Wikipedia:Templates for discussion/Log/2021 July 11: Difference between revisions

Content deleted Content added

Inline

Revision as of 17:00, 11 July 2021

< July 10	July 12 >

July 11

Template:FIFA Arab Cup champions

Template:FIFA Arab Cup champions (talk · history · transclusions · logs · subpages)

per Tfd from August 2010. Falls under navbox crust where it just links to the teams that won. KingSkyLord (talk | contribs) 15:34, 25 June 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Note: This discussion has been included in WikiProject Football's list of association football-related deletions. Giant Snowman 15:37, 25 June 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Merge with parent template {{FIFA Arab Cup}}, no need for a separate template. Giant Snowman 15:39, 25 June 2021 (UTC)[reply]
Delete Same as the rest of the recreated navbox crust templates. --WikiCleanerMan (talk) 18:27, 25 June 2021 (UTC)[reply]
Question What is "navbox crust", please and why is it a bad thing to fall under it? Thincat (talk) 16:31, 1 July 2021 (UTC)[reply]
Navbox crust is basically information that can be included on one template, but that information is created on a separate template. And the reason it's bad is because it clutters up Wikipedia. --WikiCleanerMan (talk) 16:41, 1 July 2021 (UTC)[reply]
Thank you. So it is the same as "navbox cruft" which is what was being referred to in the 2010 TfD. I agree with merging then. By creating huge templates that then need to be collapsed we can indeed reduce clutter. Thincat (talk) 17:08, 1 July 2021 (UTC)[reply]
Delete. The general team that won the competition is not well-connected to the year in which they won the competition. If this were connected to a specific year's team, it might be reasonable (I make no comment on whether such articles do or should exist), but linking to the general team is not. I see no value accordingly for merging either. --Izno (talk) 03:19, 6 July 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.
Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, Plastikspork _―Œ^(talk) 16:35, 11 July 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Template:AFC Challenge Cup winners

Template:AFC Challenge Cup winners (talk · history · transclusions · logs · subpages)

A recreation of a deleted template from a Tfd from August 2010. The rationale for deletion was "navbox cruft" where these types of templates just list winners. This template is redundant in comparison to Template:AFC Challenge Cup. I do intend to nominate the recreated templates from the August 2010 Tfd for deletion as well. --WikiCleanerMan (talk) 15:01, 24 June 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Note: This discussion has been included in WikiProject Football's list of association football-related deletions. Giant Snowman 14:45, 25 June 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Merge with parent template {{AFC Challenge Cup}}, no need for a separate template. Giant Snowman 14:49, 25 June 2021 (UTC)[reply]
Delete. The general team that won the competition is not well-connected to the year in which they won the competition. If this were connected to a specific year's team, it might be reasonable (I make no comment on whether such articles do or should exist), but linking to the general team is not. I see no value accordingly for merging. --Izno (talk) 03:27, 6 July 2021 (UTC)[reply]
Keep. The template provides a useful chronological summary for the reader in a common format. It enables them to cpmpare competitions across time. --S ellinson (talk) 10:00, 10 July 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.
Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, Plastikspork _―Œ^(talk) 16:35, 11 July 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Template:AFC Challenge Cup winning managers

Template:AFC Challenge Cup winning managers (talk · history · transclusions · logs · subpages)

A navbox with no clear navigational purpose. Only linked to five articles and will not be updated since there were only five AFC tournaments played. --WikiCleanerMan (talk) 15:13, 24 June 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Keep It has a clear navagational purpose - to navigate between managers who won the AFC Challenge Cup. Five articles is a fine amount, regardless of there being no potential for further expansion. --SuperJew (talk) 08:57, 25 June 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Note: This discussion has been included in WikiProject Football's list of association football-related deletions. Giant Snowman 14:45, 25 June 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Delete - not needed. Giant Snowman 14:49, 25 June 2021 (UTC)[reply]
Delete per WP:NAVBOX. These are not well-connected topics. --Izno (talk) 03:27, 6 July 2021 (UTC)[reply]
Keep. The template provides a useful chronological summary for the reader in a common format. It enables them to cpmpare competitions across time. --S ellinson (talk) 10:00, 10 July 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.
Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, Plastikspork _―Œ^(talk) 16:35, 11 July 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Template:AFC Challenge Cup top scorers

Template:AFC Challenge Cup top scorers (talk · history · transclusions · logs · subpages)

No information can be gained from this template as there already exists a table of the top scorers on the mainspace. --WikiCleanerMan (talk) 15:13, 24 June 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Keep You can make that claim against most templates, as templates should be created only when supported by a mainspace article/section. Such a claim makes templates in general redundant and is therefore not a valid case for deletion of a template. --SuperJew (talk) 08:54, 25 June 2021 (UTC)[reply]

How can we tell they were the top scorers? Navboxes are not for this purpose. Navboxes are for mainspaces, not sections. This doesn't make templates generally redundant. This template is redundant for the purpose it was created for. --WikiCleanerMan (talk) 12:43, 25 June 2021 (UTC)[reply]

@WikiCleanerMan: I didn't understand the question How can we tell they were the top scorers. How can you tell anything? Via the information in the mainspace article/section. I don't understand what difference you're making between mainspaces and sections (Navboxes are for mainspaces, not sections) - the section is part of the mainspace.

