Talk:Seventh generation of video game consoles

Please do not ... ... change any of the launch prices in this article, regardless of current price. The launch prices are set in history and there is no way they will ever change. ... change any of the sales numbers without citing a valid source. VGChartz.com and Nexgenwars.com are not considered valid sources. The most reliable sources are the companies' own quarterly financial statements. See Wikipedia:Footnotes for help with creating reference tags. .

Nintendo DS is NOT Seventh Gen.

I don't think the DS is Seventh Generation because first, it was made in 2004, and it's graphics are similar of the PSone. Yes, one. I think the DS belongs in Sixth Generation, because is is not 7th Gen. worthy. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 68.62.215.236 (talk) 17:07, 3 February 2008 (UTC)

The distinction of whether it belongs in sixth or seventh generation is due to release dates and what it is competing against. It is not whether it is graphically similar to a previous generation console. Chan Yin Keen | Talk 18:48, 3 February 2008 (UTC)

Exactly, otherwise the Wii would also belong in the previous generation. Nintendo even admitted up front the graphics wouldn't be significantly better than the GameCube's. The Seventh Taylor (talk) 21:30, 8 February 2008 (UTC)

Graphical capabilities don't determine the generation of a console. Neither do motion sensing capabilities (that would put the Wii a generation past the 360). The release date is the only factor. Why do people keep bringing this up? Useight (talk) 03:29, 12 February 2008 (UTC)

I'd like to think that release dates aren't the only thing that define generations either. It's worth noting too that the scope of the some of the older generations overlap in years. As it is I feel the DS is seventh gen mostly due to its attitude. 7th gen systems are all focused on socialability to some extent and the DS is certainly included in that trend. Of course release dates have something to do with it otherwise we'd include the original XBOX in the 7th gen under my classification too. I think maybe the generations are best defined as time periods in which certain trends and technologies are dominant. Under that model then yes, the DS is definitely 7th gen.70.171.212.60 (talk) 00:23, 26 March 2008 (UTC)

• Also, even if graphics are involved, full 3D in a handheld system wasn't around before the DS/PSP if my memory is right..72.205.199.80 (talk) 00:53, 16 May 2008 (UTC)

Handhelds aren't consoles at all. Neither the PSP nor the DS really belong here.--72.200.213.177 (talk) 06:57, 29 May 2008 (UTC)

They're called handheld consoles, and as such, are consoles. Chan Yin Keen | Talk 17:28, 29 May 2008 (UTC)

To tell you the truth you DO have a point! But ya know what i mean Gameboy would be third gen Neo Geo Pocket would be forth and Advanced Pico Beena would be fifth so i guess that is how it works. Mcjakecool Mcjakeqcool (talk) 19:20, 3 September 2008 (UTC)

But still, it's got no 7th Gen technology. A touch screen isn't all that fancy. Plus, the old one is big and bulky and old. I still think it's not 7th Gen.

Don't be ridiculous. Wii is 7th gen and it's not got HD graphics. Dreamcast is 6th gen and it doesn't use DVD. The Saturn is 5th gen and it is barely even heard of.Ffgamera (talk) 11:17, 6 October 2008 (UTC)

Other consoles

Should the Vii be included, or are there many other Famiclones in this generation that should then be included as well? The Seventh Taylor (talk) 21:40, 8 February 2008 (UTC)

Console War?

MAybe we should include the console war... —Preceding unsigned comment added by 142.162.79.140 (talk) 23:06, 8 February 2008 (UTC)

Archive?

The page is starting to get rather long, so I would suggest an archive up to and including "Sales Standings." If there are no objections, I will archive the page by Tuesday. Laptopdude (talk) 15:39, 10 February 2008 (UTC)

It has been archived Laptopdude (talk) 00:11, 12 February 2008 (UTC)

Current price

I think we should add current price to the comparison table. It will give readers a better idea on how the consolemakers position themselves on the market today. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Blueblister (talk • contribs) 03:18, 15 February 2008 (UTC)

I think, the prices have not changed since launch. If there is variation in terms of price from the launch price, it is probably due to the retailers, not console makers. Can anyone verify any official price drops or price hikes though? Chan Yin Keen | Talk 05:09, 15 February 2008 (UTC)

The Xbox 360 in Japan is getting an offical price drop, although the article indicates only US dollars not yen. --Silver Edge (talk) 05:55, 15 February 2008 (UTC)

Oh, my bad. The 60GB PS3 had a pricedrop in october of last year but it has been phased out since then.Blueblister (talk) 15:51, 15 February 2008 (UTC)

handhelds =/= consoles

Should this article not be called History of video game systems (seventh generation) ? Handhelds are not consoles. xenocidic (talk) 14:31, 23 February 2008 (UTC)

See handheld game console. --Silver Edge (talk) 21:35, 23 February 2008 (UTC)

Fair enough, but see http://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/console

“ A video game console, especially as opposed to a handheld. ”

I guess I'm just not a fan of calling portable gaming systems "consoles", but I guess it's not a big deal. xenocidic (talk) 22:00, 23 February 2008 (UTC)

VG Chartz

Can someone tell me why VG Gartz is not a relaible source for sales figures? Thanks. Seanor3 (talk) 15:14, 28 February 2008 (UTC)

Something about being self-published, I think. Zanfy (talk) 21:40, 28 February 2008 (UTC)

Check at WikiProject Video Games. VGChartz is just a little different from a self-publishing source that does make their numbers up. -- ReyBrujo (talk) 00:57, 29 February 2008 (UTC)

The beginning of XBox's article isn't showing up

It starts off with the headline about the consoles and the goes right into mid-article about XBox without the title or beginning of it. If you try to edit it you see that it's there in the editing section but there's nothing I can seem to do to make what appears in the edit section appear on the page itself. --67.165.141.239 (talk) 21:13, 2 March 2008 (UTC)

Yes, one reference was eating it all. It is already fixed now, thanks for informing that! -- ReyBrujo (talk) 23:18, 2 March 2008 (UTC)

What distinguishes Seventh Generation?

