Talk:Helen Zille

Untitled

I understand that Helen Zille was the journalist who revealed the death of Steve Biko at the hands of the security police. If that's true, it is worthy of mention in this article.165.146.189.82 13:11, 24 May 2006 (UTC)

Not that I know of, or that a cursory google search reveals. I'll look around a bit more, though. dewet|✉ 13:44, 24 May 2006 (UTC)

...and just as I hit submit, I find the link. Here's an IOL story about her, with the following paragraph:

Zille, a former journalist who was praised by her peers for her role in exposing the brutalities that led to the death in detention of the Black Consciousness leader Steve Biko, is the national spokesperson for the Democratic Alliance.

So I guess that's enough of a cite, no? dewet|✉ 13:51, 24 May 2006 (UTC)

That's as much as I heard (which was on Cape Talk Radio). It was a comment made in response to a listener who was making the jump from Zille being white, and DA, to the "obvious" fact that she would then be anti-black.192.96.88.227 12:09, 29 May 2006 (UTC)

Multilingualism.

Under 'Early Life and Career', it says "Zille is also able to speak Xhosa." And that's the sum total of her linguistic capacities, apparently... In actual fact, she is perfectly fluent in at least FOUR languages: English, Afrikaans, Xhosa, and German. Perhaps the article should reflect this. FlyBang 17:29, 20 April 2007 (UTC)

Fine but it earns a cite tag. Zain Ebrahim (talk) 15:00, 15 February 2008 (UTC)

Her grand uncle is ...

Heinrich Zille (so it is said in the german articles about both Heinrich and Helen Zille and i read this in german newspapers too). --78.48.192.223 18:05, 4 July 2007 (UTC)

Size of image

It seems a little too large, could it be rescaled down again. Teatreez (talk) 19:20, 27 March 2008 (UTC)

yeah the size is a lot too large and big and huge. it is very inorhodox with other articles and should be scaled down to a more reasonalbe size like the other articles on prominient political figures such as Franklin Roosevelt Josef STalin and Calvin Coolidge.Smith Jones (talk) 20:42, 28 March 2008 (UTC)

Better now? - htonl (talk) 19:13, 29 March 2008 (UTC)

Anachronism

"Zille began her career as a political journalist for the Rand Daily Mail, where she famously exposed the truth behind Steve Biko's death.[2] At this time she became politically active in the Democratic Party." - well, Biko's death was in 1977 and the DP was formed in 1989. Presumably she was active in the PFP, but this would need to be cited. Zaian (talk) 12:35, 17 November 2008 (UTC)

I remember reading somewhere that she joined the Black Sash - now if only I can remember where! Roger (talk) 15:36, 17 November 2008 (UTC)

Wikinews

Perhaps there is a way of linking the article to the multiple news stories that she is attached to on a daily basis?Teatreez (talk) 03:00, 6 February 2009 (UTC)

There don't seem to be any Wikinews stories about her. http://en.wikinews.org/wiki/Special:Search?search=zille&go=Go returns nothing. --GRuban (talk) 15:30, 6 February 2009 (UTC)

"South African Jews" category

Should this article really be in Category:South African Jews? It's a cited fact that she attends the Rondebosch United Church, so she's not Jewish in the religious sense. According to the article, her mother's father and her father's mother were Jewish, which would not make her Jewish by the traditional matrilineal rule. - htonl (talk) 01:47, 19 July 2009 (UTC)

Well, that would depend on whether the category is primarily viewed as that of a religious grouping, or as an ethnic grouping? If the latter, universal rules for categorisation should apply (part-French would mean French and something else, i.e. both categories?), not culturally-limited ones (such as matrilineality). I think the dominant world view on the topic of ethnicity these days is a genetic-centered one. That said, I hate classifying people. It's becoming more and more fluid/meaningless. — Gk sa (talk) 02:46, 18 April 2011 (UTC)

Home Language?

I can see she can speak four languages, with German obviously being her parents' tongue, but what language does she speak at home? --Bezuidenhout (talk) 15:29, 3 August 2009 (UTC)

I believe she also speaks Dutch. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 85.144.100.44 (talk) 18:27, 9 March 2010 (UTC)

I was wondering the same thing. Why doesn't the article say what her mother tongue is? Obviously she speaks Afrikaans and English but what is her first language?--Xania ^talk 21:57, 8 September 2011 (UTC)

I do sometimes get the feeling she may speak Afrikaans at home? Her husband seems to be Afrikaans and if so she probably speaks it at home? I still have no clue.. Bezuidenhout (talk) 06:44, 9 September 2011 (UTC)

Neutrality issues

This page is in severe need of some NPOV edits -- everything here is praise, or posited in a way to shine the best possible light on Zille; contrast it with the articles on other South African politicians, which tend to be at least half criticism. This would be suspect in itself, but I've also found some of the references to be blogs or have little to do with what is supposed to be referenced. I know it's common for the supporters of politicians (or, more cynically, their staff) to edit Wikipedia pages in that person's favor, but this might be the most extensive and well-covered one I've seen. The partisans are getting more sophisticated, I guess. Undeniably (talk) 07:28, 12 October 2009 (UTC)

