Talk:TARDIS

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July 2003 – June 2006

Possible tweaks

I was just wondering if the following tweaks to the article would be usefull or welcome, or whether they would be judged unnecessary or irrelevant - I think sometimes its better to check in discussion before making the changes in the article itself. Any comments on the points below? If the response is generally positive, I'll try to introduce the points into the main article, harmoniously and not taking up to much space of course :-)

1. Other appearances, merchandising. The article states that 'Fan-built full-size models of the police box are also common'. Are they really that common? It might be better to say that 'a number of fans have built full-size models', but I don't think it is correct to say they are common. Also, is it worth adding that the BBC generally frowns on such fan reproductions and that the only officially licensed full-size replica of the TARDIS is made by ThisPlanetEarth?

2. External doors. In the TV series, the police box doors have always opened inwards. In contrast, the doors of Peter Cushing's police box in the Dalek movies open outwards. Interestingly, in some of the publcicity stills for the 9th Doctor series, the police box doors are shown opened fully outwards, while in the TV series itself they always open inwards.

3. Doors. Occasionally, the external doors close by themselves suggesting they are physically connected to the electronicaly operated internal doors. For example, in the second episode of Unearthly Child, there is a very satisfying moment when we see an internal shot of the console room with the inner doors closing slowly, followed by a cut to the outside showing the external doors slamming shut right on cue (wonderful direction!) while everyone is some distance from the TARDIS. On many other occasions, however, we see the Doctor pulling the right hand external door closed, suggesting the two entrances are not linked, or at least that they can be unlinked. This refers to the original series only, of course.

4. TARDIS destroyed. The destructability/indestructability of the TARDIS has been discussed, but there has been at least one instance I can think of (Mind Robber) where the TARDIS was actually destroyed and shown to explode in space with all the panels going off in different directions, leaving the Doctor and companions clinging to the control console. Should this be mentioned?

5. Popular culture. Another appearance for the TARDIS is in a song on the album Six by Manusn, which also features a speaking part by Tom Baker. At the end of the song, the dematerializaton sound can be clearly heard in the fade out. Also, Robbie Williams 'Fashion Tardis down at Quo Vadis' - is that a relevant one?

--82.14.68.109 08:46, 17 June 2006 (UTC)

Just my own views:

1. This refers to fan-built models but not for commercial use, which the BBC seem to have no problem with, though. There are lots of websites out there where people have built TARDISes out of garden sheds, etc., so it seems pretty common.

2. This seems a little too trivial for me: any particular significance to be attached to it?

3. "For most of the series' run, the exterior doors of the police box operated separately from the heavier interior doors, although sometimes the two sets could open simultaneously to allow the ship's passengers to look directly outside and vice versa." Does this cover it? Or a variation on this?

4. It may be worth noting, but it seems that the destruction of the TARDIS in that instance was more of an illusion. A better example might be Frontios.

5. The Six reference seems all right, but not sure about the Robbie Williams one. How significant is the reference to the song? --khaosworks (talk • contribs) 09:26, 17 June 2006 (UTC)

Thanks Khaosworks :-) 1. This was me thinking aloud really, so I've no strong feelings about the original version of the text, I was just interested to see what everyone else thinks. It may be worth mentioning that the TPE replica is the only officially licensed one though and include the link. On the same point, this is actually marketed as a movie TARDIS. TPE do not have a licence to produce a TV TARDIS but I was told when I bought mine that the two were so similar that they didn't think it was worth the expense to apply for a second licence. Most purchasers adapt them to suit their own preferences, e.g. I have modified mine to look more like a Tom Baker era TV prop. 2. I'd like to hear other opinions, I thought it was an interesting titbit of information. 3. That sounds good to me 4. Ditto 5. OK, I'll mention Six. Does anyone else have an opinion about Robbie Williams? (keep it clean!). I don't really understand the significance of the line myself. I'll wait to see if there is any other feedback before doing the mods. --82.14.68.109 11:55, 17 June 2006 (UTC)

TARDIS radar system

TARDIS apparently is the name of a radar system (In real life.) "TARDIS" Go takes me here instead of to a disambiguation page which I expected. I'd give a reference website but I have to dash to work. Sorry. 208.199.16.170 11:36, 21 June 2006 (UTC)

In the 2005 series, the keys are also remotely linked to the TARDIS,

It should be pointed out that this process takes some time to occur.

Not signalling its arrival; the summoning, perhaps, but that was a particularly special circumstance. --khaosworks (talk • contribs) 14:29, 22 June 2006 (UTC)

this article is getting flagged as very long

Editing the page and Wikipedia will now tell you that it's over 50K characters long, and that people using Google toolbar might encounter problems editing this article. Sounds like time to split some sections off to sister articles? I have absolutely no knowledge nor interest in this TV series so I can't be of help in the actual splitting, sorry. 24.19.184.243 11:25, 30 June 2006 (UTC)

The section "The Doctor's TARDIS" is 17 kilobytes long, the longest top-level division in the article. Might be a good candidate for splitting off. Bryan 23:43, 30 June 2006 (UTC)

Personally, the Other appearances in pop culture needs to secede from this article... Either that, or shortened. This could grow inconveniently bigger with other not-so-useful references as anything that happens to be bigger on the inside than out..