I came to this article expecting to find a clear explanation of what characteristics qualify a video game console as belonging to the "seventh generation." Instead, all I see are comparisons of various video game consoles that are generally deemed to belong to this group. Unfortunately, this does nothing to explain what sets these apart from sixth generation machines. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 68.37.23.57 (talk) 06:53, 9 March 2008 (UTC)

See #Nintendo DS is NOT Seventh Gen. --Silver Edge (talk) 15:27, 9 March 2008 (UTC)

The competition of the first released console, and then the next made one is the next generation. It is not necessarily the exact competition because the Dreamcast is 6th gen, but it competed against the PS1. eg. The PlayStation was 5th gen, the PS2 was 6th gen, and PS3 is 7th gen. Ffgamera (talk) 07:46, 28 October 2008 (UTC)

Worldwide

Worldwide must mean Worldwide minus US and Japan, but it doesn't say that. In the worldwide sales for XBox 360, PS3, Wii the numbers can not be the worldwide sales. Is there anyway to change this without having to write too much? 142.165.59.39 (talk) 00:47, 11 March 2008 (UTC)

Well, if I was trying to find a quick way to say the number included the entire world except the US and Japan, I'd probably call the area Europe/Australia. I know that doesn't include Asia, but they don't really sell too much in Asia (except Japan), unless I'm mistaken. And I'm not sure about the numbers you're referring to, just giving a possible answer for your question. Useight (talk) 00:55, 11 March 2008 (UTC)

Are we saying that suddenly the US and Japan aren't part of the world?? Chan Yin Keen | Talk 01:50, 11 March 2008 (UTC)

I'm going to go in and edit so it makes some sense. Using the word "Worldwide" is illogical. Currently it would appear negative 1m copies of the Xbox have been sold outside the US/ Japan.--Zoso Jade (talk) 14:53, 11 April 2008 (UTC)

Wii RAM

Well, my understanding of memory isn't that great, but the article currently says Wii has 91MB total of RAM. I think it may be in error. Someone please verify.24.180.171.1 (talk) 03:41, 18 March 2008 (UTC)

Update

I added an update template to the milestone games for a few simple reasons:

• There is a complete lack of PS3 games. Although PS3 didn't do so well this generation, they've obviously produced some great titles.

• Super Mario Galaxy is outrageously outdated. Quote "...sold more copies on its first week, including over 500,000 in the US, than any other game for the Wii..." See Super Smash Bros. Brawl.

• I am almost certain that some new news has cropped up about Halo 3 besides its sales figures.

I'm really busy right now, but I might do some stuff to it tomorrow.--haha169 (talk) 05:42, 19 March 2008 (UTC)

Ahh...yes, and also:

• PS3 - I believe we may have to add Devil May Cry 4.

• XBox 360 - Call of Duty 4, obviously. This article mentioned how this game helped Xbox tremendously in its opening week.

• Wii - Wii Sports. Definitely. 17 million in sales, better than all other games this gen. Plus, you get to play sports by swinging around and not actually doing it! --haha169 (talk) 15:24, 19 March 2008 (UTC)

The fact that you will have to be constantly updating your Nintendo titles is a clear indication that it's way too soon to be "deciding" what the biggest games of this generation will be. It would be like going ahead and listing whatever presidential front-runner is currently leading in the polls as the 42nd President of the United States.pjh3000 (talk) 02:36, 24 March 2008 (UTC)

Why can't we just leave it as is and wait a year or two before we write the history books. Probably should take this section out all together. It's way too soon to track this unless someone is just trying to inflate their e-penis. pjh3000 (talk) 20:26, 19 March 2008 (UTC)

Not really. Milestone titles aren't just titles that largely affected future games. They are also titles that have affected a large amount of modern events. For example, Halo 3 had been shown on various CNN and other TV network news stations. Super Smash Brawl had a midnight Gamestop tournament.

Technologically, Wii Sports created a whole new platform of movement while playing, while Call of Duty 4 is a breakthrough in graphics. --haha169 (talk) 21:57, 19 March 2008 (UTC)

Call of Duty 4 is not a real breakthrough in graphics compared to other games such as Grand Theft Auto IV, or Battlefield: Bad Company. Ffgamera (talk) 07:46, 28 October 2008 (UTC)

Screenshot

It says there is a request for a screenshot. What kind of screenshot are we looking for, here? --haha169 (talk) 23:04, 21 March 2008 (UTC)

Good point, I've removed the argument from the vgproj tag. xenocidic (talk) 14:52, 24 March 2008 (UTC)

NPOV

I believe this article to be biased toword nintendo and the wii. For example:

“ BioShock (Xbox 360, PC) is considered a major influential and artistic game of this generation[108][109] with a plot that quickly created controversy with the decisions the player makes during the game.[110] ”

“ Halo 3 (Xbox 360) broke many first day records, including preorders (1.7 million+), and first day sales (US$170 million+), surpassing its predecessor, Halo 2, in both of these fields.[111][112] It created a breakthrough in artificial intelligence technology, making the enemy, Al, a strong figure. However, the player's allies could easily be considered to be far poorer in intelligence quality.[113][114] ”

“ Super Mario Galaxy (Wii), currently one of the most critically acclaimed title of the seventh generation, sold more copies in its first week, including over 500,000 in the US, than any other game for the Mario title in the history of the franchise.[115] It is second only to The Legend of Zelda: Ocarina of Time as the overall best-reviewed game of all-time, as listed on Game Rankings.[116] ”

“ Super Smash Bros. Brawl (Wii) is a product of a landmark joint cooperation between former rival companies, Nintendo and Sega, along with the help of Konami.[117] [118] It is the third in a series of cross-over fighting game and is the first Wii game to strongly support online play.[119] It dominated sales during both Japan and North American release dates, selling 850,000 in its first week in Japan and 1.4 million in North America.[120][121] ”

“ Wii Sports (Wii) has been attributed as a major factor in the Wii's worldwide success.[122] The game, along with Wii Fit, has been cited as attracting more casual, female, and elderly gamers.[123] This is a rarity among seventh generation games, as developers tend to try and attract young males.[124] It has also been cited as one game that can provide a bonding experience among family members,[125] and as a means of exercising and losing weight when played regularly.[126] As of December 31, 2007, the game has sold 17.85 million copies worldwide—including bundled copies, making it the best-selling Wii game published by Nintendo.[127] ”

If you notice, not one bad thing is said about any of the wii games, but non wii games are criticized. There are more examples besides just this. Sorry about bad format, (new) but we should clean this article up. 68.38.187.85 (talk) 02:23, 24 March 2008 (UTC)unregistered

It's definitely biased towards Nintendo. We should probably remove the Milestones section anyway. Until the next generation, we won't know what the big titles were for this one. Until then, it's just prognosticating, which has no place on Wikipedia.pjh3000 (talk) 02:32, 24 March 2008 (UTC)

Reformatted for readability. No comment as the bias. xenocidic (talk) 14:53, 24 March 2008 (UTC)

Hey, if you want, you can add verified criticisms of the Wii games (but don't over-do it), and you could add some more positive things for 360, and maybe add an obvious PS3 milestone title. One whole reason why there are more Wii games is because of the Wii's nature of being the only console to be based on in-game motion. There isn't that much to talk about graphics, except that the graphics are "quite amazing". Remember, be bold and edit the article yourself. But its good that you pointed it out, I'll see what I can do. --haha169 (talk) 23:04, 25 March 2008 (UTC)

