Talk:Sequel

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"Midquel" needs a better citation

As has been discussed further down on this page, the term "midquel" seems to be a neologism invented here on Wikipedia. There is now a cite in this article for the definition of a midquel: Margarete Rubik; Elke Mettinger-Schartmann (2007). A Breath of Fresh Eyre: Intertextual and Intermedial Reworkings of Jane Eyre. However, in the text of that book (conveniently searchable on Google Books, the part where it defines "midquel" cites Wikipedia as its source!

So we still need a different term to prove that midquel is not a bit of original research. --101.98.144.68 (talk) 08:39, 15 March 2014 (UTC)[reply]

Talk from 2003

Moved from inline comments:

Did the movie industry invent the word or was it used in publishing first? (04:08, 13 Jul 2003 . . User:Lee M)

The OED and other dictionaries date it to 1972 when used in the Britannica Book of the Year for 1972/73; someone can look there for the first credited use... (19:08, 12 Dec 2003 . . User:66.167.49.35)

- IMSoP 22:28, 16 Dec 2003 (UTC)

Video Games?

Can the word sequel only apply to films and books? Can't computer and video games have sequels? Vanky 19:55, 13 Feb 2005 (UTC)

Hmm, yes, I'd say any "work of fiction" can have a sequel really, which in my book would include video games. I've added a fudge to that effect to the introductory paragraph, but a more thorough rewording would probably be sensible. - IMSoP 20:33, 13 Feb 2005 (UTC)

RPG video games follow story-lines and plots just like any other book/movie/play/ect. So why not? - 07:29, 07 Oct 2010

the first sequel?

when was the first true sequel written? By "true" I mean a work of fiction which follows on from a previous work, not one that was split up into multiple "parts" merely for practical reasons (such as Shakespeare's Henry VI parts 1, 2 and 3; or the Lord of the Rings trilogy). www.etymonline.com dates sequel meaning "story that follows and continues another" to 1513. Does anyone know what work of fiction this might refer to?

Given that the play was (supposedly) written to accommodate Queen Elizabeth who wanted to see Shakespeare's fictional creation Falstaff "in Love", one could make an argument for The Merry Wives of Windsor, although that's aroun 1600. Tomsalinsky 22:19, 28 January 2006 (UTC)[reply]

wouldn't that technically be more like a spinoff rather than a sequel? ;) --Krsont 20:43, 17 May 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Wasn't the Odyssey a sequel to the Iliad? Exodus a sequel to Genesis? EamonnPKeane 17:23, 29 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Oedipus Rex by Sophocles was part of a trilogy. 14 August 2007 (ALB)

The Iliad was a sequel to the (sadly lost) Cypria. EamonnPKeane 23:53, 27 October 2007 (UTC)[reply]

First numbered sequel

Godfather Part II and not Quatermass 2? Tomsalinsky 22:16, 28 January 2006 (UTC)[reply]

I am also a person who spent an hour of research on this topic just now and want this fact recognized. Meanwhile I will simultaneously debate with myself on whether this counts, as it does not take the full title of its predecessor, and also it would seem that there are even older titles. I think Alladin II is a sequel to Alladin and the Wonderful Lamp (Indian spellings or something? I'm simply citing the IMDb). There are possibly even older ones. Furthermore, it appears to be mostly an evolution to things using "No. 2". While some stuff is hard to sort through, particularly pre-planned sequels, possibly in production before the release of the original, I can say fairly safely that while French Connection II is probably the earliest example with modern mainstream recognition, there are earlier examples. Like Hyeong 2 from 1971. Or Breast Orgy 2 in 1972. Eclipsed Moon 15:43, 7 March 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Threequel

What is the term "threequel" that re-directs here supposed to mean?? Georgia guy 02:21, 4 February 2006 (UTC)[reply]

I've just added in a modified version of that article in the prequel section which hopefully answers your question. Turnstep 16:43, 5 February 2006 (UTC)[reply]

I wouldn't class Bourne Ultimatum as a threequel but a trilogy. All three films tell one story and the books they are based on was a trilogy as well. Nightjim 16:23, 3 September 2007 (UTC)[reply]

GoF to replace PoA?

