Wikipedia talk:WikiProject Tropical cyclones

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• 12 Sep 2024 – Tropical Storm Hanna (2002) (talk · edit · hist) has been proposed for Today's Featured Article by Harizotoh9 (t · c); see discussion

Featured article candidates

• 21 May 2024 – Hurricane Hilary (talk · edit · hist) was FA nominated by Hurricanehink (t · c); see discussion

Good article nominees

• 07 Jul 2024 – Meteorological history of Cyclone Freddy (talk · edit · hist) was GA nominated by HurricaneEdgar (t · c); see discussion
• 30 Jun 2024 – Hurricane Juliette (2001) (talk · edit · hist) was GA nominated by Hurricanehink (t · c); see discussion
• 19 Jun 2024 – Typhoon Ewiniar (2024) (talk · edit · hist) was GA nominated by TheNuggeteer (t · c); start discussion
• 07 Jun 2024 – Tropical Storm Yun-yeung (talk · edit · hist) was GA nominated by OhHaiMark (t · c); see discussion
• 15 May 2024 – 1937 Pacific typhoon season (talk · edit · hist) was GA nominated by Hurricanehink (t · c); start discussion
• 29 Apr 2024 – 1937 Hong Kong typhoon (talk · edit · hist) was GA nominated by Hurricanehink (t · c); start discussion
• 17 Apr 2024 – 1876 Atlantic hurricane season (talk · edit · hist) was GA nominated by 12george1 (t · c); start discussion
• 09 Apr 2024 – 1873 Atlantic hurricane season (talk · edit · hist) was GA nominated by 12george1 (t · c); start discussion
• 08 Apr 2024 – 1872 Atlantic hurricane season (talk · edit · hist) was GA nominated by 12george1 (t · c); start discussion

Good topic candidates

• 16 Jun 2024 – 1993 Atlantic hurricane season (talk · edit · hist) was GT nominated by Dylan620 (t · c); see discussion
  The topic includes: Timeline of the 1993 Atlantic hurricane season

Requested moves

• 01 Jul 2024 – Hurricane Beryl (2024) (talk · edit · hist) move request to Hurricane Beryl by Quxyz (t · c) was moved to Hurricane Beryl (talk · edit · hist) by King of Hearts (t · c) on 03 Jul 2024; see discussion

Articles to be merged

• 08 Jul 2024 – Tropical Depression Two (2010) (talk · edit · hist) is proposed for merging to 2010 Atlantic hurricane season by OhHaiMark (t · c); see discussion
• 05 May 2024 – Hurricane Isaias tornado outbreak (talk · edit · hist) is proposed for merging to Hurricane Isaias by Hurricanehink (t · c); see discussion
• 05 May 2024 – Effects of Hurricane Isaac in Louisiana (talk · edit · hist) is proposed for merging to Hurricane Isaac (2012) by Hurricanehink (t · c); see discussion
• 05 May 2024 – Effects of Hurricane Isaac in Florida (talk · edit · hist) is proposed for merging to Hurricane Isaac (2012) by Hurricanehink (t · c); see discussion
• 13 Apr 2024 – Cyclone Kate (2006) (talk · edit · hist) is proposed for merging to 2005–06 Australian region cyclone season by Hurricanehink (t · c); see discussion
• 03 Mar 2024 – Tropical Storm Cristobal (2002) (talk · edit · hist) is proposed for merging to 2002 Atlantic hurricane season by Hurricanehink (t · c); see discussion
• 23 Feb 2024 – Tropical Storm Nicholas (2003) (talk · edit · hist) is proposed for merging to 2003 Atlantic hurricane season by Hurricane Noah (t · c); see discussion
• 23 Feb 2024 – Tropical Storm Lester (2004) (talk · edit · hist) is proposed for merging to 2004 Pacific hurricane season by Hurricane Noah (t · c); see discussion
• 23 Feb 2024 – Tropical Storm Ignacio (1997) (talk · edit · hist) is proposed for merging to 1997 Pacific hurricane season by Hurricane Noah (t · c); see discussion
• 23 Feb 2024 – Tropical Storm Danny (2009) (talk · edit · hist) is proposed for merging to 2009 Atlantic hurricane season by Hurricane Noah (t · c); see discussion

(1 more...)

