He deleted my message without a response. I still suspect he's merely boorish and arrogant, but he seems unwilling (if you're right, unable) to deny that he holds anti-Semitic views. 12:17, 7 Apr 2005 (UTC)
He deleted my message without a response. I still suspect he's merely boorish and arrogant, but he seems unwilling (if you're right, unable) to deny that he holds anti-Semitic views. 12:17, 7 Apr 2005 (UTC)
:"Anti-Semitic"? "Boorish"? "Arrogant"? Those are personal attacks. Please reread [[Wikipedia:No personal attacks]]. Let's all get along and concentrate our efforts on improving articles. :) [[User:Helpful Dave|''Helpful Dave'']] 13:48, 7 Apr 2005 (UTC)
:"Anti-Semitic"? "Boorish"? "Arrogant"? Those are personal attacks. Please reread [[Wikipedia:No personal attacks]]. Let's all get along and concentrate our efforts on improving articles. :) [[User:Helpful Dave|''Helpful Dave'']] 13:48, 7 Apr 2005 (UTC)
Hi there,
I'm David's (Chamaeleon's) girlfriend. I'm writing to you because I'm upset about all these arguments and accusations being made in regards to David. He will not respond on Wikipedia, only by email, because he is trying to make a fresh start. Wikipedia is a place for NPOV, and therefore this discussion should not even be happening; but I hate that people believe things that are not true and which are grossly unfair. So, to say what he has not:
David is the most honest, decent, moral, logical and caring person I have ever met. He doesn't have a racist bone in his body. He is even a vegan. How can a person whose career in life is linguistics, who has lived in 4 different countries, who has friends of many nationalites, be racist? He doesn't even think in terms of race, if he says "you" he means just the person(s) he is talking to, not their race, or religion or group. He has not gone into great detail with me about the discussions people on wiki have been having about him, so I cannot argue all points for him, but I know that he is upset that people have been given the wrong impression about him. All he wants is to make a fresh start on the project of Wikipedia which means so much to him. If David has vandalised or edited without sources, then that is one thing, but that is not being argued here. What is being argued is POV, which has no place here. Sincerely, Erin.--[[User:Chammy Koala|Chammy Koala]] 14:47, 7 Apr 2005 (UTC)
Congratulations! It's my pleasure to let you know that, consensus being reached, you are now an administrator. You should read the relevant policies and other pages linked to from the administrators' reading list before carrying out tasks like deletion, protection, banning users, and editing protected pages such as the Main Page. Most of what you do is easily reversible by other sysops, apart from page history merges and image deletion, so please be especially careful with those. You might find the new administrators' how-to guide helpful. Cheers! -- Cecropia | explains it all ® 08:01, 6 Apr 2005 (UTC)
congratulations. I've never seen so many support votes... it turns out that no nail-biting was required at all. dab(ᛏ) 08:09, 6 Apr 2005 (UTC) File:Happyshatner.jpg
Congratulations, Mel. The many months of electoral tension are finally over. ;-) SlimVirgin(talk) 08:16, Apr 6, 2005 (UTC)
Well done, Professor! And let me just say that it was my pleasure to support —and oppose— your nomination! El_C 08:19, 6 Apr 2005 (UTC)
Faster than a speeding edit-revert, it's Admin-Man! Congrats! :) Grutness|hello? 09:34, 6 Apr 2005 (UTC)
Um, you don't have to thank me. Mine was just a small vote among over 50+ of others, so are you going to leave them thank you messages as well? In any case, congratulations! Ethereal 10:04, 6 Apr 2005 (UTC)
Congratulations, Sir. Oh, you're at Oxford, so rather than merely banning people you can rusticate them. That'll teach 'em! (Since I'm in very central Tokyo right now, I'm not quite sure whither I'd be rusticated. The computer-free home of the in-laws, I suppose.) But that's for later. What's the local tipple? Morrell is no more ... Brakspear, perhaps? Turn off the computer, pour yourself a pint; you can pick up the administrative mop and broom tomorrow. -- Hoary 10:29, 2005 Apr 6 (UTC)
Eh? I thought you were an admin already. Oh alright fine then, congrats from me too. :-) Kim Bruning 12:12, 6 Apr 2005 (UTC)
New Admin?
