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This is an old revision of this page, as edited by EagleFalconn (talk | contribs) at 03:29, 13 January 2010 (Delete request). The present address (URL) is a permanent link to this revision, which may differ significantly from the current revision.


Uzbekistan 2020

You closed the AFD as a redirect, but the information from Uzbekistan 2020 was not moved to the Lola Karimova-Tillyaeva page. Information about the organization still belongs on her page as a section. Please undelete the Uzbekistan 2020 page for a little while so the information can be copied to Lola Karimova-Tillyaeva. Thanks. Otebig (talk) 21:07, 3 December 2009 (UTC)[reply]

  • I restored the history behind the redirect so everything should be there now. If you are going to merge material then we need to keep the history undeleted behind the redirect for attribution purposes Spartaz Humbug! 05:24, 4 December 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Thank you

(I entered this on the review page but was not sure that the editors would see it... so please excuse me if I have done this incorrectly.)

Thank you very much for your review and feedback. I believe, based on reading through the responses, that the current problem with the article on Alfredo Corvino is that the revisions I made are still more like "derivations" of existing phrases... similarity infringement... in other words, while I changed words, the structure of the phrases in my article was still too similar to the original material.

How do I address a situation where I may wish to use a direct quote? Is this possible? For example, if I wanted to include a segment of an actual conversation by an individual... such as a direct quote by Alfredo Corvino... can this be done? Sometimes, things are said or written so precisely... so perfectly... that they can not be rewritten and have the same impact.

Although it may not seem like it to you, I really am trying to learn and to do things in a correct manner. What really frustrated me yesterday was that my article was blocked and I could no longer make any modification or revisions... and all the messages from editors accusing me of vandalizing wikipedia! (They did seem a bit harsh.)

I will also explore the second suggestion... drafting in userspace ... I am not sure what this exactly means but I will certainly investigate. I am quite sure that new/novice contributors like me, are a constant source of annoyance and irritation to editors, like you... and I do apologize for any inconvenience I have caused.

Thank you for your time! Seamanjg (talk) 02:02, 29 December 2009 (UTC)[reply]

I want to thank you for the additional assistance you provided. I have followed the suggestion and re-written the article on Alfredo Corvino on my user page... (I think)

Seamanjg (talk) 13:37, 29 December 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Please undelete Kiss All the Boys image?

I don't suppose I could prevail upon you to undelete the File:Kiss All the Boys (Yaoi Manga).jpg image from Kiss All the Boys? The admin who speedied it when it was orphaned is having an attack of RL. Thank you. --Malkinann (talk) 03:09, 6 December 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Done Spartaz Humbug! 03:18, 6 December 2009 (UTC)[reply]
Cheers! --Malkinann (talk) 03:27, 6 December 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Vote stacking

Hello! I don't know if you have seen Wikipedia:Sockpuppet_investigations/Bravedog#Conclusions, but THREE of the accounts who said to redirect in Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Una Healy (Bravedog = GaGaOohLaLa, and also Dalejenkins) were actually the same person (including the nominator) and therefore may have unduly influenced the discussion by giving a false consensus. Best, --A NobodyMy talk 05:18, 7 December 2009 (UTC)[reply]

You were involved in a discussion regarding the use of copyrighted architectural designs on Wikipedia pages and I'm trying to find community consensus on a gray area. If you can, please let me know at what point you feel these images should be replaced here. Thank you so much! DR04 (talk) 19:23, 11 December 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Epona (IRC services)

Re Epona (IRC services), WP:WEB doesn't apply to software. There was little point in AfDing the article as I intended to merge it into a parent article. Note that Miami33139 has already jumpped into that AfD. I intend to stay out of that AfD because if I comment, Miami33139 will just create even more drama there. --Tothwolf (talk) 13:46, 12 December 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Google Watch DRV

Hey there. I saw that you closed Google Watch's DRV early citing the rationale that DRV cannot overturn a merge. While that is the case, I did cite in my closing rationale that "there is a consensus that the article should not remain as a standalone one". Although it is not a direct prohibition against unmerging, it is indicative of the fact that there was a consensus to get rid of the article and keep it that way. I was wondering if perhaps the DRV could take its course, just so that any possible future disagreements could we avoided? Feel free to tell me your thoughts on the matter. Cheers, NW (Talk) 14:13, 12 December 2009 (UTC)[reply]

  • The point is that DRV cannot dictate article content and a merge is a specialised keep so all that DRV would do is affirm that the content be kept. Whether its kept as a standalone article or a merge does not require an admin to resolve as ordinary editors have the tools for the job. There is an interesting essay about this at WP:ND3. So basically, if I reopened the DRV you would find the outcome is endorse keep with no opinion on the merge. Remember that merge at AFD is a recommendation not a binding consensus as consensus can always change and the content has been found encyclopaedic. I think there are grounds to review the scope of DRV and I would personally support that but, as it stands, it can't help you determine if the article should be standalone or merged. Spartaz Humbug! 15:42, 12 December 2009 (UTC)[reply]
    • Thanks for the speedy response; it was very enlightening. I'm not really too familiar with the ins and outs of DRV, so I'll read up on them sometime soon. Maybe one day I'll start a discussion on WT:DRV. It does seem like things are changing though; the Michaele Salahi AfD, which was closed as keep, looks like it is going to be overturned to merge. NW (Talk) 16:14, 12 December 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Thanks!

I feel sorry for Barbario though as I can understand his/her frustration with Admins and others who ignore policies. But I believe we make sense when we say that a policy/guideline that is not adhered to is invalid. I dont know if that would ever fly to get officially put into the WP:Policies and guidelines page but if you will back it we can always put it on the talk page and see what happens.Camelbinky (talk) 22:33, 12 December 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Foswiki redirect

Hi, you closed the DRV for Foswiki as "deletion endorsed", and so far as I am concerned that's fine because given the recency of the branching the two are best discussed in a single article. However, in my opinion a redirect from Foswiki to TWiki is necessary. Since the branching occurred a year ago, the two branches have had roughly the same public attention (Foswiki probably a bit more than TWiki), and either project has good reason to claim being the official successor of pre-branch TWiki.

