Talk:Presidential M&M's

This article is written in American English, which has its own spelling conventions (color, defense, traveled) and some terms that are used in it may be different or absent from other varieties of English. According to the relevant style guide, this should not be changed without broad consensus.

A fact from Presidential M&M's appeared on Wikipedia's Main Page in the Did you know column on 12 February 2017 (check views). The text of the entry was as follows:

Did you know... that Presidential M&M's are given as gifts to guests of the President of the United States?

A record of the entry may be seen at Wikipedia:Recent additions/2017/February. The nomination discussion and review may be seen at Template:Did you know nominations/Presidential M&M's.

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American English

This is an article about an American product made by a US company used by the US President. Why is it in Brit English? By Wiki convention this should be in American English. HalfGig talk 14:38, 12 February 2017 (UTC)[reply]

See Wikipedia:Manual_of_Style#Strong_national_ties_to_a_topic. This means we can change Cadbury to American English. HalfGig talk 14:43, 12 February 2017 (UTC)[reply]

Because I wrote it and I am British, I don't use the American dialect of English. If you wish to change it then go ahead, I won't object. The C of E God Save the Queen! (talk) 14:47, 12 February 2017 (UTC)[reply]

Thank you. Very nice article BTW. FYI, when I edit a Brit article I use Brit English even though I'm not a Brit. HalfGig talk 14:50, 12 February 2017 (UTC)[reply]

Obama sourcing

I saw this linked from the main page and noticed some poor sourcing in the section about Obama. The article uses sources to come to conclusions that aren't in the sources given (WP:SYNTHESIS), particularly "Obama does not like M&M's". — RockMFR 15:18, 12 February 2017 (UTC)[reply]

You purported to pull the DYK from the main page because of this. You said there was "poor sourcing." YGBSM. Lots of good sources. Particularly for the hook. Severe overstepping, IMO. 7&6=thirteen (☎) 15:37, 12 February 2017 (UTC)[reply]

WTF??? Totally agree with 7&6=13. @RockMFR: way over reacted here. He did it without discussion too. HalfGig talk 15:42, 12 February 2017 (UTC)[reply]

In addition to the edit summary, see here, which involves a small tangential dispute. I agree. WTF? 7&6=thirteen (☎) 15:45, 12 February 2017 (UTC)[reply]

Thanks for reporting this at Wikipedia_talk:Did_you_know#Presidential_M.26M.27s. I commented there too. HalfGig talk 15:52, 12 February 2017 (UTC)[reply]

Lots of good sources.

Do any of them state that "Barack Obama does not like M&M's"? —David Levy 15:55, 12 February 2017 (UTC)[reply]

A Red herring. Here is the hook that was pulled: that Presidential M&M's are given as gifts to guests of the President of the United States?" 7&6=thirteen (☎) 15:59, 12 February 2017 (UTC)[reply]

Throwing out the baby with the bathwater. 7&6=thirteen (☎) 16:00, 12 February 2017 (UTC)[reply]

If there is a mistake in the article correct it. But pulling the hook on this is B.S. and severe overreaction. 7&6=thirteen (☎) 16:02, 12 February 2017 (UTC)[reply]

A Red herring.

Throwing out the baby with the bathwater.

I'm attempting to discuss a potential problem with the article, irrespective of whether it justified pulling the hook.

If there is a mistake in the article correct it.

I seek to determine whether the article contains a mistake in need of correction.

But pulling the hook on this is B.S. and severe overreaction.

Perhaps so, but that decision wasn't mine. I merely asked a simple question. —David Levy 16:38, 12 February 2017 (UTC)[reply]

Articles appearing on DYK need to conform with Wikipedia:Verifiability. Even if the hook is fine, the rest of the article needs to be well-sourced, too. — RockMFR 16:03, 12 February 2017 (UTC)[reply]

Nevertheless, I have edited the sentence to make the claim less strong and more similar to the hook in response to the concerns expressed here. The C of E God Save the Queen! (talk) 16:05, 12 February 2017 (UTC)[reply]

Thanks. I know these situations aren't fun, but I believe very strongly that things linked from the main page need to be solid. — RockMFR 16:07, 12 February 2017 (UTC)[reply]

As User:EEng noted, you could have edited out or marked the offending language. You need to Do no harm, and consider less drastic alternatives. Pulling a hook is extreme. 7&6=thirteen (☎) 16:14, 12 February 2017 (UTC)[reply]

The claim that Obama "did not look favorably upon M&M's" doesn't seem materially different. The source citation establishes only that he didn't want them in his trail mix on a specific occasion. (I love M&M's, but I wouldn't want to eat them in trail mix either.) —David Levy 16:38, 12 February 2017 (UTC)[reply]

Added a quote that might clarify some of this. FWIW, I like M&Ms in trail mix a/k/a Gorp.

In any event, it is now back on the main page. WP:Dead horse. 7&6=thirteen (☎) 16:41, 12 February 2017 (UTC)[reply]

Here's an article from the Washington Post with a quote stating that Brian Williams saw Obama putting M&Ms in his mouth. However, it does not state whether he chewed and swallowed the M&Ms (perhaps he spit them out while nobody was looking?), and of course it was a quote from Brian Williams from prior to the whole "making up stuff" fiasco in 2015. I'll leave it to the candy experts to decide whether to include this in the article. — RockMFR 22:12, 12 February 2017 (UTC)[reply]

Trump

I do not agree with the part about Trump being cut. I know it ended up back in heavily modified in the other section, but it should go back into Air Force One section as that is where this event happened. Besides, the source doesn't say it's SOP, though it probably is, it says what happened in the instance of Trump. HalfGig talk 20:48, 12 February 2017 (UTC)[reply]

It's short-term trivia that will be forgotten next month. It's practically a textbook example of ephemeral 24-hour-news-cycle-driven fluff that doesn't belong in Wikipedia. -Jason A. Quest (talk) 22:05, 12 February 2017 (UTC)[reply]

It's also the only thing we have with Trump and the M&M's and the only thing that shows what might happen with them during a transition, so no, I do not agree with you. HalfGig talk 22:13, 12 February 2017 (UTC)[reply]

There is no requirement that Trump be mentioned. Please read some of the policies I linked to. -Jason A. Quest (talk) 22:17, 12 February 2017 (UTC)[reply]

I don't agree. And now you need to learn to drop the stick You are now just being petulant. HalfGig talk 22:26, 12 February 2017 (UTC)[reply]

A Commons file used on this page or its Wikidata item has been nominated for deletion

The following Wikimedia Commons file used on this page or its Wikidata item has been nominated for deletion:

Presidential M&Ms (the parting gift from a West Wing tour) (6976145616).jpg

Participate in the deletion discussion at the nomination page. —Community Tech bot (talk) 18:23, 6 August 2020 (UTC)[reply]