I'm biased, because Prisoner of Azkaban is my favorite film in the Harry Potter series. But I gather that it's widely believed, and rightly so, that Goblet of Fire is more generally regarded as the greatest Potter film yet. Anybody mind if I edit this? - Caleb Osment 07:02, 3 March 2006 (UTC)[reply]

distant sequels

I think the Terminator sequels are distant sequels. Parodoxicaly, they are also prequels because of the time travel apsect of the movie.whicky1978 02:33, 23 April 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Indiana Jones

I've changed a sentance in the second last paragraph at the end of the "Titling of sequels" section, it originally said that Raiders of the Lost Ark had sequels, but that's not true, Temple of Doom was in fact a prequel. All I did was change the wording from "to better align it with its sequels." to "to better align it with its prequel and sequel." —Preceding unsigned comment added by It's me It's me (talk • contribs)

Quasi-sequel, midquel, interquel

I have merged quasi-sequel (now a redirect) as per suggestion. I also added redirect articles for midquel and interquel. All of these redirects point to sequel, but could be changed to redirect to Sequel#Other terms. mwazzap 08:49, 27 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]

I believe that interquel and midquel are actually the same thing (after one work, but before another). The Lion King 1 1/2 is actually the events of the original film from Timon and Pumbaa's point of view. That isn't the same.

Interquel and midquel are not the same thing. An interquel takes place between two previously completed works, and a midquel takes place during a previously completed work.

For example, the video game Metroid Prime was released after Metroid and Metroid II, but it takes place between them and is therefore an interquel.

On the other hand, in the video game Jak II, there's a two-year gap between the moments when the character of Jak is taken prisoner and when the character of Daxter rescues him. A later game titled Daxter takes place during this two-year gap, and is therefore a midquel.

I've never seen The Lion King 1½, but if it's simply a retelling of the events of The Lion King from another point of view, it's not an interquel or midquel or even a sidequel, but a parallel. This is similar to the novel Ender's Shadow, which retells the events of Ender's Game from another perspective. DT29 05:01, 9 January 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Harry Potter

HP was actually planned with 8 books, but Rowling made the decision to just make 7 instead.

Reply to unsigned comment: No, Hagrid says in book 1 that Hogwarts education lasts 7 years. EamonnPKeane 23:55, 27 October 2007 (UTC)[reply]

"Midquel"

I'm not exactly sure, but I believe the word "midquel" was invented on Wikipedia, or at least made up one day by a bored person. Whereas "interquel" at least has an entry on some Webster's editions, "midquel" seems to only exist as a result of Wikipedia, and just barely at that. Axem Titanium 22:07, 18 September 2007 (UTC)[reply]

I agree, a lot of this seems made up 141.151.79.241 03:28, 20 September 2007 (UTC)[reply]

What would you call this?

The upcoming Paul of Dune by Kevin J. Anderson and Brian Herbert will reportedly feature a section detailing the childhood of Paul Muad'Dib Atreides (therefore another prequel to Dune) and a section describing his Fremen Jihad (a sequel to Dune and prequel to Dune Messiah). The original Dune will, as a result, be sandwiched between the two sections of the new book. Anyone have a term for this one?

I'd like to suggest amphiquel..."a -quel on both sides". --SandChigger 03:43, 14 October 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Pirates of the Caribbean

In the article it's stated that PotC is an example of a pre-planned franchise for the purpose of franchise titles, but this is not technically the case. Pirates was developed without any sequels planned, and it was only after the success of the first film that they decided to expand it into a franchise. Perhaps another franchise should be used as an example. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Test0zero (talk • contribs) 18:28, 19 December 2007 (UTC)[reply]

'Triquel'?

