Jump to content

Wikipedia:Wikipedia Signpost/2022-02-27/WikiProject report

Add links
From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
The Signpost
← Back to Contents
View Latest Issue


WikiProject report

10 years of tea

Contribute   —  
Share this
By EpicPupper
Disclosure: EpicPupper is a host at the Teahouse.
Drawing of a rocky plain with a cherry blossom tree
Logo of the Teahouse

The Teahouse is a forum where editors can inquire on their editing struggles, and is a crucial component to our welcoming and editor retention initiatives. From helping newcomers to advertising WikiProjects, this project has many impacts. How are these goals achieved, and what do the hosts think about the Teahouse itself? To answer that, we interview a diverse group of hosts at the Teahouse, from Cullen328 who has been at the project almost since day one and stalwarted earliest development, to Celestina007, a new pages patroller, to Panini!, a three-time FA writer, to Qwerfjkl, a bot operator and AWB wizard, to ThadeusOfNazereth, a vandalism fighter.

What is the Teahouse, in your own words?

  • Sdkb: The Teahouse is a centralized forum where we direct new editors who are encountering difficulty with some part of Wikipedia or just have a question. As hosts, we try to help newcomers navigate our processes and edit productively. We hope that they'll be encouraged to contribute further, not feel bitten, and that a few will ultimately become experienced editors.
  • Blaze Wolf: The Teahouse is a friendlier, more welcoming version of the Help Desk; however, this doesn't mean the Help Desk is only for experienced users, or that Teahouse is only for new users. Rather, the Teahouse is just more geared towards newer users.
  • Cullen328: The Teahouse is a friendly, welcoming place where more experienced editors can answer questions from newer editors about how to edit Wikipedia productively. Friendly helpful answers are the expectation.
  • ThadeusOfNazereth: The Teahouse is the closest Wikipedia comes to a genuine "community center" – a place where anybody can come to ask their questions about editing Wikipedia without fear of judgement.
  • Nick Moyes: The Teahouse is a friendly question and answer forum, catering mainly for new editors, which aims to solve their editing difficulties. Everyone who asks a question there is individually welcomed and answered in as simple a manner as possible. There are a number of more experienced editors there (known as Hosts) who serve up answers, but absolutely anyone can help out, just so long as they're confident in it being a helpful reply.
  • Panini!: The Teahouse is a service where users can ask questions about the ropes Wikipedia and receive guidance from experienced editors. It's a newcomer-frinedly environment, where anyone can ask anything and get speedy and helpful service.
  • Celestina007: In summary, the Teahouse is a very friendly venue which teaches new editors how to edit and even older editors how to edit better. The beauty of the Teahouse is that it is so much more than that, the Teahouse serves as a guide to nurture new editors from beginner level to become experienced editors, another salient point I noted above which is imperative and would like to speak on, is that the Teahouse is not only for new editors as even very experienced editors visit the Teahouse for help. What I can’t over emphasize is being a host at the Teahouse also invariably teaches hosts themselves new things they previously were unaware of. The Teahouse serves as a life long learning process for everyone both new and old editors, and as aforementioned, even hosts themselves. Another beauty of the Teahouse is the warm reception of new editors by hosts (A group of very advanced individuals well grounded in policy). The Teahouse is the most friendly environment a new editor can feel comfortable in when asking questions compared to other venues similar to the Teahouse.
  • Gerald Waldo Luis: The Teahouse is, as everyone above said, a place where new users can ask questions regarding editing, whether they are just getting started or are having a problem with editing. But it is not just for new users, experienced editors can also ask questions here. We the hosts treat everyone here as editors, regardless of experience, and give everyone the same amount of helpfulness. Oh and sometimes hosts ask questions too!

What has changed at the Teahouse in the last 10 years?

