Talk:Frozen (2013 film)

Voice?

Resolved

What does "After she gave birth, she re-recorded some lines as her voice had deepened, and there were 'more womanly tones.'" even mean? Did her voice become and stay deeper because of the pregnancy? Bumblebritches57 (talk) 18:30, 1 October 2013 (UTC)

POC

Nothing about the controversy about the lack of poc people are crying about? --89.249.2.54 (talk) 10:57, 3 October 2013 (UTC)

To be fair, it's a German story... why should there be black people in it? is that not in itself racist? INB4 accusations of racism. Bumblebritches57 (talk) 14:53, 3 October 2013 (UTC)

Danish story, and because there are groups of people of colour living in the sorts of regions described in the original story. "Black people" no but certainly people of colour. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 14.1.77.242 (talk) 19:14, 9 October 2013 (UTC)

I haven't critisized your use of "colour" so don't criticize my use of black people, where I'm from "african american" is seen as a derogatory phrase, and frankly your critique is pointless. and just because there may be black people in a country (weather they were there when the story takes place wasn't even specified) doesn't mean they were in the original story, you can't fault Disney for not changing the race of it's characters AKA revise history to appease some people that care far too much about trivial details. Bumblebritches57 (talk) 19:16, 15 October 2013 (UTC)

The way this works on Wikipedia is someone needs to cite a "reputable" source complaining about racism in this movie before Wikipedia can mention it, not you or I or any other random smuck count or that would be "independent research". I do get the feeling after reading the Critical response section that this article is kind of one sided but with 87% RT score there are not too many reputable people complaining, even still I found this interesting nugget, accusation of sexism not racist: http://www.cartoonbrew.com/disney/frozen-head-of-animation-says-animating-women-is-really-really-difficult-89467.html BerserkerBen (talk) 19:26, 27 November 2013 (UTC)

Reputable enough source? http://knowyourmeme.com/memes/disneys-frozen-whitewashing-controversy

It contains oodles and oodles of references to examples.

Tried to include a few sentences on the whole stupid cntroversy, using the article above as source, but it got shot down within an hour...

Who shot it down, a random IP address? Just revert it (put it back up maybe in the the controversy section: rename "Portrayal of female emotions" back to "controversies"), if someone, especially a random IP address (which may or may not be a covert paid corporate wiki editor) deletes something and you disagree, then revert it, put a complaint here on the talk page, if they do it again we may need to go to wiki dispute resolution to handle it BerserkerBen (talk) 17:56, 20 January 2014 (UTC)

Controversy section

Well I added a controversy section for the above convtroversy and it was deleted within 2 hours by some IP address, honestly if anyone else cares pick up the issue, I given up fighting on wikipedia years ago. BerserkerBen (talk) 21:15, 27 November 2013 (UTC)

There's been enough criticism over the ethnic stuff now that it deserves mention. Added something under the critical reception tag, with sources. Notably also sources that show how the film was actually well received within the indigenous Sámi community. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 84.215.19.208 (talk) 11:38, 17 January 2014 (UTC)

Aaand it's gone. I wrote an objective, three-sentence section about the criticism from the "no-PoC" camp, a section which also included the positive reactions from Sámi people. With references. Removed in half an hour or so. I'd believe some editor was on the Mouse's payroll, if it wasn't that it would make no sense to remove the praise from Sámi media and officials if that was the case.

Anyway: I personally think the complaints about no "PoC" are downright ridiculous, but it's now notable enough that it should be included.

The existence of an Internet meme doesn't give a subject notability. If even the African-American Film Critics Association lauds the film, that concern must be more outlier than mainstream criticism. --McDoobAU93 14:07, 17 January 2014 (UTC)

Furthermore, sources cited are all in Norwegian, therefore I couldn't review them...Quenhitran (talk) 14:58, 17 January 2014 (UTC)

Hm. Google Translate is hardly a perfect tool, but it does give you the gist. In any case, I hope there's not a ban against citing non-English language sources on English Wikipedia, because that would really make it suffer... There's a lot of important sources out there not in English (particularly when the information needing sources concerns events in non-English speaking areas). — Preceding unsigned comment added by 84.215.19.208 (talk) 15:56, 17 January 2014 (UTC)

