Talk:Iran

HDI is incorrect

The HDI given for Iran does not match the source, which should be 0.798, "high".

Religion section needs addressed

I'm sure we've all read the many reports and polls of the rise agnosticism/atheism/non-Islamic worldviews in Iran, but the article lists prominently the clearly state-manipulated "90+% Muslim" stats. We shouldn't be parroting the lines of the Islamic Republic and should make it more clear that Iran is a lot more diverse than the State propaganda is putting out.

Could this be addressed?

Please don't generalize the population of Iran as mostly Muslim, as it is not accurate. Contrary to your statement, many people in Iran tend to distance themselves from Islam. Additionally, Iran is home to various religions; it is the Islamic Republic's authoritarian regime that attempts to portray the majority as Muslim. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 174.95.130.15 (talk) 17:07, 28 January 2024 (UTC)

Semi-protected edit request on 11 January 2024

45.84.41.69 (talk) 12:40, 11 January 2024 (UTC)

 Not done: it's not clear what changes you want to be made. Please mention the specific changes in a "change X to Y" format and provide a reliable source if appropriate. —*Fehufangą (✉ Talk · ✎ Contribs) 13:38, 11 January 2024 (UTC)

Persia

Iran was historically known as "Persia". Not today. I think it's better we change the beginning line to "Iran, also historically known as Persia". Seeing as no news source for example refers to Iran as Persia anymore. Pro translator (talk) 12:38, 20 January 2024 (UTC)

No need. Persia translates to Iran in Persian language, and vice versa, both are the same with zero difference. Greeks called Iran Persia, and a lot of westerners still know Iran as Persia thorough their study/school books etc. A change will significantly harm the etymology of the term. Cyrus-Gg1 (talk) 19:40, 27 January 2024 (UTC)

Recent reverts

@HereIAmNow1379: I have undone your mass revert for several reasons:

• You restored a significant volume of unsourced and poorly sourced content. Per WP:BURDEN you are required to provide reliable sourcing in order to restore this content
• Image captions are meant to be succinct, typically no more than three lines; more detail should be provided in the body, at linked articles, or on the image description page
• There should not be more images than the volume of text can support, to avoid issues with article layout. Not everything discussed needs an image here.
• You are adding a lot of content and detail to an article that is already quite long. The material here should provide only a high-level overview of the topic, with details left to the child articles. The articles that you raised as comparators, Poland and China, are both significantly more succinct than this one. Nikkimaria (talk) 15:45, 27 January 2024 (UTC)

Have not had time to really look but [1] Moxy- 16:35, 27 January 2024 (UTC)

Wikipedia is truly useless. How is it possible that people put so much time and effort publishing useful information and deleted so easily?! If no one does anything, everyone's efforts will be wasted. So what I do is this:

1- I will remove some of the existing images and replace them with more important ones

2- I will put the information that was previously on the images on the the article body without the images

In this way, the rules will not be violated and I request you to please do not delete them so that the editing works of all users remain on the article. HereIAmNow1379 (talk) 17:19, 27 January 2024 (UTC)

Can no longer load full article on my phone to help trim...can only load lead ...18305 words is a huge problem. Moxy- 18:34, 30 January 2024 (UTC)

We are not Moslems

Please don't generalize the population of Iran as mostly Muslim 174.95.130.15 (talk) 17:09, 28 January 2024 (UTC)

Change first picture of Iran

Iran has lots of beautiful places, but you chose not good picture to introduce Iran in first picture, please change it, the second picture is better for show of Iran 174.95.130.15 (talk) 17:13, 28 January 2024 (UTC)

Religion numbers and unreliable survey

For many years until this edit three days ago data from CIA's country factbook has been used in this article's Infobox under religion section. Articles of other countries like Syria use CIA factbook as well. The new source used three days ago is an unreliable online survey from an unknown website called "GAMAAN" with dubious results. For example, it claims 7.7% of Iran population (87 million) are Zoroastrian which would be more than 6 million people, while the number of Zoroastrians across the world is no more than ~ 120,000! This source has zero reliability to be used on Wikipedia, It is not clear who with what expertise has conducted such a survey and how it can make such big claims for an entire country. Either official numbers have to be used mentioning that they are official, or if there are concerns with those numbers we can remove all the stats, It is not madatory to have percentages for religious breakdown when reliable data is not available. Just look at Lebanon e.g. Drako (talk) 20:53, 4 March 2024 (UTC)