  • Sdkb: I can't speak much to the Teahouse's history, as I wasn't around when it was launched as a more beginner-focused alternative to the help desk. But it's currently poised to undergo some transformations in the near future, so I'll speak to those instead. They're coming about because of the WMF Growth Team, which is developing features to encourage newcomers. Marshall Miller and the other members of the team have so far been fantastic about communicating and collaborating with us, and their help is needed because of much of the work in this area involves interface changes that require developer support. They've found that newcomers prefer to have a specific mentor, so they're introducing a new mentorship system that sends questions to your talk page and may someday largely supplant the Teahouse's current role. I'm curious to see where it goes, but there are also some potential obstacles. Particularly, I'm concerned about the impact on volunteers of having questions addressed specifically to them, which can feel more burdensome compared to getting to choose which questions to answer as at the Teahouse.
  • Cullen328:I have made about 8,163 edits to the Teahouse, and my goal has always been to help improve the encyclopedia by welcoming and helping good faith newbies, while constantly realizing that spammers and self-promoters need to be informed of the facts of Wikipedia life in a polite but firm way. I cannot think about what has changed too much since I first started contributing to the Teahouse, except that I am much more experienced now, and still strive to give accurate and helpful answers.
  • Nick Moyes: There are few hosts who have been there right from the beginning, but I am not one of them. I don't think anything has changed in terms of its original aim to be a safe, friendly, informal place for new users to ask questions and be served with helpful answers. Looking through its many elements that are now marked as 'historic' one can see that we no longer invite visitors (guests) to create a profile for themselves, nor is there a rota of on-duty hosts known as a Maître d'. A scheme to award one another with 'Teahouse badges' is no longer used, either. These were overly complicated, and were soon phased out once the Teahouse took off, and simply aren't necessary nowadays.
  • Qwerfjkl: I haven't be a host for long, but more recently I've noticed a few things changing, such as templates like {{WikiDonation}} and {{THYFA}} being created. The Reply Tool is also soon to be enabled for all editors by default, which will help a lot with answering questions (by identifying the editor who asked it).
  • Celestina007: My vast proficiency with policy aside, I’ve been here only six years, thus I can’t comment with veracity as to the modus operandi of the Teahouse 10 years ago. Having said, what I can however say, is that the Teahouse is a super very friendly space for new editors to request guidance. It is my candid opinion that the Teahouse is literally the safest and friendliest venue for newer editors, The Teahouse hosts are extremely patient and polite individuals, answering the same questions over and over again every single day without an iota of frustration, so whilst I can’t expressly state the manner in which the Teahouse operated ten years ago and what has changed now, what I can however do is speak of how things currently are at the Teahouse as I have explained. Having said, It is my firm believe that 10 years ago, it worked with the same philosophy which we currently are using, which simply put is assisting editors to edit better.

What do you see as some of the biggest achievements of the Teahouse?

  • Sdkb: Just the fact that it exists and works is an achievement. We're nearly always able to give helpful information to any newcomer competent enough to ask an understandable question, and I think most editors who are trying to do something constructive come away feeling like they've had a positive interaction. Many people these days are used to the awful customer service bureaucracies elsewhere on the internet, so it's often a pleasant surprise to discover that there's a group of humans who are not just willing but eager to understand their problem and help them out.
  • Blaze Wolf: Like Sdkb said, that it exists and works. There are a million ways the Teahouse could've failed, and yet it continues to succeed. Users are able to ask genuine questions and receive genuine answers, which isn't usually true elsewhere on the internet. It's amazing that this works so well.
  • Kaleeb18: For me it's the community that has been created at the Teahouse. I think it is awesome how a bunch of editors can come together and help out other editors and their questions.
  • Nick Moyes: It has to be editor retention. OK, I know that's a very anodyne term, but the reality is that the right Teahouse response can turn a frustrated newcomer into someone who is encouraged to stick around and contribute, knowing they aren't all on their own here, and can get help whenever they need it. Right from the start, the Teahouse has built a reputation for itself of being different and more informal, tolerant and friendlier than anywhere else in this project.
  • Qwerfjkl: I think it's the reputation the Teahouse has – as a place for new editors to ask questions and receive helpful answers, often after only a few minutes, due to the hardworking editors that monitor the Teahouse (not all of them hosts). These editors ensure there are very few questions that go unanswered.
  • Cullen328: Our greatest achievements are the informative encyclopedia articles that we have assisted new editors to create, and if some of those people go on to be long term contributors, then that is an achievement as well.
  • Panini!: The Teahouse, I believe, has achieved everything it striven for. The community and presence that the portal has gained really makes it the number one place for any user to come to. I've seen people, including myself, go from asking the questions to answering them!
  • Gerald Waldo Luis: I agree with everyone above. It's fun to assist new editors in helping to build the Wikipedia effort, especially seeing those who came to make DYK and GA articles. Like Panini!, I too was a questioner before being an answerer, and I have to partially credit that improvement to the amazing hosts.
  • Celestina007: In summary, our greatest achievements is nurturing new editors to achieve their fullest potential. The Teahouse has also become a major factor in editor retention.

What does an average day at the Teahouse look like? What roles and tasks do you associate with the Teahouse, and how do you go about fulfilling them?

