Talk:Māui

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On 13 August 2023, it was proposed that this article be moved from Māui (mythology) to Māui. The result of the discussion was moved.

Untitled

"Taranga did not know who he was until she reminded him." Say what? Could someone please figure out who's who and straighten this sentence out? Thanks, LA RoeDoe 14:10, 27 July 2005 (UTC)[reply]

Rewrite

I rewrote the article with sources. It was a bit of a mess because careless editors had intermingled traditions from various islands and countries, eg Hawaiian traditions mixed up with Māori ones. Kahuroa 11:06, 12 April 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Edit

I deleted two of the links because they were no longer valid. (DBOblivion 15:46, 29 September 2006 (UTC))[reply]

Merge?

There are at least five articles about different Maui versions. Is there any way we could merge this article into this page, combining any common parts, and spliting the differences into certain sections? 104.192.129.42 (talk) 20:10, 27 August 2017 (UTC)[reply]

I agree it should be merged and highly recommend it. Maui lacks substantial overarching mythos to have a good article just on his own. Taking the different cultural articles on the character and making them section of this one, i believe, will allow this article and therefore the other to become more fleshed out and all around better more informative article. Big-bad-juju (talk) 15:30, 3 November 2018 (UTC)[reply]

Edits and Merges

I buffed up the general info and intro. I also merged the smaller cultural pages on Maui. I plan on making section for Hawaii and Maori, but since those articles are already fleshed out I will only make small sections for each and link to the existing articles.Big-bad-juju (talk) 02:46, 1 December 2018 (UTC)[reply]

Hello.

I'm from Wallis-and-Futuna islands (or Uvea mo Futuna).

My grandmother told me, when I was a kid, that Tagaloa and one of his kin were out fishing like robbers at night. While Tagaloa was out with his net he asked his mate to keep an eye out for the Sunay catch them stealing,which the other one didn't do.

When the Sun rose, his mate -who had a fishing line with a hook (probably Maui) managed to pull his line back in time with his meal but Tagaloa, whose net was heavy finally decided to leave it in place because of the plentiful fishing he did and fled only to come back at night to harvest.

When he came back, the net had lost some of its preys because there were 4 wholes in it. The remaining fishes had turned into islands and prevented the net from being removed without causing harm to the land created.

He left his net to protect his "biggest catch": his net is our reef barrier, the wholes are the passes and the islands caught are said to be Wallis and its surrounding isles.

What the other 4 fishes became, I cannot remember but other stories say one of these fish became a beautiful lady that would sometimes roam the Ocean to find her lost husband.

When she's tired she just lays down and vanish in the waves.

Some tale also say Hawaii's name was originally Maui because he caught a worm that tried to hide in a cave. The snake was so huge he had to leave it in place - the head is the main island and its scales formed the smaller islands of the Hawaiian archipelago.

It was also said there are wholes in the Ocean that can lead anyone back to Fidji, Vanuatu and even Rapa Nui and that elder Gods used them to keep an eye on the fishes and the lands they believed were theirs.

So Maui is "important" because he's not from mankind but Tagaloa has the same background. Both were elder gods and both were tricking mankind to keep fed - they both protected the results of their deeds as creations, good or bad.

I think that's something people have to know. Heletuusi (talk) 08:26, 10 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Wiki Education Foundation-supported course assignment

This article was the subject of a Wiki Education Foundation-supported course assignment, between 24 August 2018 and 18 December 2018. Further details are available on the course page. Student editor(s): Big-bad-juju. Above undated message substituted from Template:Dashboard.wikiedu.org assignment by PrimeBOT (talk) 04:45, 17 January 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Requested move 13 August 2023

The following is a closed discussion of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on the talk page. Editors desiring to contest the closing decision should consider a move review after discussing it on the closer's talk page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

The result of the move request was: moved. Extraordinary Writ (talk) 23:29, 5 September 2023 (UTC)[reply]

Māui (mythology) → Māui – Per WP:SMALLDETAILS, a disambiguation isn't needed here. The subject of this article is the primary topic, with other articles about Māui referring to his description within specific Polynesian mythologies. Rather than disputing for being the primary, these all help to establish the overarching Māui article as the primary topic for Māui with a macron over the ā (while the island is the primary for Maui without a macron.) This is currently a redirect to this article, but I'd suggest a hatnote for linking to the disambiguation as well for clarity. Turnagra (talk) 05:17, 13 August 2023 (UTC)— Relisting. —usernamekiran (talk) 22:18, 29 August 2023 (UTC)[reply]

Oppose removing the parenthesis will only cause confusion. In ictu oculi (talk) 06:29, 13 August 2023 (UTC)[reply]
In what way? And how would any potential confusion be worse than other current examples of WP:SMALLDETAILS, such as Ice Cube and Ice cube? Turnagra (talk) 07:15, 13 August 2023 (UTC)[reply]
Support as SMALLDETAILS indeed covers this case. Schwede 66 09:01, 13 August 2023 (UTC)[reply]
Support per WP:PRIMARYTOPIC. The SMALLDETAILS rationale is not sufficient, because that only deals with the "Māui" / "Maui" issue. There are, though, four articles that have the macron (the other 3 being Māui (Hawaiian mythology), Māui (Māori mythology) and Māui (Christian convert)), but this article is the primary topic of the four. I don't understand the view that removing the disambiguator will cause confusion – at least, not any more than the many other cases of PRIMARYTOPIC (or of SMALLDETAILS). Nurg (talk) 09:06, 13 August 2023 (UTC)[reply]
Weak oppose the other have nearly as many views (9,634) as this one (10,525) [1]. Crouch, Swale (talk) 18:30, 13 August 2023 (UTC)[reply]

