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Based on my research and the [https://books.google.com/ngrams/graph?content=swaminarayan+sampraday%2Cswaminarayan+sampradaya%2C+swaminarayan+%28spiritual+tradition%29&case_insensitive=on&year_start=1800&year_end=2008&corpus=15&smoothing=3&share=&direct_url=t1%3B%2CSwaminarayan%20Sampraday%3B%2Cc0%3B.t1%3B%2CSwaminarayan%20Sampradaya%3B%2Cc0| n-gram result], I am requesting to move the current article, to change the title to Swaminarayan Sampradaya as it is more appropriate. [[User:Apollo1203|Apollo1203]] ([[User talk:Apollo1203|talk]]) 08:21, 31 December 2019 (UTC)
Based on my research and the [https://books.google.com/ngrams/graph?content=swaminarayan+sampraday%2Cswaminarayan+sampradaya%2C+swaminarayan+%28spiritual+tradition%29&case_insensitive=on&year_start=1800&year_end=2008&corpus=15&smoothing=3&share=&direct_url=t1%3B%2CSwaminarayan%20Sampraday%3B%2Cc0%3B.t1%3B%2CSwaminarayan%20Sampradaya%3B%2Cc0| n-gram result], I am requesting to move the current article, to change the title to Swaminarayan Sampradaya as it is more appropriate. [[User:Apollo1203|Apollo1203]] ([[User talk:Apollo1203|talk]]) 08:21, 31 December 2019 (UTC)
:I supporting '''moving''' the article as it reflects scholarly consensus [[User:Moksha88/sandbox3|(1)]]. In merging the pages, I didn't realize I couldn't simply rename the page and would have suggested merging in the opposite direction. [[User:Moksha88|Moksha88]] ([[User talk:Moksha88|talk]]) 18:07, 31 December 2019 (UTC)

Revision as of 18:07, 31 December 2019

Schismatic groups

I would want to know as to the following of each in terms of numbers. Its important as if the following is the same then the views should be represented equally. Wikidās ॐ 08:25, 10 May 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Title

Name does not sound right. I propose it be moved to either Swaminarayan Faith or Succession of Swaminarayan. Wheredevelsdare (talk) 14:09, 15 May 2008 (UTC)[reply]

I agree, I like Swaminarayan Faith    Juthani1   tcs 19:30, 15 May 2008 (UTC)[reply]

You can look up on how exactly this works with other groups. I think a good example is Bahá'í Faith article. Its featured and can used as an example to where to go from here. Wikidās ॐ 20:27, 15 May 2008 (UTC)[reply]
 Done - Wheredevelsdare (talk) 22:19, 16 May 2008 (UTC)[reply]
Should "Faith" and/or "Sect" in the title be capitalized? I could be wrong, but it seems to me that only Swaminarayan should be capitalized, since "faith" is not the only formal term used for the tradition, and is used for the article to make the distinction between the faith and the religious leader. --Shruti14 t c s 16:00, 4 August 2008 (UTC)[reply]
I agree. Around The Globeसत्यमेव जयते 15:59, 29 August 2009 (UTC)[reply]

I agree from what I read this may be blasphemous to Hinduism. BAPS financing is also not clear whether this is a commercial enterprise or a genuine religious organization. This is worship of the person swaminarayan just like sai baba who is inspired by muslim influences and some people still consider Hinduism. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 66.49.150.167 (talk) 00:07, 1 April 2015 (UTC)[reply]

Denomination?

Is the Swaminarayan faith considered Shaivism, Shaktism, Vaishnavism, or Smartha? Sylvain1972 (talk) 17:07, 28 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]

It is considered a denomination of vaishnavism by most, however some believe it is a denomination of its own    World   tcs 20:15, 28 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]
I think the intro should characterize it as Swaminarayan Vaishnavism or Swaminarayan Vaishnavist Hinduism then. As a westerner having delved into the topic of Hinduism, I agree with the Indic sentiment that there is not really a religion called "Hinduism", but since most westerners use to believe there is, the "Hinduism" (similar to Abrahamite) may still be retained. Rursus dixit. (mbork3!) 22:31, 12 April 2010 (UTC)[reply]
See my comment above, that's the only problem with doing that The World 12:38, 13 April 2010 (UTC)[reply]

