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January 9

Missing Artist

Hello there I sent this question in December as well. There is an artist who should be up on wiki. Richard Seaglove had spent a lot of time entering Paul's details I believe but it has still not been approved by Wiki.

Paul Robinson Nina Simone's drummer for her final 19 years and Van Morrison's drummer and who has worked with so many huge names and venues. Richard said several months ago that it would be up. Paul is about to release a biography of his time with Nina Simone. We are just wondering why his Wiki entry is not up yet. Really important for agents and publishers to see it up here before the book is released. Can you perhaps let me know why it's not yet up there? Is it still being verified? Blessings and many thanks for Wiki Rebecca — Preceding unsigned comment added by PoeticPlenties (talk • contribs) 10:51, 9 January 2020 (UTC)[reply]

A couple of editors told you, about 5 weeks ago, what the problem is.[1] ←Baseball Bugs ^{What's up, Doc?} carrots→ 11:07, 9 January 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Also, what did you do to the help desk page? Did you go back to a previous version? ←Baseball Bugs ^{What's up, Doc?} carrots→ 11:13, 9 January 2020 (UTC) I am not sure what I did. I am just replying here[reply]

Someone called Richard Seaglove here says that their work covers "Source, Design and Production of specialised merchandising materials focused on the music Industry.... " It would be interesting to find out whether their work extends to claiming to write WP articles that don't exist. Possibly not, but it's not a common name. Ghmyrtle (talk) 17:20, 10 January 2020 (UTC)[reply]

There's certainly enough information out there to establish he's notable enough to have an article about him. See here and here. There's lots out there; his best known work was with Nina Simone, but he's worked with a wide variety of other artists. I can't find any evidence of PoeticPlenties work on the article; was it created under another account? --Jayron 32 13:19, 9 January 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Thank you so much Jayron32. Yes it's true he has worked with a bunch of extraordinary artists, and continues to do so. Currently drumming for Eric Bibb who just received Best International Blues artist. Van Morrison is another musician Paul Robinson drummed for a very good number of years. I don't know how wiki works, myself. No I didn't create the wiki entry for Paul. Someone called Richard Seaglove did. He uses two different emails 'henryharwood' and rich at glynt (which is the name of his studio I think. Apparently he completed an entry in 2019. I know this because he emailed me to ask me some other facts about Robinson's career. Robinson's partner (and mother of his daughter) did the Eulogy in French and English at Nina's funeral. This is a significant oversight that he is not mentioned on Nina's page from the very start. Can you help at all?

What is a fish game, a fish table, and a fish arcade?

I'm reluctant to include this in any existing article, but this is a source that sort of defines the term.— Vchimpanzee • talk • contributions • 16:45, 9 January 2020 (UTC)[reply]

I've got a feeling I've asked about fish games before. Will have a dig in the archives to see what I can find. DuncanHill (talk) 16:48, 9 January 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Ah, it wasn't me, it was you @Vchimpanzee:! See Wikipedia:Reference desk/Archives/Entertainment/2018 September 27#What is a fish game?. DuncanHill (talk) 16:51, 9 January 2020 (UTC)[reply]

I forgot I had asked.— Vchimpanzee • talk • contributions • 16:55, 9 January 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Anyway, I'm not sure how to include this in any articles. Redemption game is the only article mentioned.— Vchimpanzee • talk • contributions • 16:57, 9 January 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Assuming I correctly edited Redemption game the first time I asked, the sources conflict. WFMY says the games are definitely illegal, and yet the new guy at the Salisbury Post says they are not but that Greensboro, North Carolina banned them. WFMY says Greensboro just enforced a rule that was already there. Anyway, I guess this requires further research but I've got other stuff to do today.— Vchimpanzee • talk • contributions • 17:05, 9 January 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Living in North Carolina, I think I can bring up some personal knowledge. In NC, gambling halls and casinos are illegal, but "internet cafe"s or Sweepstakes parlors are not. In a lot of low-rent areas, people will set up what are called an "internet cafe" or a "sweepstakes", but which are essentially sketchy casinos. Fish tables are a type of game prevalent in those places. Remember also, in the real world, where most of us live, there are lots of things which are quite illegal, but which limited resources can make enforcement difficult, so people and business can often skate by for years without anyone doing anything. Even if these places are illegal, other than getting harrassed by the occasional bored police officer, they usually aren't high on the list of high-priority enforcement problems. Here is a recent article from another NC county. As noted in that article, the state of North Carolina has four enforcement officers to work these cases. Four. For the entire state. So that's why they are allowed to operate; in order to shut them down you need to gather evidence, investigate, make a case, arrest people, put on a trial, etc. You just can't police the entire state with just 4 people. --Jayron 32 16:41, 10 January 2020 (UTC)[reply]

I don't know if I can improve any article based on this source or the description here.

