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Alleged Abuse Towards Girlfriend

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I think it would be worth noting in his personal life that there was controversy regarding his ex-girlfriend, Maya Henry, writing a book inspired by their toxic relationship including his alleged abuse and substance problems. Cool879 (talk) 22:08, 16 October 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Accusations of this nature require gold standard sourcing. Without it, the accusations can't be mentioned in the article. --150.143.27.224 (talk) 13:52, 19 October 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Would NBC News or The Independent count?
https://www.the-independent.com/arts-entertainment/music/news/maya-henry-liam-payne-allegations-cease-desist-letter-b2631401.html
https://www.nbcnews.com/pop-culture/liam-payne-ex-fiancee-maya-henry-fans-condemn-online-harassment-rcna176486 72.230.69.40 (talk) 16:42, 24 October 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Maya Henry's book is fiction. We cannot base it on real life events. Maria1718182 (talk) 07:42, 26 October 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Awkward/unclear wording?

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I don't know a lot about Liam Payne, so I wouldn't know how to reword this sentence within his article, but it reads a little awkwardly and in a way that is unclear. I figure a fan, or someone more familiar with his personal life and struggles, would be better-equipped to reword this (particularly the bolded portion):

On 1 June 2022, Payne was interviewed by Logan Paul for his podcast series where he, while intoxicated, brought up several topics, among which he claimed that One Direction originated with Simon Cowell's promise to him, and discussed former fellow member Zayn Malik's family life where he declared, "There's [sic] many reasons why I dislike Zayn and there's [sic] many reasons why I'll always, always be on his side".

Afddiary (talk) 22:51, 16 October 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Infobox photo

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Hello, which option do people want for the photo:

Option A from 2023 Option B from 2011 something else option C

TheLoyalOrder (talk) 00:17, 17 October 2024 (UTC)[reply]

I prefer B TheLoyalOrder (talk) 00:18, 17 October 2024 (UTC)[reply]
adding reasons - from the height of his fame as part of 1D, he's in the middle of singing which is what he's known for, I think the quality is fine, better than 2023 TheLoyalOrder (talk) 00:37, 17 October 2024 (UTC)[reply]
I would agree with option B for the same reasons – most relevant to his profession, most representative of his career (especially for the page of a deceased person), and it is of decent quality. If not that, though, I think A is a better 2nd option than D. Afddiary (talk) 01:22, 17 October 2024 (UTC)[reply]
C - There was one from 2016 Payne 2014.jpg I think is better, the 2011 one isn't great quality. orangesclub 🍊 00:23, 17 October 2024 (UTC)[reply]
ok I'll add Option D from 2014 (file named wrong) TheLoyalOrder (talk) 00:29, 17 October 2024 (UTC)[reply]
I prefer this one (Option D)! Ilanthress (talk) 01:02, 17 October 2024 (UTC)[reply]
I support Option D or another high quality image from WikiMedia Category:Liam Payne in 2014 as this more accurately reflects him when he had higher notoriety. -Gimelthedog (talk) 09:47, 17 October 2024 (UTC)[reply]
I agree with Option D for these reasons. It's (albeit rather subjectively) his most recognisable appearance to a general audience. I can understand the pushback against it though. Ilanthress (talk) 11:56, 17 October 2024 (UTC)[reply]
  • Support option B, with second preference to option A. Agree completely with Afddiary above; I do not think Option D looks like him either at the height of his career nor what he looked like at his death.. after the 2014 pic was taken, he had significant plastic surgery & weight loss, so it strikes me as a poor choice. FlipandFlopped ツ 03:03, 17 October 2024 (UTC)[reply]
I'd say B as well. It's a bit of a dark (lighting wise) image, but it represents what he's known for better. I prefer A over D as a second choice. Changing to E or B. AkiyamaKana (talk) 03:05, 17 October 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Alright I am just finding out that for infoboxes, people need to vote before making edits and I'll be considerate of that from now on. I think Option B is the better choice! Clammodest (talk) 05:06, 17 October 2024 (UTC)[reply]
> Alright I am just finding out that for infoboxes, people need to vote before making edits
its not always the case its just multiple people had different opinions on what would be best, no worries :) TheLoyalOrder (talk) 05:08, 17 October 2024 (UTC)[reply]
  • Option A I completely agree w/ the rationale for option B and normally I'd be in favor of it, but the quality isn't the best, it's too shadowy whereas Option A has the best quality, isn't too obscuring and you could actually see Payne fairly well. --TDKR Chicago 101 (talk) 07:34, 17 October 2024 (UTC)[reply]
I support Option B. It's common for Wikipedia articles to display a photo of a deceased notable person of when they were most notable and recognizable, Option B shows Liam Payne at his most known stage. Bnwkr (talk) 10:15, 17 October 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Option A is clearer in my opinion. Mb2437 (talk) 16:57, 17 October 2024 (UTC)[reply]
I propose two possible alternatives to the suggested A,B,and D:
E: from 2014, good quality close up and from 1D days
F: (probably a cropped version) from 2013, good quality of him singing from 1D days Mason7512 (talk) 20:11, 17 October 2024 (UTC)[reply]
E isn't a bad shout. Mb2437 (talk) 20:59, 17 October 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Yeah E looks to be the better one of the two. Clammodest (talk) 21:41, 17 October 2024 (UTC)[reply]
E is gonna be the best bet. BarntToust 22:52, 17 October 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Has a good mix of the pros from A and B; it has both the clarity of the former and the more appropriate date range of the latter. Mb2437 (talk) 22:58, 17 October 2024 (UTC)[reply]
E is already used in the career section of the article. If we're gonna make it the infobox photo, can we take it out of the career portion? 205.186.52.209 (talk) 23:48, 17 October 2024 (UTC)[reply]
I had commented earlier but just wanted to say I feel E looks weird, like he's leaning forward slightly which makes his chin smaller and forehead bigger than it should be. Also think its a bit too tight a crop around his head, if there was this photo with a wider shot I'd rank it higher. F his face is obscured and its tinted green, Rank of all the suggestions so far B > A > D > E > F TheLoyalOrder (talk) 23:33, 17 October 2024 (UTC)[reply]
B obscures a large chunk of his face, with uneven lighting across the board, if we're talking proportions and visibility. Mb2437 (talk) 23:39, 17 October 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Just gonna throw in an extra proposal here, for good measure.
G: from 2012, arguably the 'peak' of One Direction as a young boy band. Shows his face well and is clearly centered, and I edited it solely so that it would work well within an infobox. CarterSterling (talk) 19:36, 19 October 2024 (UTC)[reply]
I don't think it's the best option due to the poor quality. Mason7512 (talk) 19:40, 19 October 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Poor quality. Mb2437 (talk) 19:44, 19 October 2024 (UTC)[reply]