There isn't a prohibition on the use of non-English sources on the English Wikipedia ... a reliable source is a reliable source regardless of its language. But if you're relying heavily on a non-English source for a potentially controversial addition, you may want to take some time and get it translated for other editors to review. After all, there is no deadline. --McDoobAU93 16:41, 17 January 2014 (UTC)

I didn't think it would be controversial to add that the movie is praised from one of the groups whose culture it draws inspiration from. For the "No PoC" thing, which is a controversy, I used an english-language source (Know Your Meme) which again has references to other English-language sources. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 84.215.19.208 (talk) 17:42, 17 January 2014 (UTC)

Allegations of sexism occurred[113][114][115] after head of animation for Frozen, Lino DiSalvo, said:

"Historically speaking, animating female characters are really, really difficult, because they have to go through these range of emotions, but you have to keep them pretty and they're very sensitive too — you can get them off a model very quickly. So, having a film with two hero female characters was really tough, and having them both in the scene and look very different if they're echoing the same expression; that Elsa looking angry looks different from Anna being angry."

Some media commentators took this to mean that a difficulty exists due to a limited range of facial variation for recent Disney female cartoon characters because of the need to keep them "pretty."[113][114][115] A Disney spokesperson told Time that DiSalvo's quote was widely misinterpreted stating that he was "describing some technical aspects of CG animation and not making a general comment on animating females versus males or other characters."[113][115]"

This is what I had added and I don't see why it was deleted, I'm going to add it back in. BerserkerBen (talk) 03:20, 20 January 2014 (UTC)

I don't know. An IP deleted this piece a few weeks ago but no editors have reacted to it, so I haven't questioned it since then.Quenhitran (talk) 03:36, 20 January 2014 (UTC)

Well if you see some 'ip address' delete it again please revert it, it is not like I'm going to come and check on this page everyday because some 'ip address' has being paid to delete these things at random on the behest of a company that shalt not be named without proof. BerserkerBen (talk) 06:28, 20 January 2014 (UTC)

Music by:

As of me writing this, in the info box, under "Music by:", only listed Christophe Beck. I realize, that one only lists the composers, not lyricists in the "music by" credit. So, I am editing the page to include Kristen Anderson-Lopez and Robert Lopez, as they both composed music for the vocal songs in addition to writing the lyrics. Unlike with many song writing teams where one person is listed as the lyricist and one as the composer, Anderson-Lopez and Lopez are jointly credited for the songs, thus sharing the composing and lyric-writing duties, and thus should be included in the "Music by' section in addition to Mr. Beck, since, as a team, Anderson-Lopez and Lopez composed the vocal songs, while Mr. Beck composed the score. I am editing the page to reflect this. - Jay22246 (talk) 22:07, 28 November 2013 (UTC)

The infobox field is typically only supposed to list film score composers and not include song composers. Similar examples include; The Lion King, Mulan, Winnie the Pooh, and The Muppets. ~ Jedi94 (talk) 23:43, 28 November 2013 (UTC)

Critical response section misleading?

It feels like the positive reviews of Frozen, including the ones cited in this article, are largely back-handed, and mean to review the film as good in a formulaic way, but not in the "Disney Classic" way the section suggests by having the Beauty and the Beast, Lion King, Aladdin comparison as its intro.

Making the comparison gives the impression that Frozen is being revered for its storyline, music, animation in the same way these films were originally hailed as raising the bar for future Disney films. Most of the top critics, NYtimes, Rolling Stones, Slant, etc seem to be passing the film off as being modeled after those films, but not really reaching the same caliber. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 75.128.49.188 (talk) 23:50, 29 November 2013 (UTC)

one minor question

Does Hans qualify as an official Disney Villain? I mean he wanted to assassinate Elsa, didn't he? Visokor (talk) 07:43, 9 December 2013 (UTC)

