor at the same time, when he too was in England with political refugee status.)

Aim Here 10:39, 19 June 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Legal status

I am not happy with the recent addition of the Court of Appeal case on the potential deportation of Qatada; it looks much like a copy/paste job from the BBC website. Any objections to removal? Let me know Ben stephenson (talk) 21:31, 9 April 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Palestinian

An IP has edited "...is a Palestinian Islamist militant".

There is actually a Wiki article Definitions of Palestinian and on the basis of that I suppose it's accurate from a strictly ethnic point of view. However I have misgivings given that a majority of UN nations accept that there is a State of Palestine and calling him Palestinian suggests he is a citizen of that state. But he is not, he is Jordanian and what is at issue presently is whether he can be safely deported to his native Jordan.

I also frankly suspect a "he's a Palestinean, so let's call him a Palestinian" agenda here. I don't know what Wikipedia crieria are, but common sense suggests that the tag is only really appropiate if Mr. Qatada identifies himself publicly as a Palestinian (and indeed whether his fellow Palestineans endorse that identification) and he has not. Opening paragraph guidance in that case is that ethnicity should not be mentioned. Moreover I can find no recent identifications of him in the media as Palestinean, indeed just the one CBS caption for a file photo dating from 2001.

I'm therefore reverting the edits and ask the IP to bring the issue here. 81.178.38.169 (talk) 19:18, 12 February 2012 (UTC)[reply]

Chicago IP is persisting with Palestinean origin in lede. I'm leaving it since Sky News has recently led with "Palestinean" covering Qatada's release on bail. JabbarWales (talk) 04:32, 14 February 2012 (UTC)[reply]

Chicago IP is persistently blanking, soapboxing etc. I've reverted but we are out of here now. Done our bit :). JabbarWales (talk) 08:55, 14 February 2012 (UTC)[reply]

Link 13

This links to a profile of Abu Hamza who is a different person.Streona (talk) 10:08, 14 February 2012 (UTC)[reply]

Hi Streona. Yes, I was puzzled by that at first when I was reviewing the article, but in fact it does mention Qatada, indirectly supporting the article's assertion:"Diyab presented Abu Hamza as an example of an Islamist who had relinquished violence, citing Abu Hamza's call in 1997 not to obey the fatwa issued by another London fundamentalist, the Palestinian-Jordanian Abu Qatada who had called upon Muslims to kill the wives and children of Egyptian police and army officers as part of the struggle in Arab countries."

The Middle East Media Research Institute is a questionable Reliable Source (RS) I should say (partisan, willing to wager that J's Chicago IP above is them :)) and I did consider scrapping the citation and providing another, but in fact I couldn't find one, other than sources (including his SIAC hearings) referencing fatwas he issued advocating the killing of women and children but not mentioning the specific context: I suspect Algeria rather than Egypt.

In the end I left it. Much of that section worries me. When I was trying to source the various assertions, especially the sermons in Atta's Hamburg flat, I got the queasy feeling that many of them were in fact relying on the Wiki article! 81.178.38.169 (talk) 12:58, 14 February 2012 (UTC)[reply]