That doesn't really make it clear what should be in a Wikipedia article. But if I make a mess and no one bothers to clean it up, I guess it's the same thing.— Vchimpanzee • talk • contributions • 17:09, 10 January 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Part of the problem is that there isn't always good source text about things like this. No one is writing "an authoritative encyclopedia of sketchy gaming machines" or something like that. Lots of things in this world exist, but don't have great sources about them. --Jayron 32 17:48, 10 January 2020 (UTC)[reply]

I know my goals are in conflict with Wikipedia's goals, but I would just like to see these three terms at least defined somewhere on Wikipedia. It was many years before I really understood notability.— Vchimpanzee • talk • contributions • 19:53, 10 January 2020 (UTC)[reply]

No, your goals are 100% in line with Wikipedia's goals. However, accomplishing a goal requires resources, and where those resources do not exist, the goal cannot be accomplished. For example, my goal is to be so wealthy I never have to work again in my life. Lacking both money and the means to get significantly more, I lack the resources to achieve that goal. Similarly here, we want to have reliable sources of information to learn more about this topic. If those sources don't exist, no amount of want will make them exist. --Jayron 32 12:04, 15 January 2020 (UTC)[reply]

January 12

Note of the word "brains" in "She's in love with the boy"

Leaving out of this discussion what key the song is actually in, I would like to know exactly what interval above the tonic the word "brains" is in the song "She's in Love with the Boy". Specifically in the line "When it comes to brains he's got the short end of the stick". Whenever I hear the song on YouTube this note is a flattened third above the tonic. But the sheet music at musicnotes.com says it's a major 3rd. Which is correct?? Georgia guy (talk) 01:58, 12 January 2020 (UTC)[reply]

It's a good example of a blue note -- a flattened third often played against an otherwise major chord. I've seen some hellish transcriptions involving #9 chords. --jpgordon^{𝄢𝄆 𝄐𝄇} 23:14, 12 January 2020 (UTC)[reply]

It actually isn't a "flattened" third. This is misleading. This is a major chord (albeit a 7th-style change in transition to the subdominant) with a diminished 10th. In this case, if the key were E-major, the diminished note would be a G-natural (otherwise a G-sharp). It is not written, but certainly sung (implied) but Yearwood. The actual third within the chord remains: G-sharp - against the diminished 10th; giving it that blue note sound that jpgordon was referring to. Maineartists (talk) 02:35, 13 January 2020 (UTC)[reply]

That's a minor 10th, not a diminished 10th (which would be a G-flat). And it's absolutely flattened by common musical parlance, which has no problem talking about something like "Dorian flat 2" even if this is B Dorian and the "flat 2" is really a C natural. Double sharp (talk) 05:02, 13 January 2020 (UTC)[reply]

It's a blue note. It's not any kind of tenth. Perhaps I should have said "lowered" rather than "flattened". --jpgordon^{𝄢𝄆 𝄐𝄇} 05:48, 16 January 2020 (UTC)[reply]

You are speaking as if the note itself defines the chord. You're thinking "scale" not chord. You don't "minor" a note; you minor a chord by diminishing the third in a triad. However, in this specific incident, the singer is indeed singing a G-natural against an E major chord (not the second in the chord, but second to her root). It's not the second in the chord when played out on the piano or accompanying instrument - that would imply the chord should be E-minor. You have to have a G-natural in the underlying chord (G#) for the diminished 10th (the singer's 3rd) to be "blue". It's a turnaround change into A. Academia jargon doesn't apply in this very natural understanding. Double sharp diminishing the 10th in E-major doesn't make it a G-flat. When you diminish a note, it goes by half-steps: G# to G-natural. Maineartists (talk) 14:42, 16 January 2020 (UTC)[reply]

@Maineartists: Nope. One semitone less than a major third is a minor third. One semitone less again is a diminished third. And the same for tenths. A diminished interval is one semitone smaller than a minor or perfect interval. We started with a major tenth (E to G-sharp); so E to G-natural is a minor tenth, and it is E to G-flat that would be a diminished tenth. What is sung here is a minor tenth above the tonic, not a diminished tenth. (Or we can just speak of thirds, modulo octaves.) The note is flattened one semitone with respect to the diatonic note of the key it is in; in this case it means G-natural instead of G-sharp. So we have a major chord harmonising the "blue note", creating a clash between the major and minor thirds that are played simultaneously. It's not a second, unless you want to insist on a tertian analysis and call it F-double-sharp instead of G-natural, which would make it an augmented ninth above the tonic E. But considering that the next note is an F-sharp, that would be silly. Double sharp (talk) 16:09, 16 January 2020 (UTC)[reply]

January 13

What do you call it when a vinyl record gets stuck?