This should be a denomination on its own — Preceding unsigned comment added by 69.171.129.133 (talk) 06:35, 1 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]

It is a sub-denomination within Vaishnava Hinduism, much like Gaudiya Vaishnavism (ISKCON sect). The present title doesn't really make sense since it's not its own brand of Hinduism; rather, it is a sect of subsect within Hinduism. It would be more appropriate to move the article back to its previous name of Swaminarayan faith or Swaminarayan sect. Or perhaps it could be renamed to something like Swaminarayan (sect) to indicate that its name is Swaminarayan (and not Swaminarayan Faith, as in the case of the Baha'i Faith, but that it is a faith community as distinguished from Swaminarayan the spiritual leader who is the founder of the faith group. --Shruti14 talk • sign 01:45, 12 July 2015 (UTC)[reply]

Orphaned references in Swaminarayan Faith

I check pages listed in Category:Pages with incorrect ref formatting to try to fix reference errors. One of the things I do is look for content for orphaned references in wikilinked articles. I have found content for some of Swaminarayan Faith's orphans, the problem is that I found more than one version. I can't determine which (if any) is correct for this article, so I am asking for a sentient editor to look it over and copy the correct ref content into this article.

Reference named "isbn8170247985":

  • From Shikshapatri: M. G. Chitkara (1997). Hindutva. APH. Retrieved March 26, 2009. Page 230
  • From Desh Vibhag Lekh: M. G. Chitkara (1997). Hindutva. APH. Retrieved March 26, 2009. Page 228
  • From Shri Swaminarayan Mandir, Vadtal: M. G. Chitkara (1997). Hindutva. APH. pp. 227–228. Retrieved June 10, 2009.
  • From Vachanamrut: M. G. Chitkara (1997). Hindutva. APH. p. 228. Retrieved June 13, 2009.
  • From Swaminarayan Sampraday: M. G. Chitkara (1997). Hindutva. APH. p. 230. Retrieved June 17, 2009.

Reference named "isbn8120606515":

I apologize if any of the above are effectively identical; I am just a simple computer program, so I can't determine whether minor differences are significant or not. AnomieBOT⚡ 10:24, 1 July 2009 (UTC)[reply]

https://indiankanoon.org/doc/145565 laxmikant (talk) 03:00, 30 March 2018 (UTC)[reply]

New information

Keeping in mind some information has been transplanted here from Swaminarayan, the article now gives information on both the Faith (or belief) and Succession. Should the article title be changed to reflect the same - Swaminarayan Faith and Succession or Swaminarayan Hinduism? Around The Globeसत्यमेव जयते 10:43, 1 July 2009 (UTC)[reply]

I strongly agree. The name of the article must reflect the information. I think Swaminarayan Hinduism would be a suitable name. Swaminarayan Faith and Succession, to me at least, feels like there is a bit of repetition. The faith includes succession, if you see what I mean. World (talk • contributions) 18:34, 3 July 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Sources

There are a number of academic and journalistic sources that provide an (at times highly critical) analysis of the evolution and social function of the faith. These should be covered in this article, and some use of the would be essential, should it be nominated at any future stage for Good Article status:

  • Rohit Barot, 'Religion, migration and wealth creation in the Swaminarayan Movement', in Bryceson, Deborah and Ulla Vuorela (eds), The Transnational Family".
  • Rohit Barot has written books that would also prbably touch on the subject and should be checked at some stage.
  • David Hardiman, "Class base of Swaminarayan sect", Economic and Political Weekly, 10 September 1988 (subscription needed, or library access)
  • Makrand Mehta, controversial article in the Gujarati-language journal of the Centre for Social Studies, Surat, 1986

Suggestions

nn

  • "The Swaminarayan faith has a large percentage of Hindus who are followers of Swaminarayan." what how it mean? Are there non-Hindu Swaminarayans?
  • "India, Britain, and the United States." Form sentences. A section on distribution of Swaminarayan Hindus is necessary
  • Instead of having a section titled "Succession of Swaminarayan", I suggest a layout of:
    • "Common beliefs"
    • Common History: who is Swaminarayan? Sampradaya and reason of schisms
    • Separate sections on each sect within S.Hinduism. Highlight differences in philosophies, succession etc. A short history of each within the sect section. Chief Temples and leaders by each sect. Organization of each sect.
      • Swaminarayan Sampraday
      • BAPS
      • et al
    • Relations of the schisms (approval/criticism of each other etc.)

