Talk:President of the United States

All Presidents were Christian?

I am not so sure about this, I can think of at least one President that had no religious affiliation, Lincoln.—Preceding unsigned comment added by 67.81.187.173 (talk) 20:46, 16 September 2008 (UTC) Actually, Lincoln was in fact a Christian. As a child, one of his favorite books was the Bible. Look it up!

-- Hannah; 7:38:21 pm (PCT); 10, October, 2008

Barack Obama is not African-American by definition

Quoted from the Qualifications section: "Every president to date has been a white male, but this may change in the next election with Barack Obama, the first African-American nominee of either major party, running for the Democrats."

Although many people (including Barack Obama jr. himself) refer to him as African-American, I submit that he is not African-American by definition for the following reasons:

The Wikipedia African-American page states that the term African-American is generally used for Americans with at least partial Sub-Saharan African ancestry. African Americans are the descendants of captive Africans who survived the slavery era within the boundaries of the present United States.

1. Senator Obama is descended from the Luo tribe through father and grandfather, that would make him Nilo-Saharan.

2. Being that his father Barack Obama was born to a tribe in Kenya, it is safe to say that Barack Obama Jr. is not descended from American slavery.

3. As is commonly known, Senator Obama's mother Ann Dunham is of course Caucasian, which further designates him as Biracial.

In Conclusion, without DNA testing, it can be roughly determined that Barack Obama is 50% European and 50% Nilo-Saharan. He is only considered African-American through social identification and not through direct ancestry. If he were to go into the history books as the first African-American president, it technically could be disputed. Rkm3612 (talk) 02:51, 10 June 2008 (UTC)

You paraphrase of African American is incorrect, resulting in an incorrect impression of the scope of the term "African American" as is your apparent idea that being biracial excludes him from being African American. Since my relatives came from England and the Netherlands, I am a Dutch-American and a British-American as well as more generally being a European-American. Likewise for Obama, who is a African American and a Kenyan American. Rmhermen (talk) 15:45, 10 June 2008 (UTC)

Yes, I see that now, thanks. My intent is to show that Obama is not descended from (or related to) American slavery (which are primarily Sub-Saharan) and that his Grandfather's Luo tribe is related to a Nilo-Saharan language. My conclusion is still that Obama is socially identified, but is not directly related to African-Americans descended from American slavery. So if Barack Obama wins the presidency, he will be the first African-American and I believe the first Multi or Bi-racial, but he will not be a president descended from American slavery. Rkm3612 (talk) 03:18, 11 June 2008 (UTC)

Quoted from the Qualifications section: "Every president to date has been a white male. President-elect Barack Obama will be the first non-white president." Since the president-elect has some 'white' ancestry the quoted text would be more accurate if it were replaced with "Every president to date has been a white male. President-elect Barack Obama will be the first president with black ancestry."

{136.159.16.107 (talk) 19:51, 5 November 2008 (UTC)}

Qualifications for President Question

Most people are familair that you have to be 35 yrs old, and natural born, but I've heard that according to FindLaw.com, which is cited the requirements that were in force from Dec. 24, 1952 to Nov. 13, 1986, encompassing the time of Obama's birth, state, "If only one parent was a U.S. citizen at the time of your birth, that parent must have resided in the United States for at least 10 years, at least five of which had to be after the age of 16."

Apparently, Obama's mother was 18 so doesn't meet the five years requirement past 16, and left almost imemediately after his birth. I'm not certain the father was in the US at all, but reamined in Kenya. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 72.242.134.135 (talk) 19:03, 11 June 2008 (UTC)

That is for births overseas; Barack Obama was born in the US. -Rrius (talk) 21:00, 13 June 2008 (UTC)

Rius is correct, these rules only apply to those who were not born in the 50 states after they were ratified.

