Talk:Mahavira

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Untitled[edit]

Mahavira's teachings are more or less duplicated in the Jainism page. We can prune the extra material and keep here only the details that cannot be found on the Jainism page.
Jay 22:32, 13 Aug 2003 (UTC)

I've checked and I don't see an excessive overlap in content, but have moved the Jain prayer section to Jainism. The Teachings section that is here should stay IMO. It covers what Mahavir taught during his lifetime, which is not entirely the same as covering present-day Jain beliefs and practices. Mkweise 04:28, 14 Aug 2003 (UTC)

Where is the anti-idol stuff[edit]

Mahavir was completely against any sort of rituals, idol worship. I don't have any sources so i haven't made any changes. Another interesting fact to note would be that he never intended to create a religion or considered a god. I am jain btw Source http://64.233.179.104/search?q=cache:IAYPsMy31M0J:www.britannica.com/eb/article-59030+site:britannica.com+jainism&hl=en&ct=clnk&cd=4

Overview of Life[edit]

Mahavira was married as per Swetambar belief whereas as per Digambar belief Mhavir never married. Similarly Mahavir was not a son of King Siddharth and Queen Trishla. It is believed that the embryo of Mahavira was transferred from a woman named Devananda to queen Trisala. This was because, as per the jain philosophy, a Tirthankara cannot be born is the Brahmin caste, and since Devananda was a Brahmin, the embryo of Mahavira was transferred.

GA Review[edit]

This review is transcluded from Talk:Mahavira/GA1. The edit link for this section can be used to add comments to the review.

Reviewer: Sainsf (talk · contribs) 04:06, 1 March 2016 (UTC)


An important article and also well-written. Will review. I have suggested copyediting and rewords to improve the look. Sainsf <^>Talk all words 04:06, 1 March 2016 (UTC)

Lead[edit]

Yes check.svg Done Sainsf <^>Feel at home 14:44, 24 March 2016 (UTC)

  • Please do not include citations in the lead. The facts in the lead must all be mentioned in the main text as well - the citations should thus go to the main text.
A few left... Sainsf <^>Talk all words 18:30, 10 March 2016 (UTC)
  • "Tirthankara" should be in italics throughout the article. Either say "Tirthankara" or "tirthankara". Yes check.svg Done-- Pankaj Jain Capankajsmilyo (talk · contribs · count) 08:24, 1 March 2016 (UTC)
  • In general, all non-English words should be in italics. Please check this.
  • You should be consistent in whether you write numbers in digits or words (you say twenty-four, then 30). Numbers less than or equal to ten should be written only in words as per the MoS. Yes check.svg Done-- Pankaj Jain Capankajsmilyo (talk · contribs · count) 08:24, 1 March 2016 (UTC)
  • "has eight cardinal (law of trust) principles, three metaphysical (dravya, jiva and ajiva), and five ethical" --> "has eight cardinal (law of trust), three metaphysical (dravya, jiva and ajiva), and five ethical principles." Yes check.svg Done-- Pankaj Jain Capankajsmilyo (talk · contribs · count) 08:24, 1 March 2016 (UTC)

Etymology[edit]

  • which means the one who grows; Nigaṇṭha means In which language?
  • Sramana Meaning? Italics
  • referred to his clan "refereed"-->"refers"

Historicity[edit]

  • "Western Historians" "H" needs no caps. Could you add an example of these historians?
  • Some Western scholars sounds vague. Could we have some examples?
  • Some Western scholars suggests "suggest" Yes check.svg Done -- Pankaj Jain Capankajsmilyo (talk · contribs · count) 02:53, 3 March 2016 (UTC)
  • died in around 425 BC Remove "in" Yes check.svg Done -- Pankaj Jain Capankajsmilyo (talk · contribs · count) 02:53, 3 March 2016 (UTC)
  • predecessor of Mahavira was --> the predecessor of Mahavira, was Yes check.svg Done -- Pankaj Jain Capankajsmilyo (talk · contribs · count) 02:53, 3 March 2016 (UTC)
  • Mahavira is still sometimes referred to as the founder of Jainism. Source?