I just heard it online. The sound stopped briefly and the problem was fixed, but I can only assume that was a recording because how could the person be monitoring it that closely?— Vchimpanzee • talk • contributions • 20:35, 13 January 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Found it. Phonograph_record#Vinyl says "locked groove". Actually, that's more of a problem as I'd have to explain it.— Vchimpanzee • talk • contributions • 20:37, 13 January 2020 (UTC)[reply]

I also heard is called a "skip" - I know I'm not the only person who experienced this. Back in the 60's and 70's a radio DJ could put on a record - leave the booth for whatever reason - and a record with a skip might glitch for minutes at a time. Whoo wee I'm getting old. MarnetteD|Talk 02:49, 14 January 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Maybe there's more than one thing being discussed. A "skipping" record is one where the stylus jumps the groove so that it ends up repeating or skipping a short interval of the playback. See Skip (audio playback). Notably, though, the sound doesn't stop as the OP's post describes and I don't think I've ever heard of a stylus actually getting stuck, though I'm sure it's happened. Matt Deres (talk) 03:44, 14 January 2020 (UTC)[reply]

I believe the OP means that it stopped briefly when the DJ noticed the problem (and lifted the stylus). --142.112.159.101 (talk) 08:21, 14 January 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Deliberate locked grooves do exist, although they're normally placed at the very end of a side, in the run-out groove. The needle gets stuck and something plays on endless repeat. There's a famous example at the end of side 2 of Sgt. Pepper's Lonely Hearts Club Band. --Viennese Waltz 07:27, 14 January 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Maybe not as famous but there's also a dripping water tap noise at the end of "Alan's Psychedelic Breakfast" which runs ad infinitum. †dismas†|^(talk) 19:06, 14 January 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Assuming the DJ is actually there. Larry King once told a story of when he was an overnight DJ on a Miami radio station and left the studio while an album was playing. It started skipping in the final track, and it took him a noticeably long time to get back to the studio and fix it. ←Baseball Bugs ^{What's up, Doc?} carrots→ 05:52, 14 January 2020 (UTC)[reply]

If the recording did actually stop, i.e. producing a period of silence, it would probably because radio DJs commonly use slipmats, which allow the turntable to rotate beneath a record. If there was a big enough hole in the groove to stop the stylus (literally) in its tracks there would be silence until somebody lifted and replaced it further in towards the label. I'd imagine that this would result in stylus damage if it actually happened though. Incidentally, contrary what the linked article states Grandmaster Flash did not invent the slipmat, though he probably did re-discover it.Blakk and ekka 15:37, 14 January 2020 (UTC)[reply]

In Larry King's situation, he was playing a Belafonte LP. When it got to the "Jamaica Farewell" track, the skip made it go "Down the way, where the nights, where the nights, where the nights..." hundreds of times before he made it back to the studio.[2] ←Baseball Bugs ^{What's up, Doc?} carrots→ 18:10, 14 January 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Since the question is "what do you call it?"... another answer is "broken record". If someone repeated himself a lot, my mother would say he's "like a broken record". Looking in the OED Online, I find that they have cites for this phrase with this meaning as recently as 2004 (in The New Republic), even though a 1988 cite (in Newsday) acknowledges that "this comparison will have to be replaced as the compact disc gains pre-eminence and we forget what broken records sounded like". --142.112.159.101 (talk) 08:21, 14 January 2020 (UTC)[reply]

A quick survey of Newspapers.com (a pay site) for just 2019 indicates plenty of usage. And with vinyl records having made a comeback, it could be with us a long time. ←Baseball Bugs ^{What's up, Doc?} carrots→ 08:57, 14 January 2020 (UTC)[reply]

January 16

What instrument or effect is making the rat-ta-tat-tat type sound at the end of Guns N' Rose's November Rain

At the end of this song, there is this rat-ta-tat-tat type noise that persists for a few seconds while the music slowly fades. I'm wondering if anyone knows or can guess at what instrument or effect produces that sound.

Here is a cut to where I think it is most prominent. From this start, the sound can be heard for about 5 seconds. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8SbUC-UaAxE&t=532

128.229.4.2 (talk) 15:53, 16 January 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Willem Welsyn

I am please looking for the lyrics to Die Saad van die Onkruid by Willem Welsyn.