Talk:Quran

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Compilation[edit]

Line 4 " Thus, a group of scribes, most importantly Zayd, collected the verses and produced a hand-written manuscript of the complete book" Line 9 "Thus, within 20 years of Muhammad's death, the Quran was committed to written form"

The problem here is that hand written "complete" manuscript was already written by Zaid, the second one "uthman manuscript" copied from the first and added vocalization. So it didnt take 20 years for the Quran to be comitted to written form.


Away from what is said . existing scripts that are adopted by AlAzhar Alsharif to be authentic are as follow:


-Seventh Century, second half : ( Sanaa script-first group)document name :DAM 01-27.01. written in 22 letter no-punctuation Arabic dialect of the Syriac/Aramaic and Birmingham or( Mingana Islmic Arabic 1572a).

-Eight Century :(Sanaa script, fourth group)or (DAM20-33.01)and the British (Ms.Or.2165) and Samarkand .

-Ninth Century: Cairo ( Mushaf Al mashhad Al huseini) and Tub Kabi (H.S. 44/32)

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TEU6knDtTSc. Syr10


This section "compilation" present this statement: (According to Shia, Ali ibn Abi Talib (d. 661) compiled a complete version of the Quran shortly after Muhammad's death. The order of this text differed from that gathered later during Uthman's era in that this version had been collected in chronological order. Despite this, he made no objection against the standardized Quran and accepted the Quran in circulation).

The statement is missing the rest of Ali Ibn Abi Talib saying , Chronological order of Qur'aan is the way to avoid misinterpreting Qur'an. It worthwhile also to explain that what was called Uthman codex , is only a postulate even at Sunni Islam , where I believe read in the standard Qur'an introduction saying , it is "believed to be" 'Uthman codex, without any further claims that there is actually a proof to be Uthman's , as Muslims themselves have other stories saying Uthman's collection is actually burned. Syr10

Arabic-only discussion[edit]

During prayers, the Quran is recited only in Arabic

Is there an article with more explanation about this? I notice a lot of focus on this in places like http://www.inquiryintoislam.com/2010/11/12-you-must-read-quran-in-arabic.html but I am wondering which passages actually talk about this. Like does the Quran itself mention "no translating this into other languages" or "only use Arabic to pray" or does this come from later Hadith or something? An article about this (or a redirect to a section explaining it) would be helpful. Ranze (talk) 03:08, 1 April 2016 (UTC)


This issue is very much political and non religious. as the existing print of Qur'an uses modern 28 letters Alphabet ( created by Abu-Alaswad Al Du'aali) after the revelation and not before( https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Abu_al-Aswad_al-Du%27ali).

  • In prophet Mohamad time , an Arabic dialect of Syriac /Aramaic, a 22 letters Alphabet, spoken south of Iraq and Syria , is what used to document the oldest know Sanaa script.
  • look at Ibn Hazm (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ibn_Hazm#Language) , saying Hebru ,Arabic and Syriac are one language.
  • the modern known Qur'an at it's best is a translation from 22 letters Alphabet to 28 letters Alphabet.

For example , the word (infidels -"ALKAFIRIN")is not used in the TAUBA surah in the oldest San'aa script, while it is added in the existing adopted version of Qur'an. the word has very much political function.

A make sense attitude of Muslims, would be adopting the oldest known script, at it's original shape, rather than submitting to political leaders in saying we are adding only punctuations. And if you can not understand the dialect of Sana'a script then why you do not bother learning such dialect of the most holly book as communicated in the time of prophet Mohammad , instead of submitting to political leaders. The other option would be adopting the collection of Ali-Ibnabi talib who was the authority behind asking Abu-Alaswad to punctuate the Aramaic alphabet and to move to new one.

Ali IbnAbi talib was not only known for his refined language but he was an author of the book Nahj-Al-balagha (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nahj_al-Balagha)  which is something similar to Shakespeare works in the English literature. this book  replaced for Ali followers the contradicted literature of ( Hadith) and elevated the level of ethical values, away  from the Nomadic one . In Nahg Al Balagha , one will read the word ( Watan , meaning the home land) something never never comprehended by the nomads and never used in the Arabic language until the 20th century. The immediate effect of NahjAlbalagha among the believers , is peaceful communities in general. Syr10

The Quran was revealed in Arabic. Any translation is actually an interpretation and not the actual Quran. Therefore if you recite a translation you have actually recited something other than the Quran. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Abirfaisal (talkcontribs) 14:52, 31 May 2016 (UTC)

Which Arabic? The one written in 22 non punctuated letters like in Sanaa Quraan ? or the 28 letters , appeared some 100 years after the profit Mohamad time.Syr10

There should be no 'U' in 'Qur'an'. When I entered 'U' into the Arabic keyboard I got the Arabic equivalent. There is no 'U' in Qibla, Qatar or al-Qaeda. The Koran has been hacked into.[edit]

[1]American Journalism Review , editorial assistant Andy Zieminski, Ray Hanani, Palestinian American Freelance Columnist, downloaded Thursday 9 June 2016. There should be no 'U' in 'Qur'an'. Despite this, when I entered 'U' into the Arabic keyboard I got the Arabic equivalent. There is no 'U' in Qibla, Qatar or al-Qaeda. There are professional hackers backdating to Prophet Mohammed's or Prophet Muhammad's lifetime, causing him immense pain when receiving messages from al-lah (the al-) God (lah), deity) when memorising and recording the Koran. This is also linked to the reasons why Prophet Mohammad was requested to change the direction of prayer from the Dome of the Rock Jerusalem, to Mecca Saudi Arabia, Petra etcetera. I believe Petra where there was an earthquake causing the Qibla to be moved to Mecca is the final resting place, but I cannot confirm. Please check on the 'U" and "u", ALSO IN RELATION TO THE ARABIC COUNTERPARTS.