Response to pjh The milestone titles section stays. Wikipedia documents current events as well as history. I was a main editor for Effect of the 2007–08 Writers Guild of America strike on television, and was there for the large remodeling of the article after it was over. Once the 8th gen comes out, we can re-format that section, but right now, we know which games are more influential than the other games in this generation. It's actually quite obvious. --haha169 (talk) 23:36, 25 March 2008 (UTC)

The way Wikipedia works is consensus, not just once person who edited some other articles' fanboy opinion. So far you're the only one defending the Nintendo bias.pjh3000 (talk) 23:54, 25 March 2008 (UTC)

As a nintendo fanboy I'd like to agree that this part is too biased toward Nintendo. I play Smash bros. brawl for hours each day right now and I still don't think it's influential to this generation - it's just a popular franchise brought to its next obvious iteration. Smash-brothers-now-with-internets might be tons of fun, but it's hardly influential. It might have broken a few wii specific sales records, but it hardly changes the way video games get designed (like Galaxy or Bioshock do), nor does it demonstrate a specifically earth-shattering market performance, (like Halo 3 does and GTA 4 probably will). On the other hand, I don't see the "controversy" statement about Bioshock as negative at all, but I'm the sort of person who assumes any popular artwork that also sparks controversy is a good candidate for "influential."70.171.212.60 (talk) 00:41, 26 March 2008 (UTC

Pjh3000, don't make stuff up if you're going to add titles to the "Milestone titles" section, like what you did with Gears of War, which was a blatant copy and paste of Halo 3's text and references. 90.9 million+ preorders for Gears of War? And when was Gears of War the successor to Halo 2? --Silver Edge (talk) 02:05, 26 March 2008 (UTC)

Oops, the entry for Gears of War I recovered from an earlier version of this article. I did not write it, but I should have done a better job of proof-reading.pjh3000 (talk) 02:26, 26 March 2008 (UTC)

I'm not supporting the Nintendo bias. But I no almost nothing about PS3 affairs, so I'm not the perfect one to balance it out. If you read my previous comment, you'd see that I was asking you guys to fix it. --haha169 (talk) 04:22, 26 March 2008 (UTC)

Oh yes, and I think Bioshock and Mass Effect should be removed, simply because the entry is short and it only says something along the lines of: "it sold 1 million units...". And I highly suggest someone in the PS3 field add some useful PS3 games. --haha169 (talk) 04:24, 26 March 2008 (UTC)

Don't just remove content because it's too short. Expand it if you think it needs to be expanded. Removal just makes the problem worse.pjh3000 (talk) 14:29, 26 March 2008 (UTC)

Update Actually, I took a quick scan through Bioshock and it seems interesting. But I think someone needs to expand it. --haha169 (talk) 04:26, 26 March 2008 (UTC) Response to the IP - the Brawl section actually says a bit about how it was influential to the seventh generation, not just sales numbers. --haha169 (talk) 04:32, 26 March 2008 (UTC)

Where does it say anything about the games influence? All I see are sales numbers. That puts it on par with MotorStorm. Either we list both MotorStorm and Smash Bros or we take them both out.pjh3000 (talk) 14:42, 26 March 2008 (UTC)

You can take them both out if you want, but it says, and I quote: "Super Smash Bros. Brawl (Wii) is a product of a landmark joint cooperation between former rival companies, Nintendo and Sega, along with the help of Konami...and is the first Wii game to strongly support online play." The second one probably isn't too important, but a joint cooperation between Nintendo and Sega, when they were bitter rivals in the 3rd-6th gen consoles is quite an important factor. --haha169 (talk) 22:11, 26 March 2008 (UTC)

Actually, no. Don't remove it. Sega+Nintendo partnership is a major event in the seventh generation video game history. --haha169 (talk) 22:14, 26 March 2008 (UTC)

You're right, I forgot they used to be bitter rivals. How times change.pjh3000 (talk) 00:42, 27 March 2008 (UTC)

I can't believe you forgot "Genesis Does What Nintendon't". Useight (talk) 00:50, 27 March 2008 (UTC)

Bioshock still needs expansion. Anybody up for it? And I still need to watch that commercial with audio...--haha169 (talk) 03:07, 27 March 2008 (UTC)

Guys were getting off the topic. the point is, weather or not brawl should be in it is not really the point. The point is: this part of the article is biased and favoring nintendo. Not one bad thing was said about nintendo games, and i know their not perfect. How about putting in how some wiis needed to be fixed when brawl's double memory disc didn't work in it. Yet for some reason, the non wii games are critizcied. That's not bad, but in comparison of the wii milestones, biased. I made this NPOV violation announcement for a reason. Lets try to fix it.—Preceding unsigned comment added by 68.38.187.85 (talk) 02:49, 30 March 2008

I'm sorry, but I'm afraid I can't answer easily to somebody who doesn't even know how to sign their signature. (Its ~~~~, by the way). I'd really like for you to point out any faults listed in the other games. Please, do so. Plus, its milestone titles, so we aren't really supposed to be writing negatives about games, are we? And finally, if you were the person who added that horribly written piece about Brawl's disc error, I suggest you put it here and let other editors correct your grammar before actually posting it. --haha169 (talk) 02:10, 5 April 2008 (UTC)

NPOV (cont.)

Also, I'm quite curious as to why you singled out Brawl. It is perhaps the one game on the list with least POV. It states only facts, and why it is important. Landmark joint cooperation, first Wii game to fully support online gaming, and sold dot dot dot... Why did you single it out? I'm curious. --haha169 (talk) 02:28, 5 April 2008 (UTC)

I'll answer both questions. First of all, I signaled out brawl because i just chose one as an example. Second, I didn't sign my username because i hadn't logged in(had to eat dinner fast) and didn't think it would be that important. Third, ANY game, even legendary games, have some faults. Fuorth, brawl was not the landmark join cooperation. It was the SECOND one. Mario and sonci at the olympics was the landmark joint cooperation. True, Brawl was the first wii game to support online gaming, but does that make it a milestone title? Brawl shouldn't be on it. Fifth, I guess I should've posted the sentence about the disc error(i did put that there) but i figured peopel dont have to write down every single sentence. At worst, I thought you might just fix the grammer instead of deleting it. (I'll still take the blame) For faults in the games, the disc error in brawl effected alot of people's wiis. In gears of wars, the story is noted for not being very deep, and not developing it's characters. Super Mario Galaxy was noted for being too easy. And while these may seem not important, i think it's as important as saying Halo had some allies that were "poorer in inteligenece" characters. Finally, this article is finally at least a bit more neutral, so thank you to everyone. PandaSaver (talk)PandaSaver

"Versions" of consoles.

