Talk:Racism

Wiki Education assignment: CMN2160C

This article was the subject of a Wiki Education Foundation-supported course assignment, between 13 January 2022 and 16 April 2022. Further details are available on the course page. Student editor(s): JiangLyn (article contribs).

Segregation Extended-confirmed-protected edit request on 5 August 2022

The definition of racism in the introduction is limited mostly to chauvinism with regard to "races", which is indeed one crucial characteristic of racism. Some racists, however, extend the concept to the point that groups of different geographical origin must be segregated, especially to prevent mixing of the "races". The definition should absolutely mention this and cite the terminology for these sub-concepts. My proposal for reformulation:

It may also mean prejudice, discrimination, chauvinism, or antagonism directed against other people because they are of a different race or ethnicity. Some racists, however, extend the concept to the point that groups of different geographical origin must be segregated, especially in order to prevent mixing of the "races" (miscegenation).

(Any other wording making the same point is also okay. I am a non-native speaker of English and not fully aware of stylistic subtleties.) --HV (talk) 10:36, 5 August 2022 (UTC) HV (talk) 10:36, 5 August 2022 (UTC)

 Not done for now: Thanks HV. This may be a perfectly appropriate edit but there are a few reasons it probably hasn't been implemented yet. First, it takes a degree of effort to see exactly what change is proposed because the WP:EDITXY format hasn't been fully utilized (the previous text is missing). This means editors have to "hunt down" exactly what's changing which takes more time and effort. Second, without seeing the exact changes being proposed this reads like a controversial edit which should always reach consensus here on the talk page before anyone implements it. Lastly, it's difficult to tell if the new information you're proposing (i.e. some racists extend...) requires new citations or is already supported by existing ones. To be clear - I'm not necessarily opposed to, or rejecting this proposal; it's just really difficult to evaluate right now.

I recommend cleaning it up by adding the old text at a minimum and ideally adding new citations or referencing existing ones for the additional information you've proposed (i.e. the extension of the concept of racism you mention). You've done a good job explaining what's missing so if this is controversial I expect it will generate some discussion here and if not, this may get implemented much faster. --N8_wilson 🔔 14:48, 31 August 2022 (UTC)

Thank you for pointing this out to me. Since I am not familiar with editing in the English Wikipedia I would like to ask you or anybody else for assistance in finishing my request by simply acting in my place. I understand that the rules and procedures here are quite different from the German WP where I usually contribute (e.g. we do not have WP:EDITXY). --HV (talk) 19:54, 31 August 2022 (UTC)

I should clarify that nothing I wrote above was meant as a rebuke of you or your request HV; you didn't "break a rule". I just hoped to provide thoughts as to why this might not get completed quickly. Here on English WP, it's encouraged to ignore all the rules when they stand in the way of progress. In that spirit, lets re-open this request for now so other editors can see this needs attention. I'm neither an authority on edit requests, nor an expert in this particular topic so if another editor can quickly determine everything's good here I don't want to hold it up. Thanks for your 5,000+ main-space edits in de.WP! --N8_wilson 🔔 20:21, 31 August 2022 (UTC)

I totally got your point. :) I just wanted to explain my hesitation in taking further actions on my own as resulting from a combination of language barrier and ignorance of specific WP:en-rules. If other users feel ready enough to complete this matter, it would actually be a great relief to me. --HV (talk) 11:47, 1 September 2022 (UTC)

"Blackwashing" listed at Redirects for discussion

An editor has identified a potential problem with the redirect Blackwashing and has thus listed it for discussion. This discussion will occur at Wikipedia:Redirects for discussion/Log/2022 November 14#Blackwashing until a consensus is reached, and readers of this page are welcome to contribute to the discussion. Sangdeboeuf (talk) 12:51, 14 November 2022 (UTC)

Weird sentence

Although antisemitism has a long history, related to Christianity and native Egyptian or Greek religions[140] (anti-Judaism), racism itself is sometimes described as a modern phenomenon. I come from "scientific racism" Wikiedia page to investigate this further. I have noticed some weird tendencies on Wikipedia to frame christianity racist. Christianity has been used to serve many different ends, indeed. But it should be dealt with professionally. The sentence could instead begin like this "Although etnocentrism has a long history, ...". Why is christianity highlighted? Why is antisemitism equated to racism? And which are those native Egyptian or Greek religions? Well, there is no point of the linking phrase "although ..." in this paragraph, and it has has no relevance to "Racism as a modern phenomenon". Short it down — Preceding unsigned comment added by 130.225.188.129 (talk) 14:49, 25 January 2023 (UTC)

On both Wikipedia pages I have been met with a wall of silence. I'm losing faith in Wikipedia 130.225.188.130 (talk) 21:39, 13 February 2023 (UTC)

It's probably because your question is really unclear and you've got a weird comment thrown in, Why is antisemitism equated to racism? that's easy to read as a red flag. VQuakr (talk) 21:43, 13 February 2023 (UTC)

Antisemitism is an element of the set of racist ideologues, behaviors, etc. (racism) among many other elements. The sentence reduces racism to a set of only that element, antisemitism, which is, if anything, a red flag. Wikipedia policies already warn against juxtaposition manipulation in the NPOV policies "Undue weight can be given in several ways, including but not limited to the depth of detail, the quantity of text, prominence of placement, the juxtaposition of statements, and the use of imagery" 130.225.188.131 (talk) 20:01, 17 March 2023 (UTC)

Extended-confirmed-protected edit request on 28 February 2023

In the Racism as a modern phenomenon section, a sentence should be added about Martin Luthers racism against the Jews influencing later Nazi racism. Rote1234 (talk) 01:09, 28 February 2023 (UTC)

 Not done: it's not clear what changes you want to be made. Please mention the specific changes in a "change X to Y" format and provide a reliable source if appropriate. Firefangledfeathers (talk / contribs) 01:23, 28 February 2023 (UTC)