This is the English Wikipedia, we use English keyboards, and we name articles in the English Wikipedia according to how the topic is most commonly referred to in reliable English-language sources. ~Amatulić (talk) 05:41, 24 June 2016 (UTC)

References

  1. ^ Halim Lliasi's 'variously in the same volume M.A. Haleem Elliasii The Holy Qur-'aan with an apostrophe and 2 a's, Roman Transliteration of The Holy Qur'an With Arabic Text. English Translation by Abdullah Yusuf Ali, 8th revised edition April 2002 Christian calendar

Lepore textbook update[edit]

A while back in the archives an IP user posted that a history textbook by Jill Lepore had a sentence that posited that Arabian sailors never attempted to cross the Atlantic because the Quran forbids travel beyond the Mediterranean (Encounters in the New World, 2000, ISBN 0-19-515491-6; pp. 14-15). The user said they contacted Lepore to get a source or verse on this and did not get a reply. I am wondering if there has been any update, or if not, whether anybody would be interested in attempting to contact Lepore again. If you wish to do so, please wait a couple days and then post here before sending the email. SamuelRiv (talk) 01:47, 13 June 2016 (UTC)

Inimitability[edit]

Inimitability presented almost as a circulated and agreed upon fact , and to present the statement correctly , Why not giving an example. case study from SORAT "Al Nisaa"

( http://www.holyquran.net/cgi-bin/prepare.pl?ch=4) .

(http://islam101.com/quran/yusufAli/QURAN/4.htm).

If a man dies and has four daughters, living parents and a wife . how shall the inheritance be handled according to Sorat Al Nisaa:

- The four daughters receive two thirds. The parents receive one third ( one sixth each).AlNisaa/11 ( Women/11).

- one eighth goes to the wifeAlNisaa/12 ( Women/12). Total 112.5% Is not that similar to Jesus feeding hundreds of people out of one loaf of bread.

Syr10

History[edit]

The article says: The Quran describes Muhammad as "ummi",[38] which is traditionally interpreted as "illiterate,"

The statement need further research into the Aramaic sources of Qur'an, with good reason knowing that San'aa copy of Quran was written in 22 letters alphabet , which is what Syriac /Aramaic is. In Aramaic ummi comes from the word mother , and the word mother is the source not only of life but knowledge, meaning Ummi refer to the literate rather than the illiterate .If this was the case , anyone may imagine what kind of damage , the Arab illiterate tribes inflicted on their own holly book.

Qur'an can not be studied without section dedicated to Aramaic relation to the book.

The lingual contents of Qur'aan hold an Aramaic wording roots , which in turn rooted in Babylon and Sumerian dialects , similar to English or Spanish languages having Latin roots.

  • For example we will mention here some names in English and in brackets the Arabic and Babylonian spell . February ( Shbat/Shbatu) , March (Adar/Adaru), April ( Nissan/Nissanu) May ( Ayar/Ayaru) , June (Haziran /Simanu) ,July ( tamuz in Arabic/Tamuz in Babylon/ Damuzi in Sumerian), August (Aab/Abu), September ( Aylul/Aylulo)...

preserving wording roots in the modern languages, is the most important aspect of literal character , beauty and functionality. While it's expected from a Spanish teacher to teach Latin roots to help students better understand how to use and practice their lingual skills. It is quite the opposite in Arabic in general and in Qur'anic Arabic, as part of certain political and religious views. Arabic was introduced as the language of God and of those living in heaven, arriving at a result that this language was found before any other language and as a result, Arabic words have no roots in the Arabic dictionary.

In short, this view simply resulted in a non-functioning language and society. For example the term ( hoor el aein ) was presented in wholly Qur'an as a reward from God to believers after death. Such reward was communicated among Arabs, in what they call literature, as beautiful girls with big eyes, while the Aramaic root to the word simply means sweat grapes, making their heaven, the place that is full of what may send you to hell, simply because the connection between the reason and the result was linguistically broken by dropping the lingual roots including any and all civil history , literature and music.Syrian10

https://www.amazon.com/Quran-Misinterpreted-Mistranslated-Misread-Language/dp/0977860698#reader_0977860698.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ap_IA-aFUXE.Syrian10

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lk40dR8UpaU.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Syro-Aramaic_Reading_of_the_Koran.



also history section mentions the Cave of Hira (Islamic tradition relates that Muhammad received his first revelation in the Cave of Hira ) , the name in Arabic is actually the cave of Harra'a rather than Hira.


Syr10

Bible[edit]

The article states with "citation needed":

"The Quran speaks well[citation needed] of the relationship it has with former books (the Torah and the Gospels) and attributes their similarities to their unique origin and saying all of them have been revealed by the one God"

The statement is misleading, because the more correct citation would be quite the opposite because Muslims and the overwhelming majority of Islamic literature believe that the former books that Islam approve are not what is in circulation today and what is in circulation is no more than modified literature, prohibited from entering or circulating in many Muslim countries.

