Talk:John of Garland

Text and/or other creative content from this version of Johannes de Garlandia (philologist) was copied or moved into John of Garland with this edit. The former page's history now serves to provide attribution for that content in the latter page, and it must not be deleted as long as the latter page exists.

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Proposed merger

Yes, I was never aware of the John of Garland article: I hadn't encountered that form of his name. They should be merged. Andrew Dalby 19:47, 25 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Just to clarify, this was not a proposal to merge the musicologist and the grammarian (in fact, it was I who separated them, I think). This was a proposal to merge the Latin and the English form of the grammarian's name. Andrew Dalby 21:11, 12 January 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Merger again

I am pretty sure there is only one Johannes de Garlandia. Not only is it a pretty singular name, at least one source in my possession identifies him as a musicologist and grammarian. The dates are uncertain, I believe this is a single individual. Guy (Help!) 00:00, 21 December 2007 (UTC)[reply]

They're two different people. More recent research, as shown in the article on Johannes de Garlandia in the online New Grove, clearly separates them, with the caveat that the name of the later individual -- the music theorist -- is not entirely certain. The most complete treatment of the issue seems to be in an article by M. Huglo: "La notation franconienne: antécédents et devenir", in La notation des musiques polyphoniques aux XI–XIIIe siècles (Poitiers, 1986) and pub as part of Cahiers de civilisation médiévale, xxxi/2 in 1988 (pp. 123–32). It's a confused issue, but the specifics of his work on music theory make it impossible for at least one of these people to have lived before the very end of the 13th century. Antandrus (talk) 15:34, 12 January 2008 (UTC)[reply]

... while this one (the grammarian), according to his autobiography, was active as a teacher from around 1220; and he lists his own works rather obsessively, and there is nothing about music in the list. (The list is quoted on the Latin page la:Iohannes de Garlandia (grammaticus).) Andrew Dalby 21:09, 12 January 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Since there hasn't been any other comment, I'm removing the "merge" tag for the present; but if anyone wants to cite specifically any modern research arguing that the two are one, by all means do. Andrew Dalby 21:28, 3 March 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Requested move 2 November 2017

The following is a closed discussion of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on the talk page. Editors desiring to contest the closing decision should consider a move review. No further edits should be made to this section.

The result of the move request was: moved. Due to a merge in 2006, a history swap will also be performed to preserve the attribution history. Mahveotm, this did not need another relist. Jenks24 (talk) 07:29, 18 November 2017 (UTC)[reply]

Johannes de Garlandia (philologist) → John of Garland – This author is normally known in English as 'John of Garland': see for example the Oxford Dictionary of National Bibliography. AndrewNJ (talk) 18:32, 2 November 2017 (UTC) --Relisting. Regards, Krishna Chaitanya Velaga (talk • mail) 02:37, 10 November 2017 (UTC) --Relisting. ʍaɦʋɛօtʍ (talk) 08:52, 17 November 2017 (UTC)[reply]

I agree.

There would still be a need for a hatnote distinguishing him from the musicologist, because, as seen in the discussion above, the two have often been confused. Andrew Dalby 09:35, 3 November 2017 (UTC)[reply]

I also agree. The VIAF tells us that English-speaking cataloging authorities—the American LOC, as well as the Australian and the Irish national libraries—identify his work under "John of Garland". Belastro (talk) 22:11, 16 November 2017 (UTC)[reply]

The above discussion is preserved as an archive of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on this talk page or in a move review. No further edits should be made to this section.