Not a lot needs to be said about it, but I think it's significant that this generation is the first to see major consoles offering different versions of themselves at launch and beyond. We might not think too much about it now, but I think it will be remembered that this generation is the first to see widespread acceptance of all demographics, and the fact that the consoles have been parsed to meet different practical and economic uses is indicative of that. (My analysis, of course, shouldn't be part of the article - I'm just trying to convince you all that is IS important). 70.171.212.60 (talk) 00:00, 26 March 2008 (UTC)

Well, last generation, there was the PS2 and the PS2 Slim. Useight (talk) 00:15, 26 March 2008 (UTC)

Sure, but I think the key phrase in my post was "at launch." There were also multiple versions of the gameboy advance, nes, snes, genesis, etc, but those were mostly just ongiong manufacturing changes.70.171.212.60 (talk) 00:23, 26 March 2008 (UTC)

You did say "at launch and beyond." I do agree that this is the first generation where multiple SKUs is prominent, but I was just bringing up that it had happened before. Useight (talk) 00:26, 26 March 2008 (UTC)

Lets just say this is the first generation where different versions of consoles have been released at the same time, and not just with different bundled games, but actual variations of the hardware. This is the first time it's happened that I can think of (and I started out with Pong).pjh3000 (talk) 02:49, 26 March 2008 (UTC)

I think that there is already some mention about this in the article. If you want, you can go find more to add from the PS3, Xbox 360, or Nintendo DS articles. Just don't fluff it up too greatly.--haha169 (talk) 04:33, 26 March 2008 (UTC)

Resistance: Fall of Man

hey, pjh, the section with Resistance uses "publicity" in the intro, though it doesn't really make much sense in the sentence. Do you mean "publicly" or something of that nature? Or do you mean it helped publicity due to ....? --haha169 (talk) 03:06, 27 March 2008 (UTC)

In any case, unless something besides the Cathedral thing is mentioned, this title should be replaced by the new Final Fantasy when its released. (I know I'm speculating here, but virtually every FF title made it to the milestone titles, so I think the same will happen here.) --haha169 (talk) 03:10, 27 March 2008 (UTC)

Gears of War removal?

I say we get rid of Gears of war on the milestone list. It didn't do that much that would have a legacy(hence milestone). All it did was get on the top ten list and ON THE DAY IT WAS REALEASED ONLY was it the number one played on xbox live. ANy objections? If not I will remove it soon PandaSaver (talk) 00:26, 3 April 2008 (UTC)PandaSaver

You're mistaken, it held the #1 spot for quite some time. While I personally am not a big fan of Gears of War, it's obvious that it has made an enormous impact on the 360 and it is certainly a legacy title. xenocidic (talk) 03:22, 3 April 2008 (UTC)

Sorry if I was mistaken. It obviously was not clear in the artcle( someone or me will have to make it clearer) but just to be save you can't just say it had an enourmous impact. Would you give me some examples? 68.38.187.85 (talk) 20:45, 3 April 2008 (UTC)PandaSaver

Just from a personal experience, I have never been near a 360, i never played one for any length of time apart from a few seconds in games stores. I have no real interest in that machine and yet if someone was to ask me to name a game, it would certainly be Gears Of War. Obviously, I am only one person but i am sure i'm not alone on this matter.. (rab random (talk) 22:23, 21 June 2008 (UTC))

WP:VG/A Assesment

Hi there. Just responding to the request for assessment for this article at WikiProject Video Games. There's a lot of work that's gone into this article that's clear to see. There are some recommendations that I've made below that I think will improve the article further.

• Lead - needs expanding. Possibly look at two or three paragraphs summarising the article. This could include information on critical acclaim or reception, sales standings, or further information that you feel is appropriate. Currently, the lead only informs the reader that three consoles were released, while the article covers so much more.
• Xbox 360 - There's several references that need to be tweaked using the cite web template. It may be worth checking back through the main Xbox 360 article as well, in order to summarise the content here at an adequate level. In particular, it may be worth summarising the console's main features and services before presenting the timeline of events in order to provide the reader with more context. I'm not talking about wholesale copy/paste, just the key points.
• Playstation 3 - as with the 360 section, have a look at bringing in more summary of the main Playstation 3 article to provide the reader with more context for the timeline. Also, have a look at redoing Phil Harrison's quote as it's quite cumbersome. Possibly try summarising the quote instead of using the quote.
• Wii - As before have a look at bringing in more summary of the main Wii article. In this case though, it's probably only worth bringing through a bit about the hardware used, ad you already refer to development choices here.
• Comparison - get some citations for the HD video section.
• Handheld Systems - consider spinning out into History of handheld video games consoles(x generation). Summarise the content here, while placing the comparison table, development and reception information in the other.
• Software - Possibly look at renaming Software as Milestone titles, instead of having one subsection in a section.
• Other systems - possibly include a paragraph on each?
• Remakes - same as Other Systems - possibly include a paragraph on each?
• References - go through all references, wikilinking publishers where possible.

Other than these issues, it's some good work. I'm happy to regrade to B-Class. With further work, it'd be worth getting a peer review before pushing for GA or A-Class. Well done! Gazimoff (talk) 20:08, 8 April 2008 (UTC)

Thank you. The previous articles didn't do anything to remakes, so we'll leave it as that. I'll take a look at the rest, though. Maybe not today, however. --haha169 (talk) 04:04, 9 April 2008 (UTC)

GTA IV

Should Grand Theft Auto IV be added for a milestone video game? It has sold countless copies and was given 10/10 by many reviewers. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 220.233.7.176 (talk) 10:12, 30 April 2008 (UTC)

Where'd it say countless copies? I can see all the 10/10 but I haven't quite followed up on whether it has earth shattering sales or not. Personally haven't gotten a copy yet actually. Chan Yin Keen | Talk 13:16, 30 April 2008 (UTC)

I'm not sure about "Countless Sales" but I do think GTAIV should be added. GTAIV is the first game in 9 years to get a 10.0 on IGN, and the first game in 7 years to get a perfect 10.0 on Gamespot. Plus, if you check out gamerankings, it's currently dethroned Orcarina of Time for the top game of all time. PrinceLionheart (talk) —Preceding comment was added at 20:15, 30 April 2008 (UTC)