There is something in  Islam called ( AL TAKIA),  which means speak and appear well,( or be politically correct)  especially when arguing with al Nasara ( Christians ) and Jews, regardless of what you believe in, what may have been the reason for this article to arrive at it's conclusion but with doubt and citation needed .  

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Islamic_view_of_the_Christian_Bible

  • Muslim relation to others is based on two principals,

First submission of others is the final goal including conversion or paying Al-Jizia ( penalty of not converting to Islam ). Second , any land Muslims arrive at becomes muslim land ( and their invasion is called Fatih , meaning opened by the will of God) the people of such occupied land will be automatically considered occupiers. look at the article of Caliph Abdul Malik Ibn Marouan "https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Abd_al-Malik_ibn_Marwan". where the Caliph is described to see the Syrian Christians as occupiers , even though they were native Syrians and they were still majority. .....

(O, my little son, thou hast no understanding. Verily he was right, and he was prompted to a worthy work. For he beheld Syria to be a country that had long been occupied by the Christians, and he noted there are beautiful churches still belonging to them, so enchantingly fair, and so renowned for their splendour, as are the Church of the Holy Sepulchre, and the churches of Lydda and Edessa. So he sought to build for the Muslims a mosque that should be unique).

  • Quran approves the Bedouin literature of the bible (http://www.chabad.org/library/article_cdo/aid/477185/jewish/Why-Is-There-So-Much-War-and-Violence-in-Torah.htm ), in what seems to be an alliance of the Bedouin offspring of Able, given the right from God to not only steal civil cities and farms of civil neighbors, but to wipe them out . Islam approve any Bedouin attack on civil cities even if done by Bedouin Jews, : "يَا قَوْمِ ادْخُلُوا الأَرْضَ المُقَدَّسَةَ الَّتِي كَتَبَ اللَّهُ لَكُمْ وَلاَ تَرْتَدُّوا عَلَى أَدْبَارِكُمْ فَتَنقَلِبُوا خَاسِرِينَ ".(SORAh ALMAIDA,20&21) : Remember Moses said to his people: "O my people! Call in remembrance the favour of Allah unto you, when He produced prophets among you, made you kings, and gave you what He had not given to any other among the peoples.21. "O my people! Enter the holy land which Allah hath assigned unto you, and turn not back ignominiously, for then will ye be overthrown, to your own ruin).
  • Quran at the same time not only disapprove the civil literature of the bible, but assumes God is leading a proxy war on those "who call themselves" Christians to make them hate and kill each other. Same Sourah , ALMAIDA. 14 : " وَمِنَ الَّذِينَ قَالُواْ إِنَّا نَصَارَى أَخَذْنَا مِيثَاقَهُمْ فَنَسُواْ حَظًّا مِّمَّا ذُكِّرُواْ بِهِ فَأَغْرَيْنَا بَيْنَهُمُ الْعَدَاوَةَ وَالْبَغْضَاء إِلَى يَوْمِ الْقِيَامَةِ وَسَوْفَ يُنَبِّئُهُمُ اللَّهُ بِمَا كَانُواْ يَصْنَعُونَ ". (http://islam101.com/quran/yusufAli/QURAN/5.htm )(14. From those, too, who call themselves Christians, We did take a covenant, but they forgot a good part of the message that was sent them: so we estranged them, with enmity and hatred between the one and the other, to the day of judgment. And soon will Allah show them what it is they have done ).

Syr10

Encouragement for the sciences[edit]

Ibn Khadoun (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ibn_Khaldun) defended Islam in it's religious aspect , but with firm quotes of Arabs as barbaric tribes , if went through a country , they will leave it with destruction. Twice in the section mentioned Ibn AlHaitham to be Muslim scientist, presenting The Islamic background and Qur'an to be his encouraging cultural reserve and the reason to be who he was. To not mislead the reader it is very important to know that

most of his 237 books were lost in the "Islamic scientific environment".
and that he acted as a crazy man to reclaim some of his freedom from the (governor in the name of God in Egypt).

http://kenanaonline.com/users/mhae2016/posts/399007.

his story , along with many other mistreated scientist is very similar to scientists in the middle ages of Europe. Ib Alhaitham is an Iraqui , traveled to Egypt , in both countries science is deeply rooted before Islam. Environment that had no scientific or civil history, like the Arabian peninsula has not made any advance after Islam, produced no scientists ,  meaning Islam was not the reason behind scientific work in countries like Egypt ,Syria or Iraq.

take any scientist or philosopher from the Islamic controlled countries , and you will see the dark ages of Europe . take for example Ibn Rushd described to be the introducer of secularity to Europe, definitely out of his sufferings of the rigid ,backward religious Islamic political control . (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Averroes)where you may read for example :

.... (Then a number of his enemies in Cordoba, who were jealous of him and were competing with him both in knowledge and nobility, went to Yaqub al-Mansur with excerpts of Abu Walid's work on some old philosophers which were in his own handwriting. They took one phrase out of context that said: "and it was shown that Venus is one of the Gods" and presented it to the king who then summoned the chiefs and noblemen of Córdoba and said to Abu al-Walid in front of them "Is this your handwriting?". Abu al-Walid then denied and the king said "May God curse the one who wrote this" and ordered that Abu al-Walid be exiled and all the philosophy books to be gathered and burned...And I saw, when I was in Fes, these books being carried on horses in great quantities and burned).....
  • Take another scientist : Alkindi, another example of the dark ages (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Al-Kindi#Life}:we read about him in Wikipedia the following....." especially of al-Mutawakkil (r. 847–861), al-Kindi's star waned. There are various theories concerning this: some attribute al-Kindi's downfall to scholarly rivalries at the House of Wisdom; others refer to al-Mutawakkil’s often violent persecution of unorthodox Muslims (as well as of non-Muslims); at one point al-Kindi was beaten and his library temporarily confiscated.Henry Corbin, an authority on Islamic studies, says that in 873, al-Kindi died "a lonely man" Syrian10
  • Al-Biruni also mentioned twice in the article as an example of Islam encouraging science , let us go to the Wikipedia article on Al-Biruni :(https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Al-Biruni#Life) to read the following :.........