I was going to create the redirect myself per common sense, WP:REDIRECT and WP:RECREATE#Valid reasons for recreating a deleted page and ask for its protection afterwards. But it's salted. So: Could you please create the redirect? IMO it should go directly to TWiki, not to a subsection. Hans Adler 12:01, 14 December 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Salahi

Thanks for taking care of that, it was a good call since it rightly pointed out that there was a problem with the AfD close, while suggesting that consensus seemed to be in the direction of a merge, but still leaving it up to editors to work out the specifics. --Bigtimepeace | talk | contribs 17:50, 14 December 2009 (UTC)[reply]

aMSN deletion

Hi, you deleted the aMSN page, and we believe this should not have happened. could you follow the discussion in the talk page of the "AfD" of aMSN, please? Wikipedia_talk:Articles_for_deletion/AMSN

Thanks. Kakarotoks (talk) 20:08, 14 December 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Deletion review for AMSN

An editor has asked for a deletion review of AMSN. Because you closed the deletion discussion for this page, speedily deleted it, or otherwise were interested in the page, you might want to participate in the deletion review. Tim Song (talk) 05:09, 16 December 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/FidoNews

Hi, you just closed this AfD as "no consensus". However, just before it had been relisted to garner more debate. In addition, there were two deletion votes (nom and Nsk92), one remark by Psychonaut that FidoNet is notable (but that is FidoNews' parent organization) with the added expectation that this might mean that FidoNews also is notable (but no vote was given), and one vote by Armbrust to merge and redirect to FidoNet. I would greatly appreciate if you could have a second look at this. Thanks! --Crusio (talk) 07:53, 17 December 2009 (UTC)[reply]

  • No consensus because one editor brought forward multiple sources an no-one challenged them. Therefore there is a presumption that the sources were adequate. It happened late in the debate and the only subsequent vote was ambiguous and I couldn't just assume that delete voters would have retained their position in the face of sourcing. Spartaz Humbug! 08:35, 17 December 2009 (UTC)[reply]
  • I think the sources were not challenged because the editor explicitly stated that they were about "FidoNet", not "FidoNews". (I know that that is why I myself did not challenge them, I did see them shortly after having been posted the day the debate was opened on Dec. 9th). Note that the editor who brought up these references refrained from giving a clear vote himself. --Crusio (talk) 08:50, 17 December 2009 (UTC)[reply]
  • ER, I think I must have misread the relisting date because when I closed I thought it had been relisted for aweek already not the same day. Of course the discussion needs to continue some more. I have reversed the closed and left everything where it was. I guess the only good thing is you have a clue about what you should do with the sources presented. Spartaz Humbug! 09:27, 17 December 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Ready 'N Steady

Why did you delete this page? I thought the matter was still being decided. RMc (talk) 19:45, 17 December 2009 (UTC)[reply]

unclear AfD close, and incomplete close

Hi- two issues. First, your comment on the close of this AfD is somewhat ambigous (to my OCPD mind, at least). Are you saying the consensus is "no consensus", or that it is "merge" if only a suitable target existed?

Secondly, all of the bundled articles haven't been closed properly. tedder (talk) 07:04, 18 December 2009 (UTC)[reply]

  • Fixed the closes and it was no-consensus because there was no clear consensus where to merge it to. Since a merge is an editorial action no consensus is required in a deletion discussion to enact this. Spartaz Humbug! 07:17, 18 December 2009 (UTC)[reply]
Thanks, Spartaz. I try to clean up old AFDs occasionally, those came up. tedder (talk) 07:26, 18 December 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Kimberly Freeman

Why was the page deleted? I don't see discussion there on the reason. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 209.163.168.194 (talk) 20:40, 10 December 2009 (UTC)[reply]

NetLabs

Please restore this page so I can add more secondary sources establishing notability. Davejagoda (talk) 00:32, 19 December 2009 (UTC)[reply]

I will add references to RFC1147: http://www.faqs.org/rfcs/rfc1147.html which mentions NetLabs' agents and to the wiki page on Seagate Software (NetLabs was one of the companies that made up Seagate Software). I also want to link to magazines at the time such as articles like this: http://books.google.com/books?id=1T0EAAAAMBAJ&pg=PA45&lpg=PA45&dq=netlabs+dual+manager&source=bl&ots=xnkWEwUf3E&sig=GO4cW-_Tkr7kH9eJ_zoiDxxDLQQ&hl=en&ei=U1YvS9KNO4OKsQOUuczoDg&sa=X&oi=book_result&ct=result&resnum=4&ved=0CBUQ6AEwAw#v=onepage&q=netlabs%20dual%20manager&f=false. NetLabs is mentioned in this book as well: http://books.google.com/books?id=YKM5MOYLym8C including the role of it's technology which made it into other products (e.g. products sold by Sun, HP, NCR, Siemens, and NTT) - page 47 has a diagram of the various vendors and some of the evolution that occurred. Davejagoda (talk) 11:12, 21 December 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Thanks. Which source do you think is the best one? RFC1147? Davejagoda (talk) 16:04, 22 December 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Good close

Good close here I thought, if earlier than I'd have done it. Nice summary of the point of me listing it in the first place! GedUK  18:34, 20 December 2009 (UTC)[reply]

qutIM's article deletion

Hello again, first of all sorry for quoting of texts in russian, you can easy translate them by http://translate.google.com/, but they're needed for full information.