Saw a note that you're an admin now. Congratulations. I always thought you were! WBardwin 09:58, 6 Apr 2005 (UTC)
Congratulations Mel Etitis. Indeed, I need your help in mediation. :-D — Instantnood 10:06, Apr 6, 2005 (UTC)
Korean Pottery
RedWolf got involved in the Korean Pottery situation. He didn't seem sympathetic to our efforts at compromise with the Korean authors and deleted their category. Perhaps you (Mr. Admin) could see if we could accomodate them a little. RedWolf says the category title should be something like Ceramics of Korea anyway to meet Wiki specs. Thanks for your copy edits on the article. I'm keeping an eye on it too. Comments welcome. WBardwin 10:22, 6 Apr 2005 (UTC)
Here is his note from my talk page, in answer to my query on his talk page over the deletion. Hi. The reason the category was deleted was because it was listed on WP:CFD and there were no objections to the deletion after a week. RedWolf 07:35, Mar 27, 2005 (UTC)
In our exchange, he said he was not going to recreate the category for them, and that it should be in a different format/order anyway. I doubt our Korean friends even understand the voting procedure -- and I'm new enough I'm just starting to look it over. Whatever you can do would be helpful. Thanks. WBardwin 10:50, 6 Apr 2005 (UTC)
No real hurry. I've been trying to come up with a Clay Products/Industry tree that could satisfy them while keeping both the British and American terminology (which does differ a bit). Once more Korean clay articles emerge, we could start making suggestions. WBardwin 11:00, 6 Apr 2005 (UTC)
Congrats
Thanks for your message, and congratulations on being promoted! You certainly earned it, and I'm confident you'll use your powers wisely :-)
You now officially have the right to claim to be a member of the Cabal ;) -Frazzydee|✍ 11:49, 6 Apr 2005 (UTC)
Congrats, and thanks for the message. I think you'll be an excellent admin...at the very least I'll be able to appeal to unblock me after Ed Poor bans me for insubordination ;) Guettarda 13:20, 6 Apr 2005 (UTC)
'Twas my pleasure to kick in a nomination. You deserved it. Thanks for the thanks. :^) Now, go! Do battle with those who would besmirch the good name of Wikipedia! - Lucky 6.9 15:46, 6 Apr 2005 (UTC)
Congratulations. The high vote total is a strong endorsement by the community of your editing skill and tact. Cheers, -Willmcw 04:40, Apr 7, 2005 (UTC)
Excellent, Mel, congratulations from me as well! Best wishes, Antandrus 04:53, 7 Apr 2005 (UTC)
Gefeliciteerd! Since you evidently already have all the wisdom needed, I can only wish to you all the luck to complement that! Wishing you all the best, and cordially yours, Shinobu 06:00, 7 Apr 2005 (UTC)
Fixing user page vandalism
It was my pleasure. By the way, what do these anon editors have against you? Jayjg (talk) 13:25, 6 Apr 2005 (UTC)
Re: Traditions Magazine
Will continue to edit today as possible (I'm at work ATM) and will definately do alot more work on it this evening to put it more into the proper style/formatting. Thank you!
Chamaeleon
Regarding your remarks on his nomination page, how would you characterize this exchange? [1]SlimVirgin(talk) 19:23, Apr 6, 2005 (UTC)
The distinction between "genuine" anti-Semitism (whatever that is) and the kind of "insensitivity" you say he displayed is a false one. Try replacing Jew with black in his outbursts, and see whether you would still defend it as non-racist insensitivity. The "slime that has been spread across Wikipedia"; "disgusting Jews" (but only unnamed other people are saying this, of course); "the likes of JJ and SV": that vocabulary cannot reasonably be described as mere insensitivity. It's the irrational singling out of a certain group of people for criticism on the grounds of their (presumed) ethnicity. What is the "slime that has been spread across Wikipedia" and who is spreading it? Is "slime" being defined here as material written by Jews? It's a confused and very stupid series of statements at best; and I feel that, if you're going to comment at all, you should challenge him to explain it. SlimVirgin(talk) 21:12, Apr 6, 2005 (UTC)
I feel you should ask him what he meant, and that you should remove your comment that he's not in the least anti-Semitic until you've established what he meant. His attempt at hyperbole accounts only for the first of his remarks; but it morphs into what I see as his real views about slime and disgusting Jews, and the likes of. If he had said these things after announcing he was from Stormfront, you'd have clamped down on him instantly; but because you've found yourself agreeing with him politically elsewhere, you're inclined to give him the benefit of the doubt. But we are what we write on Wikipedia; intentions count for nothing, and in any event, only the most hardened anti-Semites will actually think of themselves as such. Most people who engage in anti-Semitism or racism are guilty only of insensitivity, short fuses, stupidity, and a lack of education, but that doesn't make it all right or less dangerous; the same applies to sexism and homophobia. These bigotries must be challenged whenever they appear, in whatever guise, not