Talk:Barack Obama citizenship conspiracy theories

Skip to table of contents

This is the talk page for discussing improvements to the Barack Obama citizenship conspiracy theories article.
This is not a forum for general discussion of the article's subject.

Put new text under old text. Click here to start a new topic.
New to Wikipedia? Welcome! Learn to edit; get help.

Article policies

Find sources: Google (books · news · scholar · free images · WP refs) · FENS · JSTOR · TWL

Archives: Index, 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, 10, 11, 12, 13, 14, 15, 16, 17, 18, 19: 91 days

The contentious topics procedure applies to this page. This page is related to post-1992 politics of the United States and closely related people, which is a contentious topic. Please consult the procedures and edit carefully.

The contentious topics procedure applies to this page. This page is related to articles about living or recently deceased people, and edits relating to the subject (living or recently deceased) of such biographical articles, which is a contentious topic. Please consult the procedures and edit carefully.

Discussions on this page often lead to previous arguments being restated. Please read recent comments, look in the archives, and review the FAQ before commenting.

faq page

Frequently asked questions (see also: Barack Obama FAQ)

Q1: Isn't the use of the terms "conspiracy theories" and "fringe" in the article title and body a violation of Wikipedia's policy on neutrality?

A1: No. A preponderance of reliable sources have treated and referred to the topic as a fringe conspiracy theory, rather than a legitimate controversy. The article reflects these sources as per Wikipedia's policy of verifiability. Consensus on the article title has been established through a RFC and has been repeatedly reaffirmed since.

Q2: What about the word "false" or "falsely"? Is it appropriate for a Wikipedia article to state that claims are false?

A2: Yes. Wikipedia policy is that fringe theories should not be given undue weight. Presenting a fringe theory as an unchallenged possibility gives undue credence to that theory. ("...we should not describe these two opposing viewpoints as being equal to each other ... for instance, forms of historical revisionism that are considered by more reliable sources to either lack evidence or actively ignore evidence.")

Q3: Can we discuss renaming the article or removing the "fringe" or "false" labeling?

A3: Yes. Consensus can change, so new perspective on this issue is welcome, but please do not rehash old arguments. Please review the archives to see past discussions on this topic, and keep in mind Wikipedia policies and reliable sources when you frame your discussion.

Q4: The Certification of Live Birth isn't a Birth Certificate, is it?

A4: Hawaii has never issued a document with the title "Birth Certificate". Instead, their certificate is titled, "Certification Of Live Birth". The law stipulates that it fulfills all of the functions for which anyone needs a birth certificate. It is therefore misleading to suggest that it is somehow not a birth certificate.

This article must adhere to the biographies of living persons (BLP) policy, even if it is not a biography, because it contains material about living persons. Contentious material about living persons that is unsourced or poorly sourced must be removed immediately from the article and its talk page, especially if potentially libellous. If such material is repeatedly inserted, or if you have other concerns, please report the issue to this noticeboard.

If you are a subject of this article, or acting on behalf of one, and you need help, please see this help page.

Law Low‑importance

	Law portal This article is within the scope of WikiProject Law, an attempt at providing a comprehensive, standardised, pan-jurisdictional and up-to-date resource for the legal field and the subjects encompassed by it.LawWikipedia:WikiProject LawTemplate:WikiProject Lawlaw articles
Low	This article has been rated as Low-importance on the project's importance scale.

United States: Presidents Low‑importance

	United States portal This article is within the scope of WikiProject United States, a collaborative effort to improve the coverage of topics relating to the United States of America on Wikipedia. If you would like to participate, please visit the project page, where you can join the ongoing discussions. Template Usage Articles Requested! Become a Member Project Talk Alerts United StatesWikipedia:WikiProject United StatesTemplate:WikiProject United StatesUnited States articles
Low	This article has been rated as Low-importance on the project's importance scale.
	This article is supported by WikiProject United States Presidents (assessed as Low-importance).

Alternative views Low‑importance

	This article is within the scope of WikiProject Alternative views, a collaborative effort to improve Wikipedia's coverage of significant alternative views in every field, from the sciences to the humanities. If you would like to participate, please visit the project page, where you can join the discussion.Alternative viewsWikipedia:WikiProject Alternative viewsTemplate:WikiProject Alternative viewsAlternative views articles
Low	This article has been rated as Low-importance on the project's importance scale.

Barack Obama (inactive)

This article is within the scope of WikiProject Barack Obama, a project which is currently considered to be inactive.Barack ObamaWikipedia:WikiProject Barack ObamaTemplate:WikiProject Barack ObamaBarack Obama articles

Conservatism Low‑importance

	Conservatism portal This article is within the scope of WikiProject Conservatism, a collaborative effort to improve the coverage of conservatism on Wikipedia. If you would like to participate, please visit the project page, where you can join the discussion and see a list of open tasks.ConservatismWikipedia:WikiProject ConservatismTemplate:WikiProject ConservatismConservatism articles
Low	This article has been rated as Low-importance on the project's importance scale.

Skepticism High‑importance

	This article is within the scope of WikiProject Skepticism, a collaborative effort to improve the coverage of science, pseudoscience, pseudohistory and skepticism related articles on Wikipedia. If you would like to participate, please visit the project page, where you can join the discussion and see a list of open tasks.SkepticismWikipedia:WikiProject SkepticismTemplate:WikiProject SkepticismSkepticism articles
High	This article has been rated as High-importance on the project's importance scale.