For instance, having seen episode 42 of Star Trek: Enterprise, have the people involved with creating it ever say that it was intended to be a homage unto Doctor Who's time-machine? DrWho42 23:00, 16 July 2006 (UTC)

Agreed. I strongly believe we should remove connections between the TARDIS and anything with a weak similarity (such as the Spice Girls bus, or anything that just seems to be based on the TARDIS. Furthermore other things named TARDIS should go on a disambiguation page, even if they are named after the Doctor's timeship —The preceding unsigned comment was added by Kransky (talk • contribs) 13:15, 14 February 2007 (UTC).

one other minor cultural reference

There have been for years a range of toolboxes and chests with intricate folding drawers in the UK which go under the brand name 'TARDIS'.Wolfe 18:20, 2 September 2006 (UTC)

Infobox

Any objection to the article having an infobox? thanks/Fenton, Matthew Lexic Dark 52278 Alpha 771 20:04, 19 October 2006 (UTC)

I don't object to having an infobox per se, but I'm not sure that the one currently on the page adds much of value to the article. Most of the fields are empty (appropriately so, since they're inapplicable), and the accuracy of the "force field" one is debatable. If you're thinking of The Parting of the Ways, that was just a temporary lash-up using the tribophysical waveform extrapolator (the surfboard), not part of the TARDIS's standard equipment; Rose even says, "The TARDIS doesn't have any defences!" There have been other defence systems mentioned in the classic series (the Hostile Action Displacement System, or HADS, comes to mind, but it was only mentioned once), but by and large the series hasn't dwelt on the TARDIS's technical specs, which seems to be what that infobox is looking for. —Josiah Rowe (talk • contribs) 23:37, 19 October 2006 (UTC)

I echo Josiah's comments. It's very difficult to have a useful infobox about a spaceship that has never really had consistent capabilities aside from time travel and a malfunctioning camouflage circuit. --khaosworks (talk • contribs) 02:15, 20 October 2006 (UTC)

Yea, true. I've removed the infobox anyway (-: thanks/Fenton, Matthew Lexic Dark 52278 Alpha 771 08:38, 20 October 2006 (UTC)

No problem. It was a reasonable idea. —Josiah Rowe (talk • contribs) 02:39, 21 October 2006 (UTC)

Bioship?

I'm not sure whether the TARDIS really belongs in Category:Bioships. Although it is alive in some sense, and the Doctor says that TARDISes were "grown, not made", it's not really portrayed as having organic or biological components in the usual sense of the term. The bioship article mentions Axos, but not the TARDIS. It's certainly a less clear-cut example than, say, Moya from Farscape. Thoughts? —Josiah Rowe (talk • contribs) 18:56, 6 November 2006 (UTC)

It would be really pushing it to call the TARDIS a bio-ship, to my knowledge it does not possess any biological components. MatthewFenton (talk • contribs) 19:06, 6 November 2006 (UTC)

The doctor certainly spoke of the ship dying in the new series. If it's established to be alive, then it's bio, no? Whether it's "organic" is a different issue, I'd think. _└ ^OzLawyer / _talk ^┐ 19:13, 6 November 2006 (UTC)

Sorry, but why is the one reference in "Impossible Planet" considered of overriding canonicity as opposed to the multiple references to the ship being built in the old series? --Mong the Senseless —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 81.138.2.87 (talk • contribs) 20:30, November 27, 2006 (UTC)

What are these "multiple references" of which you speak? I can't recall any references to the TARDIS being built — although that may just be a hole in my memory. —Josiah Rowe (talk • contribs) 18:39, 12 December 2006 (UTC)

The end of Warriors' Gate makes references to K-9 having a set of TARDIS blueprints in his memory, implying there's a building process involved. That's the only real reference during the classic series, though, and the novels have them "birthed". --khaosworks (talk • contribs) 22:39, 12 December 2006 (UTC)

If something is biomechanical, the distinction between "blueprints" and "anatomy" is pretty fuzzy. —Josiah Rowe (talk • contribs) 23:08, 12 December 2006 (UTC)

Also, in Torchwood, Captain Jack is growing a TARDIS on his desk - obviously impossible if it is made. I agree with Josiah, that the TARDIS is alive, and it is a bioship - Weebiloobil 07:17, 24 April 2007 (UTC)

In the Visual Dictionary, it most definitely is alive - the whole mechanism of the way it's bigger on the inside than the outside is shown... I'm not really sure how to explain it, but I'll try and it add it here first so that you guys and gals can see what it actually says about it... UltimateNagash 15:41, 7 May 2007 (UTC)

I've always understood that the TARDIS was alive in the sense that it had an emergent intelligence rather than being organic in nature. Also I'm somewhat confused by Osgoodelawyer's suggestion that something biological is not necessarily organic, although I suppose that you "construct" a biological entity Frankenstein style without it having to go through the normal organic growth processes. I don't think a ship qualifies as a bio-ship unless it is primarily biological, a half and halfer would most likely be considered biomechanical.--Teletran 03:34, 3 July 2007 (UTC)

Image

I actually believe a new image would be a good thing.. the one we have at present is pretty crappy.. I'm sure a decent view of the TARDIS could be found. thanks/Fenton, Matthew Lexic Dark 52278 Alpha 771 11:32, 12 December 2006 (UTC)

I agree. It might be good to have a screencap from the new series for the top of the article, and one from the Hartnell days showing the St. John's Ambulance badge to accompany the "Exterior" section. Since both aspects are discussed in the article, the fair use justification should be solid. If we get a better image, it could also be added at Police box#Police boxes and Doctor Who, since the point of that section of that article is that the police box image is now associated with Doctor Who more than with the police. —Josiah Rowe (talk • contribs) 06:45, 17 January 2007 (UTC)

I've moved the new CG image provided by Smomo to the "Exterior" section, since I think it illustrates that very nicely. I still think it would be nice to replace the Pertwee image with a screencap from the new series — perhaps the TARDIS in the snow from The Unquiet Dead? I'd do it myself, but I actually don't know how. —Josiah Rowe (talk • contribs) 06:38, 4 March 2007 (UTC)

'Weight' of the TARDIS?