  • Sdkb: The way the Teahouse functions is pretty straightforward: people ask questions and we as hosts answer them. Most of the time, the questions are things that any experienced editor will easily know, like how to move a page. There are a lot of editors trying to create an article through AfC and wondering why it got declined or when it'll be reviewed. Most of the time we tell them to just be patient as we don't want to incentivize jumping the queue, but if they're polite and working on an important or underrepresented topic I'll sometimes review it for them.
  • Nick Moyes: I probably type the Teahouse shortcut (WP:TEA) a dozen times a day to check for new questions. If they've all been answered: great. If not, or if I think a new editor has been given a curt or over-jargony response, I might drop by and add in a "Welcome" message and a follow-up explanation. I think this makes questioners see a more personable side to interactions on Wikipedia, plus it sets an example to other editors and hosts that the friendly, informal approach is the one we take there. I also keep a 'Watchlist eye' on the Teahouse's Talk page for any discussions that might impact on how the Teahouse is run. The key thing is to make sure it remains friendly, informal and distinct from all the other, more formal, venues here. I also try to monitor any new editors who've added themselves to the Teahouse host list. After a quick check that they're an obvious fit and with enough apparent experience, I try to drop by and leave a welcome message on their talk page. I believe that being a Teahouse host can be the first step for some editors to take up a greater role in the 'behind the scenes' work of Wikipedia. If we can encourage that kind of participation, then we're helping to retain users and to keep Wikipedia going long into the future.
  • ThadeusOfNazereth: I don't know that there is an "average" day at the Teahouse. It seems like every day I see some of the same questions, but more often I see questions that I haven't seen before, sometimes questions that I don't even know the answer to myself! The most common questions usually relate to WP:RS, article creation, or people who were warned and don't know why.
  • Panini!: I grab a cup of coffee—yes, coffee—and I see if there's any new questions I can adequately respond to. Most users are quick to the punch, so much that multiple people respond at the same time! It isn't uncommon for me to get an edit conflict from another host who answered the question the exact way I did. The questions we see on a daily basis are relatively similar to each other, but one thing I love about the Teahouse is how everyone treats a question like it's the first time it's been said before. You don't see any templates at the Teahouse!
  • Gerald Waldo Luis: Whenever I don't edit but am still online, I would always keep the watchlist open, with the "Live updates" button on, so whenever a Teahouse question pops I would be notified of it immediately. I wouldn't consider myself the most active host, but I am considerably active. Most of the time, I don't answer a question because either it is not of my expertise, or others have made a good answer to the question. I would generally say "Hi!" before giving an answer as compact as I can. Usually more experienced hosts would correct some mistakes, and I'm always fine with it since they're mostly right, and just because you are a host doesn't mean you are always right. It's an interesting domino effect where I would be the answerer, but then another person corrects me, and I would become the questioner, and another person would be the answerer. It's interesting how you not only teach someone something new, but you would also learn something new.
  • Celestina007: In my experience, a typical day at the Teahouse comprises answering multiple questions from new editors pertaining article creation and policy, My roles include proffering advice, how do I go about this? Typically, I try to advice them then link them to the relevant policy. I try as much as I can do to ensure the former comes before the latter as mere pointing them to policy without spelling it out for them may not suffice. Furthermore, a good number of editors come from AFC where their article(s) might have been declined or rejected, thankfully I have the AFC pseudo-perm so every now and again if an article by an editor might have been declined, I proffer tips and if I can see notability being met as detailed in our general notability guideline I may accept the draft article at AFC.

Do you think that the Teahouse could be better in any way? What are some of its weaknesses? Do you think it's been generally successful?

