User talk:Doug Weller

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Coming here to ask why I reverted your edit? Read this page first...

Please leave me new messages at the bottom of the page; click here to start a new section at the bottom. I usually notice messages soon. I attempt to keep conversations in one location, as I find it easier to follow them that way when they are archived. If you open a new conversation here, I will respond to you here. Please watchlist this page or check back for my reply. If I have already left a message at your talk page, unless I've requested follow-up here or it is a standard template message, I am watching it. If you leave your reply here, I may respond at your talk page if it seems better for context. If you aren't sure if I'm watching your page, or I'm slow to reply, feel free to approach me here.

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Welcome to my talk page! I am an administrator here on Wikipedia. That means I am here to help. It does not mean that I have any special status or something, it just means that I get to push a few extra buttons to help maintain this encyclopedia. If you need help with something, feel free to ask. Click here to start a new topic. If I have not made any edits in a while, (check) you may get a faster response by posting your request in a more centralized place. If you need to get a repeat vandal blocked, you can report them to Administrator Intervention against Vandalism. If you need a page to be protected from editing, try Requests for page protection. If you would like to request rollback rights or account creator rights, Wikipedia:Requests for permissions is, well, that way... :) If your problem does not fit into any of the above criteria, and your issue is urgent, you can: Make a post on the Administrators' noticeboard, the Incidents noticeboard, or one of the other noticeboards. Ask another administrator for help. Here is a complete List of Wikipedia Administrators. If you want to ask for help, you can ask at the help desk for questions about Wikipedia, and at the reference desk for more general questions. You may also simply ask a question on your talk page and add {{helpme}} before your question. This will attract the attention of experienced users who will most likely be able to help you.

Did I delete your page, block you, or do something else that I should not have done?

First, please remember that I am not trying to attack you, demean you, or hurt you in any way. I am only trying to protect the integrity of this project. If I did something wrong, let me know, but remember that I am human, and I do make mistakes. Please keep your comments civil. If you vandalize this page or swear at me, you will not only decrease the likelihood of a response, your edits could get you blocked. (see WP:NPA) When posting, do not assume I know which article you are talking about. If you leave a message saying "Why did you revert me?", I will not know what you mean. If you want a response consisting of something other than "What are you talking about", please include links and, if possible, diffs in your message. At the very least, mention the name of the article or user you are concerned with. Also, if you sign your post (by typing four tildes - ~~~~ - at the end of your message), I will respond faster, and I will tend to be in a better mood, because unsigned comments are one of my pet peeves. If you are blocked from editing, you cannot post here, but your talk page is most likely open for you to edit. To request a review of your block, add {{unblock|reason}} to your talk page. (replace reason with why you think you should not be blocked.) I watch the talk pages of everyone I block, so I will almost definitely see you make your request. If I am making edits (check Special:Contributions/Doug Weller) and I do not answer your request soon, or you cannot edit your talk page for some reason, you can try sending me an email. Please note, however, that I rarely check my email more than a few times a day, so it may be a couple of hours before I respond. Administrators: If you see me do something that you think is wrong, I will not consider it wheel-warring if you undo my actions. I would, however, appreciate it if you let me know what I did wrong, so that I can avoid doing it in the future.

You can email me from this link but in the interests of Wiki-transparency, please message me on this page unless there are pressing reasons to do otherwise. Comments which I find to be uncivil, full of vulgarities, flame baiting, or that are are excessively rude may be deleted without response. If I choose not to answer, that's my right, don't keep putting it back. I'll just delete and get annoyed at you.

Albert Stubblebine

I notice you deleted the text I had appended to the paragraph dealing with General Stubblebine's testimony in the documentary "One Nation Under Siege". I find it very unfortunate that you deemed it necessary to also remove the link to the YouTube document I copied it from. I am not at all familiar with all those copyright concerns, although I know they do exist. In this particular case, I doubt very much that the copyright owner would object to having someone linking a Wikipedia article to a YouTube excerpt from his movie. He could more understandably object to YouTube distributing the video than for someone just linking to it. It seems to me that since he doesn't seem to object to the video being freely accessible on YouTube, it is very unlikely that he would object to someone merely providing a link to the publicly available document on YouTube.

