Talk:Adolf Hitler

Images

The images used here (especially the first one) depict a proud Hitler, not even being in need to look into the camera. This must be a well-condidered and selected image taken by Goebbels propagande machinery. I wonder, if there are no non-propaganda images that may even unmask Hitler as a fatuitous politician instead of glorifying him. 78.53.37.1 (talk) 12:25, 20 June 2010 (UTC)

Since images of him were carefully controlled, it is unlikely that we'll find many high quality ones of the type you are asking for. Also, what you are asking for is POV in itself. Wikipedia should reflect the sources available, not our personal opinions. However, it may be preferable to note in image captions when the images are from propaganda sources, or in the main body of the article. (Hohum ^@) 19:26, 24 June 2010 (UTC)

The main images for almost all politicians pages on this site are the official ones. Why should Hitler be any different? Any deviation herein would be propaganda.

--I, Englishman^{Wouldst thou speak? • Handiwork} 01:35, 19 August 2010 (UTC)

The reliable sources avaliable ARE out personal opinions. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 66.183.58.186 (talk) 08:23, 18 September 2010 (UTC)

Hidden History carefully occulted. Adolf Hitler was not a homosexual but he was bisexual and he used Eva Braun to hide his homosexual inclinations from scrutiny. There were 17 cases in wartime of Hitler "intensely befriending" boy members of the Hitler Youth who once they spent time alone with their Fuhrer in private were never ever seen again. This is fact, recounted by an Italian Diplomat to me in 1963, as he hsad been in his time a confidant of Mussolini who told him, and who explained why the Nazis under Hitlers orders persecuted and sent to not concentration camps but extermination camps any limp wristed member of the public. Others unfortunate enough to be known to him personally were just rounded up and executed, by firing squad, sometimes even at night. Fact.—Preceding unsigned comment added by 212.120.237.236 (talk) 13:41, 2 December 2010 (UTC)

Hitler was not homosexual or bisexual. He was straight and only had relationships with women. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 92.238.185.104 (talk) 08:51, 13 December 2010 (UTC)

Edit request from HenryIreton1642, 6 November 2010

{{edit semi-protected}}

The assertion that Hitler conquered Asia and parts of the Pacific is unwarranted and misleading. This was done by his ally, Imperial Japan. The article needs to be edited to reflect this. I suggest deletion of these words. HenryIreton1642 (talk) 21:26, 6 November 2010 (UTC)

Thanks for your comments. The text does presently say that it was Germany and the Axis powers , which appears to be quite correct. Also, could you (and other users requesting an edit) please be a bit more specific as we are all volunteers and it is not easy attempting to understand requests. Perhaps we could change it to ..Germany has this and the axis powers had that...I made an edit to the lede in an attempt to address this edit request.Off2riorob (talk) 22:43, 6 November 2010 (UTC)

Germany and the Axis powers seems more correct. "European allies" might confuse readers with Allied Forces. Perhaps another word for "allies" could be used instead.MusicTree3 (talk) 05:04, 27 December 2010 (UTC)

adolf hitler had gay moments. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 24.196.237.70 (talk) 00:52, 26 January 2011 (UTC)

Adolf Hitler's Y DNA haplogroup

I do not want to get too involved in discussion on this matter. This is just a passing comment. I have done a fair bit of work on E1b1b.

• Can it be sourced? Yes, not with perfect strength, but I think the identification of Hitler's Y DNA type is what would normally be considered reasonably reliable sourcing, so in theory there is no reason not to mention it from the point of view of verifiability. I do think it is perhaps worth attributing as a theory put together by a journalist for the time being, because a newspaper organizing testing of relatives is not perfect. But to be honest the basic testing of Y DNA to this level of information is not cutting edge science anymore today.
• My bigger question would be whether it is notable. The journalist who organized the testing made (or perhaps implied is a better word) some interpretative remarks obviously aimed at making the discovery notable, for example mentioning that Jews and Africans are sometimes in the same haplogroup. This interpretation is pretty poor though. E1b1b is one of the most common haplogroups in Austria. I do not know of any published responses to the journal yet but in the first place this level of interpretation has a higher level of scientific difficulty, and so sourcing should be a bit stricter.