  • Blaze Wolf: Definitely. For one it could be made to look more friendly in how it is styled. Currently it looks like every other Wikipedia page. But I think with some clever formatting it can be improved. Some of its weaknesses are no FAQ, so we often get new users asking the same questions that have been asked before. Also, I think some things aren't very clear to new users. Unfortunately, some things can't be solved easily because some people just don't read. I think other than those things, the Teahouse has been generally successful. Sometimes new users ask a question there and never come back; however, when they do, that's almost always a success.
  • Sdkb: The Teahouse's interface is certainly a weakness. Newcomers can't be expected to know things like the need to sign your comments, and teaching them those technical points uses up valuable instructional space, making banner blindness a problem and increasing the likelihood they'll miss other important instructions like "please link to the page you're working on". I'm very much looking forward to the new discussion tool being activated by default, as that will improve that element. Another issue that often comes up is over-responding, where a host will add on more details after a question has already been answered, leading to long threads that many newcomers find overwhelming (alas, it seems Signpost interviews are vulnerable to the same phenomenon).
  • Cullen328: Two problems are answers that are inappropriately forceful and brusque, and less experienced editors guessing at answers and giving out incorrect information. I do not hesitate to go to an editor's talk page and ask them to be friendlier, and to not answer a question unless they are highly confident that the answer is correct.
  • Gerald Waldo Luis: The layout looks a bit cluttered and I'm sure it can be modified to be simpler and more navigable for newbies; it was intense confusion to me when I wrote my first question. We also have a recurring problem of the same topics coming up over and over again; for example, questions about why a person's obviously non-notable draft is declined; I think a FAQ bar would help with this. There must also be penalties for hosts who give out incorrect answers, as Cullen noted.
  • Celestina007: Yes, we have a weakness and the greatest weakness is leadership noting that in my capacity I'm somewhat of a leader figure there thus I share in this blame. You see, leadership at the Teahouse is pretty much decentralized, this in itself isn't necessarily wrong – in fact this helps eliminate bureaucracy – but the problem, which is a clear and present existential danger, is just anybody can become a host. Even though decentralized leadership isn't a negative thing, I would want a leader figure who determines just who can become a host; we have seen too many inexperienced editors just sign up and become hosts and give blatant wrong answers to new editors. For example, prior to officially becoming a host, I answered questions there for several months (at least 6 months) without anyone correcting me, thus I knew I was prepared to officially become a host. A fix I can think of is, perhaps a certain threshold could be implemented as a prerequisite for becoming a host.
  • Kaleeb18: Although I disagree with there being one set leader, I do think the Teahouse hosts could and probably should come together every now and then to see what we could do to make the Teahouse better. There are definitely some holes in the Teahouse that need to be fixed, but that might be because we hosts do not get together and talk about how we can improve the Teahouse. You can tell from the above there are things that need fixing, but probably never will because we do not often discuss things. So I would say one weakness the Teahouse might have is that the hosts do not communicate that often about the Teahouse.

How automated has the Teahouse become over the last 10 years, with the advent of bots, new template syntax, and gadgets?

  • Blaze Wolf: One aspect that is automated is archiving of posts, which is now done by a bot. We also now have an automated response regarding the donation banners ({{WikiDonation}}). Replying has become much easier with the introduction of DiscussionTools, which provides an easy way to reply to posts and allows for subscribing to sections.
  • Nick Moyes: The only bot I ever see at the Teahouse is SineBot, which is incredibly helpful when new users don't realise Wikipedians get somewhat tetchy if people don't sign to say who they are. It really sorts that one out for us very quickly; SineBot automatically signs the message, and posts a helpful message teaching newbies to sign their posts. The fact that we don't give templated answers to questioners, but respond to them individually, really helps maintain that all-important personal feel.
  • Kaleeb18: There is also the Muninnbot, which sends messages to users' talk pages telling them the thread they created at the Teahouse has been archived in order to prevent confusion.
  • Gerald Waldo Luis: To add on to Blaze Wolf, the Reply Tool is a really helpful new addition. It doesn't sound like much, but to open the source editor, wait a minute for it to load, scroll to the very bottom, then put indents and press ⇧ Shift+~ four times, it's a hassle. DiscussionTools simplifies all this in just two clicks, and it's now enabled by default for all users.
  • EpicPupper: HostBot was created and approved in 2012 with the goal of inviting new editors to the Teahouse. Direct invitation is the primary way that new users find out about the Teahouse. But only a small number of invited newcomers show up, so manual invitations are not enough on their own. HostBot sends out roughly 100 invitations per day, each one signed with an active host to provide a personal touch.

How do you think you contrast with the stereotypical image of a Wikipedia editor?

Interviewer note: This question is optional (like all of the other questions), and some participants might not have chosen to answer this question for various reasons (e.g. privacy and outing).