Articles for creation

• 25 Apr 2024 – Draft:Effects of Hurricane Ian in Florida (talk · edit · hist) has been submitted for AfC by 204.98.124.205 (t · c)

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WikiProject Tropical Cyclones

WikiProject home (talk) Archives: 1 | 2 | 3 | 4 | 5 | 6 | 7 | 8 | 9 | 10 | 11 | 12 | 13 | 14 | 15 | 16 | 17 | 18 | 19 | 20 | 21 | 22 | 23 | 24 | 25 | 26 | 27 | 28 | 29 | 30 | 31 | 32 | 33 | 34 | 35 | 36 | 37 | 38 | 39 | 40 | 41 | 42 | 43 | 44 | 45 | 46 | 47 | 48 | 49 Task forces → Western Pacific task force (talk) → Eastern Pacific task force (talk) → Atlantic task force (talk) → North Indian Ocean task force (talk) → Southern Hemisphere task force (talk) → Graphics task force (talk) → 2018 FT task force (talk) Newsletter (talk) Archives: 1 | 2 | 3 | 4 | 5 | 6 | 7 | 8 | 9 | 10 | 11 | 12 | 13 | 14 | 15 | 16 | 17 | 18 | 19 | 20 | 21 | 22 | 23 | 24 | 25 | 26 | 27 | 28 | 29 | 30 | 31 | 32 | 33 | 34 | 35 | 36 | 37 | 38 | 39 | 40 | 41 | 42 | 43 | 44 | 45 | 46 | 47 | 48 Project resources (talk) Jargon (talk) WikiProject statistics (talk) Article requests (talk) Cyclone Cup (talk) Vital articles (talk) Showcase (talk) Style guidelines (talk) Awards (talk) Assessment Main assessment page (talk) → Assessment tables (talk) → Assessment log (talk) → Assessment statistics (talk) Tropical cyclones portal Parent project WikiProject Weather (talk)

Project notes

I just created this wikiproject, after several months of contemplating doing so. I hope everyone working on hurricane articles will get involved. I went ahead and wrote a bunch of guidelines, basically based on current practices...naturally since this is something I just wrote it doesn't necessarily represent community consensus and needs to be discussed. That discussion should probably go here for now...although eventually we may make these pages a little more structured. For a general TODO list, see the "tasks" item on the project page. Jdorje 23:17, 5 October 2005 (UTC)

Reconsidering the Hurricane Severity Index

I am a member of WP:Weather, but not WP:Cyclone specifically and have some concerns about the Hurricane Severity Index (HSI) on many hurricane-related pages. I think it is more useful than the Saffir-Simpson Scale, but I think it's very out-of-date. The last storms on it hit the US 15 years ago and granted there haven't been many landfalls past that point (fortunately), but I still think there have been multiple storms that could have made the list. I have found a source that I believe says how to calculate it if we are able to do that without copyright (I'm actually not entirely sure how that works), but considering how I have found very little information on it outside of 2008 when it was proposed except for one article made after Hurricane Harvey 2017, I think we should reconsider having it on our pages, or at least rebranding/relabeling it.

https://www.stormgeo.com/assets/Uploads/HSI-Abstract-for-AMS.pdf

Jamisonsupame (talk) 14:04, 8 July 2023 (UTC)

Hi Jamisonsupame, are you referring to {{Most intense landfalling Atlantic hurricanes (HSI)}} being placed on some pages? As far as I can tell it's transcluded on Hurricane Opal, Hurricane Camille, Hurricane Betsy, Hurricane Ivan, and List of Atlantic hurricane records. I'm not surprised that there's not much information on the HSI out there as it was developed by a private company, ImpactWeather, Inc, which has since been acquired by StormGeo – publisher of the article you linked above. I guess it never really saw more widespread use owing to copyright (people would have to cite their methodology every time they used their scale, or maybe even pay royalties) and it seems likely the main motive behind StormGeo/ImpactWeather developing the scale was to sell their products (they are a business analytics firm, after all).

Anyway, we can't calculate the HSI ourselves – it'd run afoul of Wikipedia policies on original research as applying their formula goes way beyond routine calculations, especially with the 87-knot wind radii not being publicly available from the NHC, and wind radii from historical systems having to be calculated using historical storm surge data from SLOSH. (StormGeo/ImpactWeather doesn't actually outline how they do either of these things.) Their ranking table also looks somewhat cherrypicked to me, or maybe that's just because they don't have the data for some historical systems e.g. I doubt the 1935 Labor Day hurricane should be missing entirely. Given the absence of transparency behind their calculations and potential issues with comprehensiveness, I'd say that there's not much point in the table existing outside of the Hurricane Severity Index article. ~ KN2731 {talk · contribs} 10:16, 9 July 2023 (UTC)

I personally wonder about the notability of the HSI article since the scale hasn't taken off at all and is only used by StormGeo themselves. CC: @Cyclonebiskit: since he created the HSI template in the first place.Jason Rees (talk) 15:35, 9 July 2023 (UTC)

Adding the ACE in basins outside NHC's responsibility

Should the ACE section be added to the Pacific typhoon, North Indian and Southern Hemisphere season articles? Although they don't use RSMC data, they are also official and good measure of seasonal activity. IntegerSequences (talk | contribs) 08:08, 19 July 2023 (UTC)