"An example of Al-Biruni’s analysis is his summary of why many Hindus hate Muslims. He explains that Hinduism and Islam are totally different from each other. Moreover, Hindus in 11th century India had suffered through waves of destructive attacks on many of its cities, and Islamic armies had taken numerous Hindu slaves to Persia which, claimed Al-Biruni, contributed to Hindus becoming suspicious of all foreigners, not just Muslims. Hindus considered Muslims violent and impure, and did not want to share anything with them." .

  • The article states: "The philosopher Muhammad Iqbal, considered the Quran's methodology and epistemology to be empirical and rational.[84]".

also "The astrophysicist Nidhal Guessoum while being highly critical of pseudo-scientific claims made about the Quran, has highlighted the encouragement for sciences that the Quran provides by developing "the concept of knowledge.".[81] He writes: "The Qur'an draws attention to the danger of conjecturing without evidence ".

......very strong statements that can be easily contested  as in the story of (Isra'a/ The night trip )profit Mohamad was physically flying  through seven skies,  his tool was a donkey-mule  like creature from heaven named  ( AlBuraq) . The profit claimed no divine nature, nor the seven skies were defined, The story did not forget certain physical details like the profit tying the donkey at the site of his prayer in Jerusalem at al-Aqsa , however there was nothing at that time (621 AD) called Al-Aqsa as the primary site for prayer was built later by Khalif Umar , and the story itself was a replica   from what is considered ( Aauthan /Idols beliefs or religions worship stones and rocks) .The night trip story of Isra'a,utilizing same flying donkey like creature,   was a replica from Zradasht  /Zoroastrianism which is a prohibited religion in Islam . (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Zoroastrianism )  . Logic is broken here to the extent that symbolism can not be claimed to survive scientific questioning , rationality or"conjecturing without evidence" .The worst here is that the verse of Isra's in Qura'an is a Mekah verse ( from the first chronological half of the revelation) , the half that is aligned with the civil , spiritual , non nomadic style of literature, which raise the question of this verse being incorrectly claimed  or lingual modified to become non symbolic physical trip to the skies.Syrian10
  • interest in science is definitely a social , non religious product . over 1000 years before Islam , we may read the following about Ashurbanipal (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ashurbanipal#Art_and_culture) : "Ashurbanipal was proud of his scribal education. He asserts this in the statement: “I Assurbanipal within [the palace], took care of the wisdom of Nebo, the whole of the inscribed tablets, of all the clay tablets, the whole of their mysteries and difficulties, I solved.”.[17] He was one of the few kings who could read the cuneiform script in Akkadian and Sumerian, and claimed that he even read texts from before the great flood. He was also able to solve mathematical problems. During his reign, he collected cuneiform texts from all over Mesopotamia, especially Babylonia, in the library of Nineveh." .AshureBanipal is famous for his letter to governers of the area around 700 BC to collect every tablet or writing in science or literature to be sent to him to add to the central library.
  • In comparison what happened after Islam to Syria , Iraq, Persia and Egypt being controlled by caliph came from the Arabic peninsula ? the most important subject for Muslim Kaliph would be getting more women slaves or intertainment .( https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Harun_al-Rashid#Popular_culture_and_references) .what we read: "In Charles Dickens' 1842 travelogue, American Notes for General Circulation, he compares American supporters of slavery to the "Caliph Harun al-Rashid in his angry robe of scarlet".

Syr10

Text and arrangement[edit]

The section "text and arrangements" states the following : "The Muqattaʿat (Arabic: حروف مقطعات ‎‎ ḥurūf muqaṭṭaʿāt "disjoined letters" or "disconnected letters";[70] also "mysterious letters"). .............The original significance of the letters is unknown. "

  • It is important to know that the practice of utilizing such method of introduction letters , was an Aramaic one, where each letter refers to a number , and the total is added in a way only the literate will know what it refers to. for example , The great God Eil was referred to by the number 3600 etc.
  • The role of these numbers is to provide the receiver with check digits,( similar to the check digits technique utilized today between communicating computers to authenticate the message), to find out if the content was modified by any messenger or not ( obviously this will only work using the original 22 letters alphabet ,seen in Sanaa Qur'an). Qur'an asserts this fact by one verse of the creator saying: "we created the Qur'an and we are making it self preserved انا خلقنا القران و انا له لحافظون " . From this point on , we may easily find out that the original message revealed to profit Mohammad is in fact the 29 Surahs introduced and protected by check digits . The additions that Arabs may have tried to create on their own afterward , to leave the world with all the mess and backward values of their own , in the name of God , In one example of their behavior we mention here the incident of profit Mohamad asking them for a pen before death and his fellows led by Omar refusing and saying , the profit is sick leave him alone.