Though I'm familiar with the concept, I've never heard this word used before, and it seems very much like a neologism to me. Can someone provide reliable sources to show that this word is, in fact, really in use to describe second sequels? If not, I'd suggest replacing it with 'threequel' (which is also a neologism, but a considerably more common one) or just 'second sequel'. Terraxos (talk) 04:41, 6 January 2008 (UTC)[reply]

I agree. I've never heard the term "Triquel", but "Threequel" is a very common (albeit relatively new) term. Hell, the People's Choice Awards even uses "threequel" in the name of one of their awards. Also, a Google search brings up about 8K hits for "Triquel" and almost 29K for "Threequel". TJ Spyke 06:05, 10 January 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Does this belong here at all?

It seems to be more appropriate, in its current form, for a series of definitions in an "urban dictionary", rather than an encyclopedia. Sinneed (talk) 03:53, 2 June 2008 (UTC)[reply]

I feel the same way. This seems more appropriate content for Wiktionary or some other site. This article feels like an unfortunate endorsement of jargon that writers should be trying to avoid if they are serious about writing encyclopedia quality articles that are understandable and accessible without requiring knowledge of the English language most native speakers don't even have. Move to Wiktionary? -- Horkana (talk) 00:32, 23 March 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Clean up

I would love to delete the "Midquel" section (and a few others) but there's a note pointing out that an article with that name exists and redirects here. ("Midquel" redirects to this section; do not change this title without changing the redirect point as well) I suggest someone nominate that article for speedy deletion.

Additionally, I'd add a cleanup tag or two but don't know the format. --70.128.121.235 (talk) 07:32, 9 March 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Every Section Using Unofficial Names Such as Midquel Should be Re-Worked

I'm sorry, Midquel is not a word. Any section that is not a real word (e.g. does not have an official entry in a dictionary or at least is a well known and accepted colloquialism) has no place in an encyclopedic article.

Midquel and Sidequel are the ones that stand out. Interquel and Threequel do in fact have entries with Websters so they can stay. 'Midquels' as the article puts it are already covered in concept with Interquels and Parallels. Sidquels are just called Side Stories. Other languages do have official worlds for this (i.e. Japanese uses Gaiden), but I do not think English does. Sidequel isn't a word.

I'd also go as far to say that the section Distant should be converted to a sub section of Sequel or Companion Piece. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 24.190.34.219 (talk) 04:05, 26 March 2009 (UTC)[reply]

list Midnight Sun as parallel?

Should that Twilight book that hasn't been written yet, Midnight Sun (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Midnight_Sun_(novel)) be added under "parallel"? —Preceding unsigned comment added by Web wonder (talk • contribs) 12:07, 26 May 2009 (UTC)[reply]

No. Excessive. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 96.243.180.70 (talk) 16:21, 10 August 2009 (UTC)[reply]

excessive examples of interquel

We don't need so many examples of what an interquel is.. how about fixing it so that it's just like two or three examples.. star wars, metroid and godfather maybe.. by the time you get to street fighter it's just like, "I GET IT".. y'know? besides that, street fighter is a poor example because it's so idiotically numbered. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 96.243.180.70 (talk) 16:19, 10 August 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Nothing, not even a mention of music albums

There are plenty of albums that are sequels. There should be as many albums mentioned in this article as there are films and games. I can't be certain, since I'm not into reading novels much, but there must be a lot of books that have sequels too. Pasta of Muppets (talk) 20:43, 3 February 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Books, yes, but albums don't usually have plots and chronology, so the connection is a lot harder to describe and lot more open to PoV issues. -- Thnidu (talk) 18:55, 14 October 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Album sequels, like Only Built 4 Cuban Linx... Pt. II, actually do exist. They may not have a cohesive "story" to connect with its predecessor, but they often follow common themes and topics. Enter Movie (talk) 22:30, 11 November 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Definition; ambiguity

The article uses two conflicting sense of "sequel", one broader and one narrower. (Underlining added.)