You keep contradicting yourself. Are you interested in what's verifiable or in what's official? I've already pointed out to you that there's nothing "official" about CIA estimates because the CIA is not some sort of official decreer of the world's numbers. Largoplazo (talk) 21:02, 4 March 2024 (UTC)

Either remove the section or use reliable data. In the lack of reliable data, at least official numbers are more noteworthy than an unknown unreliable weblog with dubious credibility. Of course it needs to be declared that it is just "official" so reader is aware. Drako (talk) 21:06, 4 March 2024 (UTC)

Gamaan is not a ‘unreliable weblog’ with ‘dubious credibility’. It is written by political scientists from across the top universities in Europe, has outlined its methodology clearly, and has been cited by numberous international organisations. In addition, it has won global awards by leading research associations. This is made clear should you spend time researching them. AryanTuranica (talk) 21:11, 4 March 2024 (UTC)

Examples of citations: The Economist, the Atlantic Council, The Wall Street Journal, The Guardian, the Independent and the LSE Research Papers (the fourth most prestigious research institute and political science university in the world), to name a few. A dubious and unreliable source would never be cited to such extent. AryanTuranica (talk) 21:15, 4 March 2024 (UTC)

Those imply it is just an online poll of a few hundred people. It is by no means legit to extrapolate to an entire nation especially when it contradicts obvious facts. Drako (talk) 21:22, 4 March 2024 (UTC)

You seem unfamiliar with how data is collected within political science. A poll is the most used and reliable method by Governments, so long as their methodology and shortcomings is provided. Gamaan has done this, which you would know had you done any research. ‘Especially contradicts obvious facts.’ What exactly do you mean by this? That 99% of the Iranian population is Muslism? That the regime’s well-known propaganda tool is more reliable than what actual political scientists and Iranians have clearly expressed? Such methodology can be extrapolated to an entire nation, and is the methodology used by international organisations and Governments. An additional element is found in the case of Iran: fear. Iranians cannot exress their religious beliefs freely to government agencies in fear of backlash and oppression. Gamaan’s methodology accounts for this and is the most reliable source when it comes to Iranian’s true beliefs. It may not have been cited by Wikipedia, but it has been by government agencies, local think-tanks and NGOs. AryanTuranica (talk) 21:32, 4 March 2024 (UTC)

One poll is not definitive. PEW is also a poll, which says 78% of Iranians believe religion to be very important in their lives. So which one should we rely on?

What I mean by that is 6 million Zoroastrians living in Iran is a big claim for which there is no evidence. Fear of Iranians answering polls is probably true, but it does not justify pretending dubious polls and numbers provide a reliable picture of Iran. That undermines Gamaan's numbers too.

All I am saying is that according to Wikipedia rules multiple credible sourcers are needed to back up any such claims. Drako (talk) 21:40, 4 March 2024 (UTC)

It is a poll. One of many. And it has not info who is behind it, no page in Wikipedia, no reliable sources use it, it has no credibility to dispute reliable sources like CIA factbook which are in wide use. What international organization are you talking about? Does UN and WHO use its results? We are not here to assess its methodology. We need to find what reliable sources verify as credible. And this particular poll has no wide consensus on the big claims it makes. It fits definition of a questionable source as per WP:NOTRELIABLE. Remember, as per WP:EXCEPTIONAL, Any exceptional claim requires multiple high-quality sources. Claiming there are 6 million Zoroastrians is a huge claim, for which there is no evidence.

. Drako (talk) 21:20, 4 March 2024 (UTC)

Author of this online poll himself admits "when the relevant question was phrased to focus on their religion rather than on their personal beliefs and faith, the number of participants professing Zoroastrianism went down significantly." So these numers at best, are raw data for a particular sample and cannot be claimed to be representative of the entire nation. Until and unless credible references, like encyclopedias, cite same numbers, it is not wise nor reliable to refer to its numbers as reliable. Drako (talk) 21:32, 4 March 2024 (UTC)

We are not talking about their article on Zoroastrianism, but their 2020 Survey. It has also been cited by numerous organisations which I have already named, but which you are clearly ignoring. There is no point continuing this discussion when it is clear you are uninterested in facts. Great job spewing an authoritarian regime’s propaganda! Very reliable and factual indeed. AryanTuranica (talk) 21:34, 4 March 2024 (UTC)

Their article is describing findings of that Survey in detail. The article itself is casting doubt such numbers are a true representation of Iranians' religious mixup. You need to stop ad hominem attacks right there, I am warning you. Drako (talk) 21:43, 4 March 2024 (UTC)