There is enough literature out there on the subject worth to learn about. This issue is actually another reason to find out how much Bedouin Arabs insulted a holly book , by cutting it's roots out of history, literature and civil Aramaic history, only to arrive at the result :( we really do not know what these letters mean, however we will continue to repeat them like parrots to the end of time).

Syr10

Calligraphy -History section[edit]

The Calligraphy illustrated at the history section reveals very important issue recording the verse of (Alfatiha prayer), which is the introduction prayer before any work or speech and the most repeated words ever by Muslims.

  • Alfatiha as we know it today says referring to two different groups of people " Bismillah ......Grant us the straight path , the path of those blessed by you , not those who are being inflicted with anger ..". ( we may understand here those to be the offspring of Able as mentioned in Cain and Able story, versus those inflicted by anger , the offspring of the guilty farmer Cain ).
  • The words appear on the Calligraphy did not group people but instead used the language of civil common good: "Bismillah .....Grant us the straight path, the path you grant to those who never anger you ".

While Muslims state not even a word can be modified from the time of revelation until the end of time , we find in this example not only different wording , but different meaning, and different rooting to the main core religious story of Cain and Able, for who draws the straight path ? and who says what the straight path is?

  • In today's prayer, human follows his own will in drawing the path and then gets blessed by God . While what we see on the Calligraphy means ,God himself draws the path and then leads human to it as part or an aspect of the blessings .
  • Today's prayer is in alignment with today's Bedouin understanding of Cain and Able, as mentioned in the old testament and in the 28 letters alphabet Quran ,where the offspring of Bedouin Able choose there life style and their blood shedding sacrifices and gifts to God (which is for them the right path) and then expects and gets the God blessings and all the needed excuses.
  • The Calligraphy is clearly based on the logic of common good , not on the good for the chosen people , the offspring of Bedouin Able. It is also in alignment with Christian prayer " ... and forgive our sins ... as much we forgive others " also based on the logic of common good.

When profit Mohamad once asked who is actually gets God's blessing, his answer was, while looking east :" on your right there are Yaman ( the area of the country Yaman) those are blessed . On your left there are Al-Sham ( the Aramaic area of the Levant ) those are blessed ". They then asked him how about the Arabs ( the Bedouin desert area of the Arabic peninsula) , the profit said :Araabs are the worst of the worst (Al ashaddu Nifakan). Yet for some reason , Muslims seem to be following the Arabs in every religious detail, No difference than Jews and Christians departing from the original civil core of the 10 commandments and the new testament to the Bedouin core and literature implemented thereafter.

  • Note : The Calligraphy uses letter (S) as in Aramaic ( ص) for (path الصراط )not as in 28 letters made up later Arabic (س).

Syr10

The Woman in Qur'an and Bible correlation[edit]

The article did not address the Qur'an view of the Woman, a subject that usually makes the core of understanding any culture.

  • Beside virgin Mary, the woman in Qur'an is a source of impurity and reason for why human left God's paradise after the sin of Eve listening to the snake and enticing Adam .
  • On the other hand, the civil story of the the woman observed in the previous Aramaic religions , the woman (Aunah/ the mother of all) is the source of life granted to Ba'al , to lift him out of the dark and suffering , after defeating and killing the seven heads snake .( a continuing story of Saint George on his horse in Christianity , and of (AL khedir/the green) story told by non Arab, Syrian Muslims).
  • In the Bedouin version of the snake story, The snake's evil will passes to the woman causing the man's fall into the sin , guilt and impurity. In the civil Aramaic version , the snake is killed by the man, the man however gets exhausted and helpless until granted life and strength by the woman who become the pure virgin, mother of all in Aramaic, the pure protected in Moses tables "the non Bedouin Moses of 1592BC", the pure virgin mother of God in Christianity, and the pure virgin mother of Jesus in the 29 check digits Sourahs of QURAN or in other words the non Bedouin part of Quran (example the Sourah of Mary starts with check digits KHAIES كهيعص ).

This correlation opens again the door to discovering that, beside Virgin Mary, the woman in Quran is the product of the Arab Bedouin culture in the Arabic peninsula, before anything else.

Quran does not use the word ( person ) , but ( man , meaning the male instead) .. example : Prayer rules apply to Men in the desert like saying ( never approach a prayer if you were drunk, touched a woman , or just came back from the feces.... you first need to clean yourself with water or ,if not found, sand ).

Women/43" .... Approach not prayers with a mind befogged, until ye can understand all that ye say,- nor in a state of ceremonial impurity (Except when travelling on the road), until after washing your whole body. If ye are ill, or on a journey, or one of you cometh from offices of nature, or ye have been in contact with women, and ye find no water, then take for yourselves clean sand or earth, and rub therewith your faces and hand..."