Teachings[edit]

Yes check.svg Done -Nimit (talk) 03:35, 25 March 2016 (UTC)

  • I think this section should come after "Life events"
  • Mahavira's teachings form the basis for Jain texts. --> Jain texts are based on Mahavira's teachings
  • five major vows (vratas) I think this should be "(vratas) (vows)" as you should explain "vratas" by "vows", not the other way round. Yes check.svg Done -- Pankaj Jain Capankajsmilyo (talk · contribs · count) 02:54, 3 March 2016 (UTC)
  • If all the teachings are supported by ref. no. 25, simply add it at the end of "...were preached by Mahavira" and remove the other mentions.Yes check.svg Done -- Pankaj Jain Capankajsmilyo (talk · contribs · count) 02:54, 3 March 2016 (UTC)
  • I don't think we need to link "Non violence" after linking "Ahimsa". Same for Aparigraha (Non-possession) Yes check.svg Done -- Pankaj Jain Capankajsmilyo (talk · contribs · count) 02:54, 3 March 2016 (UTC)
  • Follow a common style in the list. All bullets should start like "Ahimsa (Non Violence) - ", "Satya (Truthfulness) -" etc. Yes check.svg Done -- Pankaj Jain Capankajsmilyo (talk · contribs · count) 02:54, 3 March 2016 (UTC)
  • so we should train our minds I think it would be more encyclopedic to say " so one should train their mind". Similarly in the list write "like one expects their own sanctity" This would improve the quality of the text.Yes check.svg Done -- Pankaj Jain Capankajsmilyo (talk · contribs · count) 02:54, 3 March 2016 (UTC)
  • Replace "that way" with "Hence", which sounds better. Yes check.svg Done -- Pankaj Jain Capankajsmilyo (talk · contribs · count) 02:54, 3 March 2016 (UTC)
  • Mahāvīra where else do you write his name like this? Be consistent in how you refer to him.

Life events[edit]

  • to reduce the choppiness, we could combine and write sentences as "Belonging to the Kashyapa Gotra,[9][20] he was born on the thirteenth day of the rising moon of Chaitra in the Vira Nirvana Samvat calendar.[29][30] In the Gregorian calendar, this date falls in March or April and is celebrated as Mahavir Jayanti.[31]"
  • Traditionally, Kundalapura in the ancient city of Vaishali is regarded as his birthplace Earlier you said it is Kundagrama.
  • After his birth, anointment and consecration (abhisheka), carried out by Indra on Mount Meru, the axis of the central cosmic contingent of Jambudvipa, he was given the name Vardhmana. looks confusing, better write "After his birth, anointment and consecration (abhisheka) - carried out by Indra on Mount Meru, the axis of the central cosmic contingent of Jambudvipa - he was given the name Vardhmana."
  • Acharanga should be Acharanga Sutra
  • Vaishali and Parshvanatha are duplinks
  • I am not sure what "lay devotee" means. Does it mean Upāsaka and Upāsikā?
  • "Yashoda" need not be in italics.
  • Any info on where Yashoda came from?
  • Why is "Kundalpur" linked so late? The birthplace is not named similarly in all places.
  • went without clothes --> discarded his clothes
  • is graphic description --> is a graphic description
  • Acharanga Sutra and Vaishali are linked once again
  • Kalpa Sūtra (122) What does "122" mean?
  • twelve and a half --> twelve-and-a-half
  • Can we link Sala-tree and Barakar?
  • Acharanga sutra "S" in caps
  • For a period of 30 years after omniscience --> For a period of 30 years since having gained omniscience
  • According to the tradition Which tradition?
  • Pawapuri and Bihar are duplinks
  • Mahavira attained moksha, i.e. his soul is believed to have become Siddha (soul at its purest form), aged seventy-two --> Mahavira attained moksha - his soul is believed to have become Siddha (soul at its purest form) - at the age of seventy-two
  • According to Mahapurana --> According to the Mahapurana same for Pravachansara
  • only nails and hair of tirthankaras are left behind --> only the nails and hair of tirthankaras are left behind
  • a Jain temple, called Jal Mandir stands --> a Jain temple, called Jal Mandir, stands

Previous births[edit]

  • Why not write "Jinasena's Mahapurana" under Moksha, where it was first mentioned? Anyway, Mahapurana is a duplink here
  • in transmigratory cycle of saṃsāra --> in the transmigratory cycle of the saṃsāra (world)
  • Duplink: Kalpa Sūtra

Influence[edit]

  • You could add a description of Mahatma Gandhi here even if a link is present
  • Before the quote from Tagore, you could add a general line on how Mahavira influenced him and then what he had to say. Also add a word or two on who Tagore is.
  • Jain Poet Bhagchand Poet should not be in caps
  • Acharya Samantabhadra Why in italics?
  • Sixty-four verses Why caps?
  • Vardhamāna Mahāvīra Inconsistency in referring to Mahavira
  • of Nirvana of Mahavira --> of the Nirvana of Mahavira
  • Duplinks: mendicants, Digambara, Saṃsāra

Iconography[edit]

  • These emblem Plural
  • Mahavira is depicted having --> Mahavira is depicted as having
  • A word or two about Srivatsa?
  • Temples dedicated to Mahavira :- --> Temples dedicated to Mahavira include:
  • Source for "Temples"?
  • Kulpakji Jain temple, Pawapuri Jain temple Locations?
  • Captions:
  • The highest known image of Lord Mahāvīra (in seated position) Would be interesting if you could add the height
  • "Kankali Tila" is in italics at one place and not in italics in another
  • Mahavira Idol dated 1470 No caps in "Idol". 1470 CE/BC?