That was my impression too. It would be interesting to analyse how many of the references are to (a) speeches or articles by Zille herself, or (b) articles based solely on press-friendly statements made by Zille, her office and her party, and (c) how much of this article is based entirely on those sources. Zaian (talk) 20:15, 9 March 2010 (UTC)

I've trimmed a bit; on further investigation I see that most of the DA press release stuff I edited was added in a single uncritical dollop by User:Mulaudzi8 in early 2009. Need to watch that. Zaian (talk) 20:38, 9 March 2010 (UTC)

Julius Malema

Hi Helen

I fully support your views in current affairs. It's well thought through, to the point and to the asvantage of all South Africans. Just want to say your views and actions already taken against Julius Malema - I fully support. Furthermore, if I were the journalist who Malema verbally abuse during a news conference on e-TV today, I would take serious actions against him. He's not above the law and needs to be taken on. How can I help/

Johnnie —Preceding unsigned comment added by 41.4.81.45 (talk) 15:47, 8 April 2010 (UTC)

Hi there; this is a Wikipedia talk page for discussing the article about Helen Zille, and it is very unlikely that you will be able to get in touch with her here. If you want to send her a message I would suggest you email her at leader@da.org.za (in her capacity as DA leader) or premier@pgwc.gov.za (in her capacity as Premier of the Western Cape). Thanks, htonl (talk) 16:20, 8 April 2010 (UTC)

Sentence about Jewish grandparents

About this sentence, which Roger removed:

Her grandfather (on her mother's side) and her grandmother (on her father's side) were Jewish

It seems to me that this should be seen in the context of the previous sentence:

Helen Zille was born in Johannesburg, the eldest child of parents who separately left Germany in the 1930s.

inasmuch as the fact that some of her grandparents were Jewish presumably explains why her parents left Germany, and therefore maybe the sentence should stay. Thoughts? - htonl (talk) 14:18, 2 June 2010 (UTC)

I missed the implied connection between the two sentences, maybe it should then be rephrased to make the connection more explicit. Roger (talk) 14:29, 2 June 2010 (UTC)

Yeah, what you've done with it seems fine to me. - htonl (talk) 15:05, 2 June 2010 (UTC)

critique

A section with critique is missing. --41.151.250.9 (talk) 12:20, 27 August 2012 (UTC)

It is under the heading "Controversies" - it probably needs to be expanded. Roger (talk) 12:56, 27 August 2012 (UTC)

Picture

The picture used for this page is outdated in my opinion. It is not a good representation of how Zille usually looks nowadays; she almost always wears glasses for instance. Anyone has a more recent photo? -- Darthdyas (talk) 10:10, 27 December 2012 (UTC)

World Mayor

The 3rd paragraph, states that Helen Zille was given the award as World Mayor in 2008 due to her success in fighting crime, drug abuse and unemployment. Two references are given. The statement is inaccurate and is not supported by the references cited. The first reference (#8) simply states that she was given the award but no reasons are mentioned as to why it was given to her. The second reference (#9) is to a page that is not publicly available and thus cannot be checked.

According to the website of the organisation that awards the World Mayor prize, testimonials from residents are taken into account when choosing who gets the prize. I could find no other criteria mentioned in general or specifically to the case of Zille.

With certainty I can say that neither crime, drug abuse nor unemployment in Cape town showed any significant change under Zille's tenure. So it cannot be given as the reason for her award. Perhaps the statement should read:

In 2008, Zille received the World Mayor of the Year Award. Her selection as recipient of the award is attributed to testimonials submitted by her supporters. Reference: http://www.worldmayor.com/contest_2008/world-mayor-2008-methodology.html

(Note that crime, drug abuse and unemployment are not mentioned in the reference). — Preceding unsigned comment added by 105.226.108.224 (talk) 20:50, 4 March 2013 (UTC)

I've fixed the broken reference - A news article on Independent Online - and also added another cite to a page on worldmayor.com that does go into the reasons for the award. It cites her anti-corruption stance and service delivery record in the face of underhanded tactics by the ANC to discredit and remove her. Roger (talk) 21:25, 4 March 2013 (UTC)

This is another request to please fix the statement, as it is not supported by the references cited. If you follow the link from reference #9:- In the 5th paragraph of the 'Helen Zille' section it states that she received the most passionate and eloquent support - that is the reason for receiving the award. From that point on it gives the testimonials, all of them clearly enclosed in quotation marks showing that it is not the view of the selectors, but rather the opinions of her supporters. Inside those quotes are the only references made to the underhanded ANC tactics, anti crime successes, and service delivery record. It is incorrect for Wikipedia to pass the supporters statements as the factual reasons for receiving the award when the reason given was (taken from reference #9): During the World Mayor 2008, Helen Zille has had the most passionate and eloquent support of any candidate.