The remark as it is currently in does not mention the interpretation and makes it clear that it was by a journalist, so it is then up to editors of this article to determine whether it is notable enough in that form. Basically it just means Hitler was in a common Y DNA haplogroup that many other Austrians and Germans are in.--Andrew Lancaster (talk) 09:38, 20 November 2010 (UTC)

We went through all this before; very recently. See: Talk:Adolf Hitler/Archive 51. There are WP:FRINGE and WP:VERIFY problems and no consensus to add it at this time. Kierzek (talk) 19:37, 20 November 2010 (UTC)

Just in case it was not clear, I posted the above because I saw it was added in again recently, and given that this shows some disagreement still exists, I thought it might help to give editors of this article some insight into how someone editing E1b1b sees it. I don't see how WP:FRINGE and WP:VERIFY are the issues with any basic report which does not mention Jews and Somalians. There is no mainstream counter theory and nothing controversial about the science of the basic test, or indeed the genealogy work. In any case a journalist is not an unusual source for such investigations. I can imagine it might seem like WP:REDFLAG is an issue, but that would I think be more clear if there was a lot of complex interpretation of the test (the stuff about Jews and Somalians we keep seeing). Here's my point: without the interpretation about Jews and Somalians (which is indeed nonsense) I believe there is then a problem with WP:NOTE, and also a concern that just by including the fact, significance is being implied when in fact E1b1b is common in Austria.--Andrew Lancaster (talk) 14:26, 22 November 2010 (UTC)

Well, yes, I think that's the point. Without the "Hitler was a black Jew" aspect, the story is pretty much meaningless and probably unworthy of mention. Paul B (talk) 14:34, 22 November 2010 (UTC)

I disagree, for two reasons:

* The fact that E1b1b is common in Austria (or even Europe in general) is meaningful, simply because few readers know that it is common. That (in addition to Hitler's fame as a racist) is what makes it interesting and notable: it contextualises Hitler's ideology by linking it to a more general lack of awareness about human history. Are we so timid about challenging preconceptions and putting forward counter-intuitive facts?

* The source is clearly as reliable, if not more so, than others used in this article and those used in many articles.

Grant | Talk 12:06, 30 November 2010 (UTC)

The fact that few readers know it is common is no more relevant than any other obscure and largely meaningless fact that few readers might know. As for Hitler's ideology, the model of race that he would be familiar with are so different from the genealogical information that haplogroups give us that it is difficult to judge what would be a meaningful statement about the relationship between the two. Race in Hitler's day meant a physical "type" which was supposed to represent a definable grouping of people, whose supposed bodily and mental characteristics were sometimes conceived of as primarily adaptive and sometimes as implying a particular genealogy. So I'm unclear what "counter-intuitive facts" we would be putting forward. Paul B (talk) 12:28, 30 November 2010 (UTC)

Paul, I don't think it it is an "obscure" or "largely meaningless" fact.

Regarding Hitler's "model of race", it definitely had its basis in genealogy/"breeding" (i.e. genetics); that, after all was what the word "race" meant originally and when Hitler was alive. (Whereas more recent fascists prefer to use cultural distinctions, in part because they know that DNA research has demonstrated the "exotic"/heterogeneous nature of most humans' ancestry.)

The "counter-intuitive fact" is, in a nutshell, this: non-"Aryan" elements (i.e. Semitic/North African ancestors) in Hitler's family tree were and are completely normal for a Western European. Of course you and I know this; I am trying to put ordinary readers first, rather than well-read Wikipedia editors :-) Grant | Talk 08:15, 1 December 2010 (UTC)