  • Note the English translation of Qur'an , clearly follows a Shakespearian language , that is understandable , even though translation shall be intended to clarify things not put it in a form that might need another translation... what is new here is (cometh from the offices of nature ? for coming from feces ). That is Inimitable. look how the translation will look using Bing translation (يَا أَيُّهَا الَّذِينَ آمَنُواْ لاَ تَقْرَبُواْ الصَّلاةَ وَأَنتُمْ سُكَارَى حَتَّىَ تَعْلَمُواْ مَا تَقُولُونَ وَلاَ جُنُبًا إِلاَّ عَابِرِي سَبِيلٍ حَتَّىَ تَغْتَسِلُواْ وَإِن كُنتُم مَّرْضَى أَوْ عَلَى سَفَرٍ أَوْ جَاءَ أَحَدٌ مِّنكُم مِّن الْغَائِطِ أَوْ لامَسْتُمُ النِّسَاء فَلَمْ تَجِدُواْ مَاء فَتَيَمَّمُواْ صَعِيدًا طَيِّبًا فَامْسَحُواْ بِوُجُوهِكُمْ وَأَيْدِيكُمْ إِنَّ اللَّهَ كَانَ عَفُوًّا غَفُورًا)(O ye who believe, pray and come not near you drunk so you know what you are saying and no side except for trespassers even washed and if you are sick or on a journey, or one of you came from faeces or guys come into contact with women, you don't find water, good at the emptiness they wash with clean sand or earth faces and hands that God was oops forgiving ).The Bing clearly looses coherence of meaning in using the word trespassers, however, it shows how the translators of Quran altered the words of feces to become the offices of nature and how they used the approach of explanation rather than translation in saying "in the state of ceremonial impurity" , something strictly prohibited by Quran .

Syr10

Ethico-religious concepts[edit]

This title in the article is not scratching the surface of what could be better researched here. better understanding of the title may be reached by creating two new titles , Life and death in Quran and Family and The tribe in Quran. without understanding these two subjects , we may not understand the Ethical-religious concepts.

  • Clues exists that what is considered the pillar of Islam today is not relevant to Mohamad massage. Bedouin Arabs simply made their own afterwards. Muslims today pray five times a day, as a must not as a choice. Hadith by Anas Ibn Malik . the first companion to profit Mohamad said on prayer that he prayed on sunset ( once a day).
  • (أخرج أحمد في المسند، والبغوي في شرح السنة، والبوصيري في مختصر الإتحاف، والمقدسي في الأحاديث المختارة، بأسانيدهم عن أنس قال: "ما أعرف فيكم اليوم شيئاً كنتُ أعهده على عهد رسول الله غير قولكم: لا إله إلا الله. قال: فقلت: يا أبا حمزة، الصلاة؟ قال: قد صليت حين تغرب الشمس، )


Syr10

Family In Quran[edit]

The family in Quran is the tribe. The inheritance of a man after death, for example, goes to his family which is his father , mother , kids and in separate assessment the wife.

The wife in Sharia law ,after the death of her husband , needs the permission of the grandfather to travel with her kids or do anything with their belongings.If the grandfather was deceased, then the rights goes to the uncle and if no uncle it goes to the Judge which is the Judge of the immediate tribe or the super tribe ( AL Khilafa, where all Muslims are brothers) .

The woman is simply hired by the big family , the tribe, to produce kids. For such hire , the man shall pay actual price of assets to the woman Father or legal guardian , such price called "Mahr or down pay مقدم ". If the man decided to divorce, he needs no court , he shall only say " you are divorced " returning the woman to her guardian , however , such return requires him to pay another price or fee called " Muakharمؤخر " .The marriage contract is a hire contract not a partnership one, where the man is required to pay a monthly compensation for satisfying the living needs of the woman for food, cloth and expense of the living space , stressing she is not an equal partner with the man. The man may hire up to four Muslim women at a time under marriage contract ( literally , the correct translation is the MATING CONTRACT, عقد النكاح) , and as many as needed from Non Muslim women under the ownership contract of " Mulk AL Yamin " meaning what owned by own efforts .

  • The relation of the woman with the tribe, is not secured through the husband , the mate, but through the son. her name actually changes to be " Mrs mother of Ali for example, الست ام علي" . Her share of dead husband inheritance is one eight ( that is not part of the 100% shares of the family) , however her share of a dead son inheritance is one quarter. That answers the question of why woman dos not rebel on such insecure family relation , where her position in the tribe, is later escalated and earned to a strong one being the mother of an adult male in the family " the tribe".

Syr10

Eschatology, Life and death in Qur'an[edit]

The Eschatology section , while well addressed from analytical aspect , it does not address where the Quranic view stands in human history, nor the function of the Quranic view in driving human culture.

  • From analytical point we may never finish gathering all the views recorded throughout history or suggested by philosophers ,thinkers and profits, however human history may be classified into few general trends.
  • First in early history, appeared the tribal Bedouin or nomadic views of life, where human personality is part of the tribe like a cell in human body. The connection among the tribal members is based on blood relation and primitive chain of command. The tribe may establish rules and methods for members to help each other securing food to all , however , asking a member to fight to death is something else , while important for the survival of the tribe , it does not answer the question of why any member shall choose to pay the ultimate price. A reward has to be offered and it shall be in a material form like providing food or sex, resulting in the creation of the early views of afterlife, to be material one preserving human body and identity. In Bedouin tribes, Gods decide who will continue afterlife and who will cease to exist based on judging behavior and following orders.
  • In civil societies , with the rise of Babylonian law , the man's participation in the city army, did not need a reward anymore but instead the power of law. death of a soldier in this case will only serve the good of the city or society or the common human good. death is followed by life granted not to the dying man but his friends or fellow citizens. the self reward became more spiritual like saying my ideas and my love will continue afterlife in smiley faces of my beloved ones. society acquired divine image in the mind of it's members, and in parallel to Babylonian law , the divine doctrine developed also in many forms connecting single human to his social, cultural and natural environment. In The city of Ugarit ( https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ugarit) a table found telling a quote of AUNAH (The virgin ANAT/ Ishter in Babylon) saying  :" Even Gods may not manipulate the food availability to human , because human society , like Gods, has the quality of eternal existence ". New spiritual awaking across the world , in what was described the AXIAL AGE (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Axial_Age) has replaced the material afterlife view of the lawless ,Bedouin nomads of previous human existence.
  • with the rise of the scientific methods of thinking after the Greek philosophers, new material trend came back to the table, refusing whatever classified as divine ,resulting in the new vision of no such thing called after life exists and human, by death, simply stop to exist, a big shock to social life and to the ways of human persuasion of happiness . Positive and brain storming fight was initiated between the two trends , between Epicurus school, from the scientific Greek trend (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Epicurus) and between the Zeno of Citium school from the natural divine Aramaic/ Canaanite trend (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Zeno_of_Citium) around 300 BC. Zeno for example did not believe an individual will continue to exist afterlife, however the connection with divine nature is available during life. Zeno quoted saying, I chose to not have a son, because I do not want him to die. His attitude was a bridge, like his life traveling from the Phoenician area to Greece where he,like Epicurus, thought there is no individual afterlife but with his Canaanite attitude in persuading happiness within eternity. Human eternity he thought exists, if human term included not only the individual body and identity , but also his natural and social environment connected spiritually by wisdom with universe. The blood connection was completely broken in both schools of Epicurus and Zeno, and humanity seemed leaving behind the tribal age.

