User talk:Ian Rose

    Hi and welcome to Ian's Talk. Please leave new comments at the end of the page. Unless requested otherwise, I will reply to you here to keep the conversation thread in one place. Cheers, Ian.

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79 Sqn World War II battle honours

Hi Ian, an editor has asked in the FAC for 79 Sqn why its World War II battle honours were awarded in 2010. I've poked around for information on this, but come up with nothing. Do you know the answer to this question? I presume that it's the result of an honours review process like the one the RAN conducted which resulted in many of its ships receiving battle honours for long-past wars and conflicts, but can't find confirmation of this. Thanks, Nick-D (talk) 00:37, 2 July 2011 (UTC)

Mmm, I don't know the reason in this instance, I can only note that it seems to be part of a retrospective honours trend that's also recently seen the actions of people like Simpson, Waller, and Sheean being revisited with a view to possibly awarding VCs (I know this pops up occasionally anyway but the most recent mention looked more serious, and hopefully it was). Cheers, Ian Rose (talk) 01:15, 2 July 2011 (UTC)

Congratulations

		The WikiChevrons
		The WikiChevrons are hereby bestowed upon Ian Rose for his efforts in the June 2011 Military History monthly article writing Contest, placing equal first with a total of 21 points from two articles. Well done! Cheers, AustralianRupert (talk) 16:36, 2 July 2011 (UTC)

Nice job Ian, I thought we were going to tie for second behind Parsec :-) Ed ^{[talk] [majestic titan]} 20:19, 2 July 2011 (UTC)

Likewise, Ed -- I wonder if this is the record for lowest winning score... ;-) Tks Rupert as well! Cheers, Ian Rose (talk) 23:28, 2 July 2011 (UTC)

WT:WikiProject Military history/Strategy#Ambassadorship

Interested in your thoughts. - Dank (push to talk) 16:18, 3 July 2011 (UTC)

Four Award

		Four Award
		Congratulations! You have been awarded the Four Award for your work from beginning to end on John McCauley.

Great work, again! As you are one of the first editors to use the new {{Four Award Nomination}} template, is it easier or harder to use than the previous copy and paste method? Cheers, LittleMountain5 15:35, 5 July 2011 (UTC)

Thanks mate. Generally simpler, except I first pasted in a diff of recent additions instead of just the Wikilink, so perhaps that could be spelt out (or maybe I misread) -- still showed up as external link something but looked odd with extra brackets being thown in by the template... Cheers, Ian Rose (talk) 21:53, 5 July 2011 (UTC)

New RAAF book due in August

This looks really promising: Whispering Death: Australian airmen in the Pacific War Nick-D (talk) 01:45, 6 July 2011 (UTC)

Indeed -- if its depth matches its apparent breadth, I can see updates to a whole swag of articles, from the ace and senior officer bios to Morotai Mutiny and (naturally) No. 1 Wing... ;-) Just not sure how they figure "the first one-volume history of the RAAF's immense conflict with Japan" -- what was Odgers then?! Cheers, Ian Rose (talk) 10:16, 6 July 2011 (UTC)

Gillison covered the period up to the end of 1942 ;) Nick-D (talk) 12:12, 6 July 2011 (UTC)

Good point -- a year is a long time in war, even if there was some overlap between the two... Cheers, Ian Rose (talk) 12:17, 6 July 2011 (UTC)

WikiProject Australia triple crown

Your Majesty Ian Rose, I am pleased to award this special edition triple crown in thanks for your contributions of DYK, GA and FC at WikiProject Australia. Thank you for volunteering to build a better encyclopedia. – SMasters (talk) 06:31, 6 July 2011 (UTC)

Many thanks mate, and thanks Bryce Abraham for the nom! Cheers, Ian Rose (talk) 10:30, 6 July 2011 (UTC)

ACR Issue

Hello. You closed an ACR that did not meet consensus today. This proves most awkward, as I have been running about like a blue-arsed fly asking people for an ACR for ages, due to a lack of seeming willing reviewers. Now I'm in the position where that effort has gone to utter waste: 2 reviewers had given Support and I have just gotten a message from someone willing to offer another ACR after 2 other requests have been ignored or unseen, and another turned down. Perhaps, given that you closed my ACR without warning, you might advise me how I'm supposed to go through the notoriously time-consuming procedure or reopening a repeat ACR and starting all over again, much to my annoyance. Ma®©usBritish (talk) 22:47, 11 July 2011 (UTC)