So by default, McCain's mother who gave birth to him in Panama South America, applied to this rule. His father being a 2nd generation US Navy admiral could debunk any american roots, but whether he qualifies for president being born in a South American territory remains to be seen. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 15.219.153.74 (talk) 17:37, 1 September 2008 (UTC)

Wrong. You do not have to be born in a state. Being born on US soil is sufficient. As such, McCain was born a citizen regardless of parentage. In addition, both of his parents were citizens, so a provision like the one referred to above would probably not matter. Finally, even if it did, military personnel are often considered resident in a state of their choosing. If there was no specific law for military members at the time, that residency would probably have been enough. -Rrius (talk) 05:35, 29 October 2008 (UTC)

Knowledge of foreign languages

This sentence in the last para of the "Qualifications" section is incorrect: "While most early Presidents could read and write Latin (as was customary for educated people of the time), none had command of a spoken foreign language." What about Jefferson, who spoke French fluently? [See Wikipedia article on him.] Madison was probably pretty good too, since TJ shipped French books (e.g., Montesquieu, Rousseau) to him while serving as Minister to France (and while Madison was working on the Constitution & Federalist Papers). [See Dumas Malone's biography of TJ.) I don't know about other early Presidents, but I wouldn't be surprised if there were others who could more than hold their own in a foreign language. Scott Thompson

I removed the lines about Presidents Bush and Carter knowing limited Spanish, because if you are going to list them that way, you have to see whatever other Presidents also spoke "limited" Spanish. I do not believe that Presidents Reagan (California), HW Bush (Texas), and Clinton (Arkansas) had no knowledge whatsoever of Spanish. I can see putting President Bush 43 back in since he is often heard making significant portions of speeches in Spanish, but the word limited opens it up to any President with even a rudimentary grasp of Spanish.

Further, the comment about Senator McCain not speaking any languages while Senator Obama speaks an Indonesian dialect is unsourced, and contradicts a direct quote from Senator Obama "While the Obama campaign says that Obama speaks a little bit of Indonesian, Obama himself admits that he isn’t bilingual. 'I know because I don’t speak a foreign language. It’s embarrassing!' he said" http://blogs.abcnews.com/politicalradar/2008/07/como-se-dice-ob.html (the context of this was the importance of teaching American kids to speak foreign languages). I am absolutely certain Senator Obama picked up "limited" use of the dialect if he grew up there for any portion of his life (as well as bits of pidgin, Hawaiian, and others from Hawaii), but I am equally certain that Senator McCain has picked up at least limited use of Spanish (he represents Arizona, after all) and Vietnamese ("lived" there for many years).Kingsley911 (talk) 15:24, 4 November 2008 (UTC)

Religions of the various US Presidents

{{editsemiprotected}} In the Qualification and Common Practices section this part here needs revised:

Every president to date has been a Christian[citation needed]; all but one have been Protestants, with the most common denomination being Episcopalian; John F. Kennedy has been the only Roman Catholic. Ronald Reagan was baptized a Catholic, but he was reared in the Disciples of Christ faith by his mother.

Not all of the Presidents were Christians, many were deists, such as Thomas Jefferson. There is also reason to speculate that Abraham Lincoln was an atheist, however, there is no proof that he was, just as there is nothing to say that he was explicitly a believing christian. I would change it to something like: "Every president to date has had a Christian upbringing..."

I just thought it should be a change worth noting —Preceding unsigned comment added by Likwidsolutions (talk • contribs) 23:20, 22 September 2008 (UTC)

I'm willing to make such a change, but first, please provide sources for the proposition that some were actually deists. -Rrius (talk) 23:59, 22 September 2008 (UTC)

In light of the considerable discussion of this subject at Religious affiliations of United States Presidents I'm eliminating the unsourced blanket statement that all Presidents have been Christians. Please coordinate with the religious affiliations page and with the pages of the individual Presidents when editing this material to avoid contradictions between wikipedia pages. Baileypalblue (talk) 01:44, 21 October 2008 (UTC)

Immigrant parents

A previous version of this article contained this line:

"Only one president was the son of two immigrant parents: Andrew Jackson. Five presidents (Jefferson, Buchanan, Arthur, Wilson, Hoover) had just one immigrant parent each."

This is an interesting and timely bit of information. Was it removed because a source could not be found, or was there just some editing lossage here? -Miskaton (talk) 14:01, 3 November 2008 (UTC)

Barack Obama hasn't been President since January 9th, 2001. Someone needs to fix the infobox (for some reason I can't edit the page).

Bush is still president

Can't change it yet, until the inauguration. 140.247.243.250 (talk) 04:26, 5 November 2008 (UTC)

No, Obama's not President, he IS president-elect.

Obama is NOT president.