  • Kaleeb18: Two major things that might separate me from the typical Wikipedian is that I am a homeschooled high schooler and a Republican editor. I’ve been told by user Kingsif that they think it is "neat" that I am a Republican editor because Wikipedia might be more liberal like people say, which could mean that right-wing topics aren't covered as much because editors just aren't interested. Although I am a Republican editor, that does not stop me from being nice to others who are not. While being in high school might show that I am a little sloppy when it comes to things like grammar, I think it also helps me have a different viewpoint on Wikipedia than the typical Wikipedian. Though after saying that, one thing that I do, that I hope every Wikipedian does, is strive to be nice in everything they do on Wikipedia.
  • Blaze Wolf: I'd say I contrast with the stereotypical image of a Wikipedia editor because I always like to hear both sides of an argument before coming to a decision, and I also try and give off a more friendly vibe with things I do on Wikipedia to make it seem like a more welcoming and friendly place, which is the opposite of what Wikipedia looks like at first glance.
  • Nick Moyes: I rarely think of other editors as being anything other than exactly like myself (i.e. boringly white, male, European, getting on in years, and with a science education and a sense of humour). So I treat everyone equally (or at least, I try to). So it's then a delight to discover many are not like me, usually younger, perhaps living on the other side of the world or having English as their second or third language. The joy of Wikipedia is that all those differences (whether cultural, social, sexual, physical, emotional or whatever) simply don't matter here – or at least, they shouldn't do when it comes to actual editing and collaboration. That said, it is important that our content and our editor base reflects diverse backgrounds, and that isn't always the case. So anything we can do to redress that balance is to be welcomed.
  • Gerald Waldo Luis: I can't say that I'm outside of the stereotype, as I find myself sometimes resorting to uncivility. But over time, I have taught myself to be civil regardless of the present heat. The common thought is that Wikipedians are autistic high school teenagers who are editing Wikipedia when they are free from school, and I am an autistic high school teenager who edits Wikipedia when he's free. If anything separates me, is that I am from Indonesia, thus not using English as a first language (apologies for all my grammatical mistakes galore). I also try to engage with editors using fun language, and whenever others respond to it nicely, it makes me feel safe editing, because it tells me that I am listened to. It's also the same feeling I try to evoke through my Teahouse answers.
  • Celestina007: An interesting question. I see myself as others and others as myself, and I believe every editor here is equal regardless of anything and should be treated with respect. However just remembered that I once read a user page three years ago describing Wikipedians as "lonely", "bitter", and "vengeful". However I'm a recluse, and I do not believe that sort of generalization is correct either. Additionally about two years ago when my new page reviewer request was still pending, an editor whom I had crossed paths with in a not so pleasant manner reverted one of my edits as "blatant vandalism" when it was not. The thing about NPR is that "blatant vandalism" is one of the core transgressions that could see you lose the permission. It was a very crafty and vengeful play in my opinion, but the granting admin saw the whole ordeal for what it was and made me NPR anyway. But no, despite that experience I refuse to believe we are vengeful people; in time, myself and that editor grew to respect each other. I refuse to believe that there is such a thing as a "stereotypical Wikipedian" as there simply isn"t.
  • Kaleeb18: I would also like to add that I do not think there is such a thing as a stereotypical Wikipedian. I’ve come across many editors now with Celestina007 being the most recent one, and I can truly say I do not think I have ever met an editor that is just like someone else. There are so many different types of editors on Wikipedia. It is amazing how everyone has a unique way of doing something, and how everyone is different. All the different editors on Wikipedia though is what makes Wikipedia what it is.

What motivated you to become a host at the Teahouse?

  • Sdkb: I initially came to the Teahouse because I was working on revamping the newcomer tutorial series, and I wanted to understand the newcomer experience better. I've continued as a host since it's gratifying to help out others. Encouraging newcomers is one of the most important things we can do on Wikipedia, since a new editor that sticks around long-term will make thousands of edits, and those who helped mentor them can take partial credit for their future contributions.
  • Kaleeb18: As a newer host, what motivated me was purely because of the friendliness and warm environment at the Teahouse. Back in October 2021, when I was a new editor, I was constantly asking questions at the Teahouse and would usually receive a great response. After I became a better editor over time and with my previous experiences at the Teahouse, I really wanted to help newcomers out in the most nicest way that I possibly could. So I gave it a shot by answering a few questions and have stayed around the Teahouse ever since.
  • Blaze Wolf: I'm not technically a host (yet); however, what motivated me to answer questions at Teahouse is that I was a newcomer at one point and, while I had an advantage in that I was previously a Fandom Wiki editor so I knew how the editor worked, I was confused as to how everything worked. I want to help new users understand Wikipedia so that they too can help improve this ever growing encyclopedia.
  • ThadeusOfNazereth: I remember what it was like starting out as an editor and not knowing what I was doing, and now that I've established myself a bit more than the average editor, it just seems right that I try and pass on some of the knowledge I've gained over the last few years. The Teahouse is also a great reprieve from the drama and vitriol that often masquerades as "discussion" on the noticeboards.
  • Nick Moyes: I've always gained satisfaction from helping other people, but I can't remember how I first learned about the Teahouse. Back in 2017 I had a problem with table sorting, so went there and got some great advice. I started lurking there, and eventually began answering a few questions. One of its stalwarts (Cullen328) later dropped by my talk page and encouraged me to "pitch in" with answers whenever I was able. There was no mention of 'hosts' – just simple encouragement, and that was all it took. I've been at the Teahouse ever since!
  • Panini!: One thing I always strive for is that every user gets the best possible answers and advice in the friendliest way. We don't bite, after all, so why should we act like we do? I've seen users get discouraged, and I certainly have too, so I've looked for ways to be the better person. I did some digging, and I asked a question at the Teahouse about a day after I made my account. I requested an article idea and asked if I could help make it, and was astonished when a user told me it's possible to make it from scratch myself. After seeing other questions being answered poorly elsewhere, I probably came to the Teahouse to give better answers.
  • Gerald Waldo Luis: My desire to help people and provide them with advice (whenever I can). It's always been my passion in real life, and over time I learned that the Teahouse is a great way for me to help people on Wikipedia.
  • Celestina007: I have been a personal home tutor in the past, who taught the English language to African students. To be honest I’d say I have a natural propensity or affinity for teaching. The innate joy is inexplicable and this is what made me become a Teahouse host.