In 'The Doctor's TARDIS/Interior', it is claimed that the 'weight' of the TARDIS in the 'Earth-like gravity of Alzarius' is some value in kilograms. Since kilograms are a measure of mass, not weight, and are therefore constant no matter what the gravity is, we should probably consider revising this, even if it is a direct quote, simply because it's nonsensical. 80.189.118.50 18:08, 1 January 2007 (UTC)

Please see Talk:TARDIS/Archive_1#Mass or Weight?. --khaosworks (talk • contribs) 18:17, 1 January 2007 (UTC)

"In Full Circle (1980), Romana stated that the weight of the TARDIS in Alzarius' Earth-like gravity was 5 × 106 kilograms (5000 tonnes). This presumably refers to its internal weight"

Another note on this. Romana gives the answer in specific reference to whether there are machines on Alzarius capable of moving the external Tardis around on the planet. It doesn't make sense because a few swamp creatures carry it. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 98.196.179.114 (talk) 19:20, 10 October 2008 (UTC)

Translation of languages

I encountered a debate on one of the talk pages regarding the TARDIS's translation of Galifreyan writing which I intended to contribute to once I had checked some references, but cannot remember where it was, now. I am sure the original questioner, if still interested, will probably find this comment. So: 'is Gallifreyan writing 'translated' for Rose?' I would say the Tardis (and the Doctor) keeps this private for Time Lords (i.e. is not included in 'the Time Lord gift'). References: Canon: In 'Fear Her', when the Tardis is analysing the scribble creature, Rose has to ask what the Gallifreyan writing says. Not-so-canon examples: the novel 'Only Human' p 15, refers to (from Rose's POV) 'A maze of graphics, in the incomprehensible alien script the Doctor always worked in.' The book suggests (p16) that Captain Jack can understand some of it, although in 'Deviant Strain', p9 (Jack's POV) 'Not a lot of it made sense but he nodded knowingly.'

Incidentally, Jack seems able to understand much of the TARDIS technology (as did others in the classic series, including Nyssa). Where did they learn to do so? Is the technology not exclusive to the Time Lords? Gwinva 14:59, 29 January 2007 (UTC)

It's because Rose is blonde :D Seriously though, I guess it's common sense technology? Or people with Time Travel knowledge can do it??? UltimateNagash 15:59, 7 May 2007 (UTC)

how is the Tardis bigger on the inside.

is it explained how the Tardis is bigger on the inside. it's explained how the tardis can (in the doctor's tardis's case was able to) camoflague ( by a chameloeon circuit) so what tachnolgy makes the Tardis bigger on the inside. plz notify me on my user talkpage when u answer thx.--I.W 21:06, 10 February 2007 (UTC)

The TARDIS' dimensional transcendentality is made possible by a state-of-the-art neutron flow polarity reverser (just kidding). In fact, Clarke's Third Law seems to be the fundamental principle behind the TARDIS' unusual dimensions. -Steve —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 207.6.224.49 (talk) 14:09, 11 February 2007 (UTC).

Steve is, of course, right. That said, the series has given a few hand-waves towards an explanation. The most common is the phrase "dimensionally transcendental". In Colony in Space, the Doctor "explained" to Jo Grant that the TARDIS was bigger on the inside because it was dimensionally transcendental. When she asked, "What does that mean?", he said, "It means that it's bigger on the inside than the outside." He also gave less-than-helpful explanations in "An Unearthly Child" (comparing it to a building on a small TV screen) and The Robots of Death (comparing it to the way that something farther away looks smaller than something up close). The general assumption is that the interior exists in a different dimension from the exterior, which would jibe with what happens to the TARDIS in Father's Day (the interior gets separated from the exterior, leaving the police box shell). Hope that helps. —Josiah Rowe (talk • contribs) 20:30, 12 February 2007 (UTC)

Dimensional Pockets actually... The console room you see is actually a sphere, with the living 'switch room' below, which controls everything. This is surrounded by more of the coral to link it up to a massive 'sceptre', with the console room at the top.

Above it is the sensor tower, ending in a large spike/antenna.

Below the console room is a sphere about twice the size, called the Core Services Module (CSM), which contains all the main things any ship needs: power rooms, time travel control rooms, navigation, life support and of course, bedrooms...

Below that it slowly thins down to the end, with an antenna to take power from various stuff. Just above that is the Cloister Room.

On the part just below the CSM are four orbs joined by rods that contain the main knowledge, databanks etc...

Surrounding this completely is hundreds of spheres joined together by curving rods, all flowing around the sceptre inside a pocket a dimension. Each of these spheres contain something, and are linked by 'bridges' (more like wormholes, I guess...)

