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Increase in mass ?

Is the increase in mass from 2016 to 2018 due to a design change, or also including any required additions to the rest of the 2020 rover ? - Rod57 (talk) 09:58, 15 May 2018 (UTC)[reply]

I read that there are (were) 2 options: Deploy the drone and keep them separate till the end, or construct a docking bay/grapple on the bottom of the rover and recharge it and deploy it whenever it is required. That second option does require more hardware and mass. It seems the rover team does not want that complication, being the drone is only a technology demonstrator. Specifically, the rover team does not want that "distraction" when they start the science, so my guess is that they will chose to deploy it very soon after landing and test it simultaneously while the rover is static and undergoing its [long] commissioning phase. Rowan Forest (talk) 14:07, 15 May 2018 (UTC)[reply]

Potential sources of information

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tEY4ThEwd9c Video title: "J. Bob Balaram - Mars Helicopter - 21st Annual International Mars Society Convention". Duration 25 minutes. Open4D (talk) 16:43, 1 September 2018 (UTC)[reply]

Requested move 9 March 2020

The following is a closed discussion of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on the talk page. Editors desiring to contest the closing decision should consider a move review after discussing it on the closer's talk page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

The result of the move request was: Consensus to move (non-admin closure) BegbertBiggs (talk) 12:59, 17 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]

JPL Mars Helicopter Scout → Mars Helicopter – The latest NASA or JPL source I can find which refers to the "Mars Helicopter Scout" name is a June 2014 lecture.^[1] Since January 2015,^[2] NASA and JPL have exclusively referred to this spacecraft as the "Mars Helicopter".^[3]^[4]^[5]^[6]^[7]^[8] Note also that the spacecraft's brand and identity bear the "Mars Helicopter" name as well.^[9]

References

^ "Rotorcrafts for Mars Exploration: Mars Helicopter Scout" – Jet Propulsion Laboratory, 19 June 2014
^ "Crazy Engineering: Mars Helicopter" – Jet Propulsion Laboratory, 23 January 2015
^ "Mars Helicopter to Fly on NASA's Next Red Planet Rover Mission" – National Aeronautics and Space Administration, 12 May 2018 – "The Mars Helicopter, a small, autonomous rotorcraft, will travel with the agency’s Mars 2020 rover mission..."
^ "10 Things: Mars Helicopter" – National Aeronautics and Space Administration, 25 June 2018 – "This Mars Helicopter will demonstrate the first controlled, powered, sustained flight on another world."
^ "NASA's Mars Helicopter Completes Flight Tests" – Jet Propulsion Laboratory, 28 March 2019 – "Members of the NASA Mars Helicopter team inspect the flight model..."
^ "NASA's Mars Helicopter Testing Enters Final Phase" – Jet Propulsion Laboratory, 6 June 2019 – "NASA's Mars Helicopter flight demonstration project has passed a number of key tests with flying colors."
^ "NASA's Mars Helicopter Attached to Mars 2020 Rover" – Jet Propulsion Laboratory, 28 August 2019 – "Engineers attached NASA's Mars Helicopter [...] to the belly of the Mars 2020 rover today..."
^ "NASA's Mars 2020 Rover Goes Coast-to-Coast to Prep for Launch" – National Aeronautics and Space Administration, 13 February 2020 – "The mission's cruise stage and Mars Helicopter will make the trip to Kennedy later this week.
^ "Mars Helicopter | Official JPL Store" – Jet Propulsion Laboratory

– PhilipTerryGraham (talk · articles · reviews) 13:59, 9 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Support per nom.--Ortizesp (talk) 19:08, 9 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Support --Yarnalgo _talk 19:17, 9 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Support per well-researched nom. Randy Kryn (talk) 03:06, 10 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Support per nom. Unnecessary disambiguation. --Soumyabrata (talk • subpages) 14:00, 14 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]

The discussion above is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

Changing title name

Hey everybody, NASA just renamed the helicopter to Ingenuity. Can somebody change the name, add paragraph about it, etc.?

