Talk:Mizrah

A fact from Mizrah appeared on Wikipedia's Main Page in the Did you know column on 8 November 2006. The text of the entry was as follows:

Did you know... that it is customary in Jewish homes to decorate the wall in the direction of prayer — mizrah — with artistic wall plaques (pictured) inscribed with the word mizrah, scriptural passages, kabbalistic writings, or pictures of holy places?

A record of the entry may be seen at Wikipedia:Recent additions/2006/November.

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Spelling?

While Wikipedia doesn't have an official policy on transcription yet, shouldn't something like "mizrach", "mizraẖ", or "mizrakh" be used instead of "mizrah"? The latter creates confusion because it overlaps with a different sound (ה). I skimmed the article and it appears to use "kh" for the /χ/ sound reasonably consistently save for the title itself. But most other Wikipedia articles seem to transcribe /χ/ using "ch"... -- prezzey 15:28, 5 November 2006 (UTC)[reply]

I've chosen Encyclopedia Judaica's spelling. Beit Or 16:20, 5 November 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Romanization of Hebrew has a good discussion of why the issues you have pointed out are not unique to this article. Beit Or 16:35, 5 November 2006 (UTC)[reply]

I agree. It's really confusing to see it spelled "mizrah" when it's pronounced "mizrakh". Kolindigo 19:04, 7 November 2006 (UTC)[reply]

My guess is that Kolindigo is Ashkenazi. Many (most?) Sefaradim pronounce that letter more mildly than Ashkenazim do (though admittedly a bit harder than a plain English "h" sound) and that's why they prefer transliterating it this way. --Keeves 22:41, 7 November 2006 (UTC)[reply]

I guess you're thinking of /ħ/? That's still not /h/. I don't see why the two should be conflated. We're talking about 2 different phonemes here. -- prezzey 00:58, 8 November 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Is there a way to have an 'h' with a dot or line under it? That's been the way many have solved the h/ch problem. The way it looks now, it might as well say "Mizra". Valley2city 17:07, 8 November 2006 (UTC)[reply]

I don't think it's a good idea. Many people will just stare at this 'h' with a dot or line under it wondering what on earth it may mean. In addition, such symbols are not good for typing. Beit Or 18:44, 8 November 2006 (UTC)[reply]

The usual transcription here on Wikipedia seems to be "ch". -- prezzey 22:53, 8 November 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Most English speaking places where the letter chet is transliterated, it is replaced with an 'h'. This is because Sifaradi and most non-Ashkinazi Jews pronounce the chet not as the 'ch' in "Bach" (the piano guy), but like a hard sound comming from the back of the throat. I believe "kh" and "ch" both would be pronounced as in "Bach", so it shouldn't be used in the title. A modified 'h' seems to be in order. Always keep in mind the spelling people use in searches. By the way, I'm Ashkinazi.HaravM 22:04, 21 November 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Direction

It should be mentioned pretty early that this only applies to places WEST of Israel. The Hatikvah, for example, really only talks about the Jews of Ashkenaz and Sephard, but not of Mizrachi Jews who lived east of Israel and would have faced west in prayer. Valley2city 02:30, 8 November 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Also, if you live in South America, you wouldn't face east. You would face north-north-east.HaravM 22:04, 21 November 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Synagogues facing south

Keeves, please read WP:V carefully. Material must be verifiable through reliable sources; "I went there and saw it" is original research, pure and simple. Beit Or 14:18, 8 November 2006 (UTC)[reply]

I was afraid you'd say that. Unfortunately for me, while it is easy to find photos of a synagogue's exterior, documenting the orientation of the interior is very difficult. Okay, you win, I'm removing that line. --Keeves 14:37, 8 November 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Facing South in America is not part of Jewish law, so don't mention places that do this incorrect thing. The Shulchan Aruch and Mishna Brura say to face Eretz Yisroel. Note that while it is common custom to face Israel by latitude and longitude lines, I believe this is not the majority poseik openion. The majority openion is to face according to the great circle. Think of an exaturated example of two people standing on the same latitude line near the North pole. One says, "Face me." the other looks away from the guy to face the line of latitude. Makes no sence, so go according to the great circle. So Shuls in Europe which face East may be doing things better than ones that face south-east.HaravM 22:04, 21 November 2006 (UTC)[reply]

The Talmud includes something that's in the Talmud?

The article says, "The Talmud states that a Jew praying in the Diaspora, shall direct himself toward the Land of Israel; in Israel, toward Jerusalem; in Jerusalem, toward the Temple; and in the Temple, toward the Holy of Holies. The same rule is found in the Mishnah ..."

However, the Mishnah is one component of the Talmud. It's like writing that the US Constitution guarantees free speech, and so does the Bill of Rights (which, for those not educated or living in the USA, is part of the Constitution). I can't fix because I have no idea what the author meant. IAmNitpicking (talk) 05:41, 28 December 2018 (UTC)[reply]

Papercut

I changed the papercut link (which went to the article on cutting one's finger with paper) to a redlink to Papercut (art). I don't have nearly the knowledge of art needed to create the actual article--I clicked because I was curious about it myself. IAmNitpicking (talk) 15:16, 4 December 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Featured picture scheduled for POTD

Hello! This is to let editors know that File:Mizrah - Israel Dov Rosenbaum.jpg, a featured picture used in this article, has been selected as the English Wikipedia's picture of the day (POTD) for November 12, 2022. A preview of the POTD is displayed below and can be edited at Template:POTD/2022-11-12. For the greater benefit of readers, any potential improvements or maintenance that could benefit the quality of this article should be done before its scheduled appearance on the Main Page. If you have any concerns, please place a message at Wikipedia talk:Picture of the day. Thank you! Adam Cuerden ^(talk)_{Has about 7.9% of all FPs} 15:08, 3 June 2022 (UTC)[reply]

An example of a mizrah papercut art which serves a dual purpose: as a mizrah (decoration for the eastern wall, marking the direction of prayer), and as a shiviti, an edifying text which reminded the worshipper of the importance of prayer.

Credit: Israel Dov Rosenbaum/Jewish Museum

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