Are you happy with the attitude of the newcomers? Does the Teahouse sometimes tire you out?

  • Sdkb: There are unfortunately a lot of questions asked at the Teahouse by editors who, to put it bluntly, lack competence. Wading through those, and through requests from editors trying to do things contrary to our purposes like writing an autobiography, absolutely does get tiring. Fortunately, it's always possible to just go do something else and return later, by which time there will be a new set of questions. The other frustrating thing is that sometimes, people will ask a question and then disappear, so you don't know if they ever even saw your answer.
  • Blaze Wolf: Yes and no to both questions. Sometimes I'm fine with the attitude of newcomers because they're new to Wikipedia. However sometimes how they ask questions can seem a bit demanding. Teahouse does sometimes tire me out; however, I always remember that these people have no clue what they are doing and are asking genuine questions.
  • Kaleeb18: I feel that for the most part the attitude of the newcomers is generally nice, but every once in a while, like Blaze said, they can seem a bit demanding and a little rude, which can sometimes make their answers harder to reply to. For the question if the Teahouse tires me out or not, that is a definite yes. After I grind a couple of questions for about a week or two, I will usually take a little break from answering questions at the Teahouse to rejuvenate and focus on other projects that I am doing as well on Wikipedia.
  • ThadeusOfNazereth: The vast majority of people who utilize the Teahouse are kind people who truly care about the project! A while back, there was an older person (in their 70s) who asked a series of questions about how to start editing who was incredibly gracious to everybody who helped him – That's the sort of thing that makes it all worthwhile.
  • Nick Moyes: Like many reading this, I find Wikipedia addictive but the Teahouse is especially so. I thought I might find giving the same sort of answers to lots of people very tiring. But behind the keyboard there's a real person with a real problem they can't solve, and it's stimulating to be able to help them or to point them towards guidance they need to read. Because I am sometimes rather verbose in my replies, it can be frustrating to have an edit conflict with another helper where someone has given precisely the same answers but in much shorter time. That's a waste of my own time, but whose fault is that? I'm perfectly happy with the attitude of the newcomers who come to ask questions. A few might expect us to help them jump the review queue or do their homework for them, but I honestly can't remember when I last encountered any unpleasant attitudes from questioners nor, indeed, from Teahouse hosts and helpers.
  • Qwerfjkl: I only look at the Teahouse every few days (previously I was more active); however, a few questions are off-topic, unhelpful, spammy, or vandalism. Luckily, the vast majority of questions are posed by editors geniunly willing to learn from other editors, and to improve their work. I have sometimes stayed away from the Teahouse because I can't face the sheer volume of questions (the whole thing can take 20-30 minutes to read); however, after a few days I do check the Teahouse again.
  • Gerald Waldo Luis: I'm not an avid 24/7 Teahouse checker, so I'm not "tired" of the questions. But I'm certainly surprised that everyday we get the same, as Sdkb says, lacking-competence questions. Which is why I suggested in a question above to include a FAQ bar. One thing couldn't be prevented by a FAQ though: I was once emailed by a Teahouse questioner threatening despite knowing that they are in the wrong; of course, it didn't happen, but it's a real issue. However this is not to neglect the many well-meaning newcomers – also editors in general – who just want to be better. In those cases my joyful side kicks in instantly. As I said, my passion has always been helping.
  • Celestina007: Absolutely not, perhaps my natural affinity for teaching makes me not tire, I am of the belief that what you love doing can not make you weary, in-fact, I believe the inverse is what happens to me, the more questions I get to answer, the more energized I am.