The whole "Disney Villains" and "Disney Princess" marketing plans depend on whichever villain/princess Disney chooses to promote at the time. If Disney decides to add Hans to the official "roster"—the one that includes Snow White's Evil Queen, Maleficent, Captain Hook, Ursula, et al—we'll certainly hear about it. There's already been rumblings that Anna will become the next Disney Princess, but that will be made official at some later date, most likely. --McDoobAU93 15:59, 16 January 2014 (UTC)

International Box Office figures don't add up

Resolved

The total sum in the first sentence and the individual amounts quoted in the second senctence don't add up (naturally, because they are quoted from two different sources :-). Sorry, but I don't have time to sort out the numbers from Box Office Mojo and correct this error. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 62.217.37.42 (talk) 16:44, 23 December 2013 (UTC)

LGBTQIA Inferences/Parallels

There's been a lot written on the implications of Frozen as an LGBTQ "coming out" story, with many parallels between Elsa's journey in the film with young people accepting their sexuality. It seems odd to leave that out of the article. Many of the references seem deliberate on Disney's part, perhaps to show subtle support without fully stating so. Disney's been long known as supportive of the gay community, though from a corporate perspective it might be dangerous for them to put a full stamp on something like this. Is there a plan to incorporate the LGBTQ angle at some point? I don't know how the timelines for articles work so someone may be doing something behind the scenes and hasn't posted it yet. If so, apologies. Thanks! 38.75.16.42 (talk) 00:42, 31 December 2013 (UTC)Supporter

Reviewers have named numerous things that Elsa's powers could represent, so it doesn't seem neutral to just pick one and present it as fact. Idina Menzel, Elsa's voice actress, actually says that Elsa's story is about not being "afraid of sticking out or showing off" and "own[ing] those things that make us really unique".[1] --1ST7 (talk) 05:35, 2 January 2014 (UTC)

The point is that there has been a lot written about the perceived LGBT aspect in WP:Reliable sources, as shown by this Google search (controversy included); that viewpoint should be in this article, and will eventually be included in this article. Flyer22 (talk) 01:55, 21 March 2014 (UTC)

Based on vs. Inspired by

I've seen some people on the web (and myself one amongst them) remarking that Frozen should be designated as "inspired by" rather than "based on" because of the vast differences from the original story. I was content with thinking it was just a matter of opinion (and perhaps it still is). However, I noticed when I saw the film again today that it says "inspired by The Snow Queen" in the official credit sequence — not "based on." Perhaps this is nitpicking, but I do see it as a difference and, if anyone agrees, I think it should be changed in the "infobox film" section. 98.233.161.32 (talk) 06:45, 8 January 2014 (UTC)Andrew

We don't seem to have the corresponding parameter in the template.Quenhitran (talk) 07:26, 8 January 2014 (UTC)

Set in Norway?

Why is this movie categorized as set in Norway? As far as I know this is set in Arendelle, not Arendal. My point is: Arendelle is clearly based on Norway, but it isn't explicit that Arendelle actually is in Norway and not some parallel universe. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 129.242.61.43 (talk) 05:52, 16 January 2014 (UTC)

I agree and have removed that category as well as Category:Films set in Europe. Erik (talk | contrib) ^{(ping me)} 15:05, 17 January 2014 (UTC)

$1

"Frozen has earned $1 in the United States and Canada as of January 26, 2014 and $2 in other countries, as of January 26, for a worldwide total of $12 "

Doesn't this make little sense? The film made $1 in the US? — Preceding unsigned comment added by 74.199.127.191 (talk) 19:08, 26 January 2014 (UTC)

Done Another editor took care of this apparent act of vandalism. It's been corrected to the cited figures. --McDoobAU93 19:29, 26 January 2014 (UTC)

"Night" or "Early morning"?