Those 20-day figures are heavily affected by the current wildfires in Maui, and the 9,634 was for the others collectively. For the 12 months to the end of July, this one has 176,000 views, and the nearest other has 61,000. [2]. Nurg (talk) 02:39, 14 August 2023 (UTC)[reply]

Support per nominator. Primary topic with the macron. Add a distinguisher tag at the top for Maui. --Spekkios (talk) 08:19, 14 August 2023 (UTC)[reply]
Support, needless disambiguation. JIP | Talk 10:52, 15 August 2023 (UTC)[reply]
Oppose. Who on earth is going to know which has a macron and which doesn't? More often going to be written without anyway. Our primary aim should be clarity, not dogma. -- Necrothesp (talk) 13:46, 16 August 2023 (UTC)[reply]
Oppose because Maui vs. Māui will be confusing for some. History6042 (talk) 11:40, 17 August 2023 (UTC)[reply]
Comment. Contributors who oppose on the grounds that it will be confusing or unclear would strengthen their case if they explain why they think this article title should be an exception to WP:SMALLDETAILS – the policy for "near-identical expressions". Nurg (talk) 22:28, 17 August 2023 (UTC)[reply]
I think that it should be an exception because some computers can't type ā without copy and pasting. History6042 (talk) 00:02, 18 August 2023 (UTC)[reply]
But the proposal is to remove the disambiguator "mythology", not to remove the macron. Nurg (talk) 00:22, 18 August 2023 (UTC)[reply]
I am aware of that. People will probably type "Maui (mythology)". History6042 (talk) 00:27, 18 August 2023 (UTC)[reply]
If you mean when searching for the article, that will work. They will find it, because "mythology" is used in the article (numerous times), and regardless that the macron is used in the title and throughout the article. Nurg (talk) 00:47, 18 August 2023 (UTC)[reply]
Besides which, I would hope "Maui (mythology)" would stay up as a redirect to whatever name this page ends up with. —VeryRarelyStable 01:15, 18 August 2023 (UTC)[reply]

Because it's far more likely to be seen without the macron and, as I said, clarity should be our first consideration. Disambiguation is supposed to aid readers, not pander to editors who are incapable of using discretion and cannot see past dogma. -- Necrothesp (talk) 10:03, 18 August 2023 (UTC)[reply]
When you mention dogma, are you referring to dogmatic application of policies like WP:SMALLDETAILS and WP:PRIMARYTOPIC, or something else? Nurg (talk) 10:16, 18 August 2023 (UTC)[reply]
Yes, that's exactly what I'm referring to. Inflexibility rather than common sense and an eye to clarity. These guidelines are not inflexible (and are not written as such). Nothing on Wikipedia is inflexible. Everything we do behind the scenes is designed to make things as easy as possible for users. -- Necrothesp (talk) 12:03, 18 August 2023 (UTC)[reply]
Thank you. That gives a better idea of your viewpoint. I see that you have previously supported ditching WP:SMALLDETAILS (aka WP:DIFFCAPS) altogether – but it still stands. I am unfamiliar with the whole debate about this aspect of the policy and still don't understand why this current proposed change would be confusing or unclear, but since WP:SMALLDETAILS still stands, I will follow it until I understand why it might be confusing. Nurg (talk) 02:39, 19 August 2023 (UTC)[reply]

Support per nom. Panamitsu (talk) 07:27, 19 August 2023 (UTC)[reply]

Support. I took a look through Maui and spot-checked a few sources, which have left me convinced that the island's name is never spelled with a macron. Thus, I find myself convinced that WP:SMALLDETAILS is worth following here; a hatnote should suffice to prevent confusion with the island, and I think the this figure is a definite PRIMARYTOPIC over other figures named Māui. ModernDayTrilobite (talk • contribs) 15:32, 21 August 2023 (UTC)[reply]

Note: WikiProject New Zealand has been notified of this discussion. —Usernamekiran_(AWB) (talk) 22:17, 29 August 2023 (UTC)[reply]

Note: WikiProject Polynesia has been notified of this discussion. —Usernamekiran_(AWB) (talk) 22:17, 29 August 2023 (UTC)[reply]

Note: WikiProject Religion has been notified of this discussion. —Usernamekiran_(AWB) (talk) 22:17, 29 August 2023 (UTC)[reply]

Support. WP:SMALLDETAILS and WP:PRIMARYTOPIC are the relevant policies and I'm not convinced there is a case for an exception here. As others have noted, a hatnote on the Maui article should avoid any confusion. Cheers, Chocmilk03 (talk) 23:27, 29 August 2023 (UTC)[reply]
Oppose per In ictu oculi; Crouch, Swale; Necrothesp and History6042. WP:SMALLDETAILS notwithstanding, main title headers which differ from other headers solely via accents, diacritics or punctuation marks are not helpful to users. —Roman Spinner (talk • contribs) 00:44, 30 August 2023 (UTC)[reply]

Support per nominator. Also, discovery and search is not an issue. For example, I reached this page by typing "talk:maui" into the Wikipedia search box Somej (talk) 07:59, 30 August 2023 (UTC)[reply]

The discussion above is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.