That being said, I fail to see why the phrase mentioning that "he states that a Boeing 757 airplane could not have crashed into The Pentagon on September 11, 2001" was allowed to remain. What is the logic here? That information comes straight from the video. Why did you delete his views about the free press having become very expensive since 9/11 and kept intact those about the Boeing at the Pentagon ?

Is it because I faithfully transcribed what he said word for word? If that is the case, would it be acceptable to mention his thoughts if I summarized them in my own words? Oclupak (talk) 03:13, 6 December 2009 (UTC)

Sorry I forgot to reply, I've responded on the article's talk page. Dougweller (talk) 06:09, 8 December 2009 (UTC)

YtG

Thanks for the note. Short of continuing to WP:RBI until they start to communicate, I don't know what else to suggest. The IPs are close enough that a rangeblock might be appropriate, but I've never done one and don't know what sort of collateral damage is acceptable - I wouldn't want to take out the entire country :) If they are static IPs that makes it easier, but at the moment I suppose we just have to wait and see. I've tagged the socks you mentioned. The only additional measure I can think of is article semiprotection; I realise there are quite a few articles involved, but it would curtail the IP editing. If we make it unproductive enough for them to continue evading the block, they may eventually be brought to the table. EyeSerene^talk 13:44, 7 December 2009 (UTC)

Thanks. I'm slowly doing that. Not something I really want to do, but the only practical way to stop this disruption. There's not much else you can do when an editor won't discuss their edits. Dougweller (talk) 16:57, 7 December 2009 (UTC)

I agree. I had wondered if there were language issues, but they seem to be able to produce article text readily enough. EyeSerene^talk 18:20, 7 December 2009 (UTC)

The redlink already existed in the sock templates I'd added to the accounts I was aware of; I don't know if I got them all though. I've created the listing page, Category:Suspected Wikipedia sockpuppets of Yongle the Great, so in future all anyone need do is tag their accounts with {{sockpuppet|Yongle the Great}} and the account will automatically be added to the category. Hopefully the rangeblock will help. EyeSerene^talk 17:18, 11 December 2009 (UTC)

Thanks, how about confirmed sockpuppets such as user:Emperor of China, shall I use it anyway? Dougweller (talk) 17:35, 11 December 2009 (UTC)

I've created that category too (not done much actually - if you follow the redlink from a sock template on a user page and add {{sockpuppet category|username}} to the blank category page, then save, it auto-detects whether they're suspected or confirmed and creates and populates the page accordingly). We now have two cats:

• Category:Suspected Wikipedia sockpuppets of Yongle the Great
• Category:Wikipedia sockpuppets of Yongle the Great

As long as any future socks are tagged with the right version of {{sock}}, the pages will maintain themselves. Only one other thing - you only really need to add the template to the userpage, not the talkpage (it creates a double listing in the category otherwise). EyeSerene^talk 19:20, 11 December 2009 (UTC)

Brilliant, thanks. I've been sticking to the user page today. :-) Dougweller (talk) 19:26, 11 December 2009 (UTC)

Heh :) I've also just tagged User:Yongle the Great as the sockpuppeteer account, so hopefully everything's in place that should be. You're very welcome, anyway. It can be a bit of a pain dealing with editors like this; some of us are chasing one around various milhist articles at the moment, and it's not much fun when there's other things you'd rather be doing. Still, Wikipedia attracts all sorts... :P EyeSerene^talk 19:38, 11 December 2009 (UTC)

This Yongle fellow & his increasing number of socks might need a range block. GoodDay (talk) 20:52, 11 December 2009 (UTC)

Yes. I'm working with Nishkid64 who has blocked 123.23.240.0/20 for five days. And I agree, EyeSerene, I've got more constructive ways to spend my time. Dougweller (talk) 20:54, 11 December 2009 (UTC)

Trouble with Yongle

Hi Doug. Looks like I'm becoming involved in the problems with Yongle the Great (talk · contribs). Please have a look at the actions of Trương Hoàng Phong (talk · contribs). Seems to be yet another puppet, whether sock or meat I cannot tell. I have reported him to the administrators at WP:ANI#Trương Hoàng Phong, but I don't feel competent to undertake a clean-up. Favonian (talk) 11:04, 8 December 2009 (UTC)