Nevermind, figured it out myself.. Ma®©usBritish (talk) 00:22, 12 July 2011 (UTC)

Milhist FA, A-Class and Peer Reviews Apr–Jun 2011

		The WikiChevrons
		By order of the Military history WikiProject coordinators, for your devoted contributions to the WikiProject's Peer, A-Class and Featured Article reviews for the period Apr–Jun 2011, I am delighted to award you the WikiChevrons. AustralianRupert (talk) 08:42, 16 July 2011 (UTC)

Thanks very much for the gong, and especially the tallying beforehand...! Cheers, Ian Rose (talk) 10:13, 16 July 2011 (UTC)

The Bugle: Issue LXIV, June 2011

Your Military History Newsletter Project news: From the editors; medal recipients; contest results Articles: The month's featured and A-class Milhist content Book reviews: Nick-D looks at Finland and Spitfires Op-ed: Fifelfoo and hunting for plagiarism

To receive this newsletter on your talk page, join the project or sign up here. If you are a member who does not want delivery, please go to this page. BrownBot (talk) 23:09, 16 July 2011 (UTC)

Featured Article promotion

	Congratulations!
	Thanks for all the work you did in making Valston Hancock a Featured Article! Your work is much appreciated. Thanks also for your reviews. Featured article candidates and Good Article nominees always need more reviewers! All the best, – Quadell (talk)

Love that roundel -- many tks! Cheers, Ian Rose (talk) 14:45, 28 July 2011 (UTC)

SF magazines

I have a lot of sf references (see the library link in my sig); I've been collecting them for years. There are only three or four that are really critical for a good article, though: they are the Tymn/Ashley Science Fiction, Fantasy and Weird Fiction Magazines, and Ashley's series The Time Machines, Transformations, and Gateways to Forever. They're not that cheap second hand; for some reason Time Machines is running at $50 on used.addall.com, which is the best secondhand book site I know of; the other two Ashley's are around $20, and the cheapest Tymn/Ashley I can see is $93. If you're interested in these titles let me know and I'll let you know if I see keep copies for sale (I do some second-hand book dealing on the side).

If you see a magazine article that you would like to work on, let me know -- I've done varying amounts of work on New Worlds, Astounding Science Fiction, Famous Fantastic Mysteries, and Tales of Wonder, each of which I think could get to FA, though Astounding would be hard because of the lack of sources covering the more recent decades. Ashley's next volume won't be out for at least a year, so there's little coverage after 1985. Or there are plenty of other magazines: F&SF, Asimov's Science Fiction, Future Science Fiction, Science Fiction Adventures (actually there are three of those), Other Worlds, and many more. If you're interested, let me know; if not, I'll just keep ploughing through them gradually. Thanks for the review and support at FAC, by the way! Mike Christie (talk - contribs - library) 23:26, 28 July 2011 (UTC)

Heh, at my house it's not so much the expense of books as the number we already have... ;-) I might look around here first but tks for offer. Re. the articles to work on, I guess the defunct ones are always easier, though Astounding/Analog would be a great one to get to FA, as would F&SF. FFM is tempting, but let me look at the others, there's plenty to work on as you've said, which would keep anyone busy while waiting for a new edition of Ashley's history to help with the extant titles. Cheers, Ian Rose (talk) 02:04, 29 July 2011 (UTC)

Four Award

		Four Award
		Congratulations! You have been awarded the Four Award for your work from beginning to end on Valston Hancock. LittleMountain5 16:10, 30 July 2011 (UTC)

Here's another—you're on a roll! LittleMountain5 16:10, 30 July 2011 (UTC)

Thanks mate! Cheers, Ian Rose (talk) 23:54, 30 July 2011 (UTC)

Congratulations

		The Writer's Barnstar
		For placing second in the July 2011 Military history WikiProject Contest with 35 points from five entries, I am delighted to present you with The Writer's Barnstar. Excellent work! Parsecboy (talk) 13:09, 1 August 2011 (UTC)

Talk:Arthur Bedford - Assessment?

When you have time User:Ian Rose, could you assess the article located here Talk:Arthur Bedford? I've added the Military History template. It would be appreciated. Adamdaley (talk) 00:53, 2 August 2011 (UTC)

Added my comments. Cheers, Ian Rose (talk) 03:06, 2 August 2011 (UTC)

Avichai Rontzki - Assessment?