At the qutIM's AfD there were a little mistakes, but because discussion is finished I can't write in it, so:

  1. Article at habrahabr.ru was created not as flashmob or for asking people to write anything at AfD's page, but as ask for help. So any strange and useless posts were unexpected and I'm sorry for them. "В связи с тем, что у меня нет никаких контактов с админами каких-либо секторов википедии я и написал эту статью. Я не ставлю целью флешмоб, цель в данном случае — разобраться с ситуацией и решить проблему, о чем я и сообщил в конце статьи."(post)
  2. Anyway article at habrahabr.ru was usefull, users helped to find possible reason of several OpenSource Softwares' deletion (I mean qutIM, Jabbin, Gajim, Coccinella and so on, most of them are world-known, but have no reliable sources). Firstly I was surprized if there is no rule how to count notability of Software and OpenSource software, but it exists.

By this rule qutIM and other OpenSource clients should just proove their's activity and the fact, that they have countable number of developers. qutIM's sources are stored at http://gitorious.org/qutim last months, also at http://gitorious.org/+qutim-developers you can see full list of developers and see their contribution to source base. By the way, as it was said in AfD, qutIM now is in official repository of Gentoo, AltLinux, Russian Fedora. Also it's default messenger in Russian Fedora Remix 12 (I've published already all links in AfD), so it's not "just another OpenSource project", but well-known one. EuroElessar (talk) 19:33, 20 December 2009 (UTC)[reply]

  • If its well known you will be able to provide lots and lots of really good sources won't you. Much better then the ones you already presented that have been rejected by the community. And any more stunts like that last canvassing exercise will end any discussion with me immediately. Spartaz Humbug! 20:30, 20 December 2009 (UTC)[reply]
  • Please, read rule more carefully:
The requirement for third party reliable sources for software projects done over the Internet is broken. People don't generally write books or even cnn.com articles about free software projects except for the very biggest ones. EuroElessar (talk) 00:08, 21 December 2009 (UTC)[reply]
Then they are not notable enough for an article. Our overriding requirement is that material must be verifiable and that requires solid sourcing. Spartaz Humbug! 04:26, 21 December 2009 (UTC)[reply]
tomshardware.com is RS, isn't it? EuroElessar (talk) 07:58, 21 December 2009 (UTC)[reply]
Page's photo of OpenSource Mag 28 Nigmatullin Ruslan (talk) 09:45, 21 December 2009 (UTC)[reply]
These all seem product round ups and are not substantial coverage. No opinion on whether the sources are considered reliable. Spartaz Humbug! 13:07, 21 December 2009 (UTC)[reply]
OpenSource Mag is a part of proffessional journal "Системный администратор" which has more than 7 year history, so it's reliable source. Tom's Hardware is world known web resource, so the fact that qutIM was in one line with Pidgin/Psi/Kopete prooves it's notability. Nigmatullin Ruslan (talk) 14:10, 21 December 2009 (UTC)[reply]
The missing aspect is substantial. Passing mentions in product round ups aren't good enough and don't prove notability so whether the source is reliable or not is really academic. You already had several chances to understand this. I'm starting to wonder if this is deliberate? Spartaz Humbug! 14:36, 21 December 2009 (UTC)[reply]
What do you mean by "round up"? No one of definitions (by Macmillan English Dictionary) is suitable here. Also describe (with links to rules) why so-called "round ups" aren't good. Nigmatullin Ruslan (talk) 15:00, 21 December 2009 (UTC)[reply]

qutIM's article deletion - two questions

  • Dear Spartaz, hello! I was a bit surprised to see that my specific comment was cited in your AfD closure comment. But I do apologize for it, I realize now that my joke was definitely out of place.
  • Anyhow, if you don't mind, could you please clarify something for me please? I do understand that my questions might be very dumb and obvious for everybody here, therefore if you think they do not worth an answer and/or you do not have time to respond, please feel free to ignore them, I would totally understand it.
  • My first question is - do you think that we improved the Wikipedia by deleting the qutIM article? If yes - could you please clarify why do you think it was improved?
  • I have now read Wikipedia is not a bureaucracy and Wikipedia:Ignore all rules articles and they seem to contradict with what I have observed.
  • So my second question is: what is more important for Wikipedia - just following the rules OR trying to make it better (bigger) by keeping the article (and possibly asking the author to enhance/rewrite/improve it to make the Wikipedia even better!)?
  • Regardless of what your answer would be, thank you so much for your continuous work and contribution! Alexei.
  • PS EuroElessar, I really am very sorry to interfere again and please accept my sincere apologies for that not-the-most-useful-comment-I-have-made-in-my-life. I just can not keep silence (although maybe I should!) after being mentioned in such a way (I know I did nothing really bad and I definitely did not intend to kill anybody, but now I feel guilty and confused). Realaaa (talk) 05:01, 21 December 2009 (UTC)[reply]
    • let me pose this question. If wikipedia has a clear inclusion standard that isn't perfect by any means but provides a threshold that most of us can understand and live with, why should we waive it for this article? If it were that important a subject then it would easily pass the notability test and its really not a high threshold to pass. I realise that its important to you, that you feel strongly about it, and there is a narrow sectional interest in it, but in the wider world its not a major subject and, if the world were really that interested, there would be lots of stuff out there about it that would easily prove notability. So my answer is that we are not improving wikipedia unless we are trying to keep the overall content relevant to what's being written about in the real world and maintaining a clear standard that everyone, and I generally mean everyone, is expected to meet to keep stuff on the 'pedia. IAR doesn't mean that a narrow sectional view can overrule a broad consensus of the community but it does mean that we should not necessarily be petty about the edges of rules if there is a good outcome to be gained - but always we must consider the wider consensus of what is expected and that is what is prevailing now. Since the community believes the notability standard is what should be applied to articles. I would personally dispute that ignoring a broad consensus is good for what is, at the end of the day, a collegiate and consensus driven system. Spartaz Humbug! 14:49, 21 December 2009 (UTC)[reply]

I want to note here, for the FOSS advocates who keep quoting an RFC from earlier this year. That RFC text is simply an essay by one person. The talk page where other users gave their opinion soundly rejected that the essay had merit. It should probably be moved from the current title to a userspace essay, and appropriately tagged as a failed proposal. Miami33139 (talk) 20:51, 21 December 2009 (UTC)[reply]

TestLink article deleted

An editor has asked for a deletion review of TestLink. Because you closed the deletion discussion for this page, speedily deleted it, or otherwise were interested in the page, you might want to participate in the deletion review.