The sales are quite amazing, but its not "countless". It has surpassed none of the sales of the games currently on the list. However, I have no doubt that it will, sooner or later. As for the ratings, yes, that is quite amazing. First perfect from IGN since 1999 and first from Gamespot since 2001. (Check its article). You may add it, but use appropriate ref tags and use encyclopedic style. See WP:MOS. Check the discussion above to avoid NPOV. Remember to keep alphabetical order and uniformed format.--haha169 (talk) 17:21, 3 May 2008 (UTC)

Misleading prices chart

The top row of the chart comparing the PS3, 360, and Wii has misleading prices. It shows prices at the launch of many derivative SKUs that were launched 1 or 2 years after the initial launch of the console. Therefore it's actually not conveying any useful information. IMO the only prices shown in the top row should be the configurations that were available at the initial launch of the console; a big part of the story of this generation of consoles is price differential between the 3 systems; and listing every single SKU that has appeared since the initial launch just totally obscures this important aspect, since the prices are now all over the place. Probably best solution is to create another row in the chart for the *initial* versions that were available and their prices. Then another row can have subsequent versions. Sorry, not time to fix it myself right now. Tempshill (talk) 16:01, 12 May 2008 (UTC)

I have no idea what you're talking about. Either you fix it, or it'll stay the same way, or you can find someone who understands this and change it. Either way, I'm pretty much the only person who visits this article often. --haha169 (talk) 00:56, 13 May 2008 (UTC)

I used to come here frequently. Just came back from my wikibreak, so I'll start back up again soon. What (s)he means is that the launch price section includes the prices of console varieties that were released AFTER the launch date. Sure, there was a 'launch' price of the new variety of console (with more GB or the Arcade 360 thing) but they weren't available at launch. Having them all together there makes it seem as if all those version were available on the launch day of the console itself. clicketyclick_yaketyyak 01:06, 13 May 2008 (UTC)

Oh, alright. --haha169 (talk) 22:04, 24 May 2008 (UTC)

GA review

The GA review of this article is currently taking place at /GA1, and is transcluded below.

GA review 1

• The talk page needs archiving!
• "The Xbox 360, and PlayStation 3, for example" - rmv the first comma at least
  • Fixed --Silver Edge (talk) 01:51, 25 May 2008 (UTC)
• The second paragraph of the lead could make some mention of how the DS and PSP were revolutionary...
  • Added --haha169 (talk) 04:29, 30 May 2008 (UTC)
• Newspapers and the like in publishers need italics... (MOS:ITALICS)
  • Done --Silver Edge (talk) 01:51, 25 May 2008 (UTC)
• "According to blogs and rumors" - you use plural but only cite one...
  • Fixed - changed it to The Mercury News, since that was the publisher. --haha169 (talk) 22:21, 25 May 2008 (UTC)
• Xbox 360 isn't that much to type. Please don't refer to it as the 360, it looks very unprofessional.
  • Fixed I was only able to find two. I thought there was more, but apparently not. I'll fix if there is more. --haha169 (talk) 22:02, 24 May 2008 (UTC)
• "At the end of first half of 2007, the console stabilized at 11.6 million units shipped as sales dropped 60% while its rival, Wii, gained momentum and Sony announced a competitive price drop on the PlayStation 3;[11][12] however, Microsoft's strategy to boost sales with the release of the highly anticipated Halo 3 in September 2007, paid off, outselling the Wii in that month in North America" - this is very hard to read. Please copyedit.
  • Fixed Did I do a good fix? I made 2 sentences as well as fixing the second half a bit. --haha169 (talk) 21:49, 24 May 2008 (UTC)
• "was released roughly a year later," - just say the date
  • Fixed --haha169 (talk) 22:59, 27 May 2008 (UTC)
• "and with a higher price, than its direct competitor, the Xbox 360" - the commas aren't necessary are they?
  • Fixed --haha169 (talk) 18:01, 24 May 2008 (UTC)
• Some references are just URLs; need titles, publishers, accessdates, and the like
  • Fixed Converted them using [1]--haha169 (talk) 18:08, 24 May 2008 (UTC)
• In the 3rd paragraph of the PS3 section, check that refs are placed after commas
  • Fixed I also went and removed all spaces between refs and text throughout the article. --haha169 (talk) 21:59, 24 May 2008 (UTC)
• The Wii section sounds POV-ish... "favouritism" is kinda what it reads like...phrases like "acclaimed first-party franchises" would look better if you'd point to, say, IGN calling them that in the context of Wii.
  • I agree that the beginning of the Wii section sounds like favouritism, and I changed a couple words to make it less POV-ish, the entire section is balanced out due to a bit of criticism at the end. It could do with some work, though. --haha169 (talk) 05:30, 29 May 2008 (UTC)
• "with the upcoming releases of key, highly anticipated, major exclusives like Wii Fit and Mario Kart Wii." - Mario Kart Wii has been released; I've played it (and it was awesome)
  • I haven't got it yet...:( Removed --haha169 (talk) 05:27, 28 May 2008 (UTC)
• Who's Jon Hare?
  • Fixed - he's a British computer game designer.--haha169 (talk) 21:53, 24 May 2008 (UTC)
• {{Fact}} in High definition video section
  • Fixed - added 2 references. Might add more later if I have time. --haha169 (talk) 18:13, 24 May 2008 (UTC)
• Why doesn't the portable console section have subsections like the home console section does?
  • Well, I find it a bit difficult to include home-console subsections because of less media interest. I could possibly patch something up, but that would make the article over-long. Possible split? --haha169 (talk) 22:23, 25 May 2008 (UTC)
• There's no discussion in the last two sections before the refs section...just images?
  • The images at the end are just to uniform itself with the rest of the "history of video games" series of articles. If the reader wants to learn more about the console, they can click on the link. There really won't be a lot of good from adding more to an overly large article. --haha169 (talk) 05:32, 29 May 2008 (UTC)

---

Sorry for the late reply... refs 41 - 44 are just URLs, please format. Otherwise, all the above seems good. dihydrogen monoxide (H₂O) 04:06, 1 June 2008 (UTC)

Actually, I found 4 bare references using web reflinks. I'll have it fixed immediately. Doing so right now...--haha169 (talk) 22:36, 1 June 2008 (UTC)

They were 4 references all in a row, citing the same thing. I've removed two, and reformatted the most verifiable ones. --haha169 (talk) 22:40, 1 June 2008 (UTC)

Please leave a note on my talk page when you're done with these comments. Cheers, dihydrogen monoxide (H₂O) 09:51, 24 May 2008 (UTC)

All looks good so passed. dihydrogen monoxide (H₂O) 01:12, 2 June 2008 (UTC)

This GAN has passed, and this is now a good article! If you found this review helpful, please consider helping out a fellow editor by reviewing another good article nomination. Help and advice on how to do so is available at Wikipedia:Reviewing good articles, and you can ask for the help of a GAN mentor, if you wish.