I've been watching revisions on this page for a month and I realized that many editors were confused if the sequence in which Anna and Elsa play at the beginning of the film took place at night or in the early morning. Therefore I think this issue should be discussed :D Quenhitran (talk) 09:21, 28 January 2014 (UTC)

I think it's clearer to say "night" rather than early morning. The scene takes place when it's dark outside, so "night" is unambiguous. It's possible that "early morning" may mean 2 am or 4 am to some people (when it's dark outside), but others may interpret it to mean 6 am or 8 am (when it's starting to get light outside). AmericanLemming (talk) 04:03, 29 January 2014 (UTC)

Maybe you're right. I've checked the original screenplay and they say "night". Perhaps others get confused because of Anna's words, "The sky's awake, so I'm awake, so we have to play." Quenhitran (talk) 04:15, 29 January 2014 (UTC)

Norwegian bias

I do sympathize with the fact that the film's mainly Norwegian-looking setting is causing a lot of Norwegian enthusiasm, but the sources referred to talk of a general Scandinavian inspiration and the Maypole is rather Swedish.--Berig (talk) 11:59, 9 February 2014 (UTC)

Hmm. I think the confusion lies in that the setting and music are inspired mainly by Norway, yet the cultural references are Scandinavian, in that they're not specific to Norway but rather to Northern Germanic cultures as a whole. So I agree with changing most instances of "Norwegian" to "Scandinavian" in this paragraph, with the sole exception of the bit about the landmarks, as all three of them are in Norway.

However, as far as the two sources cited referring to general Scandinavian inspiration, that's true, but they're both blogs, so I'm not sure how reliable they are. In my opinion, I think we should say something along the lines of "the film is inspired by Scandinavia in general but Norway in particular", as that seems to be the case. But you're the Scandinavian studies expert, and I'm just a college kid who's 37.5% Scandinavian (12.5% Danish, Norwegian, and Swedish each), so you probably understand these matters better than I do. :) AmericanLemming (talk) 17:41, 9 February 2014 (UTC)

There's nothing specifically Norwegian about a stave church (there is still a medieval one in Sweden), trolls, fjords, Viking ships, lutefisk or runes. While you find specific Norwegian references you also see a Swedish maypole. However, as for any cultural elements I'd be very wary of pinpointing anything as specifically Norwegian, Swedish or Danish. The three cultures are very close with internal variations and things people consider "Norwegian" or "Swedish" usually exists in similar forms in the other Scandinavian countries as well. Any statement like "Norway in particular" would naturally need to be backed up by reliable sources per WP:RS.--Berig (talk) 19:26, 9 February 2014 (UTC)

How about starting the paragraph with "While the setting was principally based on Norway, the cultural influences in the film were drawn from Scandinavian culture as a whole and from Scandinavia's indigenous Sámi culture."? I think acknowledging that the setting is principally Norwegian could help readers and editors understand the distinction between the Norwegian setting and Scandinavian cultural influences that you've done a nice job of elucidating here on the talk page. AmericanLemming (talk) 20:43, 9 February 2014 (UTC)

Remember that even though Sámis inhabit northern parts of Scandinavia, they aren't exclusive to that area. The Sámi domicile region (Sápmi) encompasses both the northern parts of Scandinavia and Finland, as well as the Kola peninsula in Russia. If you compare the scandinavian languages to the Sámi languages, you will find that they are very different. In fact, the Scandinavian languages are more related to Russian than they are to the Sámi languages. It would be wrong to categorize the cultural references – therein the cultural references to the Sámi culture – as Scandinavian. As per now the title of the paragraph is "Scandinavian inspiration", I would suggest it changed to "Nordic inspiration". Just to keep it unambigous an uncontroverisial. 129.242.61.43 (talk) 22:27, 23 February 2014 (UTC)

I've changed it to "Scandinavian and Sámi inspiration" and "from the indigenous Sámi culture of Fennoscandia". Is that better? AmericanLemming (talk) 23:21, 23 February 2014 (UTC)

If nobody else disagrees, then I think the current title should do. 129.242.61.43 (talk) 23:10, 25 February 2014 (UTC)

Cryokinesis?