--Nomnom121 (talk) 15:09, 29 April 2020 (UTC)[reply]

@Nomnom121: It's helpful if you include a source with comments like this so others don't have to spend time searching for sources. I'll see what I can find later, but perhaps someone else will add it first. I can do the move if needed. - BilCat (talk) 15:49, 29 April 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Not sure how to reply without an account but: https://www.jpl.nasa.gov/news/news.php?feature=7650 — Preceding unsigned comment added by 82.18.129.198 (talk)

Thanks! The title will have to be disambiguated, as Ingenuity already has a primary topic. One option Is Ingenuity (spacecraft), though technically it isn't a spacecraft, as it only travels on one to Mars. (That would be like calling a Humvee an aircraft because it's transported on a C-17.) Mars Helicopter Ingenuity would be another option. - BilCat (talk) 16:14, 29 April 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Sorry, @BilCat:! I wasn't sure whether to include that or not. Mars Helicopter Ingenuity should work.--Nomnom121 (talk) 16:25, 29 April 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Done FWIW - changed article name to Mars Helicopter Ingenuity as suggested - should be ok - please comment if otherwise of course - in any case - Stay Safe and Healthy !! -Drbogdan (talk) 16:59, 29 April 2020 (UTC)[reply]

I think Ingenuity (helicopter) is more accurate and fits better with existing conventions for interplanetary vehicles (see Perseverance (rover), Curiosity (rover), Opportunity (rover), Spirit (rover), Rosalind Franklin (rover), etc; but of course this is the first helicopter so there's not complete precedence). Based on the above linked article and the official website its name seems to be just "Ingenuity" not "Mars Helicopter Ingenuity" so I think using the latter for the article title is technically incorrect. Thoughts? --Yarnalgo _talk 17:32, 29 April 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Requested move 2 May 2020

The following is a closed discussion of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on the talk page. Editors desiring to contest the closing decision should consider a move review after discussing it on the closer's talk page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

The result of the move request was: No consensus. Unfortunately, there are too many proposed options and too few !voters. King of ♥ ♦ ♣ ♠ 04:15, 31 May 2020 (UTC)[reply]

– Building upon concerns raised by BilCat that the disambiguator "spacecraft" may not be appropriate for vehicles that do not operate in space, and by Yarnalgo that "Mars Helicopter Ingenuity" is not an appropriate name as it is not used in any official capacity. I want to add to this by saying that "Mars Helicopter Ingenuity" is also not seemingly used in any commonly recognisable capacity either, and that the disambiguator "rotorcraft" may be more appropriate than "helicopter", as it adequately describes all rotor-propelled aircraft without denoting a specific type of rotorcraft; Dragonfly, for example, isn't referred to as a helicopter while Ingenuity is commonly referred to as such. – PhilipTerryGraham (talk · articles · reviews) 02:04, 2 May 2020 (UTC)—Relisted. – Ammarpad (talk) 10:19, 9 May 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Support Ingenuity (rotorcraft), but Questions about Dragonfly (rotorcraft) - Per nom on Ingenuity. As for Dragonfly, it's unclear to me from reading its article whether it's also a lander, not just a rotorcraft. That probably needs more discussion with WP:Spaceflight project members, who tend to do things quite differently than WP:Aviation, which is where most of my Wiki-experience is. The 2 articles have a Spacecraft infobox, after all. - BilCat (talk) 07:33, 2 May 2020 (UTC)[reply]

@BilCat: Ingenuity lands as well, so by very literal definition it is also a lander. I believe the point is ultimately illustrate that both these vehicles can conduct scientific investigations from flight. – PhilipTerryGraham (talk · articles · reviews) 20:09, 9 May 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Huh?? I'm not sure if you're trying to funny, or if you missed my point entirely. Or both. - BilCat (talk) 21:48, 9 May 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Oppose per almost all of the page sources, which call this craft a Mars Helicopter, and per NASA own page on the Mars Helicopter (which contradict official capacity and 'common name' assertions in the nom). JPL's logo image for the mission labels it 'Mars Helicopter'. Randy Kryn (talk) 13:34, 2 May 2020 (UTC)[reply]