I just find out you had deleted a page about TestLink. My first impression was that you receive money for. But I think that you are not experienced in software testing discipline. Could you check my review of your action there: [1] Havlatm (talk) 08:57, 22 December 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Spartaz, My English is not good - but I'm sure that I didn't wrote that you receive money for as you wrote in deletion review. I have no reliable article for :-P Havlatm (talk) 10:03, 22 December 2009 (UTC)[reply]

I see its closed so its too late but for the record I would have been happy to withdraw the comment as I misunderstood what you meant by "My first impression was that you receive money for". Spartaz Humbug! 15:17, 22 December 2009 (UTC)[reply]

FYI, I checked wikipedia-pages of similar tools like is TestLink. I find out that you should remove nearly all these tools to follow "yours" rules. For example [2] - this is the most famoust test management tool in the world. I have no copy of TestLink page before deletion (not sure how system shows it to me). But I'm sure that TL page was in better shape. Are you going to delete this page? Bad if yes. You can check also list of "popular tools" on pages [3]. No one of them has reliable citations as you required. That is why I cannot believe you. That is why your proud ideas are wrong in my eyes. Havlatm (talk) 00:01, 26 December 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Notification: Proposed 'Motion to Close' at Wikipedia:Community de-adminship/Draft RfC

You are invited to join the discussion at Wikipedia talk:Community de-adminship/Draft RfC re: a 'Motion to close', which would dissolve Cda as a proposal. The motion includes an !vote. You have previously commented at Wikipedia:WikiProject Administrator/Admin Recall. Best Wishes for the Holidays, Jusdafax 05:44, 24 December 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Comparison between Roman and Han Empires AFD

Hello, I apologize if you already know this, but the said stubbification and reworking was already in progress during the AFD and was largely completed(see current version of the article, largely free of OR and Synthesis). Also see several delete votes that switched to keep as a result of the article being reworked at the end of the AFD, which brought the number of keep votes up to the same as delete. Teeninvestor (talk) 16:11, 25 December 2009 (UTC)[reply]

  • Yes I did read the AFD. Until both sides in the dispute are happy this is the best way to prevent further dispute and some recent participants in the AFD were still voting delete so this is clearly a work in progress even though it is clearly much better then it was. Hopefully, if you have already done much of the work, it will not be long before all sides in the dispute are happy this can be restored. Spartaz Humbug! 16:14, 25 December 2009 (UTC)[reply]
    • It is a work in progress, but Wikipedia is not perfect. Considering the keep votes and arguments were roughly the same (and probably exceeded) as the deleters, this AFD should have been closed as No consensus. The current arrangement merely inconveniences the reader and causes him/her to not want to view the article, as well as delegitimizing it. All work in progress should be carried out in the article space; we do not userify every article that is not perfect. I feel it amounts to a de facto delete. You speak of making the deleters happy; but if you checked, the ones who were working constructively to try to remove OR and synthesis had largely changed to keep, while the ones still voting delete were long-time deleters who simply object to the topic (and comparison articles) in general, even if it's an FA. It will be impossible to try to make them "happy" unless the article is deleted. I propose a different solution; the current version is restored, and any changes to be required through talk page consensus.Teeninvestor (talk) 16:30, 25 December 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Note about the requirement to make both sides of the dispute happy

Thanks for your help, first of all. But if you read the AFD, most of the delete voters who were strong deleters have already switched to keep (the article was overhauled massively during the AFD), while the ones that remain were the ones that have been agitating for nearly a year to delete this article. see this link when they argued that not being able to insert Pro roman OR was a reason to delete the article. They're not giving me any advice cause they don't have concerns; they just want the article deleted. As we can all agree this is a notable topic, a de facto deletion would be a terrible outcome for wikipedia. I propose that instead, if a sufficient number of outside editors agree that the article is suitable for inclusion in the encyclopedia, that the article be restored.Teeninvestor (talk) 16:34, 27 December 2009 (UTC)[reply]
I Think you already said your piece. Spartaz Humbug! 19:28, 27 December 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Deletion review for Comparison between Roman and Han Empires

An editor has asked for a deletion review of Comparison between Roman and Han Empires. Because you closed the deletion discussion for this page, speedily deleted it, or otherwise were interested in the page, you might want to participate in the deletion review. Teeninvestor (talk) 18:25, 25 December 2009 (UTC)[reply]

I think that was the correct move, personally. It should satisfy all sides without pleasing any of them - a sure sign it's right. . when you get a chance, you might switch the stub template to {{Hist-stub}}, but no hurries. --Ludwigs2 06:43, 26 December 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Closed AfD for Asset Voting

Clearly your resolution to WP:Articles for deletion/Asset voting (3rd nomination) "seems to be the best way to resolve this", or you would have resolved it another way, but could you elaborate, perhaps in an afterword to your close as you did here? I'm not ungrateful, just puzzled.