Resolved

I have reverted out the cryokinesis reference in the article, and asked that the person adding it bring forth a reference wherein a RS used it to describe Elsa's ability. It could be nanites, elemental familiars, guardian angels or plain, simple Disney (or ordinary northern European storytelling) magic. The point is, I suspect that an editor might be theorizing, and we don't do that here at Wikipedia. - Jack Sebastian (talk) 21:46, 15 February 2014 (UTC)

If you are expecting an official announcement from Disney that their princess possesses cryokinetic powers then you're wrong. You'll never find one like that. But a number of sources are available on the Internet, and I'll cite some:

• http://www.metro.us/newyork/entertainment/movies-entertainment/2013/11/26/frozen-reminds-us-that-disney-is-more-than-just-pixars-owner/ "Elsa was born, for some reason, with cryokinetic powers."
• http://canadaam.ctvnews.ca/movie-reviews/reviews-frozen-oldboy-philomena-and-armstrong-lie-1.1563260 "“Frozen” is the story of two royal sisters, the Princesses of Arendelle, Anna, a spirited adventurer (Kristen Bell) and Elsa, a cryokinetic queen (Idina Menzel) with the awesome power to manifest ice and snow."
• http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Characters/Frozen "The Queen of Arendelle and a powerful cryokinetic."
• http://eyeofthetigernews.com/660060 "The movie starts amicable and cheerful as the two sisters play together until Elsa’s cryokinetic abilities cause her to hurt Anna, starting a chain of events in the movie that leads to Elsa abandoning her kingdom."
• https://www.dailyadvance.com/features/shirrel-rhoades-disney8217s-8216frozen8217-thaws-fairy-tale-2232173 "Just when you thought Disney had exhausted the genre, the House of Mouse has come up with yet another animated “princess” movie -- this one featuring one with cryokinetic powers."
• https://thecoastnews.com/2013/11/disneys-magic-is-in-full-display-with-frozen/ "However, Elsa has been suppressing her cryokinetic abilities due to her sister nearly getting killed once."
• http://blogcritics.org/movie-review-disneys-frozen/ "After Elsa strikes Anna in the head with her cryokinetic powers, the king and queen rush Anna to seek out the help of the nearby trolls."

Jedi94, 1ST7, McDoobAU93, AmericanLemming, please let us know your opinions. Quenhitran (talk) 05:00, 16 February 2014 (UTC)

Thank you for providing the requested references. You only needed one or two, and the combative attitude not at all. - Jack Sebastian (talk) 22:37, 17 February 2014 (UTC)

Great, thanks. I've marked it as "resolved". Both in real life and on wiki, I'd like to do things with a constructive manner. But don't consider "undoing" as something combative. Quenhitran (talk) 05:25, 18 February 2014 (UTC)

Semi-protected edit request on 5 March 2014

Dr. Kenneth Libbrecht, a professor from the California Institute of Technology, was invited to give lectures to the effects group on how snow and ice form, and why snowflakes are unique.[41] Using all this information, together with advanced mathematics (the Material Point Method), physics, computers, and assistance from mathematics researchers at the University of California, Los Angeles,[46] the effects group created a snow simulator and snowflake generator called Matterhorn that allowed them to randomly create 2,000 unique snowflake shapes for the film.[43] The software was also capable of depicting realistic snow in a virtual environment and was responsible for rendering several key sequences.[34][45][47] "There you see [Kristoff] walking through and see his footprints breaking the snow into little pieces and chunk up and you see [Anna] being pulled out and the snow having packed together and broken into pieces. It's very organic how that happens. You don't see that they're pieces already – you see the snow as one thing and then breaking up," explained principal software engineer Andrew Selle.[45]

To be replaced with:

Dr. Kenneth Libbrecht, a professor from the California Institute of Technology, was invited to give lectures to the effects group on how snowflakes are unique and how they form through branching and plating. Using this information the studio created a snowflake growing tool, that allowed to create 2,000 unique snowflake shapes for the film. Another big challenge was how to deliver shots of heavy and deep snow that both interacted believably with characters and had a realistic sticky quality. Disney software engineers: Alexey Stomakhin, Lawrence Chai and Andy Selle, worked closely with researchers at the University of California, Los Angeles: Prof. Joseph Teran and Craig Schroeder, on the tech behind a snow simulator, eventually nicknamed Matterhorn, which was based on a Material Point Method. The tool was used in about 43 scenes where characters were interacting with snow. Engineering principles were used to produce a full range of different snow phenomena, including chunky and powdery forms of snow, as well as to simulate how snow reacts in different situations. "Snow is an important character in the movie," said Stomakhin. "We really wanted people to believe it's real." "There you see [Kristoff] walking through and see his footprints breaking the snow into little pieces and chunk up and you see [Anna] being pulled out and the snow having packed together and broken into pieces. It's very organic how that happens. You don't see that they're pieces already – you see the snow as one thing and then breaking up," explained Selle. "Snow reacts differently than other materials," said Teran, who's been a Disney consultant since 2007. "If you squish snow, it's going to get harder. But if you stretch it, it gets weaker and breaks apart. We took all that into consideration for the model."