User:Ian Rose,

Could you please do another assessment of Avichai Rontzki and add any Military banner stuff to the template? I feel the part where he fought in a war after training should be under "Cold War" period. Once again, it would be appreciated. Adamdaley (talk) 02:23, 2 August 2011 (UTC)

Thanks

Thanks for pointing the errors in my entries. What a pity, regarding the XF-108 – you could have passed it on 1 August, instead of 29 July :P As with the AV-8B, I updated the class from C to B myself; in hind sight, that was pretty stupid. What's more stupid is the fact that I didn't enter last month's contest, when I had at least five GAs. Sp33dyphil ^{"Ad astra"} 07:25, 4 August 2011 (UTC)

No not stupid, not at all -- the bit about not assessing "your" articles to B-Class (Stub and Start, and I think C-Class, are cool) is not that obvious except by convention, and we've all wished we entered things in contests when we didn't, me included! If you keep up your efforts you'll do well no matter what... ;-) Cheers, Ian Rose (talk) 08:04, 4 August 2011 (UTC)

Good Article promotion

	You did it again!
	Another round of congratulations are in order for all the work you did in making William Anderson (RAAF officer) a certified "Good Article"! (He was already sporting a certified "Good mustache".) Thank you; your work is much appreciated. All the best, – Quadell (talk)

Heh-heh, you're very kind and I'm sure Bill Anderson would appreciate the gesture as well... ;-) Cheers, Ian Rose (talk) 15:48, 5 August 2011 (UTC)

WP:FOUR for Morotai Mutiny

		Four Award
		Congratulations! You have been awarded the Four Award for your work from beginning to end on Morotai Mutiny. TonyTheTiger (T/C/BIO/WP:CHICAGO/WP:FOUR) 00:34, 7 August 2011 (UTC)

--TonyTheTiger (T/C/BIO/WP:CHICAGO/WP:FOUR) 00:34, 7 August 2011 (UTC)

Thank you very much Tony, I assume this must've become eligible due to rule changes -- if so the main award page needs to be updated as this is still given as an example of an ineligible article... ;-) Cheers, Ian Rose (talk) 03:46, 7 August 2011 (UTC)

Coordinator notice

Hi Ian, I've posted a note at Wikipedia talk:WikiProject Military history/Coordinators saying that the article McDonnell XF-85 Goblin is ready to be promoted. I see that you are a MilHist coordinator, so I'm wondering if you think the article is ready to go. Cheers! Sp33dyphil ^{"Ad astra"} 06:27, 10 August 2011 (UTC)

Hi mate, I did see it listed and from memory it looked ready to close/promote when I glanced at the nom page, I just haven't been able to guarantee myself the requisite time to do these things lately -- however if no-one gets to it beforehand I should be able to take care of it by the w/e. Cheers, Ian Rose (talk) 07:29, 10 August 2011 (UTC)

Oh yay! Thanks for the reply. Cheers! Sp33dyphil ^{"Ad astra"} 08:05, 10 August 2011 (UTC)

Thanks for the promotion! Cheers! Sp33dyphil ^{"Ad astra"} 23:34, 12 August 2011 (UTC)

Balmer

Hi Ian, The following book has a rather good four page biography of John Balmer: Grantham, Sid (1991). The 13 Squadron Story : An illustrated amalgam of the official and unofficial history of No. 13 Squadron R.A.A.F. during its wartime existence from 1940 to 1946 : A brief history of No. 13 (City of Darwin) Active Reserve Squadron, newly re-formed in Darwin in 1989. Dee Why, NSW: S.R. Grantham, for the 13 Squadron Story Book Fund. ISBN 0646026321. The downside is that it might not be a reliable source as it's self published. The book appears to be heavily based on the squadron's war diary, and the bio of Balmer appears to have drawn on his official file or similar so it's not a bad source, I just don't know if it would pass the standards in an ACR, much less a FAC. Nick-D (talk) 07:41, 10 August 2011 (UTC)

Very kind of you to let me know, mate. I might have a look for it anyway, as well as the Beaufort one you pointed out, when I get some more time. Cheers, Ian Rose (talk) 10:21, 10 August 2011 (UTC)

The Bugle: Issue LXV, July 2011

Your Military History Newsletter Project news: From the editors; medal recipients; contest results Articles: The month's featured and A-class Milhist content Book reviews: Nick-D looks at Zeebrugee and Afghanistan Op-ed: WereSpielChequers examines RfA

To receive this newsletter on your talk page, join the project or sign up here. If you are a member who does not want delivery, please go to this page. BrownBot (talk) 22:15, 14 August 2011 (UTC)

talkback

Hello, Ian Rose. You have new messages at WT:MIL.
You can remove this notice at any time by removing the {{Talkback}} or {{Tb}} template.