What is your favorite question that you've seen?

  • Sdkb: There are moments of amusement like this one. But my favorite questions are those that get me to think about something in a new way. Newcomers often have a particular form of insight, since they see everything with fresh eyes. For instance, the other week a user came by interested in translating an article from Guarani. They correctly recognized that the Guarani article was not neutral and wouldn't be appropriate for here, but they thought it still had value as a cultural document. It prompted me to think more about how biased content, while certainly something non-encyclopedic that we want to remove, might still have some intrinsic value elsewhere, perhaps for future historians of knowledge.
  • Nick Moyes: I don't have a particular favourite. But I do like those questions that are sufficiently technical that nobody else has answered it yet and where I think I have a chance of learning something new along the way. It's also quite nice when a questioner comes back and acknowledges that you've helped them.
  • Kaleeb18: I am with Nick Moyes on this one. I like finding questions I do not really know the answer to like this one. It made me work hard to figure out the answer to their question and I learned how to do something I had no clue how to do before.
  • Qwerfjkl: It was an interesting discussion about an editor who drew an artwork of the subject of an article, as there were no images available, and used that instead.
  • Panini!: I love questions where I walk away learning something, too. I remember a user asked a question about how to make hyperlinks that don't lead to disambiguation pages, so I taught them about piping links. Then, another user jumped in and taught me to give more advice, which taught me about piping shortcuts; how you don't need to specify the disambiguation (such as [[Door (song)|]]). It's great to have a bunch of hosts actively present, so minds can be put together to give all sorts of new information, especially moments when multiple users guide a newcomer through a process.
  • Gerald Waldo Luis: Have to agree with Nick. Some questions not only help the questioner learn, but also help you learn, as you research the problem raised. Another instance of the domino effect I talked about earlier.
  • Celestina007: I believe I’ve answered so many questions there, it has become a blur in my memory, I can't single out one now; however, questions pertaining to notability, sourcing, and article creation are the sort of questions I enjoy answering.

How can prospective hosts join in?

  • Sdkb: Anyone who wants to help out can just jump in. If you want to be listed as an official host, you can sign up here. More help is always welcome, but I'd emphasize to Signpost readers that one of the best things you can do for the Teahouse is to prevent editors from needing to come to it. Linking the acronym justifying your revert in your summary only takes a few seconds, but it can really help out a newcomer struggling to navigate Wikipedia's complex systems. Improving template documentation and making help and project pages clear, consolidated, and concise are crucial.
  • Blaze Wolf: Gain lots of knowledge on varying policies and in how Wikipedia works. Also study other hosts' answers at the Teahouse as you can learn a lot just by watching other people. Finally, don't try and join in too early and answer questions just to give an answer if you don't know the answer.
  • Nick Moyes: We welcome anyone answering questions at any time. They just need to be the right answers! So I'd advise lurking for a while and simply try answering a few questions where you can contribute something useful. Do it in a friendly manner and, if you like it and are able to meet our 'Host Expectations', simply hit the big blue button on the Teahouse header and 'Become a host'.
  • Kaleeb18: DO NOT RUSH IT! I remember wanting to be a Teahouse host after the first week of me starting Wikipedia! What a crazy thing for me to think. The reason I decided not to become one is because I did not meet the host expectations. I eventually became a much more experienced editor and familiarized myself with Wikipedia’s policies and became a host a few months later. I am very glad I decided not to become a host right away or the answers to all the newcomers’ questions would have been horrific. So for newer editors I would definitely suggest being patient and growing as an editor first before rushing it and becoming a host.
  • Qwerfjkl: Patience is key. I find a few editors who are newcomers to the Teahouse themselves, and then go on to answer other questions with not quite the correct advice, although done with good intentions. There was a WT:TEA thread at Wikipedia talk:Teahouse § Inexperienced editors answering questions about this.
  • Gerald Waldo Luis: Fun fact – when I answered a question for the first time, I didn't make myself an officially-listed host since I didn't know you should list yourself in the first place. Luckily no one reverted my answers and I found it out myself, and listed myself as host. Always be kind, welcoming, and patient. Keep answers as short and simple as possible. Don't act like a stiff customer serviceperson, be engaging!
  • Celestina007: This brings us back to one of our weaknesses I discussed earlier: literally anyone can sign up. The threshold is pretty much non-existent, or if it exists the bar is set very low. However, I've observed Nick Moyes, arguably one of our finest, if not our finest alongside 331dot & Cullen 328, remove certain editors who signed up as hosts due to experience related concerns.