Comments:

Basically, the snowflake growing tool and snow simulation tool (Matterhorn) are two separate things. And it would be good to emphasize that. Feel free to remove the citations, if 3 is too many, but they do explain important concepts behind the tech. All the reference are still valid. Also here is another one that was used: http://today.ucla.edu/portal/ut/math-wizards-create-snow-for-disney-263913.aspx

Stalexey (talk) 17:54, 5 March 2014 (UTC)

Thank you for listing a request here. Well, the source is valuable, and I'm working on it. I'll post it after making some minor edits. Quenhitran (talk) 06:27, 6 March 2014 (UTC)

Not done: According to the page's protection level and your user rights, you should currently be able to edit the page yourself. If you still seem to be unable to, please reopen the request with further details. — {{U|Technical 13}} ^{(t • e • c)} 05:15, 12 March 2014 (UTC)

Appropriateness of a Lesbian cartoon for children?

Just curious why the issue is not discussed?Presidentbalut (talk) 09:08, 23 March 2014 (UTC)

Which character is lesbian? BOVINEBOY2008 12:02, 23 March 2014 (UTC)

Do you have independent reliable sources stating this is an issue or were you just hoping to stir something up? - SummerPhD (talk) 14:41, 23 March 2014 (UTC)

I have been reading about it all over the web. I should not have to say this, but I am not a religious person. I also am not a bigot. But I do draw the line when it comes to children. Besides, if this is a controversial element of the story, should it not be discussed? As I understand it, the story is about two princesses that fall in love? Presidentbalut (talk) 18:53, 23 March 2014 (UTC)

You are severely misinformed. The story is about two sisters. They have sisterly love. There is nothing the least bit sexual about it. Reading crazy conspiracy theories by right-wing nutjobs is not the best way to get your information. --Tenebrae (talk) 17:34, 23 March 2014 (UTC)

184.155.141.104 a.k.a. Presidentbalut does not have a source for this and is apparently trying to stir up a discussion about nothing. - SummerPhD (talk) 18:11, 23 March 2014 (UTC)

This is not some kind of conspiracy theory; Google "Frozen LBGT" and other similar keyword searches. "Frozen LBGT" comes up with over 3 million hits, including articles from the Huntington Post and Independent.co.uk. "Let it Go" in particular has been seen as a coming out analogy, though that may better be seen added to the Elsa article. Bruce Campbell (talk) 18:54, 23 March 2014 (UTC)

Actually, there are a lot of articles out there interpreting the film as a LBGT analogy; not to mention other interpretations and themes of the film. It could be interesting if some of that discussion could be included into the article. Wikipedia has entire articles about thematic content in films. However, obviously anything would be need to be very highly referenced and researched quite thoroughly, so including something like that would have to be very carefully executed. Bruce Campbell (talk) 18:54, 23 March 2014 (UTC)

Also, a lot of these articles are actually quite positive, mentioning that the film is teaching tolerance and acceptance. Bruce Campbell (talk) 18:55, 23 March 2014 (UTC)

Those interpretations = "lesbian cartoon"? Wow. A Google search for "+Frozen +lesbian" brings up nothing. Special:Contributions/Presidentbalut, however, seems to bring up a number of heat>light situations. - SummerPhD (talk) 20:14, 23 March 2014 (UTC)

The first page of "Frozen LGBT" came up with these hits. If you want comments from articles that elude to Elsa's sexuality:

From Forbes:

This is not about whether there should be a theatrical Frozen 2, from an artistic point of view. There surely can be more stories to tell as the kingdom comes to terms with Elsa’s “totally not a metaphor for homosexuality” ice powers, as well as how the two mostly separated sisters adjust to actually be in each others’ lives again.

