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Talk:Political impact of the COVID-19 pandemic

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This is an old revision of this page, as edited by Tommancs (talk | contribs) at 15:52, 5 April 2020 (→‎Hungary). The present address (URL) is a permanent link to this revision, which may differ significantly from the current revision.

Template:COVID19 sanctions

Singapore's Election?

Singapore's election is of concern here; several opposition members have suggested that the General Election should be postponed, while the Election Boundaries were finalized in March. I'm not following the situation close enough to write about it in the article, so I'm posting here in the hope that others might know more about it. Mount2010 (talk) 18:52, 19 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Chart

I made a chart on my sandbox to keep track of what people in office, in what offices and in what countries have been infected. I think this would be a better way to convey information, but I'd like some opinions and suggestions instead of just putting this in the article.

Country Executive power and cabinet Upper house Lower house Other positions
 Australia Minister for Home Affairs
 Brazil Ministry of Mines and Energy
Institutional Security Office of Brazil		 Ambassador of Brazil to the United States
 France Ministry of Culture
 Iran Vice President
Minister of Cultural Heritage
Ministry of Industry, Mine and Trade
Minister of Foreign Affairs
Assembly of Experts

Expediency Discernment Council
 Indonesia Ministry of Transportation Mayor of Bogor
 Italy President of Lazio
President of Piedmont
Mayor of Lucca
Mayor of Piacenza
 Morocco Ministry of Equipment, Transport and Logistics* *
 Monaco Prince of Monaco
 Norway Minister of Labour and Social Inclusion
 Philippines
 Spain Ministry of Equality
Ministry for Territorial Administrations		 President and Vice President of Catalonia
President of the Community of Madrid
Parliament of Navarre
 United States New York State Assembly
Georgia State Senate
Mayor of Miami
 United Kingdom England

Same person denoted with asterics.

I think that at least some of us don't know many of the names, and the descriptions of the offices on the lists below the article come without country and most of them without clarifying if they were in office or not. Cristóbalrguacl (talk) 06:10, 23 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]

EDIT: I modified the chart after posting it because I dug up more information that is not included in the article. Also, I should point out that the red bars are for cases and black bars are for deaths. Cristóbalrguacl (talk) 07:02, 23 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Thank you for this chart. It is a great way to convey the information without having a giant list at the bottom. -Jon698 (talk) 05:37, 24 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Charles, Prince of Wales

Charles, Prince of Wales being tested as positive for coronavirus should be included in this article as he is the heir to the throne which still holds political power even though Queen Elizabeth II does not utilize her powers. There is a difference between some random lord in the middle of nowhere in Northern Ireland or Cornwall getting coronavirus and the heir to the British throne getting coronavirus. - Jon698 (talk) 17:36, 26 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]

@Jon698: Charles is not a politician, and placing him in the section for politicians implies that he is. Please remove him per WP:BRD until you get a consensus that says he is a politician. -- DeFacto (talk). 17:52, 26 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Charles is a politician. The Monarch is the head of state and holds including the power to appoint and dismiss the Prime Minister, appoint and dismiss other ministers, summon, prorogue and dissolve Parliament, regulate the Civil Service, and mutliple other political powers even if they aren't used and as the heir Charles is important enough to be included in this article. - Jon698 (talk) 18:04, 26 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]
@Jon698: per WP:BLP, I think you need to provide reliable sources to support that. And per the politician article as "A politician is a person active in party politics, or a person holding or seeking office in government", the sources will need to show which political party he supports or which government office he holds or is seeking. -- DeFacto (talk). 21:20, 26 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]
@DeFacto: Nonpartisan and head of state. Multiple news organizations include him as a politican/world leader who has been infected. https://foreignpolicy.com/2020/03/18/coronavirus-corridors-power-which-world-leaders-have-covid-19/ https://www.foxnews.com/world/which-world-leaders-politicians-tested-positive-coronavirus-quarantine - Jon698 (talk) 00:14, 27 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]
@Jon698: although he may become king one day, he is not a politician, so should not be listed as such. The British monarchy is a strictly constitutional monarchy with no formal authority. It is apolitical, non-political, politically neutral. The monarch does not vote and does not stand for election.[1][2]. For Prince Charles to be within scope, the article would need to be renamed to include his role (he is not head of state or king, and may never be) and he should be included in a non-politician section. -- DeFacto (talk). 08:51, 27 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]
@DeFacto: How about a compromise? He will be removed from the "Impact on politicians", but will remain in the status infobox. - Jon698 (talk) 11:31, 27 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]
@Jon698: or we could simply rename the section (and maybe the article) to make it inclusive of Charles's position and role - if you think he needs to be shoehorned in. How about "Impact on politicians and pillars of society" for the section title? -- DeFacto (talk). 16:18, 27 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Protests or riots