The first sentence says
A sequel is a work in literature, film, or other media that chronologically portrays events following those of a previous work.
But when we get to the first level-2 section, Chronologies, we read
There are a number of ways that subsequent works can be related to the chronology of the original.

Sequel

The most common approach is for the events of the second work to directly follow the events of the first, either picking up dangling plot threads or introducing a new conflict to drive the events of a second story. [This is the definition given in the opening as the only meaning.]

Prequel

A sequel that portrays events which precede those of the original work is called a "prequel." [Note the use of "sequel" here, contradicting the opening def.]

(followed by a slew of other terms).

Wiktionary provides both these senses, plus a deprecated third:

A narrative that is written after another narrative set in the same universe, [this is sense #1],
especially a narrative that is chronologically set after its predecessors, [sense #2]
or (perhaps improper usage) any narrative that has a preceding narrative of its own. [not used in this article]

I've borrowed from that wording to modify the opening sentence, with a link to Fictional universe.

--Thnidu (talk) 19:27, 14 October 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Requel

Why not add a heading for requels -- remakes/reboots that act as sequels. For eg, The Incredible Hulk was a requel to Hulk and Terminator Salvation which was supposed to be a reboot later became a sequel. There are many more examples. Why not give a few and write a heading??? Someone please reply as soon as possible.

Jinjanjaa (talk) 20:00, 24 June 2011 (IST)

Change "parallel" to "paraquel"

In the section on "Parallel" it says "citation needed", which I take to mean that there isn't really a consensus that this word is confirmed as the correct term for works of fiction that are chronologically concurrent but involve different, though related, circumstances from the original story. I would like to change this entry to be "paraquel" instead. Whereas I haven't really found "parallel" used much (especially since it's hard to make a Google search that disambiguates from the usual meanings of "parallel"), I've found various references to "paraquel": http://thestorytellersscroll.blogspot.jp/2011/03/what-is-paraquel.html http://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=paraquel http://jimhenry.conlang.org/review/paraquel.htm Also, I edited out part that described an example referring to a "Back To The Future" movie and took out the word "parallel". Parallel means "two things that run side by side but never touch". This seems inappropriate for describing characters and events that intertwine to some degree (even if one side only observes the other, they change their actions based on their observations.) I hope these edits are acceptable. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Ebisumartin (talk • contribs) 15:23, 11 August 2012 (UTC)[reply]

None of those sources for "paraquel" are WP:RS. Anybody can edit Urban Dictioanary. The first cite is a blog, as is the third: http://jimhenry.conlang.org/review/paraquel.htm, and that says he coined it. So it was made up by "Jim Henry" in 2008. Not really a great pedigree. Parallel is a real word and the meaning is obvious. So I have reverted that. It doesn't have to be a mathematically perfect analogy to use the word. Barsoomian (talk) 19:22, 11 August 2012 (UTC)[reply]

Yes the examples linked to can be "edited by anybody" (just like this site), but at least they are examples. Whereas "parallel" remains completely unsupported. I think marginal support for a term should beat no support for a term, shouldn't it? — Preceding unsigned comment added by Ebisudave (talk • contribs) 02:35, 15 August 2012 (UTC)[reply]

The word "parallel" is a real word. Here for example part of the Oxford English Dictionary definition in the sense used here.

parallel
2b. Concurrent or contemporary; existing in the same period of time.
1859 C. Darwin Origin of Species x. 325 This great fact of the parallel succession of the forms of life throughout the world, is explicable on the theory of natural selection.
1878 W. Stubbs Constit. Hist. III. xviii. 131 The parallel lines of war and negotiation run on for three years more.