All of this info compiled from the Visual Dictionary, ISBN 978-1-40531-867-9

Hope that helps...

UltimateNagash 15:57, 7 May 2007 (UTC)

No not really. In "The Robots of Death" the Doctor explained it in terms of objects appearing smaller than they really are when they're far away. If you think of the interior tardis being connected to the exterior by a wormhole then the outside doesn't necessarily need to fit around the inside. Of course then the problem becomes where you put the inside, as previously stated a pocket dimension is probably the best solution. --Teletran 03:58, 3 July 2007 (UTC)

Fluorescent walls?

An anon recently added the following:

In an episode from the First Doctor's era, one of his companions, Barbara asks "What I don't understand is where's the light's coming from?". he replies "It must be some kind of fluorescent substance in the walls."

This sounds vaguely familiar to me, but since TARDIS is a featured article we should include information like this only if we can provide a specific episode citation. Anyone remember where, specifically, this is from? —Josiah Rowe (talk • contribs) 07:29, 12 March 2007 (UTC)

Failed his TARDIS test

In "The Shakespeare Code" Martha asks if someone needs to take a "driving test" to fly the TARDIS and the Doctor replies that not only that it does, but that he failed his. This was a joke of course but it did strike me as a possibly truthful one. Do we mention this? (I can't find it if we do). --GracieLizzie 19:48, 10 April 2007 (UTC)

Gallifrey Chronicles reference should be removed

I think that this article attempts to integrate televised and non-televised material to such a degree that it's really getting unclear what ideas are fully supported by televised evidence and what are not. In section 2, we have a general statement about TARDISes alluding to The Two Doctors:

Before a TARDIS becomes fully functional, it must be primed with the biological imprint of a Time Lord, normally done by simply having a Time Lord operate the TARDIS for the first time. This imprint comes from the Rassilon Imprimatur, part of the biological makeup of Time Lords, which gives them both a symbiotic link to their TARDISes and the ability to withstand the physical stresses of time travel.

This paragraph is fine, though I think the word "normally" should be removed. I don't think there's any doubt in The Two Doctors that it's absolutely done this way. This idea of a symbiotic link between the Doctor and his particular TARDIS has a great deal of overt support in the new series (what was Bad Wolf if not the TARDIS protecting the Doctor?) and it also is implied in the way several classic Doctors anthropomorphize the TARDIS. Indeed, Hand of Fear's "call from Gallifrey" scene and The Masque of Mandragora's invention of TARDIS language translation services (as importantly revised in The Christmas Invasion) directly demonstrate that the TARDIS establishes mental links specifically with the Doctor. Importantly, if the Doctor's disabled, so too is the link the TARDIS establishes with others. He is, as Rose points out, "part of the circuit". All of this completely jibes with The Two Doctors.

However, in the very next section we have what I think is a contradictory statement:

In the programme, the Doctor's TARDIS is an obsolete Type 40 TT capsule (presumably TT stands for "time travel") that he unofficially "borrowed" when he departed his home planet of Gallifrey. According to the Eighth Doctor Adventures novel The Gallifrey Chronicles by Lance Parkin, it previously belonged to a Time Lord named Marnal, who was, like the Doctor, somewhat of a renegade.

This co-mingling of spin-off material with the televised facts leaves me, as a reader of this article, scratching my head as to how the TARDIS has become an obviously imprinted on the Doctor if he wasn't the original owner. The simpler conclusion from just the televised facts is that the First Doctor stole the TARDIS when it was in its unprimed state.

Mentioning Lance Parkin in the thick of the article just muddies the water. Gallifrey Chronicles is perhaps a worthy footnote, but it definitely shouldn't be a part of the main body of the article. If anything, The Two Doctors proves The Doctor didn't steal someone else's TARDIS, he just stole from the government on Gallifrey, which is consistent with his character. CzechOut 02:47, 11 April 2007 (UTC)

TARDIS models mentioned in the series?

The meddling monk is said to possess a "Mark IV TARDIS" which is 'newer' than the Doctors, should the "mark etc" model system at least be mentioned once somewhere in the article? 207.202.227.125 02:12, 3 May 2007 (UTC)

TARDIS v. Tardis (yet again)

Don't want to re-open that old wound of TARDIS vs Tardis again - archived at TARDIS vs. Tardis and Backronym - but over the past couple of weeks there have been letters in the Beeb staff mag, Ariel which I've put here - and as a result of this extra info., I've gradually expanded the first footnote of the article to include it - hope this meets with approval. Zir 13:07, 7 May 2007 (UTC)

And added a photo of the 1980s fibreglass TARDIS which can now no longer be taken apart Zir 00:23, 19 May 2007 (UTC)

Cameleon circuit

What, no mention of the famously malfunctioning "Cameleon circuit"? This name is given in some episode or other to describe the system that is supposed to make a TARDIS blend in with its surroundings. Although it isn't given that name at first, the circuit makes its appearance early on when it malfunctions on a voyage in the very first Doctor Who story. --Tony Sidaway 13:10, 16 May 2007 (UTC)

The chameleon circuit is mentioned several times in the article. Lexicon (talk) 14:12, 16 May 2007 (UTC)

Ah, the problem is my inability to spell chameleon. --Tony Sidaway 14:15, 16 May 2007 (UTC)

