Talk:2024 Iran–Israel conflict

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This is an old revision of this page, as edited by Brandmeister (talk | contribs) at 19:45, 19 April 2024 (→‎Requested move 14 April 2024: oppose). The present address (URL) is a permanent link to this revision, which may differ significantly from the current revision.

"conflict" hasn't broken out

As of yet, I wouldn't consider it a conflict, since the Al-Asad Airbase retaliation for the Assassination of Qasem Soleimani isn't considered a "conflict" between the United States and Iran, and neither did the 1991 Iraqi rocket attacks on Israel consider as a "conflict" between Iraq and Israel. But this is still recent, nobody knows about the possible escalations that could follow suit. Christophervincent01 (talk) 04:43, 14 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Agreed, this article is unnecessary unless there’s an actual confrontation between Israeli and Iranian forces rather than a back and forth, much like (as mentioned) the Soleimani case. 2605:B100:D1D:5E7A:1904:DCC3:4974:B1F9 (talk) 08:11, 14 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Well, the period of tensions during that time was called the Persian Gulf crisis anyway, even if there's no article. And at this point it's pretty much confirmed Israel will respond based on statements by western officials, and that Iran will respond again. Personisinsterest (talk) 10:51, 14 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]
It still wasn't called a "conflict" and it's highly notable that there isn't an article on the "Persian Gulf crisis," with it rather redirecting towards the Iran–United States relations. Christophervincent01 (talk) 19:09, 14 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Requested move 14 April 2024

2024 Iran–Israel conflict → 2024 Iran–Israel crisis – As the Al-Asad Airbase retaliatory strikes by Iran, against the United States, in retaliation for the Assassination of Qasem Soleimani didn't lead to a conflict, "conflict" would be an inappropriate title as of yet, per WP:CRYSTAL. Christophervincent01 (talk) 19:04, 14 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Support Yeah, 'crisis' seems like a more accurate description of what's going on here. And CNN,1, Politico 2, The Guardian 3, NYT 4, USA Today 5, and others refer to it as such. Most refer to it as 'Middle East crisis', but we can be more specific. Personisinsterest (talk) 19:37, 14 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Listing it as a crisis until Israel decides (or declines) to make a move is probably the best option. Some Hecking Nerd (talk) 21:34, 14 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Oppose. 1. The sources provided by user above describe it as "Middle East crisis" or "Iran crisis". These are generic media terms used for ease of understanding made from the perspective of U.S./U.K.; it's not a specific term for the events that transpired, and adding "2014" and "Israel-" to it doesn't make it so; it just makes it more semantically awkward. 2. Nominator cited Operation Martyr Soleimani, but this isn't a correct precendent; that article never named the Operation as part of a "crisis" except for a link to 2019–2021 Persian Gulf crisis which has in fact been deleted and left as a redirect. The deletion discussion for that article has good arguments on why using the "crisis" to describe a series of events has its own WP:CRYSTAL issues. It presumes an ongoing problem that requires defusing or else might need to war. It's not necessarily less CRYSTAL-y than the simple description "conflict". Ceconhistorian (talk) 10:07, 15 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]
stricken by User:Philipnelson99 per WP:ARBECR]Oppose Changing the article's namespace is just not necessary at this moment. It was said Israeli war cabinet plan to respond to Iran under 24 hours. Let's hold on and watch. Caleb Ndu (talk) 16:04, 15 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Support the term crisis accurately describes the content of the current situation. D.S. Lioness (talk) 17:15, 15 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Wait per D.S. Lioness, yes it is a crises, but we should wait to see what happens in the next few days LuxembourgLover (talk) 17:31, 15 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Support but this is no longer a crisis which already escalated to a confrontation a step before a direct conflict. Nicola Romani (talk) 15:06, 16 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]
I agree that confrontation is the best way to describe this. What people are failing to realize is this beyond a crisis. Israel attacked a sovereign nation’s embassy, that nation responded with the largest drone attack in history combined with cruise and ballistic missiles. This is the first confrontation of this nature between the two nations 2601:153:880:35A0:3906:5F6D:5958:EBF3 (talk) 01:24, 17 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Support: the term conflict is better reserved for direct engagement. As of right now, the term crisis better represents the tit-for-tat strikes. Also, crisis is used over conflict in the news per User:Personisinsterest. --Pithon314 (talk) 14:14, 19 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Oppose for two reasons. First, the two countrise just have exchanged significant air strikes, i.e. 2024 Iranian strikes in Israel and 2024 Israeli strikes on Iran. This is a de facto war already. Yes, this may be not a full-scale war, i.e. Iran only used less than 10% their missiles, but still an ongoing war. Secondly, there is the ongoing Israel–Hezbollah conflict (2023–present). One can argue this is already a ground war of Israel with Iranian proxy forces, and not just proxies: they have been created by Iran and subordinated to Iran, pretty much like "pro-Russian rebels" were subordinated to Russia in Ukraine after 2014. My very best wishes (talk) 17:48, 19 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Oppose This is beyond mere crisis at this stage, as both countries officially attacked each other in armed retaliations, amounting to a casus belli (even if no further escalation follows). Brandmeistertalk 19:44, 19 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Add US Navy to list of units involved