@Randy Kryn: But not explicitly "Mars Helicopter Ingenuity", which seems to be a synthesised title for disambiguation more than an actual, official name for the vehicle. My common name concerns dealt with this specific name, not "Mars Helicopter" or "Ingenuity" separately. – PhilipTerryGraham (talk · articles · reviews) 15:27, 2 May 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Then it should be Ingenuity (Mars helicopter) and not (rotorcraft) which isn't a commonly used descriptor of Ingenuity. Randy Kryn (talk) 16:06, 2 May 2020 (UTC)[reply]

"(rotorcraft)" is a valid disambiguator, but "(Mars helicopter)" is not. - ~ BilCat (talk) 17:00, 2 May 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Then the present name, left as is, continues to cover the topic and all of the common and official names. Even the JPL logo calls this 'Mars Helicopter'. Randy Kryn (talk) 17:07, 2 May 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Right, but the logo does not call it 'Mars Helicopter Ingenuity'. There is no source that I've seen that uses that phrase exactly. It is either called the 'Mars Helicopter', 'Ingenuity', or sometimes 'the Mars Helicopter, Ingenuity', but I have not ever seen it officially referred to as 'Mars Helicopter Ingenuity'. --Yarnalgo _talk 18:27, 3 May 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Here's an official (I think, maybe not) NASA video on Facebook entitled "Mars Helicopter Ingenuity". PhilipTerryGraham, Yarnalgo, please check it out, does this seem like a good titling source? Thanks. Randy Kryn (talk) 19:42, 4 May 2020 (UTC)[reply]

That does look like an official NASA page ("NASA Explores"), but I think a single social media post on an offshoot NASA Facebook page is not really a strong source (it's possible that the person that made that post isn't involved in the project and doesn't know themselves what it should be called). For what it's worth here is one post on the main NASA Facebook page and one post on the official Perseverance rover Facebook page that both use the "Mars Helicopter" and "Ingenuity" names separately but not put together. All that said, we're definitely splitting hairs here. "Mars Helicopter Ingenuity" captures both names that are used in official capacities, and the fact that it is used somewhere by an official NASA outlet is kind of enough for me. I would be okay with moving to one of the suggested names ("Ingenuity (rotorcraft)", "Ingenuity (Mars helicopter)", or "Ingenuity (helicopter)"), but I also am okay with leaving the name as it is for now, at least until we sort of see how NASA moves forward with the branding for the mission through the launch this summer and beyond. I think I am neutral now on this move, and we can always revisit it later if NASA's branding becomes more clear one way or the other. --Yarnalgo _talk 20:11, 4 May 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Propose Mars Helicopter Ingenuity → Ingenuity (helicopter) (or Ingenuity (Mars helicopter) if preferred)

Oppose Dragonfly (spacecraft) → Dragonfly (rotorcraft)

Ingenuity appears intended to be a permanent, primary designation and not just an informal nickname that would coexist with a formal name like "Mars Helicopter Scout". As the proper name for the helicopter was only announced recently, we have to accept there will continue to be legacy and ongoing technical references to the thing by its previous descriptor. WP:COMMONNAME doesn't require us to wait until a new name surpasses 50% cumulative use vs. its predecessor, especially when the old name was a generic descriptor intended to be eventually supplanted by a more public-friendly proper name. However, "rotorcraft" seems like an unnecessarily arcane disambiguator --- it clearly meets the definition of a helicopter (vs a gyrodyne or some other categorization) and the fact that the longstanding mission description was "Mars helicopter" adds to the appropriateness of that term.

In contrast, don't support the Dragonfly rename. The whole assemblage that travels from Earth to Titan and gravity assists around planets and aerobrakes and so on is called Dragonfly, which makes it a spacecraft first in my book. Ingenuity's situation is not analogous, in that it's a dormant lump of cargo without any agency of its own during the spaceflight phase, and it only really becomes a thing once it is called upon to do helicopter things. The Tom (talk) 15:45, 16 May 2020 (UTC)[reply]