What I am saying is that even racial theorists in Hitler's day had models of ancient population movements that supposed that the "Nordic race" and the "Alpine race" (the ones to which Hitler himself was typically assigned) emerged from earlier ancestors - whether in Asia, North Africa or elsewhere. That's what I meant by race being conceived of as a "type" in which ancestry and adaptive characters combined to create a definite race. Baur, Lenz and Fisher, whose book Human Heredity was the main immediate influence on Hitler's theories, argued that the Nordic race had come into being from pre-Nordic ancestors fairly recently, as a result of adaptation to the harsh northern European environment. In other words the existence of non-Nordic ancestors would not somehow undermine the model, but would be predicted by it. In this model of race, two people could both be "Nordic" even if they had completely different ancestors (far enough back), because the race was created (supposedly) from adaptation, irrespective of very ancient ancestry. Most theorists, of course, assumed that races diverged from one another, and so would likely have some common ancestry at some point in the past. Paul B (talk) 09:56, 1 December 2010 (UTC)

My point is that (regardless of the theory of race) Nazi ideologues clearly regarded any "non-Aryan" ancestors as undesirable (even when they considered that individual cases did not warrant genocide) and that they, often (perhaps mostly) held "one drop" theories of race. That is exactly why individual Nazis (including Hitler) concealed, contested or tried to suppress knowledge/suggestions of such ancestry in their own cases. When more recent science, using techniques that were not available in the 1930s or 40s, shows Hitler to be something that he is famous for holding in contempt, I think that is obviously relevant and interesting to many readers. To a lesser degree, as I have said before, there is added interest because this research refutes misguided, but lingering, misconceptions about the "homogeneity" of the European gene pool. Grant | Talk 06:08, 2 December 2010 (UTC)

Why on the Ancestry bit does the DNA result says "likely" when that is just what the article says which is absolutely rubbish it makes the whole bit of information above it sound hyprotical and stupid. — Preceding unsigned comment added by GeordieNUFC (talk • contribs) 20:23, 11 December 2010 (UTC)

Reverted once again afer being added back on as a "minor" edit; which it is not. There is no consensus for the addition (see discussions above and prior); it has been discussed at length. It is speculation, conjuncture and has RS problems. Kierzek (talk) 16:13, 20 December 2010 (UTC)

How is it "speculation", "conjuncture" and "RS problems"? Hitlers genetic background has been reported in several reliable sources, yet for some reason people don't want it here. --Supreme Deliciousness (talk) 11:02, 30 January 2011 (UTC)

Whitewash

I would think that some indication that his name is used as a synonym for evil should make it into the first paragraph. --Ezra Wax (talk) 18:41, 26 November 2010 (UTC)

Is this a comment for encyclopedic discussion, have you got a citation? I searched your comment in google, Adolf Hitlers name is used as a synonym for evil and didn't get any real results? Off2riorob (talk) 19:09, 26 November 2010 (UTC)

How about "modern day hitler"? --Ezra Wax (talk) 20:59, 26 November 2010 (UTC)

In the UK we sometimes use the expression tin-pot hitler for an officious authority figure but that hardly reflects his crimes. The expression modern day hitler does get some interesting results but I don't really see it worthy of inclusion, but perhaps others will, or be bold and add it and see how it goes, regards. Off2riorob (talk) 21:08, 26 November 2010 (UTC)

There are two different issues of usage here, I think:

(a) Hitler and his regime are sometimes used as examples of the most extreme evil (not quite synonyms for the concept of evil).

(b) The term 'Hitler' is used to describe someone as authoritarian - e.g. http://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/little_Hitler. Barnabypage (talk) 22:05, 26 November 2010 (UTC)

Referring back to another user-generated wiki is as bad as referring back to a blog. This isn't a legit source. Ekwos (talk) 06:41, 30 November 2010 (UTC)

It's an example in Talk, not a proposed source for the article. Barnabypage (talk) 11:35, 1 December 2010 (UTC)

Are the results of a google search really encyclopedic material? Are we going to include the results of all google search results in all articles? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 124.180.186.233 (talk) 13:38, 30 January 2011 (UTC)

