Talk:Ashton-under-Lyne

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Featured articleAshton-under-Lyne is a featured article; it (or a previous version of it) has been identified as one of the best articles produced by the Wikipedia community. Even so, if you can update or improve it, please do so.
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Article milestones
DateProcessResult
September 28, 2008Good article nomineeListed
August 9, 2009Featured article candidatePromoted
Current status: Featured article

St Petersfield[edit]

I've added some info about the regeneration in the St Petersfield area of Ashton. Feel free to add more or tidy up what I've added as required. Aenimiac 22:05, 1 October 2006 (UTC)

IKEA[edit]

There's a free-to-use image of IKEA Manchester, for use with any planned Economy section for Tameside. --Jza84 |  Talk  13:25, 22 May 2008 (UTC)

I'll add it to my list of things to do :-) Nev1 (talk) 13:37, 22 May 2008 (UTC)

Market town?[edit]

Does the ancient Royal Charter granted to Ashton mean it is, still, a market town? --Jza84 |  Talk  22:13, 14 September 2008 (UTC)

It certainly was a market town, and since I can't find any mention of the charter being removed or taken back, I think it still counts as a market town. Nev1 (talk) 14:10, 15 September 2008 (UTC)
Sounds good to me. I'll check out Frangopulo's Tradition in Action (1977) to see if I can get some more info. :) --Jza84 |  Talk  14:16, 15 September 2008 (UTC)

Going forwards[edit]

I think the recent developments section can be split between the history and the new economy sections. What's to be done with thenightlife section? It doesn't seem very encyclopaedic. Also, although the post office closures are sourced, are they really notable? Nev1 (talk) 16:55, 15 September 2008 (UTC)

I share these sentiments. Perhaps a sentence on the post office and nightlife stuff could go into economy? --Jza84 |  Talk  17:18, 15 September 2008 (UTC)
I've done most of that apart from the stuff about the post office. I'm not convinced it's important, the closures aren't confined to Ashton and don't have a huge impact. The information is still in the article at this point though.
On the upside, I'm now happy that the article deserves it B-class rating. Nev1 (talk) 20:11, 15 September 2008 (UTC)
I agree it could go. It certainly doesn't sit well in that section no matter what though anyway. We can always restore it again if something comes up.
The article is coming on nicely now. I've a few books I'll flick through in the next 24 hours for factoids, but other than that, it's just the notable people section that strikes me as poor now. --Jza84 |  Talk  20:17, 15 September 2008 (UTC)

(<-) Actually... I think the Landmarks subsection could be expanded into a section in its own right. We should be able to write up more about the War Memorial(s) and Parish Church, and notably, mentions of Hartshead Pike are missing (the pike being in Ashton). Then there's the Portland Basin etc.

For Economy we could (of we have space) include a photo of Ashton Market Hall. Simillarly, we need a Public services section (if we're to mirror WP:UKCITIES), in which case we can use Ashton Fire Station as an image perhaps?

Finally, these 70 photos are avaliable on licences compatable with WikiCommons; I'll try and add them. --Jza84 |  Talk  20:30, 15 September 2008 (UTC)

I've added an image of the parish church and an old industrial landscape from geograph to wikicommons, both of which I'd like to see in the article at some point. I'll try to redraw the old Ashton coat of arms for the Governance section too. Also, this is a good source to use for the Landmarks bit. --Jza84 |  Talk  20:56, 15 September 2008 (UTC)
Good finds, hopefully we'll be able to fit a lot more pictures in, but I'm afraid there probably won't be room for all of them (I don't mean all 70 from flickr). I was thinking an image of the market hall could go at the end of the history section. There's plenty of room for expansion yet, especially the landmarks as you say. I don't think I've ever really had a go at writing a public services section, but the NHS facility go in. Nev1 (talk) 21:10, 15 September 2008 (UTC)
I've just realised there's nothing about cotton(!) or the town centre in the economy section. With that, we can hopefully squeeze in the picture of the market hall, then the picture of canal can go in the history section. Nev1 (talk) 21:36, 15 September 2008 (UTC)
I was wondering about the textiles stuff. I have M. Nevell's A Guide to the Industrial Archaeology of Greater Manchester which usually has at least something on each mill town's textile heritage - I'll have a look. I'm quite pleased with the amount of images we have to hand now actually. I really struggled for Royton, and had to beg some photographers on Flickr to release stuff! If we're really keen, we may need to go through this list too. :S --Jza84 |  Talk  21:49, 15 September 2008 (UTC)
The guide would be useful for a concise paragraph, by Tameside 1700-1930 will be more detailed and have more figures (possibly better for the history section). There's an incredible amount of information available, not just about Ashton but Tameside in general. Also, I don't remember an article being so easy to find decent images for! Also, I've added a bit to the economy section about the town centre so we're ready to add the image of the market hall. Nev1 (talk) 21:57, 15 September 2008 (UTC)