The discussion above is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

Mission type and duration

@PhilipTerryGraham:, I saw you removed the mission type and duration from the infobox because "such info can be found in the {{Infobox spaceflight}} of Mars 2020", but the info that was in these two fields is not in the Mars 2020 infobox because they are specific to the helicopter's mission and not the overarching Mars 2020 mission. The helicopter is a technology demonstrator whose mission is planned to last for 30 days. This is pretty different from the overall mission and duration of Mars 2020, which is definitely not a tech demo (it reuses most of its tech from the last rover) and is meant to last for at least a year. The helicopter is kind of an offshoot from the main mission so I think it's important to have that information here. What do you think? --Yarnalgo _talk 01:27, 7 May 2020 (UTC)[reply]

@Yarnalgo: The lead paragraph makes note of the 30-day lifespan of Ingenuity in the third sentence, so I think that's adequate enough. Once the Mars 2020 mission gets up and running, we're gonna see a lot of conflation between the mission timelines of both Perseverance and Ingenuity, so I think it's best to keep mission and spacecraft as separate as possible to avoid a messy spread of information; this'll ultimately include documenting the activities of Ingenuity in Mars 2020 (or a future Timeline of Mars 2020 article if one is ever created), and thus why such info is not detailed in this article's infobox, especially if the cells are labelled as "Mission duration". – PhilipTerryGraham (talk · articles · reviews) 01:58, 7 May 2020 (UTC)[reply]

@Yarnalgo: The Flight History section of the infobox currently contains the dates for the Mars 2020 mission, not for the Mars Helicopter Ingenuity. I concur that the information in this section should specifically reflect the helicopter. Plain Text (talk)

I agree and think this information is important to include in the infobox so that when readers come to this page it is immediately clear that the helicopter is a much shorter tech demo mission and isn't meant to accompany the rover through its entire mission. @PhilipTerryGraham: are you okay if I add the mission type (Technology demonstrator) and duration (30 days) back? --Yarnalgo _talk 02:06, 19 February 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Inconsistent Units in Dimensions

The dimensions for the chassis and overall height are given in cementers, but the rotor diameter is given in feet. Should the rotor diameter value be swapped with the value in brackets, 1.2m?

2001:569:7D2D:3200:C42F:FC72:4AF5:534A (talk) 19:59, 31 July 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Deployment

please add slot for deployment date as given by this site

^[1]

chinakpradhan (talk) 1:59, 28 January 2021 (UTC)

There is no parameter for "deployment date" in the infobox, and that can't be added from this page. Please quit trying to add it. Thanks. BilCat (talk) 06:36, 28 January 2021 (UTC)[reply]

References

^ businessinsider.in. "Deploy Date". businessinsider.in. Retrieved 2021-01-28. {{cite web}}: |last= has generic name (help) This article incorporates text from this source, which is in the public domain.

Help Welcome - "Timeline of Mars 2020"

The newly created "Timeline of Mars 2020", related to the "Mars 2020" page, and which would include events related to the "Perseverance rover" and "Ingenuity helicopter" pages, may need help in updating and related - the newly created page structure is based on the earlier "Timeline of Mars Science Laboratory" page, which includes events related to the "Curiosity rover" - Thanks - in any case - Stay Safe and Healthy !! - Drbogdan (talk) 17:03, 19 February 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Semi-protection

I think most people are well aware that the pages for Mars 2020, Perseverance (rover), and Ingenuity (helicopter) are under a concerted vandalism attack by an entity that is jumping IPs to post dick pics to the top of the pages. I believe admin have just applied semi-protection Mars 2020 and Perseverance (rover), so I'm wondering if this article receives it as well. Phillip Samuel (talk) 21:17, 19 February 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Comment I just request semi-protection. Hopefully the admin respond Phillip Samuel (talk) 21:30, 19 February 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Requested move 20 February 2021

The request to rename this article to Ingenuity (helicopter) has been carried out.

If the page title has consensus, be sure to close this discussion using {{subst:RM top|'''page moved'''.}} and {{subst:RM bottom}} and remove the {{Requested move/dated|…}} tag, or replace it with the {{subst:Requested move/end|…}} tag.