Hitler's Sexuality

Hidden History carefully occulted. Adolf Hitler was not a homosexual but he was bisexual and he used Eva Braun to hide his homosexual inclinations from scrutiny. There were 17 cases in wartime of Hitler "intensely befriending" boy members of the Hitler Youth who once they spent time alone with their Fuhrer in private were never ever seen again. This is fact, recounted by an Italian Diplomat to me in 1963, as he hsad been in his time a confidant of Mussolini who told him, and who explained why the Nazis under Hitlers orders persecuted and sent to not concentration camps but extermination camps any limp wristed member of the public. Others unfortunate enough to be known to him personally were just rounded up and executed, by firing squad, sometimes even at night. Fact.—Preceding unsigned comment added by 212.120.237.236 (talk) 13:41, 2 December 2010 (UTC)

Hitler was not homosexual or bisexual. He was straight and only had relationships with women. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 92.238.185.104 (talk) 08:51, 13 December 2010 (UTC)

Control

The article suggests he may have had borderline personality order, which "and would imply Hitler was in full control of himself and his actions." Surely there is a "not" or "not always" missing there? - assuming that the posthumous diagnosis of BPD is justified.Straw Cat (talk) 14:20, 28 November 2010 (UTC)

The whole section seemd very poor and uncited so I removed it with the edit summary of .. speculation, uncited and tagged as close paraphrasing since March - removing, feel free to cite and assert notability and replace - Off2riorob (talk) 14:48, 28 November 2010 (UTC)

Edit request from NichtKevin, 2 December 2010

{{edit semi-protected}} In subtopic: Legacy

change "Loosely translated it reads: 'For peace, freedom // and democracy // never again fascism // millions of dead remind [us] '" to "Loosely translated it reads: 'For peace, freedom // and democracy // never again fascism // millions of dead warning '"

This is a more literate translation of the inscription. NichtKevin (talk) 18:05, 2 December 2010 (UTC)

If it were a literal translation then it wouldn't be a loose translation — not to mention that Mahnen is better translated as to remind per this reference. Cheers. My76Strat 06:49, 3 December 2010 (UTC)

Request : Adolf Hitler (Thai version)

The thai version of this article exposes Adolf Hitler as a good person and only this face of this man. Maybe someone needs to edit the thai version of this article or update it to show all his personality. (124.120.192.83 (talk) 20:55, 9 December 2010 (UTC))

Query

Does anyone know if Hitler had a daughter? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 121.254.18.61 (talk) 07:21, 12 December 2010 (UTC)

No, he did not. Kierzek (talk) 16:16, 20 December 2010 (UTC)

He did not, although the children's book "Hitler's Daughter" by Jackie French is quite interesting. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 99.90.180.59 (talk) 22:10, 4 January 2011 (UTC)

color Photos

wikipedia is a great site and we can put in it more color photos which will be fantastic to look on. for detailed colored photos of the nazi period, look into http://www.scribd.com/doc/12588702/Nazi-Germany-Color-Photos-from-LIFE-archive — Preceding unsigned comment added by Preethamnewgen (talk • contribs) 09:10, 24 December 2010 (UTC)

Hitler's contributions

There's been some argument about the neutrality of the introduction. I've edited the last paragraph to make the tone more consistent with the rest of the intro: it's clear that there are at least three editors including myself against Tdadamemds specific language, but I do agree that the information is useful, and I think that paragraph has been reverted enough :) Publicly Visible (talk) 06:29, 27 December 2010 (UTC)

Ok, this is a looooong article. Maybe we should just pull it out. The material is covered later, and the intro isn't even that negative. Publicly Visible (talk) 07:02, 27 December 2010 (UTC)

Hitler's leadership created the world's first national freeway system. It created the world's first operational jet aircraft. It created the world's first rocket to poke into space. And I cited a photo from LIFE Magazine that shows his personal involvement with the VW. You all think these facts are adequately covered in the body of the article?

I thoroughly expected all the reverts. That fits the standard for covering Hitler's history. I myself will not edit this article any more for a long time. You all can decide what kind of facts you want to have covered. Certainly there are others here who promote the Wikipedia standard of NPOV. I will be glad to address questions or issues for me here in the Talk, but I'll hold back on editing the article itself until 2012 at the earliest.