@IntegerSequences You need to clarify what you want here, as the inclusion of ACE has been discussed multiple times over the years. Regardless lets take a couple of steps back here and consider a few things that need to be considered before ACE goes anywhere near the season articles. First of all we have to remember that there are at least two ways to calculate what the ACE of a season is, which means straight of the bat it is original research for us to calculate it ourselves. We then would do well to remember that the ACE is one of at least 4 ways to calcuate how active a season is with Velocity Flux, Power Dissipation Index and the Hurricane Destruction Potential index being other ways to calculate it. We then have to take a step back and remember that there are multiple warning centres in these basins, which prompts the question whose data do we use? It would be ideal to take the data from the RSMC/TCWC's (JMA, IMD, MFR, BMKG, BoM, PNG NWS, FMS, MSNZ), who are official, however, with the exception of the IMD they do not tend to present details on what the ACE was. We could use the data from either Ryan Maue or Phil Koltsburg/CSU, however they currently disagree with each other. I also compared the JTWC 2020 ATCR which states that the ACE for 2020 was 155.7 with both websites. CSU shows that it was 152.8 units, while I can not see an overall value for 2020 from Ryan Maue. It is also worth remembering that the season articles are long enough without a section being added that talks about various statistics. Out of curtsey I am pinging @Siroxo: to this discussion, as they commented on this proposal when it was originally placed on Talk:2023 Pacific typhoon season.Jason Rees (talk) 10:28, 19 July 2023 (UTC)

Strongest storm

2023 Atlantic hurricane season keeps getting its strongest storm changed and me, User:Hurricanehink, and User:Drdpw have expressed interest in the changing of what defines the strongest storm. It is mostly based on the premise that people don't read footnotes and comments and that in our experience, strongest storm usually correlates to wind speed. While I'm not sure about the views of other editors (or how it could be coded), I think that we should have three strongest storm categories: one for intensity, one for windspeed, and one for when there is one storm with both highest windspeed and intensity. ✶Mitch199811✶ 23:06, 29 July 2023 (UTC)

Having three different categories seems a bit excessive, and bulky. The infobox would be overcrowded for one. I'm not sure why our practice is to measure a storm's intensity by its barometric pressure rather than its wind speed (perhaps another editor can provide further insight there). I'm not really sure there's an easy solution to changing the infobox to measure by wind speed rather than pressure unless there's a consensus to do so. Gumballs678 talk 03:04, 30 July 2023 (UTC)

There needs to be a way to include both the strongest by wind speed and most intense by pressure in the season infoboxes when not the same storm, as happens in many seasons. Our practice of measuring tropical cyclone strength by pressure has generated confusion and controversy across several articles, and is out of sync with with various meteorological agencies worldwide, which determine tropical cyclone strength by wind speed. And more broadly, in media and common conversation, wind speeds equate with strength, not barometric pressure. (See also: Wikipedia talk:WikiProject Tropical cyclones/Archive 48#Two Proposals Concerning Listing Tropical Cyclone Strength) Drdpw (talk) 04:00, 30 July 2023 (UTC)

I don’t disagree. Maybe “strongest storm” can still exist, and then if a scenario such as the one in this current season arises, we can have strongest by wind and strongest by pressure, that way both areas are covered and it clears confusion. If it doesn’t occur, meaning it’s clear that the strongest storm of the season is X and not Y, then we can keep the separate designations hidden. Gumballs678 talk 12:06, 30 July 2023 (UTC)

There might be a better way to do it. But it's really just so that we can say who the most intense, windiest, and both ones. ✶Mitch199811✶ 15:19, 30 July 2023 (UTC)

In terms of measuring intensity, wind speed, and the categories associated with them, is used as it is the easiest way to convey information about a storm to the public. However, a storm's overall intensity is better represented by its pressure, which includes other things like size and structure, and determines its location and movement. I know this isn't much, but I hope it helps. ChessEric 18:14, 30 July 2023 (UTC)

@ChessEric Would it hurt to have effectively two strongest storm sections, one half for pressure and another for wind speed? ✶Mitch199811✶ 18:18, 30 July 2023 (UTC)

No. If it gets rid of the confusion, I'm all for it. ChessEric 19:59, 30 July 2023 (UTC)

It would alleviate confusion and controversy generated across several articles. Drdpw (talk) 03:45, 1 August 2023 (UTC)

Does anyone with coding skills have the ability to do a mock-up for the 2022 AHS to demonstrate this? Hurricanehink mobile (talk) 12:55, 1 August 2023 (UTC)

I might be able to via MS paint but I don't even know where templates are coded. ✶Mitch199811✶ 14:10, 1 August 2023 (UTC)

Mockup for what the Strongest section could look like.

I made a really rough sketch in MS paint of what I was thinking it could look like. The values are not right. The font will obviously be more correct with the template. Wording may also change. ✶Mitch199811✶ 15:25, 1 August 2023 (UTC)

It looks nice, but do we necessarily need to include winds for the storm with minimum pressure, or the pressure for the storm with maximum winds? I might just have the storm name and the appropriate value for each strength rating. — Iunetalk 16:30, 1 August 2023 (UTC)