Talk:Rudolf, Crown Prince of Austria

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Secrets d'histore[edit]

Program of TV2 France retransmitted TV5 Monde Sat 5 Sep 2009 Academics claimed he was a philanderer for whom sex was a sport, for which he kept records of his conquests. Apparently he caught syphilis at an early age, and suffered from the mercury treatment then standard medication. The pistol had been discharged all six shots, and did not belong to Rudolf. The body of Marie was stolen in 1989, and later recovered by police, identified and examined by V. University. The identity was confirmed. no bullet wounds were found on her body. she had been battered to death around the head. The death is discussed at some length, but I have not found the script —Preceding unsigned comment added by Timpo (talkcontribs) 17:32, 5 September 2009. I do not speak enough French or have any interest to do this research. I hope someone might find it useful. Program is called "Rudolfe, fils de Sissi" (Elizabeth of Bav nickname)Timpo (talk) 02:50, 6 September 2009 (UTC)


It was rumored, that Rudolf suffered from a veneral dissease. However, this is a serious charge and should be supported by reliable evidence, such as, e.g., a quote from a medical journal. Also, Schonbrun's medical archives are now open. I would like to know myself, but could not find evidence on this in any serious books on this topics. If you provide the evidence, I'll gladly revert my edit and remove the accuracy tag. David Cruise 21:00, 22 September 2005 (UTC).Removed the accuracy flag.Cruise 00:28, 24 September 2005 (UTC)


About 99% of this article is about nothing but his death. There's nothing about his early life, any functions of state he may have attended, international affairs, anything. 07:09, 19 July 2006 (UTC)


Why was his daughter not considered heir to the throne, as had been the case with Maria Theresa, his ancestress and empress?Mowens35 18:38, 8 December 2006 (UTC)

Austria used semi-salic succession rules. See Salic law article. An exception was made that allowed Maria Theresa to get the throne. See the article Pragmatic Sanction of 1713. WikiParker 21:00, 8 December 2006 (UTC)

Stephanie's photo on Mary's final letter[edit]

Warning: This photo shows Royal Princess Stephanie of Belgium, wife (widow) of Crown Prince Rudolf of Austria, and NOT the baroness Mary Vetsera. See and compare different photos of Mary and Stephanie in enwiki, dewiki, huwiki, also in Commons. Akela3 19:05, 23 December 2006 (UTC)

Corrected. WikiParker 11:42, 31 December 2006 (UTC)

Murder or Suicide[edit]

If one accepts these new allegations that the deaths of Crown Prince Rudolf and Baroness Vetsera were not a double suicide, then how does one explain the numerous suicide notes left by the pair? Baroness Vetsera left notes to her mother and to her sister, and Rudolf also left several. It is noted by historians that Emperor Franz Joseph was particularly hurt by the fact that his son had left him no farewell note, but had written to others. One wonders if handwriting experts have examined these letters? Surely Baroness Vetsera's family would recognize forged suicide letters?

Indeed, I'm sure this is one reason why no serious historians doubt the generally accepted story that it was a double suicide. john k 05:31, 13 January 2007 (UTC)

Personally, I believe that Zita was telling the truth that Rudolph did not comit suicide. One can argue that this whole suicide story was a plot against the Habsburgs in order to hurt the family's name and therefore hurt the country. It could have been a situation in which someone was pointing a pistol at Rudolph and Mary and forced them to write sucide notes. What would their motives have been had they comitted suicide? Weren't they happy toghether? The claims that Zita made might have been passed down the Habsurg family secrectly and she was the first to open the subject to public. Not only did Zita claim this, but so did most of her children. Although they did not make a claim publicly I can assure to you, they strongly believe that this was not a suicide.

I suggest you look up which year Zita was born.Eregli bob (talk) 08:49, 11 August 2012 (UTC)

That Rudolf killed Vetsera in a mad rage {the blows to the head} and tried to commit suicide but prehaps retainer{s} came in and tried to stop him; in the struggle the retianers gun goes off and kills Rudolf {the guns not his}. As regarding the number of wounds in Rudolf could they have been through and through bullets-possibly 3 instead of 6? —Preceding unsigned comment added by (talk) 12:31, 12 June 2009 (UTC)

I removed the section because it's a conspiracy theory and there were no sources at all. --Otberg (talk) 08:16, 25 January 2010 (UTC)
Baroness Mary Vetsera shot or beaten to death?

This article claims that Rudolf shot Mary in the head, but the article about her makes it clear that Dr. Holler did not find traces of a penetration hole when he scrutinized Mary Vetsera's skull in 1945. --Couprie (talk) 15:23, 1 January 2011 (UTC)

Catholic Canonic Law on Suicide[edit]

Although when at the time Crown Prince Rudolf committed suicide the Catholic Church in fact deemed that a person that committed suicide may not receive a religious funeral. It is important to mention that this canon is no longer in effect. The Catholic Church now deems suicide as the final chapter of mental illness, and therefore, the a person that commits suicide may now receive full Catholic rites.

I don't see that it's that important to mention that the rule is no longer in effect. The important thing is what the rule was at the time. john k 05:31, 13 January 2007 (UTC)


I'm not quite sure how, but this page should probably link to, and coordinate information with, the page on the Mayerling_Incident, or merge, or something.

Feyandstrange 07:11, 25 July 2007 (UTC) The statements of ex empress Zita cannot be believed. She was an overpious woman, more of a bigot than anything else. Her claim that George Clemenceau commissioned the murder of Rudolf is plain nonsense. Rudolf was pro French and wanted his father to stop the pro Prussian politics. Zita spent her life in a reality alienated way. Her interview (you can watch it on you tube) is prove to it. Her son Otto did never comment on it and the meaning of the other archdukes is not important and of no historical value. If they would have proof of their allegations they would gladly open their house archive in Schloss Wallsee. But to this day no historian has been allowed to consult it. Why? It is easy to understand.... — Preceding unsigned comment added by Claude victor (talkcontribs) 02:54, 16 July 2014 (UTC)

Latest evidence of suicide[edit]

On 31 July 2015 the Austrian National Library issued copies of Vetsera's letters of farewell to her mother and other family members. These letters, previously believed lost or destroyed, were found in a safe deposit box in an Austrian bank, where they were deposited in 1926. The letters - written in Mayerling shortly before the deaths - state clearly amd unambiguously that Vetsera was preparing to commit suicide alongside Rudolf, out of "love". They will be made available to scholars and are likely to be exhibited in public in 2016.

Copies of the letters (and complete transcriptions) are available via the press release from the Austrian National Library (German).

Testbed (talk) 12:06, 1 August 2015 (UTC)