And btw, I do not see blaming him personally for the Holocaust while merely crediting "his government" for these other things as being part of a balanced equation.--Tdadamemd (talk) 08:09, 27 December 2010 (UTC)

Also, when deciding on whether to water down the phrase "spacecraft technology" to "rockets", you may want to keep in mind that the Chinese were launching rockets well over a thousand years ago, whereas Hitler's V-2 was the "First rocket to reach outer space. "This third day of October, 1942, is the first of a new era in transportation, that of space travel..." (Walter Dornberger)"

--Tdadamemd (talk) 08:41, 27 December 2010 (UTC)

Hahaha, this makes me laugh, clearly you are pro-nazi, and no, we cannot have Hitlers 'positive' contributions listed as he KILLED 7 MILLION JEWS! I think that outweighs any neo nazi propaganda about Hitler doing anything good. Now fuck off little man and accept the modern world124.180.186.233 (talk) 13:46, 30 January 2011 (UTC)

Does Kershaw count?

Post from banned editor

5 Aug 2010 I posted on Talk: Death of Adolf Hitler: (random questions) “I am not a scholar, I read Wiki but would not think of editing it. But I was disappointed in this article, and many points in the discussion, so I am asking some questions. Perhaps someone else will read and address them.99.41.251.5 (talk) 01:27, 5 August 2010 (UTC)” 6 Aug 2010 I posted on Talk: Death of Adolf Hitler: (random questions) “If I had read Kershaw's Nemesis Chapter 17 note 156 and Epilogue note 1 I wouldn't have wasted your time. You can't get much clearer than that. Should be required reading. Perhaps someone else should read them, and possibly edit the article. Thank you for your time.99.41.251.5 (talk) 17:48, 6 August 2010 (UTC)” 7 Aug 2010 I posted on Talk: Death of Adolf Hitler: (random questions) “I would like to direct people to the work of Ian Kershaw Hitler, 1939-1945: Nemesis ISBN 0393322521. Chapter 17 and the epilogue relate to this article. Please pay attention to his notes and sources. Be warned, his book Hitler: a Biography is a kind of digest which does not include these resources. Wm5200 (talk) 16:36, 7 August 2010 (UTC)” 12 Aug 2010 Gwen Gale posted on Talk:Wm5200 (Talk:Death of Adolf Hitler) “Article talk pages are not meant as general forums or question boards about a topic. Moreover, they are not meant as outlets for your original thoughts on topics, even if you put those thoughts as questions. Please either start citing sources (along with thoughts about how to echo those sources in the text), or stop posting to Talk:Death of Adolf Hitler. If you would like to know more about how to deal with (and skirt) plagiarism worries on en.Wikipedia, you might have a look at Wikipedia:Plagiarism. Gwen Gale (talk) 20:31, 12 August 2010 (UTC) The remark on plagarism was in answer to my concern about copying Kershaw and Joachimsthaler to the discussion. Do you think that “Assume Good Faith” was being implemented? 12 Aug 2010 I posted on Talk:Wm5200 (Kershaw knows): “Joachimsthaler was a used paperback to be read while waiting in line. I throw many of these away, they can be so stupid and/or offensive, but this guy sounded good. So I tried to check him out. When I opened up Kershaw, I tripped over the Rosetta stone of dead Hitlerism. In two footnotes this brilliant man put everything in perspective. For the first time since I was in third grade, all the pieces fit. I have no answers, but I know who does. Nobody will listen. Every question south of Kershaw relates indirectly to either him or Joach. The answers have been on the shelf of the public library for ten years, yet Wiki will not listen. I believe you have been an obstruction to any information which disputes your poison and Russian autopsy garbage. This same stuff happened before. You should be disciplined. I suppose it will be me who gets shut off. Always a pleasure doing business with you.Wm5200 (talk) 22:29, 12 August 2010 (UTC) “ Since 12 August 2010 I have been trying to get an admin (and other editors) to read these footnotes, and see if they may relate to the article Death of Adolf Hitler. For my efforts I have been dismissed, insulted, censored, and blocked. Yet somehow, I still believe that these notes may have some bearing on “the article”. I am now going to copy these two footnotes, to the best of my ability, and hope that there is one admin in Wiki who will read and deal with them. Gwen Gale not only won’t, but appears to be trying to supress them. Thank you, here they come. HITLER 1936-1945 NEMESIS by Ian