So to clarify: Would you say based on this logic that {{UEFA Champions League top scorers}}, {{UEFA Europa League top scorers}}, {{FIFA World Cup top scorers}}, {{UEFA European Championship top scorers}}, and {{Copa América top scorers}} (to name a few of the same style) should be deleted? --SuperJew (talk) 13:22, 25 June 2021 (UTC)[reply]

They should be looked at. Navbox crust is an issue that relates to templates like these. It just links to the articles of the players. That's a similar issue with the winners of the football/soccer tournaments. --WikiCleanerMan (talk) 13:48, 25 June 2021 (UTC)[reply]

@WikiCleanerMan: It just links to the articles of the players - but that's what every navbox does. What navbox does anything beyond link to the articles it lists? --SuperJew (talk) 14:30, 25 June 2021 (UTC)[reply]

This is not a template helpful for navigation. I'm not aware of any sports-related or navigational template that's for stats or about player's stats. And if a template in its title links to an article section even if it includes the mainspace link, it's an issue. The title of navboxes should only link to the mainspace article. And this template isn't used on the mainspace and so does some of the related templates I looked at. It's redundant to the main AFC template which is far more useful for navigation. All these tournaments' top scorers information are better off on a section of the main article, not on an individual template. --WikiCleanerMan (talk) 15:01, 25 June 2021 (UTC)[reply]

@WikiCleanerMan: I'm not sure if we're looking at the same template. And this template isn't used on the mainspace - how so? Every player linked in the navbox has the template used on his page. I'm not aware of any sports-related or navigational template that's for stats or about player's stats. - almost every top scorer award of a major tournament or league that I'm aware of has a navbox to link between the recepients. So do leading goalkickers in the Australian Football League and the AFL Women's (for example {{Melbourne leading goalkickers}}). And I would appreciate if you answer the question and provide an example of a navbox that does anything beyond link to the article it lists.

The mainspace is the AFC article where there already exists a template for it. That's the mainspace template. And that template makes this one and all other AFC-related templates, at least the ones I nominated, redundant for its purpose. The issue with these templates, sports-related, mainly football/soccer templates is that there is too much of this redundancy. Too much of this crust. There is no need for multiple templates when one can do the job. And for stats, at least the articles for stats, it doesn't need a template as every page doesn't need its own template. --WikiCleanerMan (talk) 21:56, 25 June 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Note: This discussion has been included in WikiProject Football's list of association football-related deletions. Giant Snowman 14:45, 25 June 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Merge with parent template {{AFC Challenge Cup}}, no need for a separate template. Giant Snowman 14:49, 25 June 2021 (UTC)[reply]
Delete per WP:NAVBOX. This is not a topic well-connected by navbox. --Izno (talk) 03:27, 6 July 2021 (UTC)[reply]
Keep. The template provides a useful chronological summary for the reader in a common format. It enables them to cpmpare competitions across time. --S ellinson (talk) 10:00, 10 July 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.
Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, Plastikspork _―Œ^(talk) 16:35, 11 July 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Template:UEFA Women's Championship winners

Template:UEFA Women's Championship winners (talk · history · transclusions · logs · subpages)

Falls under navbox crust and only linked to the articles of the winning teams in the template. Redundant to Template:UEFA Women's Championship which makes better usage of the mainspace topic it was created for. --WikiCleanerMan (talk) 15:21, 24 June 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Note: This discussion has been included in WikiProject Football's list of association football-related deletions. Giant Snowman 14:45, 25 June 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Merge with parent template {{UEFA Women's Championship}}, no need for a separate template. Giant Snowman 14:49, 25 June 2021 (UTC)[reply]
Delete. The general team that won the competition is not well-connected to the year in which they won the competition. If this were connected to a specific year's team, it might be reasonable (I make no comment on whether such articles do or should exist), but linking to the general team is not. I see no value accordingly for merging. --Izno (talk) 03:27, 6 July 2021 (UTC)[reply]
Keep. The template provides a useful chronological summary for the reader in a common format. It enables them to cpmpare competitions across time. --S ellinson (talk) 10:00, 10 July 2021 (UTC)[reply]