Article fails FA criterion #3

This article fails FA criterion #3. Please add {{Non-free media rationale}} for all non-free images without a rationale, or remove the images from this article. – Ilse@ 22:08, 7 June 2007 (UTC)

I've added a use rationale for the picture of the Jade Pagoda. I'll let the uploaders of the other images handle the others. – Sean Daugherty (talk) 22:54, 7 June 2007 (UTC)

Thank you all for providing the fair use rationales. – Ilse@ 12:39, 13 June 2007 (UTC)

Doctor Who DK guide

I had a flip-through in the local shop, and saw the Dorling Kindersley guide to the revived series. There's an excellent spread on the current TARDIS and its overall design: the control room is near the top of a "scepter" connected to time and space. I'm just making a request if anyone could properly cite the information and include it. Ilse@ 12:39, 13 June 2007 (UTC)

TARDIS in "Torchwood"

From the article: "A TARDIS has also appeared in the Torchwood episode "End of Days". Because Torchwood is situated near a rift of temperal energy, The Doctor uses it to recharge the TARDIS. In the episode Jack Harkness hears the tell-tale sound of the engines, smiles and afterwards is nowhere to be found."

I have little issue with this particular statement, although the TARDIS didn't technically appear in the episode itself, just the familiar engine whine. The issue that I have found is in the following:

"As the camera shows Cardiff Bay at the end of the Torchwood episode "End of Days", You can see a tiny TARDIS sitting near the metallic piller fountain of "Roald Dahl Plass. Veiwers assumed that he was picked up and lead to the mis-conception that the TARDIS materialised inside Touchwood but infact it did not. This is further explained in the Dr Who episode "Utopia"(S03EP11)."

I've watched the episode again and I am not convinced it is the TARDIS. The shot is long and doesn't allow much in the way of detail. Not to mention that there appears to be a SECOND "TARDIS", down and to the right of the first "TARDIS". Can someone verify that the TARDIS actually appears in the shot before I rewrite this section of text? Thank you. - DrachenFyre > YOU! 15:01, 19 June 2007 (UTC)

I still have it recorded from when I saw it in HD. I can confirm the TARDIS does NOT appear, once or twice. Hope that helps - Weebiloobil 20:25, 30 June 2007 (UTC)

Contested move request

The following is a closed discussion of the proposal. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on the talk page. No further edits should be made to this section.

The result of the proposal was

From WP:RM:

• TARDIS → Tardis — Per WP:CAPS naming convention. There also might be the need for a history page merger. I request that a sysop double check that, just in case, as I am unsure at this point. —Lord Sesshomaru 05:45, 22 June 2007 (UTC)
  • I looked at the discussion page, methinks this would not be uncontroversial. --SigPig |^{SEND - OVER} 09:03, 22 June 2007 (UTC)
• Oppose TARDIS is an acronym. 70.51.8.233 07:34, 24 June 2007 (UTC)
• Strong oppose - I fail to see how this falls under WP:CAPS, the BBC and most references use "TARDIS", and precedent is certainly set by examples such as, well, "BBC". --Ckatz^chat_spy 11:22, 24 June 2007 (UTC)
• Strong oppose - although both versions of the name are well attested, the all caps version is more common and makes more sense, being an acronym. -- Karen | Talk | contribs 11:26, 24 June 2007 (UTC)
• Oppose on the basis that TARDIS is correct -- it's an acronym. Matthew 11:29, 24 June 2007 (UTC)
• Oppose - TARDIS is the most common form used and it is an acronym. Timrollpickering 22:56, 24 June 2007 (UTC)
• Oppose - Same reason as previous. I know that no formal request has been made, but I'm going to "vote" anyway. --Val42 23:00, 29 June 2007 (UTC)

I should point out that no actual request is underway. The text was moved here as a more appropriate place to archive the discussion than buried in the history of WP:RM, which is a very active page. In any case, the consensus here is already apparent. I shall remove the proposal from WP:RM immediately. Consider the move rejected. --Stemonitis 11:36, 24 June 2007 (UTC)

And there I was going to say that Laser is Laser, but JPEG remains JPEG. I'd guess that TARDIS has become a word more than an acronym, even if (like Laser or sonar) it started as one. Totnesmartin 12:56, 24 June 2007 (UTC)

I too favour the present arrangement as "TARDIS" implies an acronym, tho' as I've mentioned before "Tardis" and "Tardis" are equally correct. See recent Ariel BBC staff mag letters reproduced hereZir 22:07, 29 June 2007 (UTC)

The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the proposal. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on this talk page. No further edits should be made to this section.

Unprecedented Hull Breach

The wall of the TARDIS is breached for the first time ever in 'The Last of the Time Lords', by a ship, presumably the RMS Titanic. Is this relevant enough to be mentioned and/or pictured? - The Good Ol' Country Doctor ^{Ụšəг ŧª∫Қ} 21:42, 30 June 2007 (UTC) It is only breached because the sheilds were down.... i hope this helps! --MiniGuy1994 (talk) 13:23, 5 August 2008 (UTC)

External link: TARDIS scanner

Earlier today I removed an external link to a site called www.the-tardis.com/, which ties together a number of Who-related RSS feeds -- useful enough a resource, but it can't be considered to be a TARDIS/Police Box site, relevant to the article. It was re-added[1] by Doctor_No1, a user whose only contributions have been to include that link. Which is odd, seeing that the ID is similar to the LiveJournal account[2] of the chap who runs said site. This seems like a potential WP:COI to me.