Kershaw @2000 ISBN 0-393-04994-9 NOTES TO CHAPTER 17: EXTINCTION page 1037 156. Amtsgericht Laufen, Verfahren des Amtsgerichts Berchtesgaden zur Toderserklarung bzw. Feststellung der Todeszaeit von Adolf Hitler, testimony of Otto Gunsche, 19-21 June 1956, Bl.5-6, 8-9; testimony of Heinz Linge, 8-10 February 1956, Bl. 5-8; Joachimsthaler, 230, 232. The meticulous study of the testimony and forensic evidence by Joachimsthaler, 229-73, dispels doubt about the manner of death. The earliest accounts emanating from the bunker were that Hitler shot himself and Eva Braun had taken poison. Below (who left before the suicides) heard this as early as 6 May related by one of the guards attached to the bunker (PRO, London, WO208/3781, Fol. 5, interrogation of Nicolaus von Below, n.d.(but covering letter is of 22 June 1946)). Hugh Trevor-Roper was given the same information by Erich Kempka and Artur Axmann, who saw the bodies in situ, as well as by Martin Bormann‘s secretary Else Kruger. (PRO WO208/3790, Fol. 54 (Trevor-Roper’s handwritten note, on a chronology of events during the last days in the bunker).) The key witnesses give no indication that a shot was heard - counter to some of the unreliable stories (e.g. Michael A. Musmanno Collection, Duquesne University, Pittsburg, interview with Gertraud Junge, 7 February 1948, FF25, Fol.48; IfZ, ED 100, Irving-Sammlung, Traudl Junge Memoirs, Fol.159; Galante, 21, testimony of Junge). The intentionally misleading account of Hitler’s death by cyanide poisoning put about by Soviet historians - see, especially, Lev Bezymenski, The Death of Adolf Hitler. Unknown documents from Soviet Archives, London, 1968, can be dismissed. Equally redundant are the findings of Petrova and Watson, The Death of Hitler. The earliest suggestion that that Hitler had poisoned, not shot, himself appears to come from the reported testimony from about an hour after the shooting by Sergeant Fritz Tornow, who had helped poison Hitler’s alsatian, and said he had detected a similar odour in the room after the suicides (though he had not been in the room before the removal of the bodies)(PRO, London, WO208/3790, Fol.128 (where he is named Tornoff), testimony of Willi Otto Muller, 4 February 1946). Hitler’s pilot, Hans Bauer, claimed on release from prison in Moscow in 1949 that Hitler had taken poison, then shot himself through the head. But Bauer was not present at the time of the deaths, and his evidence is in any case unreliable in several respects. (See Joachimsthaler, 225, 260.) Arthur Axmann, who had seen the bodies, also testified on 16 October 1947 that Hitler had first taken poison and then shot himself through the mouth (PRO, WO208/4475, Fol.39). He repeated this in his interview with Musmanno on 7 January 1948 ((Michael A. Musammo Collection, Duquesne University, Pittsburg, interview with Arthur Axmann, 7 January 1948, FFl, Fols 28-32, 44) saying he had the information from Gunsche, which the latter explicitly denied (Joachimsthaler, 236-7). Axmannís claim contradicted, morever, his earlier testimony from 1946 (see below). Neither of the surviving witnesses to the scene immediately following the deaths - Linge and Gunsche - who saw the bodies in situ suggested that Hitler had poisoned himself; and there was no trace of the acrid smell of bitter almonds on his body (in distinction to that of Eva Braun). This negative evidence in itself also rules out the faint possibility that he both took poison and shot himself. The speed at which prussic acid acts would itself render it virtually impossible for Hitler to have crushed the ampoule of poison and then shot; and if the poison could have been swollowed a split-second after the shooting, the spasms incurred would have caused the blood to splatter on the shoulder and immediate surrounds, which did not happen. (On this, see Joachimsthaler, 269-70 and, including a few lines not to be found in the German original, the English version of his book, The Last Days of Hitler, the Legends, the Evidence, the Truth. London, 1996, 179-80.) The forensic evidence also eliminates the story, first put round by Artur Axmann, though based on hearsay evidence without substance, that Hitler shot himself in the mouth. Axmann had in his earliest testimony, in fact, explicetly ruled out a shot through the mouth and claimed (as Gunsche had done) that Hitler had shot himself through the right temple (PRO, WO208/3790, Fol.125 (Axmann Interrogation, 14 January 1946)). Notions that Hitler was given a coup de grace by Linge or Gunsche - a further