only when they have Stormfront tattooed on their foreheads. As I see it, Camaeleon's expressing exactly the same anti-Semitism as the middle-class-woman character in George Orwell's "Anti-Semitism in Britain": "Well, no one could call me anti-Semitic, but I do think the way these Jews behave is too absolutely stinking. The way they push their way to the head of queues, and so on. They’re so abominably selfish. I think they’re responsible for a lot of what happens to them.” [2] Chamaeleon very explicitly made this last point. My problem with what you wrote is that you've effectively excused him (which will encourage him), and you're a respected editor (and I also respect your intellect, and your background in philosophy). I therefore feel you have a responsibility, intellectual and moral, to remove your comment until you've challenged him regarding what he meant and have received a satisfactory response. SlimVirgin(talk) 22:01, Apr 6, 2005 (UTC)
Then I'm confused, if you're not familiar with his political editing, as to why you wrote: "I don't see that he's anti-Semitic in the slightest, and ... I often agree with his political views." Asking him what he meant may get you further than you think, because he'll be unable or unwilling to explain, retract, or apologize, and that may tell you something: an editor who had inadvertently made a bigoted remark would apologize if challenged, not dig himself in even deeper. I repeat that I hope you will remove your comment, as you admit you're not sure what he meant. What you wrote will serve to encourage him. SlimVirgin(talk) 22:15, Apr 6, 2005 (UTC)
Your somewhat leading question unfortunately doesn't ask him what he means by "slime," "disgusting Jews," or that the oppose comments made about him on his nomination page by Jayjg, SlimVirgin, and Mrfixter are the cause of anti-Semitism, particularly as these focused on C's lack of grasp of NOR and NPOV. I'm struggling to understand how saying of editors that they haven't understood a specific policy forces them into Judenhass if they're not already there. SlimVirgin(talk) 22:52, Apr 6, 2005 (UTC)
His answer is on his page; I responded with:
I'm not sure what your objection is. It should be obvious to you that my view was that you're not anti-Semitic, so I'm not trying to trick you into an admission (and besides, you insult my intelligence of you think that I wasn't aware that you'd see the discussion between SLimVirgin and me). If your answer to my question is 'no', what't the harm in giving it here? If I'm not to insult your intelligence, i can only assume that your answer is 'yes'. Feel free to delete this response; that makes no difference to anything. I'm not going to indulge you in private discussions about a public matter. Mel Etitis (Μελ Ετητης) 11:47, 7 Apr 2005 (UTC)
He deleted my message without a response. I still suspect he's merely boorish and arrogant, but he seems unwilling (if you're right, unable) to deny that he holds anti-Semitic views. 12:17, 7 Apr 2005 (UTC)
"Anti-Semitic"? "Boorish"? "Arrogant"? Those are personal attacks. Please reread Wikipedia:No personal attacks. Let's all get along and concentrate our efforts on improving articles. :) Helpful Dave 13:48, 7 Apr 2005 (UTC)
Hi there,
I'm David's (Chamaeleon's) girlfriend. I'm writing to you because I'm upset about all these arguments and accusations being made in regards to David. He will not respond on Wikipedia, only by email, because he is trying to make a fresh start. Wikipedia is a place for NPOV, and therefore this discussion should not even be happening; but I hate that people believe things that are not true and which are grossly unfair. So, to say what he has not:
David is the most honest, decent, moral, logical and caring person I have ever met. He doesn't have a racist bone in his body. He is even a vegan. How can a person whose career in life is linguistics, who has lived in 4 different countries, who has friends of many nationalites, be racist? He doesn't even think in terms of race, if he says "you" he means just the person(s) he is talking to, not their race, or religion or group. He has not gone into great detail with me about the discussions people on wiki have been having about him, so I cannot argue all points for him, but I know that he is upset that people have been given the wrong impression about him. All he wants is to make a fresh start on the project of Wikipedia which means so much to him. If David has vandalised or edited without sources, then that is one thing, but that is not being argued here. What is being argued is POV, which has no place here. Sincerely, Erin.--Chammy Koala 14:47, 7 Apr 2005 (UTC)
Adminship
Superpowers? You got superpowers? Things have changed since my day. Filiocht | Blarneyman 10:27, Apr 7, 2005 (UTC)
I'm still waiting for the mop, the bucket helped with work on the ETPH article. Filiocht | King of Regulars 11:44, Apr 7, 2005 (UTC)
Description
The only reason I changed it from world to international was because I flt that the term "international" had more of a emphasis on politics and the division of nations rather than on groups of people and cultures.
09:34, 6 Apr 2005 (UTC)