I don't think it's right though that the matter ended on the unresolved accusation against user:Αβγδεζηθικλ by user:Fences and windows. If the discussion is preserved and not blanked as Fences suggested, it's only fair that the answer to Fences' charge be preserved as well. Yappy2bhere (talk) 21:25, 25 December 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Well, okay then. Yappy2bhere (talk) 21:51, 25 December 2009 (UTC)[reply]
Sorry, I didn't mean to be terse but was just going to be when your note reminded me to blank the AFD. I went for the redirect because I thought that a link to material elsewhere would prevent recreation. Spartaz Humbug! 04:22, 26 December 2009 (UTC)[reply]
Okay then, I can understand that. Thank you for letting me know. Yappy2bhere (talk) 06:41, 26 December 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Re: Closure of AFD for Gynoid

Hi Spartaz - I'm a little surprised at your closing comments on WP:Articles for deletion/Gynoid ("no consensus"). It seems an unusual closing statement to me... other than the nominator, only one person !voted "delete", and that editor later admitted that s/he could "see a rationale for having an article on this term". I'd have closed this as a fairly clear keep rather than a no consensus. Grutness...wha? 23:09, 26 December 2009 (UTC)[reply]

  • Well, I thought the arguments about the lack of sourcing for the term were reasonable and I close by looking at the arguments rather then counting heads. There were a couple of keep arguments that were not policy based and one keep but move because the term wasn't sourced so overall I felt there was no consensus. Spartaz Humbug! 04:05, 27 December 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Apology

I am going on my wikibreak, but before I go I would like to apologize for some of my behaviour, which I regret. When I return, I will not edit the article incubator.Teeninvestor (talk) 22:52, 27 December 2009 (UTC)[reply]


Please undelete DeskAway page

I was quite surprised to see a page I made DeskAway has been deleted. A lot of similar services like it have wikipedia pages eg: List of project management software, moreover I had cited references from leading Indian newspapers, TV coverage on leading business channels and top tech blogs worldwide. Thoroughly disappointed with this deletion. Since there seems no way to get email notifications, I could not be part of the discussion for deletion. Can you please re-publish it? --Smoldee (talk) 07:14, 28 December 2009 (UTC)[reply]

  • If you read the deletion discussion the main objection was the promotional tone of the article. I can't really see any harm in letting you have another go at creating this in more neutral language. Do you want me to move it into your area so you can work on a better draft? Spartaz Humbug! 08:12, 28 December 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Ya please shift it to my area, Thanks! --Smoldee (talk) 17:00, 28 December 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Thanks

Thanks very much for the thought. I think I'm too much of a partisan to be selected. And frankly, while I know I'd use the tools well, I don't think it would be unfair of others to not trust me to do so. So I'll pass. Thanks again though! Hobit (talk) 15:48, 28 December 2009 (UTC)[reply]

after your earlier close....

An improved and better sourced version of the article about the Fred movie is currently at Wikipedia:Article Incubator/Fred: The Movie. Over the next few weeks it can be expanded, sourced and further improved so that when it is returned to main pages, it will meet the inclusion requirements set by WP:NF. Please feel free to check in. Best, Schmidt, MICHAEL Q. 04:05, 30 December 2009 (UTC)[reply]

To quote from my close

The sourcing isn't quite there yet but its close. the NYT is one but we need more then one really decent source and arguably this belongs with the main article until the coverage is more substantial, So I'm closing this as a redirect with a specific caveat that this can be undone as and when the sourcing improves without need to refer to me or have any further discussion.

So you don't actually need to come back to me. Just put it back up when you feel the sourcing is good enough. Spartaz Humbug! 04:31, 30 December 2009 (UTC)[reply]
I have read and understand the good faith and intentions of your close. I wanted to thank you and let you know that it was appreciated, as it will deter cries of CSD:G7 when the article returns. Best wishes and happy holidays, Schmidt, MICHAEL Q. 06:45, 30 December 2009 (UTC)[reply]

G'day Spart

and a belated happy new year too! (heck, have some chrismassy greetings too.. my belly, head, and fridge indicate that it's not really over yet!) - would you mind popping Chinese immigration to Sydney, Australia, which you deleted into my userspace - maybe here? - I'm going to work it up into wonderfulness, and the edits to date will no doubt help - I may have some further questions about the deletion too, so may pop back anon if that's cool with you :-) cheers, Privatemusings (talk) 22:07, 1 January 2010 (UTC)[reply]

thanks heaps, Spart :-) - I don't suppose you could also restore the talk page to the appropriate spot too? - from memory there was some review material which I'd like to work from a bit as well.... thanks for such a speedy response too... Privatemusings (talk) 05:10, 2 January 2010 (UTC)[reply]
thanks again! - I've started tidying up, reworking and generally improving the article - and have decided to cull it right down to try and get it fit for mainspace :-) - I wonder if you could take a look at it (and maybe review the talk page?) to see if you feel it's ready for the mainspace at this point? - if you've got any time, any peer review type pointers would also be wonderful :-) cheers, Privatemusings (talk) 21:58, 3 January 2010 (UTC)[reply]
I really think it's ready for 'mainspace' now - I think that would be a better fit for the gnomish sort of content work currently happening in my userspace - I'm gonna be 'bold' and move it back now - but please do pipe up with any further advice / feedback, or anything :-) cheers, Privatemusings (talk) 00:47, 8 January 2010 (UTC)[reply]
User:Orderinchaos felt that a deletion review discussion was necessary, so has deleted the article once more. I've started said review discussion, which you'll find here - maybe you'll get the time to pop in? :-) cheers, Privatemusings (talk) 04:15, 8 January 2010 (UTC)[reply]
yes I see. It looks like its not going you way either. Spartaz Humbug! 08:55, 8 January 2010 (UTC)[reply]

< nope.... :-( - such is life - it'll all come out in the wash, as ever.... Privatemusings (talk) 10:04, 8 January 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Misconceptions2

Given this editor's block evasion (see [4], doesn't this merit a longer block of both master and sock? Dougweller (talk) 19:09, 2 January 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Ok, thanks. I didn't want to get into a wheel war. :-) Dougweller (talk) 20:01, 2 January 2010 (UTC)[reply]
Well, certainly wouldn't consider it wheelwarring for extendinga block where someone has been naughty post block. :-) Spartaz Humbug! 20:04, 2 January 2010 (UTC)[reply]


misconceptions2 user

you mistakenly banned misconceptions2.he has been perma banned for edit warring after ban on caravan raids.

But he did not edit anything as far as i know.This is not his ip ----> 188.221.108.172. it is mine !