surmise of Bezymenski - are utterly baseless. The “theories” of Hugh Thomas, Doppelganger: The Truth about the Bodies in the Berlin Bunker, London, 1995-that Hitler was strangled by Linge, and that the female body burned was not that of Eva Braun, who escaped from the bunker, belong in fairyland. NOTES TO EPILOGUE page 1038 1. This and what follows is based on Joachimsthaler, chs. 5-7, the most reliable and detailed examination of the cremation of Hitler and Eva Braun, providing, in addition (347ff.), compelling reasons for utmost scepticism toward the Soviet claims to have recovered the remains of Hitler’s body and to have performed an autopsy on it. (For this, see Bezymenski, Death of Adolf Hitler, and, for an early expression of scepticism, the review of Bezymenskiís book by Hugh Trevor-Roper, ‘The Hole in Hitlerís Head’, Sunday Times, 29 September 1968.) It also rests on the testimony of Heinz Linge and Otto Gunsche, given in Berchtesgaden in 1954 (Linge) and 1956 (Gunsche), together with several other witnesses to Hitler’s end. I am grateful to Frau A. Regnauer, director of the Amtsgericht Laufen, for permission to see this material. I would also like to thank Professor Robert Service (St Anthony’s College, Oxford) for translating for me part of one of Gunsche’s interrogations in Moscow (Osobyi Arkhiv ( = Special Archive), Moscow, 130-0307, Fol.282). Even apart from forensic issues, it is remarkable that, had they possessed Hitler’s remains, the Soviet authorities never indicated this, let alone showed the remains, to Linge, Gunsche, and other witnesses from the bunker who they held in captivity for up to ten years. Instead, in countless hours of grilling them in highly inhumane fashion, including taking them in 1946 to reconstruct the scene in the bunker - aimed at ascertaining whether Hitler had in fact comitted suicide - they continued to insist, dispite consistent testimony from independent witnesses to the contrary, that Hitler was still alive. According to Linge (Amtsgericht Laufen, Fol.9), he was repeatedly interrogated about whether Hitler was alive or dead, whether he could have flown out of Berlin, and whether he had been substituted by a ‘double’. When Linge asked his interrogators during the visit to Berlin whether they had Hitler’s corpse in their possession, he was told (Fol.10) that they had found many corpses but did not know if Hitler’s was among them. Stalin himself also appears persistently in the immediate post-war years - not just for propaganda purposes - to have disbelieved stories of Hitler’s death. The opening of Soviet archives following the end of the Cold War brought a flurry of new ‘revelations’ about Hitler’s end and the location of his remains, which were allegedly dug up on the orders of Soviet chief Leonid Brezhnev on the night of 4-5 April 1970 by five officers of the KGB from a plot of land near a garage in Madgeburg, and burnt. The remain had, it was said, had been buried there along with those of Eva Braun, the Goebbels family, and (probably) General Hans Krebs in 1946 and were now to be exhumed because of the danger of discovery through building work on the site. (See ‘Hitlers Hollenfahrt’, Der Speiegel, 14/1995, 170-87, 15/1995, 172-86; also Norman Stone, ‘Hitler, ein Gespenst in den Archiven’, Frankfurter Allgemeine Zeitung, 19 April 1995; Alexander Lesser, ‘Russians wanted to sell “Hitler skull” story’, Jerusalem Report, 11 March 1993; ‘Kremlin “secretly burned Hitler’s remains”’, Guardian, 4 April 1995; ‘Secret of Hitlerís ashes revealed in Soviet archive’, New York Post, 27 January 2000.) The Soviet evidence was most extensively examined in Petrova and Watson, and was also the subject of a BBC TV documentary, optimistically entitled ‘Hitlerís Death, the Final Report’, in April 1995. Apart from the jawbone, however, the only additional alleged remains of Hitler that have come to light are part of a skull discovered in 1946 (which has never been conclusively identified as Hitler’s). It is unclear how this skull related to the remains purported to have been found in May 1945 and exhumed - presumably headless - in Magdeburg in 1970. If, of course, the Soviets never had Hitler’s body in the first place, the post-Cold War revelations of the disposal of the remains have no standing. Whichever remains they buried in Madgeburg and then dug up and burnt, it is unlikely that they were those of Hitler. In any event, the matter is chiefly of relevence to interpretations of Soviet post-war actions rather than to a study of Hitler’s life.