Anything else you'd like to add?

  • Sdkb: In a sense, every question asked at the Teahouse represents a failure, since it means that our help pages and processes are too complicated for someone to navigate without personalized guidance. We're happy to offer that guidance, but it takes a lot of editor time and energy compared to instructions that only need to be written once, so we should be aspire to make our processes self-explanatory enough that fewer editors end up needing the Teahouse's assistance.
  • Kaleeb18: I would like to give some credit to some other Teahouse host that didn’t get to do this interview. One Teahouse host who I always strive to be like is GoingBatty. He is super nice, friendly, and to me is a great example of what a Teahouse host should be. I guess you could also say he was part of my motivation to becoming a host. There is also David notMD, who is the Teahouse’s most active editor and helped me create my first article Space 220 Restaurant, which reminds me, I need to work on that article soon. ColinFine is another great editor who I will run into sometimes. Other great host I’ve run into at the Teahouse that definitely deserve to be mentioned are Tigraan, Tenryuu, FormalDude, Severestorm28, David Biddulph, Cassiopeia, Melecie, ClaudineChionh, Shushugah, Jéské Couriano, Pyrrho the Skipper, Timtempleton, Maproom, Deor, and ARoseWolf. Also Hoary and Michael D. Turnbull, who are not host, are a great help at the Teahouse. I am sorry for the others I have missed, but without those people, the Teahouse would not be what it is today. I would also also like to add if your an experienced editor trying to figure out something, do not be afraid to stop by the Teahouse. We are always glad to answer your questions too along with the newcomers.
  • Nick Moyes: Since its formation in 2012, the Teahouse, together with the Help Desk, have effectively replaced Adopt-a-user as a way to help new editors (though the latter still plays its part in supporting long-term, committed new editors). I think every potential administrator who expects to work with other editors should spend at least some time helping out in one of these places. It makes you appreciate the needs and knowledge gaps of the inexperienced newcomer, and how to interact with them considerately; it's they who eventually become the major contributors of tomorrow. But soon there will be a new support opportunity – assigned mentorship – and I expect the Teahouse will be a valuable stepping stone for those willing to offer one-to-one support via the new user Homepage tab.
  • Blaze Wolf: While the Teahouse is most certainly a very friendly and welcoming place, it is certainly not the only place. Even in different WikiProjects there are friendly and kind people who are willing to help you out. Never be afraid to ask questions. If you are then you don't learn nearly as much as if you do. Most of the time you won't get in trouble just for asking a question because it's nearly impossible to learn without asking questions.
  • Qwerfjkl: To echo Kaleeb18 above, I have always respected Tenryuu, for their hard work and helpful replies at the Teahouse, and they contributed to my decision to become a host.
  • Panini!: I don't drink tea.
  • Gerald Waldo Luis: In Indonesia, there's a saying, "Malu bertanya sesat dijalan", which means "Ask, or you will never know the way out." As clumsy as a question may sound, if it is well-intentioned, ask, because it's your only way out. It did give me the way out.
  • Celestina007: Nothing much, the Teahouse is a huge success due to arduous tasks carried out by veteran hosts who I’m saddened aren’t in this discussion. I believe a threshold could be set for editors who want to become hosts, perhaps, observing their proficiency overall and a specified time frame as prerequisite for becoming a host.

Thank you so much to the wonderfully diverse group of hosts who participated, and to you, the reader. This interview broke a record in terms of the number of respondents; 10 editors contributed and shared their insight, a wonderful coincidence with the 10th Teahouse anniversary. If you would like to participate in a future interview, or have any comments, please feel free to post them below. Happy March!

Contributors:
  • Qwerfjkl
  • ThadeusOfNazereth
  • Cullen328
  • Sdkb
  • Nick Moyes
  • Kaleeb18
  • Blaze Wolf
  • Celestina007
  • Panini!
  • Gerald Waldo Luis
  • EpicPupper
← Previous "WikiProject report"
Next "WikiProject report" →
+ Add a comment

Discuss this story

These comments are automatically transcluded from this article's talk page. To follow comments, add the page to your watchlist. If your comment has not appeared here, you can try purging the cache.
It's your Signpost. You can help us.
Retrieved from "https://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Wikipedia:Wikipedia_Signpost/2022-02-27/WikiProject_report&oldid=1193880577"