Cheers, dihydrogen monoxide (H₂O) 01:12, 2 June 2008 (UTC)

Thanks! I see that this is a first for all video game history articles! :) I like being part of stuff like this. --haha169 (talk) 00:48, 3 June 2008 (UTC)

PS3 audio output

PS3 now supports DTS-HD Master Audio and DTS-HD High Resolution Audio for Blu-Ray discs since the release of system software update 2.30. You can use this site for reference: http://www.us.playstation.com/PS3/About/SystemUpdate --LF2 (talk) 00:56, 2 June 2008 (UTC)

Please, you can add it yourself. If there are mistakes, I'll will correct them. Don't worry. "Be bold'. It is a really great way to learn about Wikipedia and its codes better. --haha169 (talk) 00:55, 3 June 2008 (UTC)

Sorry about being late. I just updated it. Sorry if I didn't add references. --LF2 (talk) 22:00, 24 June 2008 (UTC)

You just gave one yourself, above. It is perfectly reliable, coming from the playstation site itself, please add it! --haha169 (talk) 02:44, 25 June 2008 (UTC)

Cited source--LF2 (talk) 17:00, 25 June 2008 (UTC)

Added audio output for PS3 v2.40 before it even came out. I added a little footnote stating this is as of 2.40 and my citation refers to the ps3 systme software article.--A. Rafey (talk) 00:08, 2 July 2008 (UTC)

Gizmondo/N-Gage

Shouldn't the Gizmondo be on this page somewhere? Even if it is just under the "other systems" section... and while we're at it, what about the second-gen N-Gage, which is listed on its article as seventh-gen? - rst20xx (talk) 13:17, 4 June 2008 (UTC)

Don't trust all the articles on Wikipedia. I don't even think N-Gage should even have an article at this stage. But since this is the main article on a FTC, I'm thinking about keeping the article full of verified facts. --haha169 (talk) 21:44, 4 June 2008 (UTC)

Well look at it this way, they should be mentioned in SOME generation. Now N-Gage is mentioned in the sixth generation article and you say its article is unreliable so that's fine... but Gizmondo is mentioned in neither sixth nor seventh - which should it be in? Seems to me to be seventh. Further, I don't see any more verification for the generations of the systems which ARE currently in the "Other systems" section, so I'm gonna go ahead and add the Gizmondo - rst20xx (talk) 10:49, 5 June 2008 (UTC)

OK, done that. But why is Evo: Phase One commented out? Because it doesn't have an image? I think that needs fixing... - rst20xx (talk) 10:55, 5 June 2008 (UTC)

Added a new image for Evo and readded it to section - rst20xx (talk) 14:49, 6 June 2008 (UTC)

Well yes, i agree! Gizmondo should definitely be on the Seventh Gen, but the N-Gage is definitely a sixth gen console. Unless your speaking about the QD? But then Game Boy Micro, GBA SP. Sorry can't help you. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Mcjakeqcool (talk • contribs) 19:26, 3 September 2008 (UTC)

No, N-Gage and N-Gage QD are Sixth Generation, the second generation of N-Gage is seventh generation but has many devices. N-Gage is currently available on the Nokia 5320 XpressMusic, 6210 Navigator, N78, N79, N81/N81 8GB, N82, N85, N95/N95 8GB & N96. I suggest putting 2 or 3 of the devices in specs, probably the most popular. The N81/N81 8GB, N95 and N95 8GB seem to be the most popular of the devices, so it's probably best to put them down. For specs on them, go here: N81, N95 and N95 8GB —Preceding unsigned comment added by 89.100.107.179 (talk) 21:31, 27 November 2008 (UTC)

360 DivX/Xvid

Since when does Xbox 360 play DivX/Xvid???? 76.69.168.223 (talk) 05:12, 11 June 2008 (UTC)

See [2] ChimpanzeeUK - User | Talk | Contribs 09:19, 11 June 2008 (UTC)

Introduction DS bias?

The intro talks about the PSP's connectivity with the internet, PS3's and other PSP's, and how the DS has outsold it despite lacking these features. The DS's connectivity to the Wii, other DS's and the internet (through the DS Browser and Nintendo Wi-Fi Connection) is completely left out. Maybe it's not a bias, but it's definitely lacking important information. -69.121.179.87 (talk) 14:08, 18 June 2008 (UTC)

I agree. Also, the information is incorrect regarding the Nintendo DS!! Which is paramount considering this is supposed to be a good source of information! For starters, the DS DOES have internet capabilities. I played Mario Kart against someone in Japan today- does that not count? Just in case it doesn't count, there is a web browser cartredge for sale at all good high street game sellers. (rab random (talk) 22:15, 21 June 2008 (UTC))

Yeah, I've played online with the DS several times, so seeing how it's so blatantly obvious to anyone who's ever owned a DS, I'll get to editing it now. -69.121.179.87 (talk) 18:39, 22 June 2008 (UTC)

MGSIV a milestone?

I'm just wondering should MGSIV be considered a milestone. It's now one of the few titles to get a perfect score on IGN, Gamespot, and Famitsu as well. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 72.189.26.155 (talk) 02:15, 23 June 2008 (UTC)

I agree, it seems to fit the criteria for a milestone title. -69.121.179.87 (talk) 23:46, 23 June 2008 (UTC)

I also agree. An additional arguament is that it has also now sold 1m copies in europe in it's first week http://kotaku.com/5019089/mgs4-ships-a-million-in-europe ChimpanzeeUK - User | Talk | Contribs 13:31, 24 June 2008 (UTC)

If you can find a ref that's not Kotaku, then I'm all up for it. One day, I am going to seriously trim that section, but I guess an "adding spree" could do for now. Also, not every game that sold 1m can make it to the list. Wait a bit. --haha169 (talk) 01:07, 25 June 2008 (UTC)

Why's that? Kotaku is used all the time for refs and is considered a reliable source. There are already at least 10 Kotaku refs in this article. ChimpanzeeUK - User | Talk | Contribs 09:01, 25 June 2008 (UTC)

Is there? Interesting...then this article can't hope to pass FA. I guess its OK for GA, but FA assessors generally dislike Kotaku. I was once able to slip it through because Kotaku was hosting an interview, and you can't fake interviews. Nonetheless, fine. This article isn't going through FAC anytime soon, anyway. --haha169 (talk) 17:35, 26 June 2008 (UTC)

• So is it the first 7th generation title to sell 1 million copies in Europe in its opening week? –xenocidic (talk) 16:32, 4 July 2008 (UTC)

Bestselling Games

This should be updated. Wasn't Grand Theft Auto IV the bestselling game for one of the consoles? --71.225.85.57 (talk) 20:50, 26 June 2008 (UTC)

It was a best selling game, period. Someone can look around for a reference to it selling a fair bit, but I do believe there has been nothing specific over how many have been sold on either the X360 or PS3. Just so you know, I'm not to thrilled about the fact that you did this, but really no skin off my back :) Chan Yin Keen | ^UT_C 10:54, 29 June 2008 (UTC)

360 1080p?