RfC: Infobox photo

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Which of the following should be Liam Payne's infobox photo? Please rank in order of preference: --- 18:35, 20 October 2024 (UTC)

  • A
    A
  • B
    B
  • C
    C
  • D
    D
  • E
    E
  • F
    F
  • G
    G
  • H
    H
  • I
    I

Survey

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  • Image A It is the highest quality image and is informative of his life, immediately conveying that he is a singer. (I was pinged to this RfC by means of Yapperbot.) ~ HAL333 22:09, 20 October 2024 (UTC)[reply]
  • Support A or E. F is okay. Oppose the rest. Some1 (talk) 23:22, 20 October 2024 (UTC)[reply]
  • Image E is the clear and obvious choice for clarity and appropriate timeline. Mb2437 (talk) 23:26, 20 October 2024 (UTC)[reply]
  • Support Image E; Image D as most up-to-date image; Image A has dramatic lighting but is low resolution and it appears the subject is scratching his head; Image G is a good portrait but delivers nothing beyond good looks; Image E is a good head shot but low resolution; Image F is out of focus; Image C is out of focus (or the compression makes it look that way) and low resolution—all that remains is a pout—like the Cheshire Cat; Image I is better used in place of Image Hin subsection Liam Payne#2016–2021: Solo projects and LP1 (belated sig added) — Neonorange (talk to Phil) (he, they) —
    Reply: The most up-to-date photos are only preferred for biographies of living people; when someone dies, a new photo is chosen, that is why it is being discussed. I also cannot understand how you can call images A and E low quality when D is arguably worse. Mason7512 (talk) 19:16, 21 October 2024 (UTC)[reply]
    Reply to reply: Well, Image Image D fails for resolution and over-compression. As well, Image D does not read as a performer—disqualifying for an infobox image of a performer if good images 'in performance' are available. Wikipedia articles tend to llast forever. Ten years from now a reader will recognize and be most informed by an image 'in performance'. We all have opinions, based on personal criteria and experience. So we differ. So we have an RFD. — Neonorange (talk to Phil) (he, they) 18:06, 22 October 2024 (UTC) —[reply]
And opinions evidently change. — Neonorange (talk to Phil) (he, they) 18:16, 22 October 2024 (UTC) —[reply]
  • Support Images E, I, then A I could see potential issues with F and G, causing confusion about his profession (giving a false impression of him having been a footballer or other athlete) and quality concerns with D and (to a lesser extent) C. Mason7512 (talk) 18:45, 21 October 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Joe Exotic