Category:Piri Reis

Hi! First of all: it's not Resi but Reis, which is explained in Reis#Military rank. Secondly, as an admin, you must well know what this cat is supposed to be. If you really wanna know, check please cats for notable people. Cheers. CeeGee (talk) 19:14, 8 December 2009 (UTC)

I know what a Reis is, but your category was Piri Resi [1] and see Piri Reis map which still has a red link to it. So, a typo, right? I thought ok, maybe I've missed something and there is a word 'Resi'. Dougweller (talk) 19:35, 8 December 2009 (UTC)

I see now, İ didn't realize it. My bad. Sorry my comments. Cheers. CeeGee (talk) 19:41, 8 December 2009 (UTC)

The Wikipedia Signpost: 7 December 2009

• From the editors: 250th issue of the Signpost

• Editorial: A digital restoration

• Election report: ArbCom election in full swing

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• In the news: Ron Livingston sues vandal, disclosure of IP address ordered, brief headlines

• Discussion report: Discussion Reports and Miscellaneous Articulations

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• Arbitration report: The Report on Lengthy Litigation

• Technology report: Bugs, Repairs, and Internal Operational News

Read this Signpost in full · Single-page · Unsubscribe · EdwardsBot (talk) 05:17, 9 December 2009 (UTC)

Pre-Columbian trans-oceanic contact

Don't you spell artifact with an "i"? Bernstein2291 ^{(Talk • Contributions • Sign Here)} 07:19, 11 December 2009 (UTC)

Archaeology/archeology, artefact/artifact, both are correct. Artifact is not a spelling used in British English but artefact and artifact are both used in American English. You will sometimes see the ae spelling for archaeology and the i spelling for artifact together. Dougweller (talk) 07:58, 11 December 2009 (UTC)

Building consensus on copyright issue

You were involved in a discussion regarding the use of copyrighted architectural designs on Wikipedia pages and I'm trying to find community consensus on a gray area. If you can, please let me know at what point you feel these images should be replaced here. Thank you so much! DR04 (talk) 19:28, 11 December 2009 (UTC)

Clerk advice please

Despite the arbitration, Tothwolf is doing large scale removals of edits I previously did, usually with no edit summary. On the discussion page he isn't answering why, but is telling me to fuck off and accusing me of paid editing. [2]. The paid editing accusation has no evidence in the arbitration and is a particularly egregious assault on my character - this community despises it as Jimbo has said it is never acceptable. I do not know how long this situation can simmer if the arbitration continues at idle. Is there anything that can be done in the mean time to make the attacks and revert warring stop? Miami33139 (talk) 21:09, 11 December 2009 (UTC)

If UrbanDictionary.com is now considered to be a reliable source then there are several articles I need to go add citations to.
As for large scale removals, exactly how many articles are part of this "large scale removal"? 2+2=5(?)...
What's to say I've not provided evidence of your sponsored editing Miami33139? You are the one who made several mistakes, the first being to engage in such editing with a clear and absolute conflict of interest. I and others also told you to leave me alone and disengage but even during the arbitration process you've continued to follow my contributions and prod/AfD my past contributions purely for harassment purposes. You have not and are not fooling anyone, Miami33139. --Tothwolf (talk) 23:21, 11 December 2009 (UTC)

If you have made evidence of my being a paid editor, please show it to me. I am not a paid editor. Miami33139 (talk) 23:37, 11 December 2009 (UTC)

No, email it to Arbcom, this discussion has to stop, I've commented at Wikipedia talk:Arbitration/Requests/Case/Tothwolf/Evidence#Personal attacks made while arbitration is underway and Tothwolf's talk page. Dougweller (talk) 08:22, 12 December 2009 (UTC)