Given the last year or so has seen so much of these, it seems reasonable to ask what the effects will be as curfews and lockdowns progess, particularly in the developing world. Bokoharamwatch (talk) 15:52, 2 April 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Hungary

We should present the new legislation fairly and neutrally. The principal points of the new law are the following ([3]): 1. The Governemt (not the Prime Minister!) is authorized to rule by decree to the extent it is necessary to diminish the consequences of the coronavirus pandemic till the end of the pandemic. 2. Not elections, but by-election are suspended till the end of the pandemic. 3. The Court of Constitution can make judgement through electronic communicaiton (without holding formal sessions). 4. The authorization is indeed indefinite, because we do not know when the pandemic ends. Of course, we can present PoVs claiming that such an emergency authorization is incompatible with democracy, but we cannot presents PoVs as facts. Borsoka (talk) 02:37, 4 April 2020 (UTC)[reply]

I assume that Human Watch Rights explained why the above legislation constitutes an "authoritarian takeover". I think the above measures are logical steps. I would like to understand what are the dangers for me (I am staunch supporter of one of the opposition parties.) Is it possible that my imprisonment is necessary to diminish the consequences of the pandemic? Or should I demand by-elections during the pandemic? Or should I demand that the Parlament grant plenary powers to the Government until the end of the pandemic twice in a month or in each month or in every third month? So I would be grateful if an expert could summarize the Human Watch Rights' concerns about the above measures. Borsoka (talk) 16:59, 4 April 2020 (UTC)[reply]
@Jon698:, could you please summarize the legislation fairly and neutrally? We are not here to present PoVs as facts. I referred to a neutral summary of the law. Borsoka (talk) 18:20, 4 April 2020 (UTC)[reply]
@Borsoka: I have fulfilled everything that I need to do per WP:BURDEN. EVERY reliable news outlet and multiple human rights organizations has stated that Hungary's laws are authoritarian. Now the burden is on you to provide sources for your claim that they aren't. - Jon698 (talk) 18:34, 4 April 2020 (UTC)[reply]
First of all, I referred to a Hungarian reliable source above hours ago - to a Hungarian news websit. Do you think we should prefer summaries of journalists who do not speak Hungarian about a law published in Hungarian? What is obvious for a native speaker of Hungarian, that ALL sources of the article published in English on this subject contains the SAME errors - suggesting that they can be traced to ONE common source (I listed the errors above). If we want to follow our community's basic policies, especially WP:NPOV, we should first present the legislation as neutrally as it is possible. Afterwards, we should, of course, present all relevant PoVs, including the ones stating that the Government's plenary power is unprecedented, dangerous, authoritarian, etc. Borsoka (talk) 18:59, 4 April 2020 (UTC)[reply]
One sources from a Hungarian site with dubious connections to the government < Human rights organizations. - Jon698 (talk) 19:13, 4 April 2020 (UTC)[reply]
I have looked more into that source you brought up and upon a quick search of their Wikipedia page I found this:

"In February 2014, Pro-Ráta Holding Zrt, a company close to Lajos Simicska, a businessman often described as a "Fidesz oligarch", but later a fierce enemy of Orbán, signed an option to buy Index from Spéder, unknown to Index's employees.[30] After Simicska fell out with Orbán in 2015.[31] and several businesspeople still allied with Fidesz started showing interest in purchasing Index" "After Fidesz's overwhelming victory in the 2010 elections, Spéder's close relationship with several figures close to the party meant that many at Index started fearing increased political influence.[24][25] This culminated in Péter Uj resigning as editor-in-chief after 11 years in September 2011[13], later citing the firing of one of Index's employees after an article critical of Viktor Orbán as the cause of his exit." - Jon698 (talk) 19:20, 4 April 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Please find further sources: [4], [5], [6]. Borsoka (talk) 19:29, 4 April 2020 (UTC) (Just a side question: do you really think that a Hungarian newspaper dares to incorrectly summarize the provisions of a law which is published? I think your experiences with newspapers must be really unique.) Borsoka (talk) 19:31, 4 April 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Tommancs (talk) 15:52, 5 April 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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