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why does it say joe exotic paid tribute but joe exotic is not in any of the references cited 176.27.133.101 (talk) 01:53, 17 October 2024 (UTC)[reply]

I've added a citation for Joe Exotic's tweet to the article. Here's the tweet in case you are curious [1]. I would rather add an RS but it seems like only TMZ (which was previously removed in this edit) and a few other non RS sources have reported on it ([2], [3]). Gideonrmt (talk) 02:53, 17 October 2024 (UTC)[reply]
I do love how a still-incarcerated Joe Exotic can somehow tweet out his condolences for the death of Liam Payne, and this was deemed notable enough for inclusion in Payne’s wiki article for a period of time. What a time to be alive Cbe46 (talk) 05:27, 17 October 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Semi-protected edit request on 17 October 2024

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“Add: Responding officers heard a thud and found Payne’s body in the hotel courtyard, according to Policicchio. We arrived in time to try and revive him, but there was nothing we could do,” Crescenti said“ 2001:1C03:A:9400:DCAB:103F:304C:D191 (talk) 01:56, 17 October 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Not done for now: Do you have a source? Currently WP:RS seems to agree he was deceased when emergency services arrived.
Gideonrmt (talk) 02:40, 17 October 2024 (UTC)[reply]
I think the source they took from is this. [4] AkiyamaKana (talk) 03:09, 17 October 2024 (UTC)[reply]
It seems to not be in that article anymore. The last time they updated the article was before I sent the first reply, but Google still showed the whole phrase as being in the article until a few minutes ago. AkiyamaKana (talk) 03:22, 17 October 2024 (UTC)[reply]

tributes section

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It's normal for pages about people to have a tributes or legacy after their death, especially if they were notable AndrewGarfieldIsTheBestSpiderMan (talk) 04:22, 17 October 2024 (UTC)[reply]

I wish that he would rest in peace. I will remember the days when I listened to One Direction’s songs and heard them everywhere! Steven1991 (talk) 05:38, 17 October 2024 (UTC)[reply]
i’m only making this section because all of the tributes were deleted AndrewGarfieldIsTheBestSpiderMan (talk) 13:07, 17 October 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Tribute sections are best avoided especially if the only purpose is to serve as a list of people who have paid an homage. Notable tributes may though be incorporated into the death/legacy section.
@AndrewGarfieldIsTheBestSpiderMan: Interesting username, though I disagree :). Hope that doesn't conflict with WP:NPOV while editing. Gotitbro (talk) 13:24, 17 October 2024 (UTC)[reply]
In this case it was highly significant that OneDirection (the band) and all 4 remaining bandmates paid tribute to Liam as they had not publically released any statements or been reunited in any way together as One Direction since the hiatus over 10 years before. Officially Zayn rejoined the other 3 specifically for the tribute on social media, having left the band before the hiatus. Given they have topped 23billion streams and are still streamed 23million times a day all over the world this feels worthy of inclusion. The tributes were all published across their solo and band social media pages. 82.33.158.175 (talk) 23:20, 26 November 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Timeline of Hugo Boss endorsements

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§ Endorsements has three events in the order July 2020, May 2020, January 2020. This seems to reverse the usual process of telling stories with "first things first" ... There's no good reason to do that; maybe some of these dates are wrong? yoyo (talk) 09:37, 17 October 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Semi-protected edit request on 17 October 2024 (2)