I just reverted an edit on the High definition video section which implied that the 360 can't output 1080p. Having just re-read the cited article, I've realised that nowhere does it say that the 360 can output 1080p. It does say that it supports "up to 1080p" TVs (this is not the same thing), and that it can output up to 1920 x 1080 (p/i not specified) but not that it can actually output in "1080p". I'm not saying that it's not true, but I can't find a reliable source confirming that the 360 does this. Can someone please update this? ChimpanzeeUK - User | Talk | Contribs 15:18, 30 June 2008 (UTC)

Good revert, it smacked of PlayStation fanboyism. Here's a citation for 360's support of 1080p: http://kotaku.com/gaming/xbox-360/shane-kim-talks-360-1080p-game-output-201816.php . cheers, –xenocidic (talk) 15:26, 30 June 2008 (UTC)

Fanboyism was my first thought too. I have added your link as a ref and also one for the PS3. I think it should be mentioned that only the PS3 can render games in 1080p though?ChimpanzeeUK - User | Talk | Contribs 16:16, 30 June 2008 (UTC)

Yes, 1080p is possible on both consoles. PS3 is just famous for its 1080p capability and the Xbox 360 isn't as famous for its HD. Ffgamera (talk) 11:28, 6 October 2008 (UTC)

Galleries

These final 2 sections need to be much more than simple galleries of products. I can't even imagine why they were added like that.--221.143.25.19 (talk) 10:51, 20 July 2008 (UTC)

They were added like that due to precedent set by previous "history" articles. --haha169 (talk) 00:39, 3 August 2008 (UTC)

Milestones for portable games.

If possible, (it is getting a bit crowded down there) but there are three game for the DS that could be considered milestones at the moment, Nintendogs, New Super Mario Bros., and Pokemon Diamond and Pearl versions (also the 3 or 4 (depending on how you view Pokemon) best selling games on the system.) I don't really know the PSP but I'm sure that someone can think of some 71.164.201.42 (talk) 01:38, 26 July 2008 (UTC)

Nintendogs definitely, Pokemon also quite useful. I'm not sure about Mario, since that article's reception section gives little more than a random list of awards. And, no offense, but I don't really think any of the PSP games stand a chance against the rest of the milestone titles. --haha169 (talk) 00:38, 3 August 2008 (UTC)

One of the complaints from reviewers about Pokemon D/P was how little it had changed from previous versions, aside from the online play and voice chat. --Tehw1k1 (talk) 09:19, 15 August 2008 (UTC)

Hmm...Pokemon has been slapped on pretty much all previous milestone titles. Lets leave D/P out for now and write one for Nintendogs. --haha169 (talk) 04:42, 19 August 2008 (UTC)

PS3 - Bioshock

I don't see the reasoning behind the PS3 not being listed with the available platforms. It is being released on the PS3, therefore it should be there. I don't why there's a dispute. The reasoning behind it being a "milestone title" is because it is "considered a major influential and artistic game of this generation" and because it has a "plot that quickly created controversy with the decisions the player makes during the game". Why would this be any different on the PS3 version? The article makes no mention of it's graphics or control system which could be the only difference on the PS3, if there are any. Please discuss here before making the edit again, which smells suspiciously of fanboyism ;) ChimpanzeeUK - User | Talk | Contribs 18:02, 26 July 2008 (UTC)

For chrono reasons. The milestone was set by the 360/PC version and the PS3 version isn't even out yet. Makes no sense. –xeno (talk) 20:45, 29 July 2008 (UTC)

But like I said, the PS3 version is the same game. It makes no difference when the article was written. The brackets merely state which consoles the game is not. Not listing PS3 would be inaccurate. ChimpanzeeUK - User | Talk | Contribs 23:10, 29 July 2008 (UTC)

If its not out for PS3 yet, why not wait until it is out and then add it? --haha169 (talk) 04:41, 19 August 2008 (UTC)

Pandora

There is some talk of whether the Pandora (listed under "Other Systems") will be 7th or 8th gen. It is viewed as being the successor to the GP2X, which is 7th gen, and will have hardware considerably more powerful than any of the other handhelds. And considering the fact that it has not even been relased yet, I'm removing the reference. —Preceding unsigned comment added by PlopperZ (talk • contribs) 12:15, 24 August 2008 (UTC) Well yes, you do have a VERY good point! The Pandora has been releaced in the middle of the Seventh Gen era but it still could be Eighth. Let's think back a while TG-16 in 87 FM Towns in 91 well it could cut it as eigth. Good thinking! mcjakeqcool Mcjakeqcool (talk) 19:30, 3 September 2008 (UTC)

The GP2X Wiz is the successor to the GP2X (7th gen) and should be considerably more powerful (533Mhz with 3D accelerator compared to 2 200Mhz processors & no 3D accelerator). Is it also a 7th-gen console? It is being released at the same time as the Pandora. Really, you could argue that both of them are the successors to the same handheld (GP2X), with the GP2X Wiz being designed by the original company based in South Korea and the Pandora being designed mainly by a group of European GP2X distributors with heavy consultation from the GP2X community on Gp32x.com. The GP2X Wiz is lower-cost but not as much of an upgrade, while the Pandora is far more powerful and has more features but is also much more expensive. Esn (talk) 04:05, 15 September 2008 (UTC)

Europe Sales Figures

I think that it would be useful to have sales figures for Europe, Does anyone know a reliable source to get this data from? m-surtees (talk) 08:43, 2 September 2008 (UTC)

I agree, the data can be found at http://vgchartz.com, and the Eurozone is a big enough market to deserve a mention, with sales comparable to those in the USA (Wii 10341858, PS3 6189818, Xbox 360 5837109 - Source http://vgchartz.com/hwtable.php?cons[]=Wii&cons[]=PS3&cons[]=X360&reg[]=UK&reg[]=France&reg[]=Germany&reg[]=Spain&reg[]=Italy&reg[]=Scandinavia&reg[]=Other+Europe&start=38662&end=39698). However, I have no experience of altering sortable tables in Wikipedia. If someone could modify the able it wouldbe appreciated Colostomyexplosion (talk) 14:03, 16 September 2008 (UTC)

Update on Xbox 360 sales?