- Dank (push to talk) 19:17, 15 August 2011 (UTC)

Ashes to Ashes

Hi Ian, New to all this but wanted to comment on the discussion about the Video for Ashes to Ashes, hope this is the right place. Slightly miffed by suggestion that pictures were the result of a camera fault as I was the video engineer on the shoot. Neither was it Quantel Paintbox which was still a year away! The cameras were Bosch Fernseh KCR40s which allowed for easy adjustment of the individual colour channel gammas. That was the main 'effect' used. The black sky was a luma key done by another engineer on the miniscule mixer in the Ewart TV truck. All this was done before it went to tape (and produced some whinging from the VT record engineer!) I had worked with David Mallet before and the direction was 'Make it look interesting'. David Bowie looked at the result and OK'd it. Next shot I was told 'Make it look different interesting' A lot of fun, I still remember first hearing Ashes to Ashes booming out over that Beach. The padded cell was used for years afterwards as a makeshift voice booth in Wandsworth. My guess for budget would be rather nearer £25k than £250k. The catering truck worked miracles though. Let me know if I should add this or send something via you. I could also dig out a couple of stills I took on the shoot. All the best Adrian7077 (talk) 21:21, 15 August 2011 (UTC)

Hi Adrian, thanks for stopping by! To be honest the £250k figure sounded high to me when I put it in, but it was cited in David Buckley's bio. On the other hand Nick Pegg said £25k so as far as Wikipedia goes, the smaller figure is just as verifiable... ;-) As the guy who created this article way back and has tried to maintain it, I'd welcome getting the facts straight and I fully understand you might feel miffed at misinformation in the article, given personal involvement. The thing with Wikipedia is that it wants third party sources so can some of this be sourced from any magazines or press cuttings you might have? Unfortunately the rules round here don't allow anecdotal stuff, no matter who might be writing it. If the stills are your personal property and you're prepared to effectively give them to the world, I can help you with the licensing if you'd like upload them and add them in. Hope to hear back from you, mate. Cheers, Ian Rose (talk) 10:57, 16 August 2011 (UTC)

Hi Ian, Sadly the only third party source I can think of is a trade magazine which was always so inaccurate when talking about anything I was involved with I long ago gave up trusting it. But if that is where our history is to come from so be it. Just don't believe a fault or an unreleased piece of kit created Ashes to Ashes. Thinking about it I'd better forget the stills as we weren't supposed to use cameras during the shoot so I don't know if I would have copyright. Thanks for your guidance though. Cheers Adrian7077 (talk) 21:11, 16 August 2011 (UTC)

Hi again. I understand re. the pics. Re. the errors, I re-read the article and now I think back, the bit about Quantel Paintbox was inserted into the middle of that sentence by a later editor. I've removed it since, apart from being, as you say, plain wrong since it wasn't even around then, it naturally wasn't cited in either of the sources used at the end of the statement. For now I've left the inflated budget sourced to Buckley until I can get a quick look at Pegg's book to confirm the page number for his lower figure. I'm not sure where the bit about an accident is in the article -- or was it on the talk page? Anyway, if you do want to add more that can be sourced to the trade mag, feel free -- I can help out with the citation format if necessary. Needless to say, I envy your experience on this shoot...! Cheers, Ian Rose (talk) 13:06, 17 August 2011 (UTC)

WP:Military History and WP:Espionage Merge?