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Add his current girlfriend at his time of death her name was Kate Cassidy she is pretty famous herself and they were together for 2 years so she deserves to be on there. DaynaEllie (talk) 14:41, 17 October 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Agree, with his passing there's no reason to assume she won't be discussed in reliable sources. --150.143.27.224 (talk) 15:04, 17 October 2024 (UTC)[reply]
 Not done: please provide reliable sources that support the change you want to be made. 𝙹𝚒𝚢𝚊𝚗 忌炎 (𝚃𝚊𝚕𝚔) 15:12, 17 October 2024 (UTC)[reply]
I can't remember if the Independent falls under reliable sources or not, sorry if it doesn't!
https://www.independent.co.uk/life-style/liam-payne-death-girlfriend-kate-cassidy-argentina-b2631039.html
https://news.sky.com/story/liam-payne-posted-on-social-media-in-hours-before-death-13234934 (ctrl+f for girlfriend) Lyeuhm (talk) 17:33, 17 October 2024 (UTC)[reply]
The Independent is listed as a reliable source, see WP:INDYUK. I personally find that its quality and its differentiation between news and opinion has declined since it stopped printing - and it looks like others had the same concerns - but it's still fine. Unknown Temptation (talk) 17:40, 17 October 2024 (UTC)[reply]
That was kind of my problem with linking it as a soul source, hence including Sky News as well. Their content has gone hill quite a bit. Lyeuhm (talk) 18:22, 17 October 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Category:Deaths from bleeding

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I removed this as the sources cited for preliminary cause of death say "cranial fracture and extremely serious injuries that led to his immediate death". I'm not a doctor, so I can't say whether he was bleeding, or if bleeding would have killed him before cranial fracture (see WP:CATDEFINE), but this category looks like WP:TOOSOON and a qualified professional will confirm all the details in due course. I'm not seeing it spelt out in sources that bleeding was the cause of death. Unknown Temptation (talk) 19:05, 17 October 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Injections

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To help cope with the pain, he had sixteen injections in his arm every morning and another sixteen every evening as a child.

The article formerly said this, but this was drawn from an article that, in fact, says this: 

From the age of zero to four I was always in hospital having tests done but they couldn't find out what was wrong. They discovered that one of my kidneys wasn't working properly and it had scarred. I had to have 32 injections in my arm in the morning and evening to try and make me better.

You can find the article here, by the way.

It says nothing about the injections being for any pain. It does not say that he had to have them "every morning and ... every evening". From the way it's worded here, it may only have been done once. It doesn't even say whether the 32 were evenly divided between morning and evening.

This dollop of unwisdom seems to have been in the article right from the beginning, and I would urge the writer to develop better reading comprehension skills. Kelisi (talk) 20:55, 17 October 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Semi protected edit request

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Multiple articles say they cannot confirm if he jumped or simply fell. Mentions of him jumping should be removed unless definitive proof is shown. 142.188.34.116 (talk) 02:53, 18 October 2024 (UTC)[reply]

You are unlikely to get verification
Just like the BBC use the "medicine" (drugs) were found in this room
BBC also never mentioned that he smashed the hotel TV, burned the room down, and jumped after police arrived
what a mess New hordak from 2018 (talk) 13:16, 18 October 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Clonazepam is a medication often used to treat conditions like anxiety, seizures, and panic disorders. It belongs to the benzodiazepine class, which has calming effects, reducing overactivity in the brain. In Liam Payne’s case, the presence of clonazepam found in his hotel room suggests he may have been using it to manage mental health issues such as anxiety.
When mixed with alcohol, clonazepam can intensify side effects like drowsiness, dizziness, and, in severe cases, cause serious complications like respiratory depression, unconsciousness, or even death. The combination of drugs and alcohol found in Payne's room points to the possibility that this interaction may have contributed to his tragic death. New hordak from 2018 (talk) 13:26, 18 October 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Make sure the infobox photo is not used in the rest of the article

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Apologies if I sound too antagonistic, but three times during the infobox photo edits recently, a photo that has already been used in the article was put as Payne's infobox photo. If you're gonna change the photo to one that's already in the article, please remove the photo from the article. Thank you. 205.186.52.209 (talk) 02:59, 18 October 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Place of death - Hotel

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Can we add that drugs were delivered to him with the photo from La Nacion the nations media outlet? [1]

Could someone please write the hotel name correctly?

The hotel is called CasaSur Palermo Hotel (address/street name: Costa Rica, 6032) and NOT CasaSur hotel.

Whether you include the exact address/street name in it, when the hotel is renamed, you can still decide, but the hotel name should already be spelled correctly. NoelSchmidt (talk) 10:15, 18 October 2024 (UTC)[reply]