--Redtigerxyz Talk 13:44, 31 August 2009 (UTC)[reply]

The Swaminarayan faith can be considered an "original" work by wikipedia standards as Hinduism already has an established collection of authentic books. remove swaminarayan from wikipedia hindu references as per wikipedia standards please and also other faiths like sai baba and iskcon claiming to be hindu faiths . please

Swaminarayan and ISKCON are established, widely recognized faith communities that are sub-denominations of Vaishnavism, which itself is a major denomination of Hinduism. Thus they are not merely 'claiming to be hindu faiths' as you say. They are actually validly classified as part of Hinduism and recognized as such by scholars, legal systems, and governments. --Shruti14 talk • sign 01:47, 12 July 2015 (UTC)[reply]
Wikipedia standards are based on reliable sources and there are sources that clearly point to both ISKCON and Swaminarayan being recognized and widely accepted subgroups within Vaishnavism which itself is one of the major branches of the Hindu faith. --Shruti14 talk • sign 01:56, 12 July 2015 (UTC)[reply]

Name change & lede

Name change given for reasons mentioned above - it does not make sense to call the article 'Swaminarayan Hinduism' since that is not an official name for it and frankly it is not some special brand of Hinduism. More properly it is a spiritual tradition within the Vaishnava major sect of Hinduism. It is also not known as Swaminarayan Faith officially (akin to Baha'i Faith) nor is it officially known as the Swaminarayan Sect. Its name is simply Swaminarayan. Changed the title of the article accordingly, with a parenthetical explanation that this is a spiritual tradition to distinguish from the spiritual leader with the same name who is the founder of the sect whose biographical article also bears the name Swaminarayan. Also edited the lede to clarify that this is a branch of Vaishnava Hinduism. --Shruti14 talk • sign 01:55, 12 July 2015 (UTC)[reply]

https://indiankanoon.org/doc/145565 it is not Hinduism at all, it is business. laxmikant (talk) 03:02, 30 March 2018 (UTC)[reply]

Hinduism

Please remove references to Hinduism in this article. This sect is already falsely claiming to be the largest Hindu temple. Please stop misinformation if you believe in a God. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 67.55.34.248 (talk) 12:21, 23 October 2015 (UTC)[reply]

External links modified

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Fan POV Tag

WP:Conachieve can you please explain why this tag was placed? There has not been a discussion about this tag.Treehugger8891 (talk) 02:08, 2 October 2019 (UTC)[reply]

@Treehugger8891:, agreed. I'm tagging @Harshil169: to explain the reasoning. Moksha88 (talk) 21:47, 2 October 2019 (UTC)[reply]
Moksha88 If someone is reading article then it can be clearly understandable that it’s written from point of view from person who follows it. On Wikipedia, articles related to religion must adhere NPOV and secondary and tertiary sources which critically examine one religion. Also, many details in the article is unnecessary for common person who just want to know about tradition but it may be necessary for fan/follower of sect. The article has systematic bias and thus, I’ve tshged this. Thanks— Harshil want to talk? 02:10, 3 October 2019 (UTC)[reply]

Merge

The following discussion is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section. A summary of the conclusions reached follows.
The result of this discussion was to merge.

This article needs to be merged with Swaminarayan. Editor2020 (talk) 03:13, 16 December 2019 (UTC)[reply]