It's not a huge deal, but I was under the impression self-promotion was not the done thing. Mark H Wilkinson 22:45, 2 July 2007 (UTC)

Police Box

The Conceptual history portion of the article gives this description of a police box:

At the time of the series' debut in 1963, the police box was still a common fixture in British cities (it was used in the 1960s as a temporary holding cell for suspected offenders until police back-up arrived), and with some 700 in London alone, it was a logical choice for camouflaging a time machine.

Which while not strictly inaccurate gives a misleading view of a police boxes function so I wrote this:

The main function of a police box was to allow communication between police officers they contained a telephone with a direct line to the nearest police station which could also be used by the public. The police box contained first aid equipment as well as a small workstation and could temporarily be used as a holding cell. As police cars and two way radios became more common the police box was rendered obsolete.

Which doesn't fit into the rest of the paragraph so I'm not sure what to do with it. Any suggestions?--Teletran 02:32, 4 July 2007 (UTC)

It's a bit more detailed than needed here (there's a link to the article on police boxes if more detail is needed). The main point is that the primary function is for communications, so I've rewritten the sentence to reflect this.

BBC Doctor Who Visual Dictionary TARDIS reference

There's a significant amount of detail in that book on the TARDIS and I thought it would be useful here. Particularly the mention of something called a Time Sceptre. Its certainly as cannonical as any of the other Doctor Who books (if not more so, as the writers did consult with the Producers of Doctor Who in the making of it), and surely at least deserves a mention. I've seen the Visual Dictionary referenced in other Doctor Who articles, and seems even more important to mention it here, where such an important part of the book is about the TARDIS. Steve Terran 23:30, 5 August 2007 (UTC)

I wouldn't dare to suggest that the Visual Dictionary is or isn't canonical, and the article shouldn't either — strictly speaking, there's no such thing as canon in Doctor Who, and we should do our best to avoid the suggestion that there is. That said, I see nothing wrong with mentioning the details from the Visual Dictionary, as long as they're properly sourced. The goal should be to present the information in a way that's simultaneously acceptable to both the reader who cares only about the television series and the reader who wants to know about Doctor Who in all its forms. —Josiah Rowe (talk • contribs) 17:15, 12 August 2007 (UTC)

Mobile Phones?

On a number of episodes of the current series the TARDIS appears to act as a relay between Rose's mobile phone (and possibly Martha's as well, cant remember if I saw it or not) allowing her to call home wherever she is in the universe. Although nobody says that this is specifically linked to the TARDISes systems, during "The Impossible Planet" the disappearance of the TARDIS into an earthquake rift renders Roses's phone useless, giving the impression they are linked. Just wondered whther this should be mentioned? —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 82.26.68.97 (talk • contribs) 16:44, August 12, 2007 (UTC)

Probably not, unless you can find the subject being discussed in a reliable source somewhere (in this case, something like Doctor Who Magazine would do). We need to avoid original research, and since it's never been explicitly stated that the Doctor's "jiggery-pokery" linked the mobile phones to the TARDIS, it would be original research to mention the phones in this article (unless, as I said, the connection has been made by someone else in a reliable source). —Josiah Rowe (talk • contribs) 17:18, 12 August 2007 (UTC)

Forcefield and The Runaway Bride

As this is zipping in and out of the article, let me just point out that although the extrapolator acquired in Series One does grant the TARDIS a handy-dandy forcefield, at no point in "The Runaway Bride" does the script assert that it's that very thing which keeps the atmosphere inside the TARDIS when the doors are open; the Doctor only says that "The TARDIS is protecting us." While it may be the case that that's what RTD had in mind, we don't know that for sure. --Mark H Wilkinson ^{(t, c)} 11:55, 7 September 2007 (UTC)

You're right, Mark — I was confused. My bad. —Josiah Rowe (talk • contribs) 14:07, 7 September 2007 (UTC)

That was my rationale for removing it - there was no direct link between the two. Apologies for not explaining that point here right away, as that might have helped to avoid the revert. --Ckatz^chat_spy 17:24, 7 September 2007 (UTC)

Another power source

The paragraph on power source (or subsequent ones on other essential substances that need replenishing) needs updating. In the episode that just aired on the SciFi channel, a "rift" in Cardif is set to be a refuling stop. —Długosz 25-September-2007 —Preceding signed but undated comment was added at 14:32, 25 September 2007 (UTC)

There is a mention of this in the section on "Other Tardises" - the Rift was previously used as a pit stop in "Boom Town". -207.6.224.49 07:58, 4 October 2007 (UTC)

Weight of the Tardis

How would the weight of the Tardis be calculated?

It appears to exist in more than three spatial directions, and does not disrupt the surface on which it rests to the extent that the weight of its contents might suggest.

(A link to "Weighing four-dimensional objects on a three dimensional weighing scale/weighbridge" or similar would suffice.) Jackiespeel 17:29, 1 October 2007 (UTC)

What you're asking for is not going to happen. First of all, it wouldn't work for the TARDIS unless it were stated on Doctor Who. Second, using such a page to calculate the weight of the TARDIS would be original research, and, as such, couldn't be used on Wikipedia.. — Val42 02:45, 4 October 2007 (UTC)

The weight of the TARDIS (5000 tonnes) is already included in the "Interior" section anyway. -Father Inire 04:36, 4 October 2007 (UTC)

But - the question has not really been answered.