On the WikiProject Military History disucussion page there is talk about a merge and eliminating WP:Espionage altogether. Would like your feedback there. It would be appreciated. Adamdaley (talk) 08:26, 21 August 2011 (UTC)

Stylized infoboxes

Hello Ian - Neutral party here. I was visiting Horatio Nelson and noticed the infobox. It does have precedent. JMOprof (talk) 14:35, 25 August 2011 (UTC)

Hi there, sorry for not responding sooner. Yes, I have seen it around occasionally, but the the most common formatting for military person infoboxes that I've seen is the simpler one with just the name. Cheers, Ian Rose (talk) 15:03, 31 August 2011 (UTC)

Featured Article promotion

	Congratulations!
	Thanks for all the work you did in making Alister Murdoch a Featured Article! Please accept this barnstar, direct to you via airmail. Your work is much appreciated. – Quadell (talk)

Heh, witty as ever, Quadrell -- thank you very much, your acts of recognition and kindness are much appreciated as well... :-) Cheers, Ian Rose (talk) 15:06, 31 August 2011 (UTC)

Four Award

		Four Award
		Congratulations! You have been awarded the Four Award for your work from beginning to end on Alister Murdoch. LittleMountain5 15:55, 31 August 2011 (UTC)

Here's yet another; great work! LittleMountain5 15:55, 31 August 2011 (UTC)

Many tks! Cheers, Ian Rose (talk) 14:18, 1 September 2011 (UTC)

G'day, mate!

Slouching Australian!

It suddenly occurred to me that this chap couldn't be more of a stereotypical Aussie if he was singing Waltzing Maltida" So, in recognition of your astounding efforts on RAAF officer biographies (and because I want to see how WikiLove's "make your own" feature works!), I present you this slouching Australian with the funny hat and his hands in his pockets! ;) HJ Mitchell | Penny for your thoughts? 10:32, 5 September 2011 (UTC)

Heh, that image was always one of my faves from the Australian War Memorial site... ;-) Many thanks for the thought, HJ, especially coming from an accomplished MilHist biographer such as yourself...! Cheers, Ian Rose (talk) 12:25, 5 September 2011 (UTC)

Battle of Battle Mountain

We're edit-conflicting on this one; I'm discovering some significant problems. - Dank (push to talk) 14:55, 5 September 2011 (UTC)

Mate, it's been sitting there for ages waiting to be closed and there was nothing in the review or coord's talk page to indicate issues -- I think if one is reviewing at this stage then the onus is on them to flag it when the notice has been there so long. I don't want to undo the closure procedure; perhaps we just need to deal with the issues on the talk page... Cheers, Ian Rose (talk) 15:01, 5 September 2011 (UTC)

• Ah, I see, I thought I had posted more on the review page than I had. I had to do some research on this one and was just posting the results when we edit-conflicted. Not a problem, I'll continue on the talk page. - Dank (push to talk) 15:17, 5 September 2011 (UTC)
  • Tks Dan. I'm sure the queries can be resolved fairly quickly on talk. Cheers, Ian Rose (talk) 15:40, 5 September 2011 (UTC)

Bugle

Hey Ian, I'm totally swamped right now with real life stuff (yay college!). Is there any chance you can get the blurbs for the articles formatted for me? I should be able to write the editor's note on Wednesday, and the book reviews are done and in Nick's userspace (all I'll need to do is move them in). We don't have an op-ed for this month, so I guess we just won't run one? Ed ^{[talk] [majestic titan]} 04:17, 6 September 2011 (UTC)

Well, I was going to close out a few more ACRs tonight but happy to transfer my efforts to the article blurbs. I've always planned to submit an op-ed some time but never got round to it so unfortunately I don't have one up my sleeve -- but if the inspiration strikes on Wednesday, you never know... ;-) Anyway, article blurbs first...! Cheers, Ian Rose (talk) 06:45, 6 September 2011 (UTC)

I've just moved the book reviews to Wikipedia:WikiProject Military history/News/August 2011/Book reviews - I suspect that the content would benefit from a fresh pair of eyes reading through it for grammatical problems. Nick-D (talk) 07:29, 6 September 2011 (UTC)

Okay, Ed, I think the article blurbs are pretty much done; I may tweak a bit further tomorrow but they could probably go out more or less as is if need be. Cheers, Ian Rose (talk) 15:05, 6 September 2011 (UTC)

Thanks very much, both of you. I'll finish it up tomorrow and get it out asap. Ed ^{[talk] [majestic titan]} 15:06, 6 September 2011 (UTC)

RE:Semi retirement

Hi Ian, thanks for your kind words, I'm scaling back due to real-life commitments that severely limit my time on Wikipedia. I will hopefully be popping in from time to time and I haven't taken any of the MILHIST pages off my watchlist (I did halve it from 2,000 though) so I should pop in occasionally. All the best, Woody (talk) 09:31, 6 September 2011 (UTC)

That's good to hear mate. Halving the watchlist from 2,000? Now that's something I should aspire to...! ;-) Cheers, Ian Rose (talk) 10:18, 6 September 2011 (UTC)

Talkback

Hello, Ian Rose. You have new messages at The ed17's talk page.
Message added 05:17, 7 September 2011 (UTC). You can remove this notice at any time by removing the {{Talkback}} or {{Tb}} template.