The notable people section is now prose, I think that with a couple of sources in the geography section and a bit of expansion to the landmarks we're ready to go for GA. I should be able to sort out landmarks tonight, any thoughts? Nev1 (talk) 16:55, 18 September 2008 (UTC)

I think we're getting close to it. We still need a Public services section (which I'm happy to write up), and the Geography section is still thinner than I'd like, but other than that we're doing well. Still haven't had chance to go through my books, but if we're pushing for GA, I'll make the extra effort to. :) --Jza84 |  Talk  18:32, 18 September 2008 (UTC)
That'd be great, I'll see if there's anything I can do for the geography section, but it's not my strong suit. Nev1 (talk) 20:01, 18 September 2008 (UTC)

Just checking[edit]

We have a quote in the history section (about the Industrial Revolution) that says "most famous mills towns in the North West". Is it definately mills towns, not mill towns? --Jza84 |  Talk  20:23, 16 September 2008 (UTC)

You're right, it was my typo; sometimes I wish there was a way to copy and paste from paper. Corrected. Nev1 (talk) 20:35, 16 September 2008 (UTC)

Notable people[edit]

I've tried to source everyone in the notable people section, those I couldn't find sources for have been moved here in case someone else can provide some:

id=Bck6oHB6_AwC&pg=PA260&lpg=PA260&dq=Ashton-under-Lyne+%22George+Formby,+Sr%22&source=web&ots=zY8G5Uqb8m&sig=rBVuYPtjNUWHwDfx_LIOVRLepfQ&hl=en&sa=X&oi=book_result&resnum=8&ct=result here], but I don't have the book)

hhtp://www.cheshirebmd.org.uk James Booth 1875 Ref:ASH/85/73Velpremus (talk) 13:03, 23 November 2008 (UTC)

hhtp://www.cheshirebmd.org.uk Ronald Gordon Fraser, birth registerd 1930 Ref AST/208/62Velpremus (talk) 13:03, 23 November 2008 (UTC)

hhtp://www.cheshirebmd.org.uk Registered: Peter Hebblethwaite1930 Ref ASH/209/42Velpremus (talk) 13:03, 23 November 2008 (UTC)

hhtp://www.cheshirebmd.org.uk Registered Colin Philip Lowrie 1936 ref ASH/220/31Velpremus (talk) 13:03, 23 November 2008 (UTC)

I have a copy of James Booth's (George Formby snr) birth certifcate if you would like a scan. (dundustin at yahoo.co.uk) —Preceding unsigned comment added by Velpremus (talkcontribs) 20:29, 22 November 2008 (UTC)

GENUKI[edit]

There's a copy of the Imperial Gazetteer of England and Wales used in the references, provided by GENUKI. Just a note there is an exact copy at vision of Britain too. Do we need to swap over? I've provided the url above eitherway. --Jza84 |  Talk  23:13, 18 September 2008 (UTC)

Vision of Britain is a great source, but I'm not sure about GENUKI, I though I'd seen it removed from some articles for being unreliable so I think it's best to use VoB. Nev1 (talk) 23:20, 18 September 2008 (UTC)
I did remember something along those lines, but wasn't sure. :) --Jza84 |  Talk  23:21, 18 September 2008 (UTC)

History - a few thoughts[edit]

  • I've done some copy editing on the history section removing some occurences of the town name as "Ashton" or "Ashton-under-lyne" seemed to be mentioned at least once, and sometimnes twice, in every sentence.
  • The story about the effigy isn't too clear - did this tradition begin during the lifetime of the Lord or after his death?
  • "The lords' consistent absence from the manor is said to have been the stimulus for Ashton's growth of a large scale domestic-based textile industry in the 17th century" This needs some explanation as it isn't clear why his absence should be the stimulus for the growth of an industry.
  • The name Assheton gets shortened to Ashton without comment. Is it known when this happened? If not there should be a comment the first time the spelling changes to say that by that time, it had been shortened. Richerman (talk) 00:48, 20 September 2008 (UTC)
Thanks for the copy edit. The tradition with the effigy has been given an earliest date. According to British-history.ac.uk, the name Ashton actually pre-dates Assheton; it looks like the Lord of the Manor chose one spelling and everyone else chose another. Nev1 (talk) 14:26, 20 September 2008 (UTC)

GA Review[edit]

This review is transcluded from Talk:Ashton-under-Lyne/GA1. The edit link for this section can be used to add comments to the review.