There has not been an update on the 360 since 25th April 2008. Why? Surely the 360 has extended it's lead on the overpriced ps3, and caught up on the dominant Wii. Mcjakeqcool (360 all the way) —Preceding unsigned comment added by Mcjakeqcool (talk • contribs) 19:15, 3 September 2008 (UTC)

I updated the figure. As you can see, the Xbox 360 has done neither of those things you asserted. Dancter (talk) 20:49, 3 September 2008 (UTC)

Upcoming consoles

What are some upcoming consoles that have yet been released? I currently have listed PlayStation 3 (160 GB) and PSP-3000 series. –Wiki131wiki (talk) 21:56, 5 September 2008 (UTC)

For handhelds, Pandora (console), GP2X Wiz. Esn (talk) 19:13, 13 September 2008 (UTC)

Image copyright problem with Image:Evo.JPG

The image Image:Evo.JPG is used in this article under a claim of fair use, but it does not have an adequate explanation for why it meets the requirements for such images when used here. In particular, for each page the image is used on, it must have an explanation linking to that page which explains why it needs to be used on that page. Please check

• That there is a non-free use rationale on the image's description page for the use in this article.
• That this article is linked to from the image description page.

The following images also have this problem:

• Image:Ngage n81.jpg
• Image:Mattel Hyperscan.JPG
• Image:Game Wave.jpg

This is an automated notice by FairuseBot. For assistance on the image use policy, see Wikipedia:Media copyright questions. --00:04, 11 September 2008 (UTC)

Edited several PS3 things

There are two 80 GB versions of the PS3, so the earlier one is now identified as the 80GB (2007 version) and the newer one is identified as the 80GB (2008 version). I have also added some bits from the 160GB PS3. And MGS4 shipped 3.94 million rather than just 3 million. I also added Life with PlayStation with Folding@Home in the Network section, I wonder why Folding@Home wasn't added before?Ffgamera (talk) 11:26, 6 October 2008 (UTC)

Xbox S/Duke Controller Adapter

   * Xbox 360 controller (up to four controllers; any combination of a maximum of 3 wired [4 with the use of a USB hub] or 4 wireless)
   * Xbox 360 Wireless Racing Wheel
   * Scene It Trivia Controller
   * Xbox S-Controller/Duke Controller Via Adapter

I was wondering who put this in, after seeing this I got fairly excited because i'm planning on getting a 360 soon, and I was fairly sure original xbox controllers weren't compatible with Xbox 360, ANYWAY...

I did some google searching (very light, mostly shopping websites) to see if such a thing existed, all I found was either guides for modding the controller to work with a USB cable or pre-modded cords for the use.

I would like to challenge the validity of this accessory, because it looks to me not to be an official Microsoft product (which are the only products we should list on the 360 page or the comparison chart)

If anyone has anything to prove that Microsoft creates such an accessory, or it is an official third-party accessory (such as Madcatz, Pelican, Etc. Etc.) then please reply to this, if enough time passes without any solid evidence, I recommend deleting that part.

Respectfully submitted, Alec92 (talk) 19:36, 14 October 2008 (UTC)

Percentages compatible

Unsure whether percentages claimed in this edit are accurate. Unsure of remaining changes done in edit also. --Oscarthecat (talk) 19:37, 14 October 2008 (UTC)

Nintendo DSi

The stats need to be updated for the nintedo DS.

The japanese nintendo site has most of the specs there already. http://www.nintendo.co.jp/ds/dsi.html (go there and pick the rightmost tab and click a little button on the flash that says specs in Japanese. -- penubag  (talk) 05:08, 17 October 2008 (UTC)

Highest Selling PS3 Game

The link we have is way out of date for Motorstorm. Off-hand, MGS4 came to mind.

http://kotaku.com/5033383/metal-gear-solid-4-is-a-giant-angry-sales-pac+man-ships-394m-copies

What do you think?70.131.211.219 (talk) 13:40, 1 November 2008 (UTC)

This has been raised before. The problem is, it has only been stated how many copies of MGS have been shipped, not the number sold. ChimpanzeeUK - User | Talk | Contribs 13:50, 1 November 2008 (UTC)

Proposed addition to "Milestones"

1. Nintendogs - Best-selling DS game and best-selling video game of this generation.
2. Mario Kart DS - Best-selling and rated Mario spin-off title, and one of the best-selling titles released in Japan (having been released since November of 2005, and still in Japan's top 30).
3. New Super Mario Bros. - Best-selling standalone title in Japan.
4. Animal Crossing: Wild World - One of the best-selling online title in Japan.
5. Brain Age: Train Your Brain in Minutes a Day! - Springboarded an entire genre of games, one of the best-selling titles of this generation. On the subject of the above five games, with the exception of Wii Sports and Wii Play, all of these games have sold better than any console game of this generation. - A Link to the Past (talk) 21:25, 14 November 2008 (UTC)

iPod Touch

I feel the iPod Touch should be included under other consoles. I have tried this before, but someone removed it saying "The article is for devices with the main purpose being games.

The thing is, they are advertising it as a gaming device, Apple executives refer to it as the future of handheld gaming. If the iPod Touch cannot be on this list then neither can the Sega Vision, which exists as a PMP, not with the main purpose being games.

I am adding the iPod Touch to the list again. Anyone who disagrees can talk to me about it. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Wikizeta (talk • contribs) 04:45, 15 November 2008 (UTC)

Nothing (to my knowledge) in the gaming world was, or is, quite like the iPhone/iPod touch. I, at least, am OK with leaving it in the article (or at least mentioned somewhere within it), but it needs to have more background information than just randomly surprising people reading the table, and then crawling back to the shadows whence it came ("iPhone" is mentioned twice in the article as of this writing). --174.130.36.91 (talk) 22:10, 13 December 2008 (UTC)

I disagree with the iPod being a gaming device. It's an MP3 player. Either the whole iPod article should be revised or it should be off the list.

Own part for DSi

Since the DS has many new features that not Original Style DS or DS Lite had, like audio file playback, video playback, in-built download function for games, a interface, the removal of the GBA-port etc., I think that it's notable enough for it's own "part" and not it's details being included in the DS/DS Lite one, since DSi has, as mentioned, many features, own games, and has changed drastically. More drastically than Game Boy to Game Boy Color. But before I go ahead and change the article, what do you think? 90.228.241.157 (talk) 17:01, 16 December 2008 (UTC)

Milestone titles

Metal Gear Solid 4 and LittleBIGplanet must be included on "milestone titles" section