Ed ^{[talk] [majestic titan]} 05:17, 7 September 2011 (UTC)

Replied again. :-) Ed ^{[talk] [majestic titan]} 14:20, 8 September 2011 (UTC)

Bugle Op-Ed

Hi, Ian. I added a comment to the ten-year anniversary of the 11 September attacks. However, I must confess that my English is far from perfect. Could you read my message and correct any error you might find, please? Kind regards, --Lecen (talk) 02:44, 10 September 2011 (UTC)

I could find nothing that needed correction -- thank you for contributing! Cheers, Ian Rose (talk) 05:52, 10 September 2011 (UTC)

If you think this is worth posting please feel free.

"I remember September 11 very well. Due to the 6 hour time difference it was already early afternoon in Germany when the attacks occurred. I had left work early to take my son to the dentist, something he didn’t enjoy very much so I promised him that we would go shopping afterwards. Boys being boys all over the world he took me to the local shopping mall wanting to buy a new computer game, CD or something. When we entered the electronics and media store we noticed groups of people standing around the various television sets, watching what we initially believed to be Independence Day. We walked over to the computer games section when we starting asking ourselves why this normally so crowded store is so empty. My son settled for some CD and we walked over to the cashier again passing the television section. People were still watching, standing, debating in shock. Only then did we realize that some important had happened. We kept staring at the television set for minutes that turned into hours in disbelief." MisterBee1966 (talk) 13:31, 10 September 2011 (UTC)

• I have posted it -- thank you for that! Cheers, Ian Rose (talk) 14:00, 10 September 2011 (UTC)

The Bugle: Issue LXVI, August 2011

Your Military History Newsletter Project news: From the editors; medal recipients; contest results Articles: The month's featured and A-class Milhist content Book reviews: Nick-D looks at Carthage and Australia in Palestine Op-ed: Remembering 9/11

To receive this newsletter on your talk page, join the project or sign up here. If you are a member who does not want delivery, please go to this page. EdwardsBot (talk) 18:04, 11 September 2011 (UTC)

Ziggy Stardust

I'm sorry. I'm new to Wiki-Editing. What would you consider a reliable source? Wiki Factualizor (talk) 04:29, 12 September 2011 (UTC)

Sorry for not replying sooner -- here's some info on WP's guidelines for that. Cheers, Ian Rose (talk) 10:24, 13 September 2011 (UTC)

Re: Bugle Op-Ed

Hi, Ian. I appreciate the invite. I could not have made it though; I was taking a Wiki-break during the weekend and I have little to add to recollections of the event. Thank you for the offer nonetheless. Jappalang (talk) 05:48, 13 September 2011 (UTC)

No prob. A weekend without Wiki, eh -- I admire your will power...! ;-) Cheers, Ian Rose (talk) 09:43, 13 September 2011 (UTC)

'Abd al-Ilah Article

Ian Rose,

I've come across an article named 'Abd al-Ilah. I find the Notes and References are mixed up (See my comment on it's discussion page). I'll see if WikiProject Biography can help fix it up somehow. Adamdaley (talk) 11:09, 15 September 2011 (UTC)

Should be okay now, mate. Cheers, Ian Rose (talk) 12:28, 15 September 2011 (UTC)

Congratulations!

I think you may need to install extra shelf space... EyeSerene^talk 16:31, 15 September 2011 (UTC)

		The Military history A-Class medal with swords
		By order of the coordinators of the Military history WikiProject, you are hereby awarded the A-Class medal with Swords for outstanding work on James Rowland (RAAF officer), David Evans (RAAF officer) and John Balmer, promoted to A-Class between July and September 2011. EyeSerenetalk 16:31, 15 September 2011 (UTC)