The weight of the Tardis-police-box-form would be only a fraction of the 5000 tons (in what gravity?) mentioned, otherwise there would probably be significant damage to the ground underneath its footprint.

Sometimes Wikipedia talk pages are the best places to ask such questions - even if to be redirected to appropriate places. Jackiespeel 15:21, 5 October 2007 (UTC)

The 5000-tons figure is for "the Earthlike gravity of Alzarius" (see the article). The article also suggests that this is the weight of the TARDIS interior, which is why the police-box exterior can be moved so easily. The article and talk pages are not good places for speculation, but you can probably find some discussion of the matter at the Gallifrey One forums. -Father Inire 23:52, 5 October 2007 (UTC)

Dr Who the series operates in "the universe as we know it" - the rules of physics etc (apart from the Tardis' specific properties).

A "red phone box" is about a metre square - and the Tardis appears to be of the same size.

The Tardis can materialise on any surface, and be supported by any ground (spaceship etc) which would support the weight of a red phone box: when it leaves, there is no visible mark. Its contents are larger/heavier/more massive, so must exist "somewhere else" - where in the multi-dimensional universe would its contents cause the Tardis to have a different weight? Would a "non-cube shaped tesseract" have different weights in different three dimensional planes?

I was asking the question in case someone on Wikipedia knew where the answer could be found. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Jackiespeel (talk • contribs) 21:26, 7 October 2007 (UTC)

Yeah, I understand that. The idea that the TARDIS exterior is in some sense separate from the interior is supported by events of "Father's Day", where although the TARDIS interior is thrown clear of the Earth, the shell of the police box remains. This does explain how the TARDIS can be so heavy, yet avoid disturbing the surface it lands on. As for issues about tesseracts, you'll probably get a more authoritative answer from contributors to the tesseract article. -Father Inire 22:56, 7 October 2007 (UTC)

The FASA RPG mentions that TARDISes can vary their weight, from next to nothing (to allow landings on unstable surfaces) to several thousand tonnes. Their whole argument is that the craft is a mathematical construct made solid ("Logopolis", and built upon in several novels), therefore the weight can be adjusted as easily as the interior/exterior appearance. Presumably, this defaults, at least externally, to the weight of the object the TARDIS is impersonating, as part of the camouflage.

Not canon of course, but perhaps worth a mention like other non-canon sources. -Wolfe (talk) 07:38, 8 March 2008 (UTC)

cite 12

The fact that these facts may not be true is pretty important; should we shift the text of cite 12 into the main article? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 82.32.48.236 (talk) 12:32, 25 October 2007 (UTC)

Kylie Minogue

I've removed the following:

It has been reported that Kylie Minogue will be playing the role of the TARDIS in humanoid form.(ref http://uk.news.yahoo.com/wenn/20071028/ten-minogue-to-play-doctor-who-s-tardis-c60bd6d_1.html).

Firstly, this is sourced to a scandal rag, The Sun. Moreover, their source is unidentified and merely speculates:

"Viewers have often been told the Tardis is a living organism. But mystery has always surrounded what it is and what gives it its powers. The elements we know about Kylie's appearance all point towards her being the Tardis.

"The elements we know about Kylie's appearance point towards" means "I do not know but I am speculating that."

Even setting aside the Sun's poor reputation, even if we knew who this unidentified individual was, reporting his speculation is not reliable sourcing. --Tony Sidaway 11:11, 2 November 2007 (UTC)

Use in popular culture

Would it be worth mentioning that in a recent episode of CSI: NY the sound of the TARDIS is used a few times? The plot revolved around a "time machine" built by an eccentric, but brilliant scientist. One of the characters, upon seeing it says something along the lines of "Paging Doctor Who." And in the flashback sequences showing the scientist using the machine, the distinct sound of the TARDIS is heard. (sorry if this doesn't make a new section, still new to editing talk pages.)UncleThursday 06:31, 4 November 2007 (UTC)

I'm torn about this, myself - there are so many mentions of the TARDIS in popular culture, I'm not sure how encyclopedic they are. That said, a mention on CSI is a lot more noteworthy than some of the items on the list right now. I would say go ahead, be bold and add it, although it may end up being removed if the list is overhauled. Just be sure to cite it properly (I suggest using the {{cite episode}} template). --Brian Olsen 17:30, 4 November 2007 (UTC)

I added the reference, and used the cite episode template. Let me know how it reads, and I double checked the links in the preview pane, so I know they work.UncleThursday 22:41, 4 November 2007 (UTC)

Proposed Merger

Chameleon Circuit was created today, duplicating much of the material in this article. I don't see it growing, and as yet it lacks references which exist here. Hence the proposal to merge it here. --Rodhullandemu (Talk) 09:47, 20 January 2008 (UTC)

There's also an entry for the chameleon circuit in the List of Doctor Who items - merging with that article might be more appropriate, although I don't have an opinion one way or the other. I would agree that the chameleon circuit doesn't merit its own article. -Father Inire (talk) 10:35, 20 January 2008 (UTC)

Agreed with the merger...after all, it is part of the TARDIS, right? Exactly. But you may want to clean it up a bit first. -Luna''keet'' (talk) 20:41, 14 March 2008 (UTC)

do it 64.180.237.28 (talk) 07:15, 28 March 2008 (UTC)

