Talk:Empire of Japan

Merge?

Can we merge this with Japanese expansionism? Kokiri 13:47, 19 Aug 2004 (UTC)

I'm inclined to merge this article with that of Empire of Japan. Any thoughts on this? Kokiri 13:48, 19 Aug 2004 (UTC)

Is it necessary? Sekicho 01:41, Sep 3, 2004 (UTC)

Why? Japanese expansionism is a movement or action. The Empire of Japan is a historical entity, like "Weimar Germany" or "Imperial Russia" which distinguishes it from other political eras.

• Removed merger until it is discussed. Why merge???? Imperialism is a different concept than nationalism. There are just different. My suggestions: either 1) keep this as is (it is certainly not a stub, and people have put a lot of work into it 2) Merge it with Japanese imperialism article, which is still short. The title Japanese imperialism sounds better too.

Past discussion

I thnked why Japanese nationalism if one term,where intent to define at diverse type of nationalist ideas.i uhknowed why exist any term similar at Nazism or Fascism for defining this ideas. if totally certain why in these word stay diverse types of military and ideologycal ideas apparently disconect,but still these all ideas proceded from one ideologycal "tree".these ideas have no insanities or any for style,theirs are diffrent ideologycal branches why proceded from same ideologycal center.

There has been a proposal to merge this into Japanese nationalism. On that page there is a somewhat more reasonable proposal to transfer some material from this page over there.

Firstly, the pages should be kept separate. Japanese nationalism clearly existed both before and after the Empire of Japan.

Secondly, while there may be something to move from here to there, some concrete suggestion would be better. No doubt there are some overlaps and possible duplications. The Japanese nationalism page is quite long already.

Charles Matthews 11:29, 24 Apr 2005 (UTC)

My problem is with Japanese nationalism. I am not certain that there has a coherent ideology or tenet called Japanese nationalism. We all know kamikaze, Shinto and Emperor as a living god and etc. But those are basically dead in Japan by now like nazism. For example, no one would confuses Nazism with contemporary nationalism in Germany. This is probably because Japanese nationalism reads somehow chaotic rather than coherent. (No offense for writers, the article has a lot good stuff.) Anyhow, my interest is not about the end-result; if there is two or article. -- Taku 17:02, Apr 24, 2005 (UTC)

Nationalism doesn't need to be a movement per se. It can also be a tendency or phenomenon. Like "American exceptionalism" which no one has ever promoted but has been a common theme in US history.

By the way Japanese expansionism used to redirect to this page, but I changed so it now goes to Japanese nationalism. How about separating Japanese expansionism, which includes kamikaze and other insanity, from Japanese nationalism?

OK, the Japanese nationalism article has now three main sections: call them pre-WWII, Macarthur period, today. The main author of the pre-WWII material - all of which has been heavily cleaned up, and some of which needs to be checked - clearly believes in the coherence. Of that time, say Taisho and early Showa. Now, I have taken out anything that relies on the Tanaka Memorial - because our page states that it was probably forged. Anything you can add on that would be good. He also believes that the expansionism was driven by particular things: anti-communism, need for raw materials in particular. I am not sure about all the theories, but he is certainly adding a very large amount of detail to the history. (By the way, I am listing pages with a major contribution from our South American friend at User:Charles Matthews/Imperial Japan, because they all need clean-up and some merges will need to happen. The 'expansionism' question is obviously complex if looked at from the point of view of economics (big additions of data on Empire of Japan (economic and financial data)). So, in the end, there will be quite a number of pages. I would say that 'expansionism' is going to be on maybe four main pages.

Anyway, at present I'm just fire-fighting, trying to edit this all into some kind of structure. Charles Matthews 18:25, 24 Apr 2005 (UTC)

It just occurred to why don't we have Japanese imperialism. The term seems to fit the political practice during WWII much better. By the way, I have just found Japanese war crimes. I know I am a Japanese person, but I just cannot see how it is accurate in any sense. In any case, thanks for the work and I will find time to do something about this issue. -- Taku 00:43, Apr 25, 2005 (UTC)

Taku, if you think Japanese war crimes is inaccurate, I would welcome your contribution — and that of others — either in that article or on the talk page. The article has undergone many changes recently and will probably undergo many more. Regards, Grant65 (Talk) 04:30, Apr 25, 2005 (UTC)

I think that Japanese nationalism should simply explain various historical and present nationalistic movements in Japan. Expansionism in my view is more akin to imperialism, and the term expansionism is not often used. There _IS_ a Japanese Imperialism page, by the way. How about 1) Japanese nationalism page of various nationalist movements 2) Imperial Japan page, simply about the Dai Nippon era. 3) Japanese imperialism listing the events of Japan which some declare imperialistic (like expansion north and south, pre WWII annexations, and Japanese territory at the height of WWII.