The Arabic peninsula, remained out of the civil axial age probably until today, refusing and resisting anything that might threaten the tribal way of life. The Civil character of Moses 1592BC and his tables and universal values were reverted to the Bedouin Judaic Moses of 1391BC leading his tribe in Sinai desert with followers mainly in the Arabic peninsula especially in MEDINA ( known as Yathreb before becoming the capital to the new Islamic age ). Christian new testament was challenged by Christian tribes in the Arabic peninsula who simply denied the divine nature of Jesus, created there own church ( where the name of profit Mohamad father Abdullah , may refer to be one of this church) . The spiritual start of Quran in it's spiritual SOURAHS labeled with check digits, were completely reversed by the rest of Qur'an concentrating thereafter on the material description of afterlife to continue and secure the tribal reward system to it's members.

Wile In Judaism beliefs of life and death and of afterlife were mostly left to be individual thing and while in Christianity afterlife was vague but mostly a spiritual existence and story of life defeating death and happiness defeating pain, Qur'an was very strict enforcing the beliefs of material afterlife in it's tribal function , of God granting life or death , pain or happiness to those who follow orders and those who do not.The Qur'anic view dominated the religious views up to the 21st century including Jews and Christians who noticed that using the tribal reward system may gain them better expansion and control , including adopting the idea of the end of time day, the return of the savior and the end of human life as we know it in Armageddon, wiping out thousands of years of the axial age.

scholars today find the end day to be exact copy story in main religions, if only we change the names of it's characters. Even in civil Europe, we may notice that the the style of the European man practicing Epicurus scientific view on weekdays and Zeno of Citium on weekends becoming a minority and the Bedouin offspring of Able wearing a tie with material views of the afterlife and a Bedouin barbaric attitude after Cain and Able in it's tribal copy, becoming the main stream culture.

Judgment in the end of time by God, is part of Judicial Islamic Khilafa, where Muslim judges may start a judgment and then God will continue to enforce in the after life.

  • SOURAT AL_MAIDA,38&39 (وَالسَّارِقُ وَالسَّارِقَةُ فَاقْطَعُواْ أَيْدِيَهُمَا جَزَاء بِمَا كَسَبَا نَكَالاً مِّنَ اللَّهِ وَاللَّهُ عَزِيزٌ حَكِيمٌ

39. فَمَن تَابَ مِن بَعْدِ ظُلْمِهِ وَأَصْلَحَ فَإِنَّ اللَّهَ يَتُوبُ عَلَيْهِ إِنَّ اللَّهَ غَفُورٌ رَّحِيمٌ) .(http://islam101.com/quran/yusufAli/QURAN/5.htm).(38. As to the thief, Male or female, cut off his or her hands: a punishment by way of example, from Allah, for their crime: and Allah is Exalted in power.

39. But if the thief repents after his crime, and amends his conduct, Allah turneth to him in forgiveness; for Allah is Oft-forgiving, Most Merciful.). Also ALMida,33: (The punishment of those who wage war against Allah and His Messenger, and strive with might and main for mischief through the land is: execution, or crucifixion, or the cutting off of hands and feet from opposite sides, or exile from the land: that is their disgrace in this world, and a heavy punishment is theirs in the Hereafter;).

Syr10

pronunciation of Quran[edit]

Hello, fellow editors. I was just a bit confused about the bit at the start of this page where it says the way to pronounce 'Quran' is 'kor-ahn'. No offense but that's just incorrect. It should be something more like 'Qoor-ahn' and if there's a way to show the hard, guttural sound of the 'ahn' please try and include that as well. I hope you consider my suggestions about making this correction. Thank you. Mok2k11 (talk) 22:34, 29 July 2016 (UTC)

There is a footnote on that in the article, with the IPA pronunciation variants:
The English pronunciation varies: /kəˈrɑːn/, /kəˈræn/, /kɔːrˈɑːn/, /kɔːrˈæn/, /kˈrɑːn/, /kˈræn/;[1] especially with the spelling quran /kʊrˈɑːn/, /kʊrˈæn/;[2] especially in British English /kɒrˈɑːn/.[3][4]

References

  1. ^ dictionary.reference.com: koran
  2. ^ dictionary.reference.com: quran
  3. ^ Cambridge dictionary: koran
  4. ^ Cambridge dictionary: quran

Qur'an and copy Mistakes[edit]

Some words in Qur'an has no meaning, even though, they were adopted as is , based on the belief that Qur'an is preserved by God himself, and writers ( copiers ) can not simply make mistakes.

source :https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BMWDvLG_Dhk

  • Sourah S/16 ,Translated from Arabic by bing : (They said our Lord our haste our cat before judgment day. ).