I will be reviewing article over the weekend. 17:38, 27 September 2008 (UTC)

GAR[edit]

GA review – see WP:WIAGA for criteria

  1. Is it reasonably well written?
    A. Prose quality:
    A good read
    B. MoS compliance:
  2. Is it factually accurate and verifiable?
    A. References to sources:
    B. Citation of reliable sources where necessary:
    C. No original research:
  3. Is it broad in its coverage?
    A. Major aspects:
    B. Focused:
  4. Is it neutral?
    Fair representation without bias:
  5. Is it stable?
    No edit wars, etc:
  6. Does it contain images to illustrate the topic?
    A. Images are copyright tagged, and non-free images have fair use rationales:
    B. Images are provided where possible and appropriate, with suitable captions:
  7. Overall:
    Pass or Fail:

Congratulations. You now have GA.Pyrotec (talk) 17:26, 28 September 2008 (UTC)

Quote[edit]

I have a rather nice quote at the turn of Ashton's industrial persuits, but I don't know where exactly to put it:

On his tour of northern England in 1849, Scottish publisher Angus Reach said:

In Ashton, too, there lingers on a handful of miserable old men, the remnants of the cotton hand-loom weavers. No young persons think of pursuing such an occupation. The few who practice it were too old and confirmed in old habits, when the power-loom was introduced, to be able to learn a new way of making their bread.[1]

— Angus Reach, Morning Chronicle, 1849

It's probably good stuff for the History section, but I can't see a convenient slot. Perhaps there's something about the transition to manufacturing we could find? Or something about Luddites? --Jza84 |  Talk  23:44, 17 October 2008 (UTC)

How about right after "From 1773 to 1905, 75 cotton mills were established in the town"? Prefaced with a bit about machines over-taking hand-looms? Nev1 (talk) 23:52, 17 October 2008 (UTC)
That sounds quite workable. I'd be happy with that. :) --Jza84 |  Talk  23:56, 17 October 2008 (UTC)
  1. ^ Powell, Rob (1986), In the Wake of King Cotton, Rochdale Art Gallery, p. 35

Sports section[edit]

I'd have commented on this at the FAC, but the chances are I'm the only active editor with the relevant sources. Ashton United, under their previous name Hurst F.C. were a significant club in terms of the development of football in the Manchester area. They were the first team from the Manchester area to win an FA Cup tie, when they beat Turton 3–0 in 1883. In 1885 they were the first winners of the Manchester Cup, beating Newton Heath (who we now know as Manchester United) in the final. (All this can be referenced to James, Gary (2008). Manchester – A Football History. Halifax: James Ward. pp. 33–34. ISBN 978-0-9558127-0-5.) Oldelpaso (talk) 20:38, 31 July 2009 (UTC)

Sounds like good stuff. Why not just add it then? --Malleus Fatuorum 21:04, 31 July 2009 (UTC)
I was about to add it myself (although feel free to do so yourself Oldelpaso, it would clearly help the article), but I'm wondering what's meant by "from Manchester"? Nev1 (talk) 21:11, 31 July 2009 (UTC)
It would be teams who affiliated with the Manchester FA when it formed. In terms of modern day Greater Manchester, Bolton Wanderers won an FA Cup tie earlier than this, but at that time Bolton teams affiliated to the Lancashire FA, and had few links to clubs in Manchester and what we now call Tameside. I've now added it myself, last night fatigue gave me a mental block on how to add it without introducing a dollop of sloppy writing. Hopefully this morning its only marginally sloppy ;) Oldelpaso (talk) 07:55, 1 August 2009 (UTC)
Thanks very much for sorting that out, it reads fine :-) Might it be worth changing "from the Manchester area" (which is a bit ambiguous) to "member of the Manchester Football Association"? Nev1 (talk) 17:04, 2 August 2009 (UTC)
The Manchester FA only formed the following year, so I've changed it to "Of the teams who formed the Manchester Football Association...". Slightly forced, but avoids anachronism. Oldelpaso (talk) 14:53, 3 August 2009 (UTC)

aerial shot[edit]

Ashton under lyne aerial shot.jpg

I took a few snaps of GM while flying into Manchester Airport yesterday, Ashton is one of them. If anyone wants to use it, feel free. The factories on the left are along Globe Street. The centre of the image takes in Ashton and Stalybridge. Parrot of Doom 10:58, 14 June 2010 (UTC)

Location of Ashton[edit]

Is it me or does is it kinda look daft to spell out various distances of Ashton in relation to neighbouring towns? It takes too much space and if someone actually wants to know precisely where Ashton is, they'll use something like Google Maps. Other places across the UK (and Globe) don't go into this detail. I'd leave Manchester in there but the rest, get rid. I just checked out Stalybridge... 6 miles (or 9.7 km) north-west of Glossop. Really? Because Glossop is that well known place. Digg17 (talk) 17:08, 3 February 2014 (UTC)

That's fair enough, I've gone ahead and trimmed the text in line with your suggestion. Nev1 (talk) 19:23, 3 February 2014 (UTC)

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Visit by King George V in 1913[edit]

I have a souvenir of the King's visit on July 12, 1913 that talks about the visit, the town (history, photos, notable mills, advertisements, etc). I ought to scan the pages. In any case, I think it should at least be noted that he visited. Does anybody else have any information about his visit?

Cover of the official souvenir for the royal visit by the King to Ashton-under-Lyne - July 12, 1913

— Preceding unsigned comment added by Digg17 (talkcontribs) 23:54, 8 April 2016 (UTC)

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