He got banned mistakenly. Admin has said that i am not a sock.he did not edit war after ban!

please unban him after sock investigation is over, I feel it is unfair that he should get banned because of me--Mirroryou1 (talk) 16:14, 3 January 2010 (UTC)[reply]

  • I can't help feeling that there is a touch of his reaping what he sowed, since the only reason why your ip was linked to his account was his previous action to evade his block by using your connection. I'm not prepared to unblock him right now, but will happily review this once the SPI is completed. Spartaz Humbug! 16:27, 3 January 2010 (UTC)[reply]
As an admin you have the ability to check ip's, please compare my ip, with misconceptions2. to get this over with. i have also changed my wep key--Mirroryou1 (talk) 15:35, 4 January 2010 (UTC)[reply]
No I don't actually and I have asked the checkuser to expand on the response to the request to help us resolve this. Spartaz Humbug! 15:56, 4 January 2010 (UTC)[reply]
Hi can u also ask the checkuser to verify who's ip address is 188.XX and who's is 84.XX.. do u want me to giv pictures of our 2 ip's. if misconceptions pressed edit, it says his ip is 84.XX, whereas mine is different, i checked on what is my ip.com. i think its crucial that they identify, whos ip, is who's--Mirroryou1 (talk) 16:01, 4 January 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Here is a picture of my ip and computer.http://img205.imageshack.us/img205/1469/dsc00135k.jpg .i will upload misconceptions soon.--Mirroryou1 (talk) 16:16, 4 January 2010 (UTC)[reply]

  • Please stop pestering me and leave me to deal with this my own way. Once the CU has commented further I will review but otherwise its annoying having the orange message bar show up every time I refresh my browser. Just stop. OK? Spartaz Humbug! 16:24, 4 January 2010 (UTC)[reply]

ok i am sorry. i wont do it anymore.last msg:check the sock investigation page for update.--Mirroryou1 (talk) 16:30, 4 January 2010 (UTC)[reply]

there is am update by jpgordon. Jpdragon has said we use different browsers.This shows we are not same person.misconceptions2 had acces to my wireless,not anymore.i changed wep key at uni campus.he can no longer use it to make accounts--Mirroryou1 (talk) 19:06, 4 January 2010 (UTC)[reply]
Looks to me like one user with two different computers. Maybe one can argue that they are roommates with identical editing patterns, use of english, and tag-teaming tendencies. But what's the point? As it is, we have 6 accounts now confirmed as being from the same precise location and used in the same way (Misconceptions2, Mirroryou1, KH360 (still a sleeper), admit-the-truth, Български360, Muhammadproject, and the IPs 188.221.108.172 and 86.18.223.124).Bali ultimate (talk) 19:14, 4 January 2010 (UTC)[reply]

What do you mean whats the point. are you trying to get me banned.Check user has proven we are 2 different persons, since we use different browsers, and the ip 188.XX is mine!! the above accounts u mention, are not my sockpuppets.they are misconceptions2, so dont throw the blame on me--Mirroryou1 (talk) 19:19, 4 January 2010 (UTC)[reply]

    • OK, we can leave it here for the night, I'll try and find time to do a through comparison of edits tomorrow and Josh doesn't exonerate you at all Mirroryou1, just advising its inconclusive either way. Now step back and give my talk page some rest. Spartaz Humbug! 19:23, 4 January 2010 (UTC)[reply]
Ok, but can you please at least reduce the guys ban from permaban to 2 weeks!!! because he is peeing me off!!!! i told u and have admitted the ip 188.XX is mine,the guy got perma banned because of the ip 188.XX and is acting like an idiot. i used it(188.XX) to make an edit on caravan raids.he use to use my internet connection but did not use it to edit caravan raids., i did!!. i hardly use wiki anyway, so i dont mind getting banned for a year or longer in exchange for reducing his ban, he is peeing me off, i dont even use wiki, it is the most unreliable website on the planet!. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Mirroryou1 (talk • contribs) 19:38, 4 January 2010 (UTC)[reply]
Patience. I told you I would try and look at it today and work willing I shall. Spartaz Humbug! 02:33, 5 January 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Greg Snegoff

Re Greg Snegoff, you deleted it after closing Wikipedia:Articles_for_deletion/Greg_Snegoff. It's been recreated. I would have deleted it as WP:CSD#G4 but I'm thinking that might result in a DRV...do you have an opinion on this one?  Frank  |  talk  15:09, 4 January 2010 (UTC)[reply]

  • I don't mind the DRV since it will be upheld unless some sources magically appear in which case I'll be the first to recreate it.. Its toast and salted now. Thanks for the heads up. Spartaz Humbug! 15:13, 4 January 2010 (UTC)[reply]
No problem!  Frank  |  talk  15:14, 4 January 2010 (UTC)[reply]

DRV Close

Just out of my own interest, how would you have closed this DRV if the copyright question had not been raised? Thanks. ÷seresin 02:57, 5 January 2010 (UTC)[reply]

  • oooh, that's a hard question. Without the copyright question I don't think there is a clear consensus so I would probably have made a comment in an editorial capacity to try and move consensus along. Alternatively I might have relisted in the hope that extra eyes would help make the second discussion more useful the the first but that had the risk of a flash mob turning up and perverting the outcome with partial non-policy based comments. FFD is in an even worse state that CFD because its not only low traffic but also doesn't have full community support as its generally there to enforce the NFCC that many users simply can't accept. I feel sorry for anyone who chooses to close FFD discussions as its unlikely that anyone will thank them for their troubles. Spartaz Humbug! 08:46, 8 January 2010 (UTC)[reply]

JIDF

- This article is semi-protected for a month. I'm wanting to use this time to make some fixes that have been needed for some time. I'm currently going through section by section proposing changes. Please feel free to comment or add ideas of your own.--Peter cohen (talk) 17:11, 5 January 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Article "Sisters of Carmel" which you deleted 12/20/09