There are 110,000 hits for "parallel novel". There are zero for "paraquel novel". Barsoomian (talk) 03:53, 15 August 2012 (UTC)[reply]

Sorry, I don't mean to be argumentative about this and belabour the point. However, after some thought, I realized that making a heading for "Parallel" is being just as prescriptivist as my suggestion for "paraquel". The reason being that "sequel" and "prequel" are nouns. In this instance of usage, "parallel" is an adjective. People say "that is a parallel story". "Parallel" modifies "story", it does not stand in for it. I do not doubt you that there are more instances of people saying "a parallel novel", but that is representative of the adjectival usage, not evidence that "parallel" stands on its own as a noun in this context.

It should also be noted that your search is flawed in that not only did you use the word parallel as an adjective, you restrained yourself to novels. Looking up the term "paraquel" on its own reveals more than zero results, such as this movie review, which uses "paraquel" as a matter of course, not simply as a proposal for the word.

No one says "that is a parallel" the same way they say "that is a prequel" or "that is a "sequel". To describe the adjective "parallel" in the same level of category as "prequel" or "sequel" or even "interquel" is being prescriptivist. Whereas the argument being made against "paraquel" is that Wikipedia is supposed to be descriptivist.

Therefor, it seems to me the most objective solution which is representative of the reality of the situation is to simply state that fact: that there is a slight lexical gap, that the common usage is to *describe* stories as "parallel" (as opposed to *naming* them "parallel"), and that people have proposed ways of closing the lexical gap. I see that someone edited the entry to say "It's hard to know what to call it", but that's not right either. We know what to call it - we call it a parallel story. We just don't have an agreed upon one-word for it.

I have been bold enough to propose an edit that takes these considerations into account, and I hope this will be accepted. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Ebisumartin (talk • contribs) 03:55, 30 August 2012 (UTC)[reply]

1) Please learn how to sign your name with ~~~~ 2) Parallel is also a noun, and regardless, the whole article is about "stories", we don't need to state it in every heading. 3) None of the other wacky words has any reliable source, and any currency outside a few blogs. Enshrining them in Wikipedia will give them an appearance of authority; WP is just supposed to record accepted knowledge, not help to promulgate new words. And what do you think you were doing by removing the quote from Card where he explains the use of "parallel", which was the whole point of the citation? -- your first post here was about the "citation needed" which is why I went to the trouble to document it.

And see this book cover "Ender's Shadow: A parallel novel to Ender's Game" on the cover. Barsoomian (talk) 04:26, 30 August 2012 (UTC)[reply]

Splendid, an example in the wild of parallel as an adjective. —Tamfang (talk) 05:59, 30 August 2012 (UTC)[reply]

Should "Remake" be listed?

The article has a section for Reboot all ready, should Remake be listed as well, perhaps as a subsection to the "Reboot" section?

I admit that I'm a little unclear as to the difference between the two, but there does appear to be one. Furthermore, if one is listed, I think that the other has just as much merit. 97.124.72.24 (talk) 05:09, 29 August 2013 (UTC)[reply]

^ reboot is a re imagining like the new spider man films, whereas a remake is a new version of and old movie like willy wonka or evil dead — Preceding unsigned comment added by 81.137.250.32 (talk) 08:33, 4 September 2014 (UTC)[reply]

Appropriate WikiProjects

I'm looking to add templates to rate this article as 'C' class (due to lack of supporting materials) at least 'mid' importance for the following WikiProjects (based on the article lead):

but was looking for comment or consensus before I did so (since it is quite an extensive list, and there are no current templates and no discussion). This would be wrapped in {{WikiProjectBanners}} — Sasuke Sarutobi (talk) 13:29, 7 January 2014 (UTC)[reply]

Fanfiction

Should there be some discussion of fanfiction on this page? Possibly under the heading "Unofficial sequels"? — Preceding unsigned comment added by 108.48.117.103 (talk) 00:23, 10 March 2014 (UTC)[reply]

im bothered about stand-alones

so Toy Story 4 will be released in a standalone format...and most of the films ive watched that are standalones have low ratings

is every standalone sequels have low ratings?if no,give examples.if yes,why?

John kaiser (talk) 02:13, 7 March 2015 (UTC)[reply]