The US Navy was involved in shooting down missiles launched from Iran to Israel the units from the United States Navy, which were involved were two Arleigh Burke class destroyers with fighter jets from the USS Eisenhower Nimitz aircraft carrier 96.60.168.239 (talk) 00:43, 15 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]

That detail, if sourced, belongs more in the specific article on the massive standoff attack that occurred on 13-14 April, currently named: 2024 Iranian strikes in Israel. Cheers. N2e (talk) 12:05, 15 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Another support from Africa

I saw this support for Israel while researching. Wouldn't it be appropriate to add it? See link Caleb Ndu (talk) 15:52, 15 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Another source here Interested editors should access it. Caleb Ndu (talk) 16:09, 15 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Extended-confirmed-protected edit request on 15 April 2024

Change On 1 April, Israel bombed the Iranian consulate in Damascus, killing multiple senior Iranian officials.to On 1 April, Israel bombed the Iranian consulate in Damascus, which killed multiple senior Iranian officials. Caleb Ndu (talk) 15:56, 15 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Why is this changed needed? The current text reads better in my opinion. Jamedeus (talk) 18:57, 15 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]
 Not done for now: please establish a consensus for this alteration before using the {{Edit extended-protected}} template. '''[[User:CanonNi]]''' (talk|contribs) 00:52, 16 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Reaction of Poland, Council of Ministers (Poland) and the Ministry of Foreign Affairs (Poland) related to 2024 airstrikes in the territory of the State of Palestine and Israel

Polsat News described about reaction of the Polish Ministry of Foreign Affairs in the next description: There are no large tourist groups there, nor are there any large pilgrimage groups, so none of our compatriots were harmed in this attack - said Paweł Wroński, spokesman for the Ministry of Foreign Affairs, on Polsat News on Sunday, when asked about the Iranian attack on Israel. Deputy Minister of Foreign Affairs Andrzej Szejna said that if the conflict escalates, we are ready to evacuate Polish citizens at any time. (https://www.polsatnews.pl/wiadomosc/2024-04-14/atak-na-izrael-ministerstwo-o-polakach/)

False and misleading claims

It says that "The drones and missiles hit various cities in Israel". In reality none of the drones even entered Israeli territory, and none of the missiles hit Israeli cities. Also when it says 33 civilians injured, maybe add that only one of them was from the missiles themselves. Otherwise it's a bit misleading. 176.230.36.187 (talk) 08:25, 16 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Very few words on the relationship between the war in Gaza to this skirmish

The article seems to only skim over relevant details of the war in Gaza, and the wider reaction in Western Asia to it. This article could be improved by elaborating on Iran's reaction to Israeli action taken against Palestinians, especially the tensions caused by Israeli intentions to attack Rafah. 109.175.167.0 (talk) 11:58, 16 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Extended-confirmed-protected edit request on 17 April 2024

Add Russia as a group supporting Iran. Sources: https://www.ynetnews.com/article/bjax9lhla

https://www.washingtonpost.com/national-security/2024/04/15/iran-israel-russia-drones-missiles/ MoCoEd23 (talk) 14:27, 17 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]

 Not done for now: The countries and groups in the belligerents section are directly involved in the conflict and have exchanged fire with the other side. Russia has only made public statements. This is still relevant and could probably be added to a reactions section as the article expands, but there isn't anywhere to put it right now. Jamedeus (talk) 17:56, 17 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Extended-confirmed-protected edit request on 18 April 2024

Remove Saudi Arabia, Salman bin Abdulaziz Al Saud, King Salman, Mohammed bin Salman, Khalid bin Salman Al Saud, and reference 10. 169.234.207.194 (talk) 17:36, 18 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]

 Not done for now: please establish a consensus for this alteration before using the {{Edit extended-protected}} template. This is likely a controversial change and no explanation is given for why it is necessary. Jamedeus (talk) 19:00, 18 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Extended-confirmed-protected edit request on 18 April 2024 (2)

The Times of Israel cannot possible considered a credible or unbiased source, Wikipedia should put off including Saudi Arabia and the UAE as belligerents due to the news source available for that claim being The Times of Israel, at least until more regarding this is uncovered. JosefAJ (talk) 21:32, 18 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]

 Not done: This has been reported by multiple sources. I just added a second citation from a more neutral outlet so that we aren't relying exclusively on Times of Israel. Jamedeus (talk) 21:59, 18 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]

israeli retaliation

It's over from their end. not ongoing. we can remove the ongoing part.now see if Iran retaliated. 37.252.95.10 (talk) 04:44, 19 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]

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