The word in Arabic actually means cat , and has no meaning what so ever . The English version is only the opinion of the translators. The source video contains other examples.

Syr10

Qur'an and English translation Mistakes[edit]

Sourah Saba or "Sheba" No 34/ 9: (https://www.quran.com/34:9) (Do they not reflect upon what lies before them and behind them, of the heaven and the earth If We will, We can make the earth cave in beneath them, or make pieces of the sky fall down on them. In that is a sign for every devout servant.)

  • The translation ( like bing will do the same ) is suggesting the language of "planet earth" positioned against "Heaven" ? . The correct translation is the sky and the Ground not the heaven and the earth , where ground is referring here to what may collapse under their feet ( no need for trying to suggest that the SOURAH recognizes the planetary arrangement of earth around sun).
  • Also positioning Planet earth against heaven ? in saying before them and behind them of heaven and earth . The translator is trying here to drive the image of a modern man talking about earth behind his life and heaven ahead of him in his future , while the SOURAH is only talking about something collapsing under feet and about things falling from sky .
  • It is clearly a schizophrenic behavior of Qura'n believers , to think whatever came in Qura'n is an act of God that shall be taken as descriptive, definitive and not symbolic, and then try to fit the symbolic referrals to scientifically fit a modern use of terms and words .
  • Some translations were intentionally modified, whenever the word seemed unacceptable to English reader: SOURAH SABA, 34:25
  • In one translation:

the word (crime is translated as sin) ( http://noblequran.com/translation/surah34.html).""You will not be asked about our sins, nor shall we be asked of what you do. "

  • In another translation same word our crime was translated as what we committed. (https://quran.com/34:25).Say, "You will not be asked about what we committed, and we will not be asked about what you do."

The correct translation:

  • (قُل لاَ تُسْأَلُونَ عَمَّآ أَجْرَمْنَا وَلاَ نُسْأَلُ عَمَّا تَعْمَلُونَ). ( Say you will not be asked about our crimes , and we will not be asked about what you do).Bing translation is not correct , however it shows the correct word to use is "crime " and not sin :(Say, don't you wonder what commit a crime us and don't ask what you're doing).

Syr10

Qur'an stands for "The Sun rotates around Earth" no concept of earth to be planet earth[edit]

SOURAH AL BAQARAH ( THE COW) 2:258 (https://www.quran.com/2:258)
  • ( أَلَمْ تَرَ إِلَى الَّذِي حَاجَّ إِبْرَاهِيمَ فِي رَبِّهِ أَنْ آَتَاهُ اللَّهُ الْمُلْكَ إِذْ قَالَ إِبْرَاهِيمُ رَبِّيَ الَّذِي يُحْيِي وَيُمِيتُ قَالَ أَنَا أُحْيِي وَأُمِيتُ قَالَ إِبْرَاهِيمُ فَإِنَّ اللَّهَ يَأْتِي بِالشَّمْسِ مِنَ الْمَشْرِقِ فَأْتِ بِهَا مِنَ الْمَغْرِبِ فَبُهِتَ الَّذِي كَفَرَ وَاللَّهُ لَا يَهْدِي الْقَوْمَ الظَّالِمِينَ ) "Have you not considered the one who argued with Abraham about his Lord [merely] because Allah had given him kingship? When Abraham said, "My Lord is the one who gives life and causes death," he said, "I give life and cause death." Abraham said, "Indeed, Allah brings up the sun from the east, so bring it up from the west." So the disbeliever was overwhelmed [by astonishment], and Allah does not guide the wrongdoing people."


  • The issue does not seem to be in question for many Muslims. they argue that Quran is correct in claiming ( Sun is moved around by God from east to west ) . example from The ( civil dialogue page . http://www.ahewar.org/debat/show.art.asp?aid=201991 )pilot Nader Juneid presents 19 scientific proofs and 11 Quran references that Sun is the one rotates around Earth. Earth of course not necessarily a planet , but rather a ground fixed in place by wedges.

Syr10

You are breaking a fundamental rule by posting this here. Nothing here, however interesting, is amenable to being used for the article. We use reliable sources, which editors are not. Technically all of your contributions should be reverted out. Nishidani (talk) 18:55, 24 August 2016 (UTC)
No intention to post anything, If so I would have created a page. I read the article , and founded many issues presented incorrectly , I pointed to those like for example scientists names used as a proof of Islam encouraging science , while they were themselves religious victims .Everything else is mostly quotes from Quran ( what is better source than that) to open a healthy discussion and find answers to some questions. I would appreciate any correction to any of my possible misreading. What I do not appreciate ,however, is to shut up because the subject is holly thing and shall not be questioned or even discussed.

As for the fundamental rule, which you did not specify , I think you are trying to refer to primary and secondary sources, sensing that you consider any Quran material is a primary source. I think that we may only agree to considering the oldest available Quran as a primary source , everything else including 28 letters Arabic Quran or any English translation , a secondary reliable source of the subject.Syr10