In popular culture[edit]

  • No source?
  • Could you add a line about the role of Mahavira in the movie? Or is the teacher just a namesake?

@Capankajsmilyo: Please continue with the issues here and at Talk:Digambara/GA1. I am tracking the changes and will mark the sections we are done with. Sainsf <^>Talk all words 05:15, 5 March 2016 (UTC)

@Capankajsmilyo: I have updated his page and done some ce in the article. Ref. 36 has a problem, please fix it soon. Sainsf <^>Talk all words 18:30, 10 March 2016 (UTC)

Urgent update[edit]

@Capankajsmilyo: and @जैन: This article is indeed a good work but Earwig's copyvio detector shows 85.3% possibility of copyvio from [[1]]. The article may need major rewording. Sainsf <^>Talk all words 12:25, 19 March 2016 (UTC)

@Sainsf: Many websites copy content from Wiki and this is just one example. -Nimit (talk) 17:11, 20 March 2016 (UTC)
Nimit, this is quite true, and indeed that site was a virtual copy of our article as it stood on April 3, 2015 (two days before that sohansinghpurohit site updated that article on April 5, 2015). However, I do find what I believe is overly close paraphrasing of reference 24 (http://www.fas.harvard.edu/~pluralsm/affiliates/jainism/article/mahavira1.htm) in the final paragraph of the Teachings section. Compare the following (bold indicates identical text with the article; italics indicates a variant form of a word):
  • Source: Pursuit of pleasure as an endless game
  • Article: Mahavira also taught that pursuit of pleasure is an endless game
  • Source: mental poise and spiritual balance. A voluntary limitation of property is community virtue which results in social justice and fair distribution of utility commodities. The strong and the rich should not weed out the weak and the poor
  • Article: mental poise and spiritual balance. One should voluntarily limit acquisition of property as a community virtue which results in social justice and fair distribution of utility commodities. The strong and the rich should not try to suppress the weak and the poor
  • Source: Any attempt to enforce these qualities by an external and legal authority, either on the individual or society, will lead to hypocrisy or secret criminal tendencies.
  • Article: Attempting to enforce these five qualities by an external and legal authority leads to hypocrisy or secret criminal tendencies.
This does need to be fixed. BlueMoonset (talk) 18:03, 20 March 2016 (UTC)
@BlueMoonset: Thank you for pointing out. Will fix it soon.-Nimit (talk) 18:09, 20 March 2016 (UTC)

@जैन:, @BlueMoonset: Thanks. I needed to ensure this is no copyvio; I was not able to perform a deep check immediately. However, we have similar issues at Talk:Jain monasticism/GA1. Sainsf <^>Feel at home 03:41, 21 March 2016 (UTC)

Sainsf, thanks for pointing out the copyvio issues with Talk:Jain monasticism/GA1; they were quite serious, and I had to remove large chunks of the article to remove the copyvio sections. (They were introduced into the article by an inexperienced Wikipedian on February 20, 2012, and went unnoticed until now.) I've pinged Nikkimaria to make sure there aren't any other issues. BlueMoonset (talk) 04:31, 21 March 2016 (UTC)

Done[edit]

@Sainsf I guess all the points you mentioned have been resolved now. Can you please have a relook. -- Pankaj Jain Capankajsmilyo (talk · contribs · count) 05:41, 5 April 2016 (UTC)

@Capankajsmilyo: Marvelous! All the issues appear resolved now. I am really impressed by all the proper italics and helpful definitions for the foreign terms. It is good that you initiated a discussion on italics for "Mahavira", it is not a GA issue and can take its time for the discussion. Just a few final comments: Sainsf <^>Feel at home 08:08, 5 April 2016 (UTC)
  • I think at least in some cases the numbers in the lead should be in digits. It will appear less wordy. "seventy-two", for example, will look better as "72".
  • Under Biographies, Other texts including Kalpa Sūtra describe the life of Mahavira appears unsourced.
  • Source(s) for the Temples section?
Cleared @Sainsf -- Pankaj Jain Capankajsmilyo (talk · contribs · count) 08:38, 5 April 2016 (UTC)

Thank you. I believe this article is ready for promotion. Really glad to pass this. Cheers! Sainsf <^>Feel at home 08:47, 5 April 2016 (UTC)

Thanks a lot....My first GA. -- Pankaj Jain Capankajsmilyo (talk · contribs · count) 08:57, 5 April 2016 (UTC)