Agreed for merger--the 'article' by itself really serves no purpose and can be put as its own section. 76.104.225.104 (talk) 04:14, 27 April 2008 (UTC)

I've redirected this to List of Doctor Who items#C; having looked at it, there's nothing that amplifies what we already have, and it's been quite some time. --Rodhullandemu 12:54, 13 October 2008 (UTC)

Bad Wolf in Turn Left

The TARDIS exterior (along with manys surrounding props) was altered for the Turn Left finale to read 'Bad Wolf' over and over. I believe this is notable as it is the first (?) time that the TARDIS exterior is seen as being altered by an external (I assume) force. It was removed as non-notable. For the sake of reversion wars, discussion here? --.../Nemo (talk) 07:20, 23 June 2008 (UTC)

A couple of thoughts... one, how do we know it is the first? That would need a citation. Second, it is notable in the episode article, but is it really notable here in the main article? Third, how do we know that it is an external force causing the change? It could even be the TARDIS itself, given that it has already been established that it translates spoken and written language for the Doctor and the companions. All in all, I don't think it is needed unless we find out there is something more to this event. --Ckatz^chat_spy 08:37, 23 June 2008 (UTC)

I'll concede I can't cite an external source regarding the consistency of the shape of the TARDIS - though the article here itself does already note other (imho much more minor) changes regarding the wording of the front panel, St Johns Ambulance badge... Whilst this change has certainly had much less screen time, it is (for once) a change which is relevant to the plot. I would say that alone makes it notable. Regardless of the origin of the 'Bad Wolf' text, very rarely has the actual TARDIS appearance been a concern to the Doctor (Father's Day is the only other that springs to my mind), and that also makes it notable. Either of these, imho, would be enough to warrant the one sentance note regdarding the change of signage. --.../Nemo (talk) 15:18, 23 June 2008 (UTC)

Six TARDIS Pilots

I think we need to clarify who the six pilots are in the final episode of Series 4. The article says both "Rose Tyler, Martha Jones, Sarah Jane Smith, Mickey Smith, the Doctor and the Doctor's doppelgänger" and "Mickey Smith, Jack Harkness, Rose Tyler, Martha Jones, Sarah Jane Smith, and a clone of The Doctor" in two separate parts. The common characters on the lists are "Rose Tyler, Martha Jones, Sarah Jane Smith, Mickey Smith and the Doctor's clone/doppelgänger.

Watching the scene again on iTunes, I believe it is Rose Tyler, Martha Jones, Jack Harkness, Mickey Smith, Sarah Jane Smith and the Doctor. To begin with, it looks like the clone (blue suit) is helping as well, but him and Donna move to the side. And Jackie (Rose's mother) stands with her arms crossed, leaving the other six to pilot the tardis.

I have edited the article to reflect what I can clearly see on the episode, and have noted this in the edit summary. Thanks. --Woodgreener (talk) 22:30, 8 July 2008 (UTC)

The article presently states the following on the question of the number of pilots:

"A previous episode showed six Timelords piloting a TARDIS (in flashback), using a pristine console devoid of the Doctor's somewhat jury-rigged modifications and repairs. The controls resembled coloured glass spheres and obelisk shaped spikes protruding from the surface of the console."

This is new to me! I suggest we delete this unless someone can actually give an episode reference. Cuddlyopedia (talk) 06:16, 12 November 2008 (UTC)

I've removed it. Surprised that stayed in the article as long as it did (it was added by an anonymous editor on [http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=TARDIS&diff=246348131&oldid=246345983 October 19). I'm 99.44% sure that there's no such episode. —Josiah Rowe (talk • contribs) 06:33, 12 November 2008 (UTC)

Unless it's a missing episode - (and I think all of those are before Time Lords appeared) then there isn't one. 86.149.200.10 (talk) 22:21, 1 January 2009 (UTC)

scanner

The TARDIS also possesses a scanner so that its crew may examine the exterior environment before exiting the ship. In the 2005 series the scanner display is attached to the console and is able to display television signals as well as various computing functions and occasionally what the production team has stated are Gallifreyan numbers and text.

Is this in reference to the main viewscreen that looks like a flat panel TV hidden behind a sliding panel, or the console display that Tegan used to look at the Index File ? 70.51.10.188 (talk) 05:27, 13 October 2008 (UTC)

Keys/Shalka

In Scream of The Shalka, the Doctor locks the TARDIS doors remotely, presumably using central locking. I see it's not mentioned here - as I don't know how you guys view the canonicity of this story I am reluctant to just plonk this info in the aricle. Thoughts? 81.151.33.88 (talk) 17:40, 3 November 2008 (UTC)

Flight control mistake

Regarding the following:

• The Time Lords (as well as similarly powerful beings) are able to divert the TARDIS's flight path (The Ribos Operation, 1978),...

I just rewatched the serial, and it was the White Guardian, not the Timelords, who hijacked the Doctor's TARDIS in the Ribos Operations, though Romana had believed she'd been sent by the President of the Timelords. I believe it was in Genesis of the Daleks that the TARDIS was externally controlled, and one or two other episodes, but am not sure enough to edit. IMHO (talk) 23:20, 18 December 2008 (UTC)

And scratch Genesis, at least if the wiki article is right. According to that, the Timelords hijacked the Doctor cum companions whilst they were undergoing transmat. IMHO (talk) 02:15, 19 December 2008 (UTC)