To follow up with you on your comments and concerns, I already emailed Arbcom so we can certainly leave it at that.
Doug, now, I know you may not personally like what I have to say here, and while I'm going to keep my comments here civil they are going to be quite matter of fact. To put it bluntly, I feel as clerk you really should be taking a much more objective view of things and not taking the continued trolling of myself by Theserialcomma (who has been warned and told to disengage repeatedly by other administrators previously; see their talk page history [3]) as anything more than baseless trolling. Despite being warned, Theserialcomma continues to troll, wikihound, follow my contribs, prod/AfD articles from my contribs, and make false statements. None of this has yet to be addressed and I've provided plenty of evidence of these continued behaviours on the case's Evidence page that shows these behaviours continuing even during the Arbcom proceedings. Theserialcomma even did it here [4] as well while following my contribs. There are many other administrators, both on-wiki and off-wiki, who have since been made aware of both Theserialcomma and Miami33139's continued behaviours, so this will no longer be happening in a vacuum anyway.
Considering that I've never been blocked, never been threatened with a block, and have not, nor have I even attempted to "out" anyone, I think you are going overboard with your comments here [5] and here [6] where you threaten me with a block for "outing". Considering Miami33139 has taken to harassing Hm2k now, and even moved sandbox articles from Mabdul's userspace to articlespace (an attempt to change from MfDing user pages to AfDing articles), someone really should be taking a much harder look at what Miami33139 has been up to.
Now, while I fully understand that you have a lot going on which has left you limited time to deal with issues relating to this case, this case is not the simple case people initially thought it would be and it really needs more attention directed its way. In the interest of stopping the disruptive behaviours from Theserialcomma and Miami33139, I suggest a proposal of an injunction for Miami33139 and Theserialcomma based on the actual evidence provided in the Arbcom case (which has been provided by both myself and others) that shows the continued patterns of harassment and gaming the system from these two specific editors.
If you wish to reply to my comments above, I'll gladly follow up with you here, otherwise I think what I've said above pretty much covers things and I intend to leave it at that. --Tothwolf (talk) 13:33, 12 December 2009 (UTC)

I do however want to point out my comment here [7] (which Miami33139 has removed [8] and "moved") where I said: "That's all I intend to say about this issue." "[...] discussing this further will be a WP:STICK issue." That should have made it readily apparent that I had already said what I needed to say and that I intended to leave it at that. --Tothwolf (talk) 14:07, 12 December 2009 (UTC)

tothwolf, this is why you must be blocked for bad faith accusations. you claim i made this comment: [[9]] by following your contribs. did you ever think that maybe i found that comment, instead of via your contribs, but through the public arbcom case against you? did you honestly forget about the arbcom case where this information was posted? this is an egregious violation of civility and failing to assume good faith, especially in the face of the timestamped evidence against you. while the right thing would be to retract your bad faith accusations in the face of this obvious evidence, the more pertinent issue is that you stop threatening to out people with erroneous information. Theserialcomma (talk) 19:51, 12 December 2009 (UTC)

Theserialcomma, you aren't fooling anyone here either. You already know the case was not filed against me, it was filed on my behalf by Jehochman [10] against yourself, Miami33139 and JBsupreme due to your wikihounding, harassment, collusion, and gaming of the system.
The original working name for the RFAR was "Hounding of Tothwolf" (RFAR link), however Manning Bartlett went with a shorter name when he opened the case [11] after it was accepted [12] (case name discussion).
Considering that you've taken to harassing and wikihounding multiple editors (too many to name) and even administrators (such as Jéské Couriano, Georgewilliamherbert, and even SarekOfVulcan), with your last baiting attempt of Nukes4Tots leading to you being blocked, I'm not really surprised at all by your actions towards me.
Are you going to even attempt to explain this edit [13] (which has also been presented as evidence [14] in the Arbcom case)?
Theserialcomma, let me also be quite blunt with you: I'm not afraid of you or your bullying. Try as you did to find my identity and information about me to use to out, bully, and threaten me, you failed to find anything (although you certainly left quite a paper trail during your efforts). --Tothwolf (talk) 14:23, 13 December 2009 (UTC)

Secret evidence

Doug, what is the procedure to see this secret evidence? Miami33139 (talk) 15:58, 12 December 2009 (UTC)

Laura Grimblay

Good point. I left a comment on User talk:Laura.grimblay about it. Enter CambridgeBayWeather, waits for audience applause, not a sausage 16:16, 12 December 2009 (UTC)

Clerk procedures

I think that the {{ACA}} is an obsolete version of the template. On the proposed decision template, it has {{ACMajority}}. It seems that the two templates do the same thing, so I took an educated guess that that was the version I needed to subst ;-). Lankiveil ^{(speak to me)} 22:47, 12 December 2009 (UTC).