From Slant:

"Disney's Frozen teems with gay themes long before it hits its stride. It tells the story of Elsa, a princess from the land of Arendelle endowed with inexplicable, ice-emitting powers that shame her parents."

And these are all literally from the first page search results. Other critical reviews likely mention similar things. There is a large amount of articles that discuss this from websites that Wikipedia recognizes as reliable. If this stuff like this isn't notable enough for inclusion in the main article, than its understood, since there is already so much to talk about, but I don't see how somebody can pretend like there aren't articles that are discussing the lbtg allusions. Bruce Campbell (talk) 05:15, 25 March 2014 (UTC)

Not to say that the main page, and the character pages, aren't wonderfully done and intricately researched, because they are! Kudos to all the editors involved. Bruce Campbell (talk) 05:15, 25 March 2014 (UTC)

Comment on content, not on the contributors. ALittleQuenhi (talk to me) 08:54, 25 March 2014 (UTC)

Thank you all for the work and references. I am not "trying to stir up" anything. Except a better article. There is endless talk about the lesbian aspects of the film. Be it intentional or not, the film has many lesbian overtones. This, as evidenced by the talk page, warrants a section in the main article. I apologize for being a lazy bum and not putting more work into this myself. But at least I sounded my voice. Someone listened and a chain reaction started. Please, for you wikimasters out there, add a section. I would thank you. For good or for bad. This is supposed to be an academic work. Please leave your emotions at home and be objective.184.155.141.104 (talk) 05:35, 25 March 2014 (UTC)

Do we really need a separate section? I think the LGBT issue is just part of the critical reactions, therefore, just drop a few lines within the "Critical response" heading. ALittleQuenhi (talk to me) 08:38, 25 March 2014 (UTC)

The Forbes piece, about animated-film marketing, gives one snarky aside about homosexuality that seems like just a sarcastic jab at people reading lesbian themes into a movie about two sisters. And the Slate review calls the X-Men movies gay-themed also. I guess if framed as one reviewer's opinion (as opposed to a serious discussion about the topic) this can be a quote in the "Critical reception section," but there's a big, big difference between a reviewer saying there may be metaphors about homosexuality as opposed to insinuations that this story of two sisters is "a lesbian cartoon." --Tenebrae (talk) 15:53, 25 March 2014 (UTC)

Note/Comment: As is mentioned in the #LGBTQIA Inferences/Parallels section above, there are a lot of reviewers (I'm speaking of the ones who pass as WP:Reliable sources) who have interpreted, or have reported people as having interpreted, the film as having one or more LGBT parallels, regardless of some wild theory about whether or not the sisters are in love (I don't see how anyone can come to a valid conclusion that the sisters are in love, by the way). The fact that various reviewers have commented on perceived gay themes in the film, and that there is controversy regarding this topic, as shown by this and this Google search, makes this something that should be covered in this article. If this article is not going to have a Themes section, or Themes subsection of the Critical reception section, like other Wikipedia film articles that deal with what critics feel are themes in the film, the gay themes aspect should have a paragraph devoted to it in the Critical reception section. I'll alert WP:FILM to this topic for more opinions. Flyer22 (talk) 03:10, 26 March 2014 (UTC)

I might also alert WP:LGBT to this discussion. Flyer22 (talk) 03:17, 26 March 2014 (UTC)

edit suggested

Please replace "132 hours" with "30 hours" in: The particular scene in which Elsa walks out onto the balcony of her palace is 218 frames long, each of which took more than 132 hours to render.[58]

The cited source is not credible and doesn't have any source for their information.

Here (http://www.animationmagazine.net/features/disney-ice/) in an interview with the director, Jennifer Lee, in which she is quoted as saying a single frame took 30 hours.

173.20.13.62 (talk) 03:10, 26 March 2014 (UTC)