Politics: American Low‑importance

	Politics portal This article is within the scope of WikiProject Politics, a collaborative effort to improve the coverage of politics on Wikipedia. If you would like to participate, please visit the project page, where you can join the discussion and see a list of open tasks.PoliticsWikipedia:WikiProject PoliticsTemplate:WikiProject Politicspolitics articles
Low	This article has been rated as Low-importance on the project's importance scale.
	This article is supported by American politics task force (assessed as Low-importance).

Text has been copied to or from this article; see the list below. The source pages now serve to provide attribution for the content in the destination pages and must not be deleted as long as the copies exist. For attribution and to access older versions of the copied text, please see the history links below.

Copied pages:
Copied Barack Obama citizenship conspiracy theories (oldid, history) → Barack Obama presidential eligibility litigation (diff) Copied Barack Obama citizenship conspiracy theories (oldid, history) → United States presidential eligibility legislation (diff)

This article was nominated for deletion. Please review the prior discussions if you are considering re-nomination:

Deletion discussions:
Keep, 21 December 2008, see discussion. keep, 21 December 2008, see discussion. Keep, 16 February 2009, see discussion.

On 22 February 2022, it was proposed that this article be moved to Birther movement. The result of the discussion was not moved.

Semi-protected edit request on 15 March 2022

This edit request has been answered. Set the |answered= or |ans= parameter to no to reactivate your request.

Remove "people who doubted Obama's citizenship were racist or republican."

It was a conspiracy spread among people of all political preference, and it is just as wrong to assume anyone with a negative view on someone who happens to be "of color" is always racist or republican. ("Of color" is a racist term by the way. We all have color in our skin) 2601:187:8380:5330:19C7:77AA:CF14:473E (talk) 07:55, 15 March 2022 (UTC)[reply]

I don't know what you're quoting, but it's not this article. Gråbergs Gråa Sång (talk) 08:11, 15 March 2022 (UTC)[reply]

This quote does not appear to exist in this article. Iamreallygoodatcheckers (talk) 07:25, 17 March 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Here's a link: https://www.mcclatchydc.com/news/politics-government/election/article102354777.html. Apparently racist Clinton supporters were among those who *started* the rumor. There is no evidence that republican's are notably more racist than democrats. https://fivethirtyeight.com/features/are-white-republicans-more-racist-than-white-democrats/ . 135.84.167.43 (talk) 16:53, 31 August 2023 (UTC) Personally I would remove the "republicans" part. It's speculative and the association with the word "racist" seems pointed and inaccurate. 135.84.167.43 (talk) 18:54, 31 August 2023 (UTC)[reply]

Semi-protected edit request on 29 August 2023

This edit request has been answered. Set the |answered= or |ans= parameter to no to reactivate your request.

jun e = june 2603:8000:D300:3650:B549:5A7:4953:2993 (talk) 09:49, 29 August 2023 (UTC)[reply]

It's not clear what you want done--Escape Orbit ^(Talk) 12:21, 29 August 2023 (UTC)[reply]

Done, thanks for noticing. Gråbergs Gråa Sång (talk) 14:49, 29 August 2023 (UTC)[reply]

Incorrectly linked

this article was incorrectly linked to a "birther" conspiracy theory promoted by Andrew Sullivan regarding Sarah Palin's biological motherhood of her son Trig. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Andrew_Sullivan RemusLupinWolfe (talk) 03:53, 7 December 2023 (UTC)[reply]

Remove the word "conspiracy"

In order for it to be a conspiracy the conspiracy suggestions are needed. From what I have read - I haven't seen any suggestion of a conspiracy. Therefore - it's just a thoery or rumor at worst. But definetly no a conspiracy theory. Norbert427 (talk) 17:45, 20 February 2024 (UTC)[reply]

The theories suggests that some people conspired to hide the "truth" about Obama's citizenship and place of birth. Therefore a conspiracy theory. --Escape Orbit ^(Talk) 17:51, 20 February 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Exactly. For example, there are people who said Obama's birth certificate was forged. Yet officials from the State of Hawaii repeatedly have said it is genuine. If the officials are lying, they are in on the conspiracy; if the officials have been duped, there was a conspiracy to insert a false document into Hawaii's records (Obama could not have done it alone); if his parents lied about his place of birth, they conspired; etc. Weazie (talk) 22:03, 22 February 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Hilary Clinton's role in the Controversy

This article is notably lacking Hilary Clinton's role in launching the controversy by means of her comments during the Democratic Primary campaign against Barack Obama. The source of this claim and the facts and history should be added to this article. For example, a discussion is found here. https://www.politifact.com/factchecks/2016/sep/16/donald-trump/fact-checking-donald-trumps-claim-hillary-clinton-/ 2601:18F:E80:894B:ECC6:DB8B:A91E:ADA1 (talk) 11:18, 24 May 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Did you read the Barack_Obama_citizenship_conspiracy_theories#Origins_of_the_claims section? Here's another ref:[1] Gråbergs Gråa Sång (talk) 13:16, 24 May 2024 (UTC)[reply]

one thing that is actually missing is any mention of the Obama "turban photo" that his campaign alleged was spread by the Clinton campaign (and a broader contextualization of how the Clinton campaign at least passively hoped to profit from birtherism). (https://www.theguardian.com/world/2008/feb/26/barackobama.uselections2008) jonas (talk) 02:55, 29 May 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Per your source, that seems to be about Barack Obama religion conspiracy theories, and it's mentioned there. Gråbergs Gråa Sång (talk) 07:21, 29 May 2024 (UTC)[reply]

External links

In this edit, I removed most of the external links. The links are largely either already used as sources in the article, or otherwise unfit for inclusion due to reliability and usefulness concerns. The list remains archived in this article's history. Wracking ^talk! 20:34, 14 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]