Thank you for your time.The Pluton (talk) 06:52, 5 January 2011 (UTC)

Wm5200 (talk · contribs · deleted contribs · logs · filter log · block user · block log). Moxy (talk) 07:51, 5 January 2011 (UTC)

Hitler's real name Schicklgruber

Dear Wikipedia, You should write about how Hitler's real name was Schicklgruber. Because that was his grandpa's name and before his grandpa died he changed it to Hitler because he disliked how people insulted him about his name.He was on his death bed when he changed his name. Being the reason why Hitler has Hitler as his name.Being a family tradition of having your grandpa's name. I find that interesting because that small thing changed History I can't imagine people back then in Germany saying HAIL Schicklgruber. He wouldn't have been such a powerful leader with that name.

Thank you for your time! By: Jamal Ajaj

PS: I am not spamming or anything I am just trying to help out the website. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 74.14.103.252 (talk) 01:50, 7 January 2011 (UTC)

No, you see even if Hitler had changed his own name the title of the article wuold still be Adolf Hitler, because 1) he changed his name to that and 2) it's the name by which he is most commonly known. However, as the name was changed by his grandfather you are referring to a name not only not used by Adolf but not used (for a long time) by his father. So, no. Britmax (talk) 11:51, 11 January 2011 (UTC)

Apologetic in the religious section

"the historian Richard Steigmann-Gall (whose views on Christianity and Nazism are admittedly outside the consensus) states, Hitler "can be classified as Catholic."[324] Yet, as Steigmann-Gall has also pointed out in the debate about religion in Nazi Germany: "Nominal church membership is a very unreliable gauge of actual piety in this context.""

These remarks seem awfully apologetic. If he was catholic, then he was catholic. I can understand people want to distance themselves from Hitler, but that's POV pushing, and doesn't change what he was. Apologetics really have no place in an encyclopedia article. ScienceApe (talk) 15:36, 14 January 2011 (UTC)

The problem is he really wasn't Catholic. After the age of twelve, he never participated in the sacraments again. Steigmann-Gall's own book admits that he is outside of the mainstream on the subject of Nazis and Christianity. Calling Hitler Catholic is like calling the famous atheist Madalyn Murray O'Hair a Presbyterian because she was baptised and raised as one. If you read the entire section you will see that far from being a believing and practicing Christian (some self serving public statements notwithstanding) Hitler had a well established plan to destroy Christianity which he considered, like Judaism, to be a weak slave religion. Mamalujo (talk) 19:47, 24 January 2011 (UTC)

Eerie Book Connection

Is there a connection between the book written by Alexis-Vincent-Charles Berbiguier de Terre-Neuve du Thym and Adolf's Mein Kampf?

Togagames (talk) 13:53, 16 January 2011 (UTC)

Time man of the year article

Here is the URL to TIME;s "man of the year" article:

• "Adolf Hitler: Man of the Year, 1938." TIME. Monday January 2, 1939

WhisperToMe (talk) 15:58, 20 January 2011 (UTC)

World War II

It says that Adolf Hitler participated i world war I under the first picture. It should be changed to WWII. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 66.32.134.73 (talk) 03:51, 26 January 2011 (UTC)

He was a soldier in WWI. Those awards listed were for his WWI service. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 50.14.189.78 (talk) 03:21, 27 January 2011 (UTC)