Hi I am unhappy to see my article Sisters of Carmel which I put a great deal of work into (granted with not a lot of good sources available) was deleted 12/20/09. You mentioned OTRS Ticket#: 2009121510016318. I realize this isn't personal but it is discouraging. Thank you for notifying me on my talk page where I have replied to you. You offered to send me what was deleted by email. Please do, and I will do what I can to make it better because I feel the topic is notable, by a commonsense definition of notability. The email address to use is ellensewall at email dot com. Thanks and peace in the new year. --Elizdelphi (talk) 03:32, 6 January 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Impulse Tracker

Would it be possible for you to paste the original content of Impulse Tracker to User:Expertseries/Impulse Tracker (prior to its deletion on 27dec2009)? I used to run a news site (itnews) for the application and am in the process of reviving the archive to its original 1998 location. Had a number of off-site links, may help us find the references we need. Thanks man, all the best, Expertseries (talk) 00:53, 7 January 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Reel FM

Hi there, regarding Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Reel FM, I would've thought you would have left the AFD running and open to other opinions, as the only contributions on closing were from myself (the nominator) and the editor who started the article. Rapido (talk) 17:59, 8 January 2010 (UTC)[reply]

  • It had already been relisted and then ignored completely so no consensus is a fair outcome here. Spartaz Humbug! 18:52, 8 January 2010 (UTC)[reply]
    • I fully understand; however it's a shame you didn't either relist a second time, or alternatively state WP:NPASR, as after doing a lot of Google searching, I can't find ANY reference to the radio station, and therefore believe the whole article is unsourced, and regarding a non-notable subject. Rapido (talk) 22:16, 8 January 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Yosef Babad (HTC)

Hello Spartaz, great call. Just a quick question, how long will it stay in this category? If just a short period of time, can you move to my sub-page. Thank you. JAAGTalk 18:09, 8 January 2010 (UTC)[reply]

I don't think it was such a great call. For one, it was contrary to a clear consensus. Secondly, dismissing the Chicago Tribune and Chicago Sun-Times as "local papers" is inconsistent with what every primary school child knows about Chicago.--brewcrewer (yada, yada) 18:34, 8 January 2010 (UTC)[reply]
Yes, I already know you firmly believed the article should have been kept. Spartaz Humbug! 18:53, 8 January 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Stumpwm

re Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Stumpwm, please undelete and redirect the page. --Gwern (contribs) 19:00 8 January 2010 (GMT)

Preservation of content which was not libelous, large, disgusting, and which was read and valued by nearly 100 people a day according to stats.grok.se.
If, unfortunately, that is not enough of a consideration for you, then undelete it so that someone could do a proper merge. --Gwern (contribs) 21:17 8 January 2010 (GMT)
The consensus of the discussion was that the material was unsourced so we delete that not merge it somewhere. Merge material needs to be verifiable and sourced otherwise it doesn't qualify for merging. And on a personal note, you might find people would be more willing to help you if the messages you left there weren't so abrupt and were less demanding. Spartaz Humbug! 04:50, 9 January 2010 (UTC)[reply]
==Deletion review for Stumpwm==

An editor has asked for a deletion review of Stumpwm. Because you closed the deletion discussion for this page, speedily deleted it, or otherwise were interested in the page, you might want to participate in the deletion review. AndreasBWagner (talk) 01:20, 10 January 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Gwern, I will provide you with a copy of the article at User:Gwern/Stumpwm. You can then improve and restore to mainspace or merge. Spartaz, you should know that lack of a reference is not grounds to delete. The question is whether a reference could be found, and I think this user should have a chance to make an attempt. There is nothing slanderous in the article, so there's no problem with userification. Please don't be so bitey when people question your deletions. Jehochman Brrr 10:37, 9 January 2010 (UTC)[reply]
Again with the personal insults. Are you able to control yourself? The user asked for it to be undeleted. I did the next best thing, because unlike you, I don't unilaterally over-rule other administrators. Jehochman Brrr 10:50, 9 January 2010 (UTC)[reply]
You are welcome to post on my talk page any time. :-) Spartaz Humbug! 10:52, 9 January 2010 (UTC)[reply]
Thank you. Feel free to disagree with me any time, any place. This whole situation is funny because I'm usually viewed as a deletionist. Jehochman Brrr 11:02, 9 January 2010 (UTC)[reply]
I'm completely mystified by what your point is but since I'm going out to the park with my kids on a lovely sunny day I really don't mind not understanding you. Spartaz Humbug! 11:09, 9 January 2010 (UTC)[reply]
Excellent! Have fun. Jehochman Brrr 11:34, 9 January 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Greg Snegoff

You obviously didn't see the Internet Movie Database and Anime News Network links when you deleted the page for having no sources. If you doubt their credibilty, go watch the animes he was credited for and you'll see his name show up. As already mentioned, his roles in Golgo 13 and Robotech are by no means trivial. Same goes for his appearances in Fist of the North Star and My Neighbor Totoro. Bluerules (talk) 21:08, 10 January 2010 (UTC)[reply]

  • IMDB oesnt count towards notable sourcing because it is user generated content, er as is the ANN source you mentioned, so neither count for anything. You should relaly be looking towards rela world sourcing, magazines, papers, books, reviews, that kind of thing. Spartaz Humbug! 03:44, 11 January 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Thanks

Thanks for your help with Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Supporters of Sun Myung Moon. What wasn't mentioned is that lots of the editing on Unification Church related articles is driven by conspiracy theory interests. Steve Dufour (talk) 03:28, 11 January 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Chrismahanukwanzakah (3rd nomination)

Hi, Spartaz. You closed Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Chrismahanukwanzakah (3rd nomination) as delete. Although I did not participate in the AfD and have no opinion as to whether the topic warrants an article, I believe that a soft redirect to wikt:Chrismahanukwanzakah would be helpful to the readers. I created a soft redirect and the page has been nominated for RfD on the basis of it being deleted at AfD. Bearian (talk · contribs) and I have some disagreement over whether or not the AfD close prevents such a redirect. As you are the closing admin of the AfD, I would be grateful if you could provide some input about this at User talk:Cunard#Wikipedia:Redirects for discussion/Log/2010 January 10#Chrismahanukwanzakah and Wikipedia:Redirects for discussion/Log/2010 January 10#Chrismahanukwanzakah. Thanks, Cunard (talk) 21:15, 11 January 2010 (UTC)[reply]

really?