Editor2020, I agree that this article should be merged though would like to suggest another article. This refers to the tradition founded by Swaminarayan. Just as there are separate articles for the founders of other faiths and the faith itself, I don’t think these articles should be merged. Instead, this article should be merged with the Swaminarayan Sampraday article. After a close review, the majority of scholarly sources use Swaminarayan Sampraday to refer to all the groups within this tradition (1). Some of the content in this article also duplicates what exists in the current Swaminarayan Sampraday article as noted by others. Moksha88 (talk) 04:21, 18 December 2019 (UTC)[reply]
Yes, you are correct. This article should be merged with Swaminarayan Sampraday. Editor2020 (talk) 04:25, 18 December 2019 (UTC)[reply]
Editor2020, let me study these articles a bit more to identify how best to make the merger happen. I will then draft up an outline in my sandbox of steps moving forward. Moksha88 (talk) 03:55, 19 December 2019 (UTC)[reply]
Editor2020, here's my suggested merger (1). If you agree, can you change the merge tags that you've currently placed to reflect the suggested merger? Per WP:PM, I will also invite other editors in the Swaminarayan Wikiproject for discussion given the complexity of the task at hand. Moksha88 (talk) 03:06, 20 December 2019 (UTC)[reply]
I don't believe I set any tags, just this mention on the Talk page. Editor2020 (talk) 22:46, 22 December 2019 (UTC)[reply]
Editor2020, my mistake. I added the tags to all the pages. Please let me know if they look alright: Swaminarayan Sampraday, Swaminarayan (spiritual tradition)‎, Nar Narayan Dev Gadi, and Laxmi Narayan Dev Gadi. Thank you. Moksha88 (talk) 03:05, 23 December 2019 (UTC)[reply]

Looking good. Editor2020 (talk) 03:16, 23 December 2019 (UTC)[reply]

I came across this discussion on the wiki project. I agree with the proposed merger. However I feel we should move the 'Temples' section from the Sampraday article into the List of Swaminarayan Temples article.Actionjackson09 (talk) 12:18, 24 December 2019 (UTC)[reply]
Thank you Moksha88 for posting on the Wikiproject page regarding this merge. I, too, agree on this merge and it also seems logical to move 'Temples' from the Swaminarayan Sampradaya article to "List of Swaminarayan Temples" article. Apollo1203 (talk) 15:21, 25 December 2019 (UTC)[reply]
Actionjackson09 & Apollo1203, I think that makes sense and will adjust the tag accordingly. Moksha88 (talk) 19:42, 25 December 2019 (UTC)[reply]
In reviewing the Sampraday article, there's a significant amount of content lacking scholarly sources along with original research. I will begin posting excerpts on my sandbox (1) which need to be verified and/or rewritten and would appreciate both of your help. I will make these edits after I merge to avoid confusing content. Moksha88 (talk) 02:32, 26 December 2019 (UTC)[reply]
On closer review, I think 'Organization Structure' from the Sampraday article is best suited for articles dedicated to each of the diocese. I have revised the structure accordingly. Moksha88 (talk) 03:39, 29 December 2019 (UTC)[reply]
Hey everyone, came across this conversation after I joined the Swaminarayan wikiproject. Thanks to (talk) for succinctly visualizing what sections from the spiritual tradition would merge into the main page under. I happen to also think that this merge should happen and agree with the editor above that the 'Temples" section should be in the list of swaminarayan temples article. The organizations within the swaminarayan sampraday should also encompass the bit about the gunatit samaj from the spiritual traditions page. If you have not done so, review the chart on Moksha88's sandbox. I believe this grouping is the best for this proposed merge. ThaNDNman224 (talk) 04:19, 29 December 2019 (UTC)[reply]
I appreciate everyone's input. As this discussion has been ongoing for at least 7 days and we have unanimous consensus to move forward, I will close this thread and begin the merger. Thank you Editor2020 for starting this process. Actionjackson09, Apollo1203, ThaNDNman224, we will need to do a lot of verifying and copy editing in the coming days.
The discussion above is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

Requested move 31 December 2019

Swaminarayan (spiritual tradition) → Swaminarayan Sampradaya – Please place your rationale for the proposed move here. Apollo1203 (talk) 08:21, 31 December 2019 (UTC)[reply]
Based on my research and the n-gram result, I am requesting to move the current article, to change the title to Swaminarayan Sampradaya as it is more appropriate. Apollo1203 (talk) 08:21, 31 December 2019 (UTC)[reply]

I supporting moving the article as it reflects scholarly consensus (1). In merging the pages, I didn't realize I couldn't simply rename the page and would have suggested merging in the opposite direction. Moksha88 (talk) 18:07, 31 December 2019 (UTC)[reply]
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