Mars Helicopter Ingenuity → Ingenuity (helicopter) – To follow conventions like Perseverance (rover) for a named vehicle. See previous move discussions @ #Requested move 2 May 2020 (Ingenuity (rotorcraft)) and @ #Requested move 9 March 2020 (Mars Helicopter). UserTwoSix (talk) 22:08, 20 February 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Support - the suggested name change ( to "Ingenuity (helicopter)" ) seems "entirely" ok with me at the moment - no problem whatsoever afaik - hope this helps in some way - iac - Stay Safe and Healthy !! - Drbogdan (talk) 01:02, 21 February 2021 (UTC)[reply]
Support. I tend to prefer natural disambiguation in article titles, but in this particular case where it's the proper name of a craft, we probably should just use a parenthetical. Rreagan007 (talk) 03:06, 21 February 2021 (UTC)[reply]
Support; seems reasonable. {{u|Sdkb}} ^talk 06:27, 21 February 2021 (UTC)[reply]
Support: seems to match the convention followed by other similar articles. -Bryan Rutherford (talk) 21:12, 21 February 2021 (UTC)[reply]
Support: reasonable, consequent convention Julo (talk) 15:39, 22 February 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Deployment date mismatch

The summary says that it'll be deployed in 30 days, but in Design the article says "...and should be deployed to the surface between 60 and 90 Martian days (sols) after the landing, or between 19 April and 19 May 2021..."

Which is correct? I don't have enough time to check it out right now, but I will in 10-12 hours if someone doesn't get to it first. Knotimpressed (talk) 05:33, 21 February 2021 (UTC)[reply]

[1] "Rotorcrafts for Mars Exploration: Mars Helicopter Scout" – Jet Propulsion Laboratory, 19 June 2014

[2] "Crazy Engineering: Mars Helicopter" – Jet Propulsion Laboratory, 23 January 2015

[3] "Mars Helicopter to Fly on NASA's Next Red Planet Rover Mission" – National Aeronautics and Space Administration, 12 May 2018 – "The Mars Helicopter, a small, autonomous rotorcraft, will travel with the agency’s Mars 2020 rover mission..."

[4] "10 Things: Mars Helicopter" – National Aeronautics and Space Administration, 25 June 2018 – "This Mars Helicopter will demonstrate the first controlled, powered, sustained flight on another world."

[5] "NASA's Mars Helicopter Completes Flight Tests" – Jet Propulsion Laboratory, 28 March 2019 – "Members of the NASA Mars Helicopter team inspect the flight model..."

[6] "NASA's Mars Helicopter Testing Enters Final Phase" – Jet Propulsion Laboratory, 6 June 2019 – "NASA's Mars Helicopter flight demonstration project has passed a number of key tests with flying colors."

[7] "NASA's Mars Helicopter Attached to Mars 2020 Rover" – Jet Propulsion Laboratory, 28 August 2019 – "Engineers attached NASA's Mars Helicopter [...] to the belly of the Mars 2020 rover today..."

[8] "NASA's Mars 2020 Rover Goes Coast-to-Coast to Prep for Launch" – National Aeronautics and Space Administration, 13 February 2020 – "The mission's cruise stage and Mars Helicopter will make the trip to Kennedy later this week.

[9] "Mars Helicopter | Official JPL Store" – Jet Propulsion Laboratory

[Deployment-10] usinessinsider.in. "Deploy Date". businessinsider.in. Retrieved 2021-01-28. {{cite web}}: |last= has generic name (help) This article incorporates text from this source, which is in the public domain.

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@@ Line 127: / Line 127: @@
 *'''Support'''; seems reasonable. <span style="color:#AAA"><small>&#123;{u&#124;</small><span style="border-radius:9em;padding:0 5px;background:#088">[[User:Sdkb|<span style="color:#FFF">'''Sdkb'''</span>]]</span><small>}&#125;</small></span> <sup>[[User talk:Sdkb|'''talk''']]</sup> 06:27, 21 February 2021 (UTC)
 *'''Support''': seems to match the convention followed by other similar articles. -[[User:Bryanrutherford0|Bryan Rutherford]] ([[User talk:Bryanrutherford0|talk]]) 21:12, 21 February 2021 (UTC)
+*'''Support''': reasonable, consequent convention [[User:Julo|Julo]] ([[User talk:Julo|talk]]) 15:39, 22 February 2021 (UTC)
 == Deployment date mismatch ==