I don't remember all the pages you deleted being discussed. How did you manage that? --Neptunerover (talk) 04:40, 12 January 2010 (UTC)[reply]

"On the "TOE'" was something I was barely starting on before all this crap started and I haven't had any time to do anything constructive with it yet. I did intend for it to go somewhere. I was never warned that it was in danger of deletion, and I think its deletion might have been an understandable mistake, considering all the anger directed toward anything me. Still, I don't think such an article would be considered inappropriate in Wikipedia, assuming I were allowed to complete it with the necessary references and so forth to make it acceptable in the main encyclopedia. Complete is something I don't think it should be expected to be at this point. This article was a completely different animal than the other two stupid economic articles (stupid or weird or whatever, I still consider them harmless). I will be the first to admit that there are some very weird things going on in my userspace, but it's pretty much harmless weirdness. There's nothing hateful or racist, or ... . Why are so many people willing to attack someone just for being different? That's a rhetorical question actually, since the answer, as always, is fear. But why are they so afraid of me and my thoughts? --Neptunerover (talk) 05:33, 12 January 2010 (UTC)[reply]

I'm sorry to lay this all on you. I've just felt so hounded. I'm actually a very easy going person. When people are hard on me though, I don't go easy on them. I still need to report Fences&Windows for his inappropriate activities in what I perceive as his abuse of power. I'll just point it out and let somebody else judge him though. I already know what his game is and why he didn't like what I was writing. --Neptunerover (talk) 05:33, 12 January 2010 (UTC)[reply]
There have been two discussions that have endorsed the fact that you should not be using your userspace as a webhost and the page I deleted was clearly under the scope of this and a third discussion was never going to reach a different conclusion. It's really time for you to just accept it and move on. Spartaz Humbug! 06:06, 12 January 2010 (UTC)[reply]


Ioquake3

Once again the ioquake3 wikipedia entry has been deleted for being without notability when, in fact, this is wholly inaccurate. ioquake3 is the de-facto standard in quake 3 engine technology with many games and other projects being based on it. Some of those games include Urban Terror, World of Padman, and tremulous. I created ioquake3 in 2005 and it has continued since then with the help of many contributors. To say that it is irrelevant does the project and those that use it a severe disservice and I think contributes to the overall discouragement of smaller open source and free software projects, as if they and the contributions made to them are without merit. id software created the original code base and released it onto the internet. To say that projects based on the original source release are not notable is like saying that it wouldn't be notable if Ray Bradbury released a book under a creative commons license solely to the net and someone took that and made an entirely new and interesting work of fiction based on it.

Of course, having created ioquake3 you can take my words with a grain of salt. Please don't let that stop you from researching the notability of the project yourself. Perhaps starting with these links:

http://www.theinquirer.net/inquirer/news/566/1040566/two-free-games-based-on-the-quake-3-engine-tip-up

http://www.linux.com/feature/136752

Many people have brought up many more accurate points of notability including academic and other sources on the now-deleted entry for ioquake3. TimeDoctor (talk) 07:49, 12 January 2010 (UTC)[reply]

  • At the very best this has marginal real world notability and the consensus at the discussion was that it didn't even have that. Wikipedia consensus is based on measuring arguments against policy not counting noses in a discussion. Here is the deal, I will undelete the article if you show me some proper real world secondary sources such as published media and books that discuss the subject in detail. If you can't then I won't be able to help you with this. Spartaz Humbug! 16:46, 12 January 2010 (UTC)[reply]
  • As was shown in the last article revision (http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Ioquake3&oldid=337262275), it's use in academic work, it's inclusion with many operating systems, and the (admittedly weak) sources, all point towards notability, and as such demonstrate a keep (as is also wanted by the majority of users), or at very least a merger. Redirect makes no sense. Comrade Hamish Wilson (talk) 22:40, 12 January 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Pamela Taylor deletion

To my reading the AFD on Pamela Taylor indicated no consensus. Can you please reconsider, particularly since some editors may have a political motivation in having a candidate's article deleted during an election campaign. I have put the AFD up for review at Wikipedia:Deletion_review/Log/2010_January_12#Pamela_Taylor. Also, there were several requests on the AFD to merge the article Pamela Taylor, which you have deleted, to Progressive Conservative Party candidates, 2007 Ontario provincial election. Could you do this? Fred the happy man (talk) 18:24, 12 January 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Message

Hello, thank you for your restorations, but I updated my part on undeletion request. Can you see this ? Thanks in advance, regards — Neustradamus (✉) 19:49, 12 January 2010 (UTC)[reply]

How long does Neustradamus have to transwiki these? As they sit long term in his userspace, they continue to have mainspace categories and templates, and aren't marked as user workspace. For the amount of time he spends doing anything else and the priority he has demanded on everyone else fulfilling his requests it certainly should not have taken him long to tranwiki them over. Miami33139 (talk) 21:13, 12 January 2010 (UTC)[reply]

It is in progress, you can see on wiki.xmpp.org but you remove all articles, so I requested deleted articles (for example about Simple Instant Messenger removed and I see "keep" in deletion page, and the merge is not done too) — Neustradamus (✉) 21:34, 12 January 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Personal request

Before I retired, my user page contained some personal information in the history. I've recently been...well, the best word I can come up with is _stalked_, and if you could delete my user page and its history I would REALLY appreciate it. EagleFalconn (talk) 03:29, 13 January 2010 (UTC)[reply]

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