please provide a reliable source supporting this Mason7512 (talk) 14:24, 18 October 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Most WP:RS refer to the hotel as Casa Sur hotel or CasaSur hotel ([5][6][7][8][9][10]). CasaSur is a hotel collection with 3 locations. The location of the hotel Liam Payne died at is Palermo, Buenos Aires. Gideonrmt (talk) 15:30, 18 October 2024 (UTC)[reply]
I wonder that i found just under 1 minute many reliable sources with the Hotelname: CasaSur Palermo Hotel
Like BBC https://www.bbc.com/news/articles/c1wnxp970pdo - CasaSur Palermo Hotel. Yes CasaSur has 3 locations in the city.
But this Location is called CasaSur Palermo Hotel.
Next reliable Source - hotel site https://www.casasurhotel.com/en/palermo. Also the hotel link on their on site google maps and the location of the hotel as CasaSur Palermo Hotel.
Also you find it on Google Maps - there you can see the CasaSur Palermo Hotel is the right hotel like on the photo from reliable sources.
Sorry for my bad english, i am a german. NoelSchmidt (talk) 10:00, 19 October 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Also your own source proves that it called CasaSur Palermo Hotel:
Reuters and The Independent
911 Call Text:
Also the employee said CasaSur Palermo Hotel in the 911 Call.
Also your BBC article has the name CasaSur Palermo Hotel. Like my other article from the BBC.

NoelSchmidt (talk) 10:06, 19 October 2024 (UTC)[reply]

 Not done for now: please establish a consensus for this alteration before using the {{Edit semi-protected}} template. PianoDan (talk) 20:06, 18 October 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Cleaning up death section

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I agree that the death section has too much detail at the moment. However, I think it is detail that many people may be interested in, especially initially. Does it make sense to create a split? https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Splitting

I imagine there will be more to add at various points as this unfolds. I already could see adding the impact on streaming numbers of his music but I am afraid to add at this point! Librarianfacts (talk) 04:06, 22 October 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Spouse Liam payne

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Children karen payne Nicola Payne 2403:580D:5FB4:0:6D1F:8819:18C1:7FED (talk) 10:00, 30 October 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Travelling to Argentina

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In the article it states, Liam and his girlfriend travelled to Argentina on 2 October while they were already in Argentina by then. According to Katelyn Cassidy, on her TikTok, they left US for Argentina at the end of September as the post is dated 30 September. https://vm.tiktok.com/ZMhCVKadm/ . Thank you. 41.212.59.115 (talk) 09:22, 2 November 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Wikipedia relies on reliable sources like newspaper articles. Also there is no original research, like evaluating post dates of TikToks. I appreciate you want the article to be as accurate as possible but we have to wait for the sources we can trust first. Commander Keane (talk) 10:01, 2 November 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Semi-protected edit request on 5 November 2024

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Remove this part of his Death context "Payne and Cassidy initially stayed at a luxury Airbnb property in Buenos Aires before relocating to a hotel when Payne's visa application was delayed and their booking expired.[178]". Because the 178 citation is a "sorry we can't find the page you requested" so this citation is not valid indicating that Coventrylive the publication has taken the article down. Craizzle (talk) 17:11, 5 November 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Hi there, the link is fine if you click on the archived link. Knitsey (talk) 17:24, 5 November 2024 (UTC)[reply]
 Not done: Amortias (T)(C) 05:23, 6 November 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Semi-protected edit request on 5 November 2024 (2)

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Change in the Investigation section on the last sentence, that "Drugs were delivered to Liam and there is a photograph from the authorities in Buenos Aries from La Nacion, the nation's top media outlet."[2] Craizzle (talk) 18:30, 5 November 2024 (UTC)[reply]

 Not done: it's not clear what changes you want to be made. Please mention the specific changes in a "change X to Y" format and provide a reliable source if appropriate. Shadow311 (talk) 00:22, 9 November 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Semi-protected edit request on 8 November 2024

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Change "an companion" to "a companion"

The article "an" is used before vowel sounds, but "companion" starts with a consonant sound (the "k" sound), so "a" is the correct article to use. MonaNights (talk) 12:37, 8 November 2024 (UTC)[reply]

 Done Thanks for the tip. I also added semicolons to the sentence which I don't normally do but I found the existing sentence confusing. --Commander Keane (talk) 12:47, 8 November 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Funeral

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Shouldn't Payne's funeral + details be mentioned under "Memorials"? It just happened this morning. 172.126.220.132 (talk) 02:19, 21 November 2024 (UTC)[reply]

  1. ^ https://www.lanacion.com.ar/seguridad/un-medio-ingles-dijo-que-las-drogas-que-consumio-liam-payne-salieron-de-lomas-de-zamora-nid22102024/
  2. ^ https://www.lanacion.com.ar/seguridad/un-medio-ingles-dijo-que-las-drogas-que-consumio-liam-payne-salieron-de-lomas-de-zamora-nid22102024/
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