Talk from "Japanese expansionism"

• Note: More astute observers might notice that I've used Pinyin translation from Chinese for Mao Zedong's name and Wade-Giles translation for Chiang Kai-shek. That's because I'm entirely against Wade-Giles, but couldn't find the Pinyin translation for Chiang. I find it hard to do the changes myself when I'm dealing with names. Any observers who would notice this probably know enough to fix it and delete this unsightly note. Please do so. Incidentally, the Wade-Giles form of "Mao Zedong" is "Mao Tse-tung." The conventions for Chinese translation are almost important enough to be an issue for people like Rhoades Murphey and Edward Said.

The Pinyin version of "Chiang Kai-shek" is "Jiang Jieshi". However, the Wikipedia article uses "Chiang Kai-shek" as standard. GCarty 20:27, 23 January 2006 (UTC)

Questions

Can anyone expand on this chapter of history? How big was the empire? What's the story behind it? How does it link to other chapters of Japan's (and other countries') history? Kokiri 22:39, 17 Aug 2004 (UTC)

The flag of the sun with rays (Kyokujitsu-ki) was not the Imperial flag. It was used as the ensign of the Imperial Navy (and still in use in the Self Defence Navy). The flag is regarded as a symbol of Imperial Japan, but the national flag was Nisshohki at that time, and has been unchanged so far.

W.K.

i am from latinoamerica and one history afficionate,why observed the asian side,and knowed of american and european colonial bad actions in others areas.for other part one farest ancest parent are one "nikkei" why more later changed your name,and my others parents know ones ancient fishers family of same nationality why living in country during 30s and 40s times.

i treated to sended some very little book or other sources,information over topic,in my limited english writing possiblities,but lamentably my scarcy english are complicated to understanding for yours.

---

The Japanese Government of the times called their state "(the) Great Empire of Japan".
By way of parenthesis, Japan is still an empire formally at least since the emperor system exists still.

---

This article may impress its readers as follows:

• The Imperial Family of Japan would be very noble,
  
• Today's Japan would not be an empire.
  

But supposing that the Imperial Family of Japan is so noble, Japan would be still an empire obviously, and supposing that Japan is completely not an empire, it means that the Emperor and the Imperial Family should have already not existed in Japan.

If Japanese have written this article, it can be said that Japanese people are as unfair as ever.
Because it is obvious that the descriptions which contradict each other would have the purpose to make Japanese people look better in their own way, if so.

                                 [12:00, 22 Apr. 2005 (UTC)]

Your korean, right?

See also

• Axis powers
• Imperial Guard of Japan
• Imperial Japanese Army
• Imperial Japanese Navy
• Kempeitai
• Kantogun
• Hirohito
• Hideki Tojo
• Sadao Araki
• Japanese fascism
• Japanese nationalism
• Socialist thought in Imperial Japan
• Militarism-Socialism
• Tosei-Ha
• Koda-Ha
• Imperial Way Faction
• Japanese Doctrines in Showa Period
• List of nationalist Japanese symbols
• Japanese political and military nationalist organizations
• Yen Block
• Greater East Asia Co-Prosperity Sphere
• Tanaka Memorial
• Japanese strategic planning for mainland Asia (1905-1940)
• Japanese strategic planning for the Pacific (1905-1940)
• N.Y.K.
• Dai Nippon Koku KK
• Empire of Japan (financial data)
• Shantung Incident
• Mukden Incident
• Manchukuo
• Manchukuo (Japanese investment in industry)
• Mengjiang
• South Manchuria Railway
• Empire of Japan (natural resources, Asia mainland and Pacific areas, after 1937)
• Karafuto Prefecture
• South Pacific Mandate
• Kwantung Leased Territory
• Russo-Japanese War
• Sino-Japanese War (1894-1895)
• Battle of Lugou Bridge
• Second Sino-Japanese War
• Reformed Government of the Republic of China
• Pacific War
• Kamikaze
• Transportation in the Empire of Japan
• List of Japanese Government and Private institutions and Groups (from 1930s to 1945)
• List of Japanese Nationalist Movements and Parties
• Political situation in Japan(1914-1944)
• Some traditional political parties in Japanese Empire
• List of Japanese Political and Civil Figures since ww2 times
• List of Japanese,East Asian and foreing supporters personalities in ww2 period
• List of East Asian leaders in the Japanese sphere of influence (1931-1945)
• list of Japanese Army and Navy members in military or politic services in Japanese Empire and nearest areas previous times and Pacific War epoch(1930-40s)
• Eugenics measures in Japanese Empire
• List of Japanese secret agents (1930s to World War Two)
• Organization of Japanese Intelligence Secret Services
• Japanese Culture,religion and Education(1930-40s Period)
• Observations of Japanese modernization:(1868-1930)
• List of Japanese political and military incidents
• Common live in Japan during wartimes(WW2)

I deleted this list from the article. The main author, Reader72, should learn how to use Categories and trim his see-also-lists to 5 articles. -- Mkill 00:33, 18 October 2005 (UTC)

Temple name

This might be a dumb question, but why does the table under "Emperors of the Empire of Japan" have a column for the temple name if Japan has never used them? Sure Japan is in Asia, but so is Thailand and List of Kings of Thailand doesn't have a temple name column. --Bletch 19:36, 29 January 2006 (UTC)

Good question. Just be bold and remove it. --Mkill 21:02, 29 January 2006 (UTC)

Done. --Bletch 04:15, 30 January 2006 (UTC)

do you know any japenese leaders that were in Ww 2?

i need help with finding that.

thank you.