He IS the president-elect. If there is a reason to revert naming him please discuss it here. -Kez (talk) 04:35, 5 November 2008 (UTC)

Can you not add the photo of Obama? There is two photos of Bush up at the moment, he is not succeeding himself. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Mu301nh (talk • contribs) 14:25, 5 November 2008 (UTC)

Post-election edit war syndrome

Please see the draft policy Wikipedia:Post-election edit war syndrome about the general mess articles like this often get into as a way forward on the endless reverts that are starting here. Timrollpickering (talk) 05:16, 5 November 2008 (UTC)

The beginning of the article is all messed up because someone didn't close the infobox properly. I can't seem to edit it because I'm guessing it has been locked. Can someone please correct this? Feudonym (talk) 05:33, 5 November 2008 (UTC)

The mess appears to be at Template:Infobox Political post rather than the article. Timrollpickering (talk) 05:45, 5 November 2008 (UTC)

Episcopal Church

There is a link to Episcopal Church near the end of the Qualification, disqualification and common practice section; it should be Episcopal Church instead. Apparently I cannot edit the page despite there being no notices about page protection. Sakkura (talk) 07:11, 5 November 2008 (UTC)

Religious Affiliation Typo

{{editprotected}}

In the following sentence in the Religious Affiliation section:

As many as thirteen Presidents have been identified by at least some historians as holding either Theist views[citation needed] notably including George Washington, Thomas Jefferson and Abraham Lincoln.

I believe "either" should be "other". Unimath (talk) 07:26, 5 November 2008 (UTC)

Change made. Timrollpickering (talk) 17:30, 5 November 2008 (UTC)

wrong president

Barack is president now not george bush anymore--Lerdthenerd(I cant be bothered to log on at the moment) —Preceding unsigned comment added by 195.194.82.4 (talk) 09:09, 5 November 2008 (UTC)

Incorrect, George W. Bush is President until January 20, 2008. Barack Obama is currenly the President-elect. Here is the wiki article where you can learn more: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/President-elect MrDestructo (talk) 10:00, 5 November 2008 (UTC)

Incorrect, George W. Bush is President until January 20, 2009. PS, seeing as the article is locked; would somebody fix the Infobox? GoodDay (talk) 15:33, 5 November 2008 (UTC)

John Tyler

Would somebody elaborate on Tyler's service in the Provisional Confederate Congress? He was a member of the Provisional Confederate House of Representatives. GoodDay (talk) 16:13, 5 November 2008 (UTC)

Nevermind, the Provisional Confederate Congress was a uni-cameral legislative body. GoodDay (talk) 16:17, 5 November 2008 (UTC)

The Next President

Although Barack Obama has been elected, his election does not make it certain that he will be the next president, as anything can happen in the next two and a half months. The electoral college hasn't even voted yet, and even then there is a month to go until inaguration. It would be more accurate to say something like barring any unforseen events, Barack Obama will be the next president. I forget exactly where, but it says somewhere where it says Obama is the next president and will be inagurated on January 20. 21:34, 5 November 2008 (UTC)

noncontroversial grammar change

{{editprotected}}

In a recent edit, an admin added in:

• The appellation "leader of the free world", frequently used...

Should it not be:

• The appellation "leader of the free world," frequently used...

NuclearWarfare ^{contact me}_{My work} 21:41, 5 November 2008 (UTC)

Declining edit. Per WP:PUNCT, the Wikipedia manual of style seems to prefer external punctuation. --Elonka 22:49, 5 November 2008 (UTC)

Interesting. Thank you Elonka. NuclearWarfare ^{contact me}_{My work} 23:28, 5 November 2008 (UTC)

Appointed Positions

I seem to be having difficult finding positions appointed by the president. This might be good information for a lot of people looking to get involved. I am still looking for a definitive list we can link to. But wanted to make sure I wasn't duplicating anyone else's efforts. Dracocat (talk) 22:01, 5 November 2008 (UTC)

Obama Is The President--76.104.88.97 (talk) 23:40, 5 November 2008 (UTC)

Obama is the first African American President of the United States of America.

As previously discussed in talk, he is currently President-elect, and will not hold the title of President until he assumes office in January 2009. Can this talk be morphed into the appropriate section? K^rowe 23:51, 5 November 2008 (UTC)