K*T*

I know Emperor Hirohito and Admiral Isoroku Yamamoto.--Brendenhull (talk) 23:09, 21 April 2006 (UTC)

Quality of English

Some of this article seems to come from a machine-translation programme. It needs an edit for grammar and style.

Siberian Intervention?

I dont see any mention of the Japanese activity in the Russian Civil War in Siberia. That lasted for several years an the Japanese Empire seemed concerned with confronting Communism. Seems it should be a topic of some level in this article.Asiaticus 23:44, 30 October 2006 (UTC)

There was not political motive. Just greedy for more land.

-G —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 64.231.137.14 (talk) 03:06, 23 December 2006 (UTC).

The unsigned was partially right, the Japanese intervened in part for the possible land claims. The Japanese Empire really took advantage of the USSR's relative weakness in the early 1920's, such as the mineral rights and what not. In the Siberian intervention, they were joined with Americans in a role to save some Czech soldiers who were somewhat isolated. As is, I agree, the Siberian intervention should be in the article. ~ (The Rebel At) ~ 05:04, 23 December 2006 (UTC)

it was very minor

Flag

Could someone please explain the difference between these?

Flag of Japan.svg

File:Flag of Japan - variant.svg

Flag of Japan - variant.svg

There doesn't seem to be a real difference between them other than a very slight color variation, and one is slightly taller than the other. I'm wondering why we have or even need both. ···日本穣^{? · Talk to Nihonjoe} 22:48, 18 November 2006 (UTC)

It appears the red sun is slightly larger as well.~ (The Rebel At) ~ 22:57, 18 November 2006 (UTC)

I think that's becauuse the white field is slightly larger, too. ···日本穣^{? · Talk to Nihonjoe} 23:10, 18 November 2006 (UTC)

I really don't think we need this "variant". —Nightstallion (?) 21:42, 30 November 2006 (UTC)

Population

Is the population of 200 million in the infobox a total of all the people within the Empire at its peak? Japan alone was only about 100 million. GrahamBould 12:50, 23 March 2007 (UTC)

pacific war

lacks the invasion of french indochina of 1941 and 1945 sections. Paris By Night 02:28, 28 June 2007 (UTC)

Isn't Japan still today an Empire?

Is it? --89.97.35.70 20:59, 17 July 2007 (UTC)

I don't know what it is. But there is name difference 'Nihon-koku' and 'dai nippon teikoku'. I don't think it is an empire, there is distinction. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 75.166.40.178 (talk) 03:55, 29 September 2007 (UTC)

It's only a change of the designate of the country. The same guy was still the emperor of Japan.-✉ Hello World! 03:40, 14 December 2008 (UTC)

Area

19,167,000 square kilometres? That's sixty times as large as Japan itself. There's only one word for that, and that's 'wrong'. Bruce Gordon gives 7.4m sq km, but that's still including 'occupied' territories (including puppet Manchukuo and simply militarily-controlled south-east Asia). Could we not get a proper estimate for the actual empire, reflecting both the area and the population (which, estimated merely as 200,000,000, is inadequate and probably equally wrong)? Bastin 22:45, 12 August 2007 (UTC)

May be a conversion issue, since 7.4m square miles is also shown here. Neier 23:53, 12 August 2007 (UTC)

Flag revert war

What's with the revert war over the flag on this page? Either sort it out reasonably in discussion or drop it; you've both surely violated WP:3RR by now. Xihr 21:33, 1 December 2007 (UTC)

Please see Talk:Occupation of Japan#Flag. It has been disputed there what should be use the image of flag. Now, I have replaced flag to the temporary image "Sin bandera" (question mark) according to those discussion. So, don't worry Xihr. I believe that the edit war has finished right now.--Gettystein 10:15, 2 December 2007 (UTC)

How about: move War-related sections out of article

The sections

• 7 War crimes during World War II
• 8 Path to defeat
• 9 Influential personnel

Aren't really about the "Empire of Japan," they are really about WWII.

The end of WWII was definitely the end of the Empire of Japan, it is true. It is also true that these parts of the article are important information... but they don't really belong in this article. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Brain (talk • contribs) 17:54, 14 December 2007 (UTC)

Taiwan and Manchuria

The creator of the pciture shown on this page's main article forgot to put Manchuria and Taiwan(and possbly other bits of China). 71.194.63.161 (talk) 00:45, 25 April 2008 (UTC)

New maps

• 
  Pacific Imperialism 1939
• 
  Manchukuo
• 
  Mengjiang

I made a few maps that may be relevant to this article. Please include them if you see fit, and let me know if I need to make corrections to any of them. Emok (talk) 18:55, 21 August 2008 (UTC)