Talk:2024 Israeli strikes on Iran

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This is an old revision of this page, as edited by Paine Ellsworth (talk | contribs) at 20:14, 23 April 2024 (→‎Requested move 19 April 2024: fmt). The present address (URL) is a permanent link to this revision, which may differ significantly from the current revision.

Isreal-iran conflict

What meant by the deployment of defense systems after isreali attack not before? 106.205.139.216 (talk) 05:03, 19 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]

To deter further strikes. M Waleed (talk) 06:26, 19 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Why it is "retaliatory strikes" if it's by Israel but only "strikes" if it's by Iran?

Resolved, see the RM above for continued discussion.—Alalch E. 09:13, 19 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]

The following discussion is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

The article title "2024 Israeli retaliatory strikes in Iran" appears to have a bias by including the word "retaliatory." In contrast, the title of the article about the 2024 Iranian strikes in Israel did not use this term, even though Iran's actions were also in response to Israel's prior attack on the Iranian consulate in Syria.

To maintain a more neutral and objective tone, I suggest removing the word "retaliatory" from the title of the article about Israel's strikes. This change would help ensure that both articles are presented in a more balanced manner, without implying a difference in the motivations behind each country's actions. 3skandar (talk) 06:35, 19 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]

  • Quick Support, already commented to the move request.
Grabup (talk) 06:55, 19 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]
I've went ahead and moved the page. The inclusion of "retaliatory" was clearly inconsistent with the other article and against NPOV. – Asarlaí (talk) 08:49, 19 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]
The discussion above is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

Edit request 19 April 2024


Please add the article move discussion box at the top of the page, the discussion above is active Bigfatman8766 (talk) 05:47, 19 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Done by Bot. Grabup (talk) 05:55, 19 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]
 Already done '''[[User:CanonNi]]''' (talk|contribs) 10:09, 19 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Possible better name

Not going to open a formal move request (yet), but there is a pretty good chance that we see further retaliation from Iran, and maybe even more retaliation from Israel. I believe it would be better to narrow it down, although it could wait until if there are future strikes. RPI2026F1 (talk) 04:35, 19 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]

A possible move would be to remove the word "retaliatory" from the title as it may be an unnecessary disambiguator but I'm not biased to either title. Flemmish Nietzsche (talk) 04:38, 19 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Maybe in the future, we condense down all future strikes into a single article? I don't know if each potential future round of retaliation will be worthy of independent articles, just as there is not an article for every strike the proxy groups do to Israel. RPI2026F1 (talk) 04:41, 19 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Well if there is further rounds of retaliation there is likely to be a full-blown war, which would certainly have its own article, but I see your point. Flemmish Nietzsche (talk) 04:42, 19 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]
I will suggest to merge the article with 2024 Iranian Attack in Israel. And rename that article’s name to “2024 Iran-Israel Conflict” or War” Grabup (talk) 04:43, 19 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]
It is not a war yet, conflict is likely a good stop-gap from now. It's a personal opinion that the world superpowers will not allow the conflict to escalate to a full-on war, as unlike the Russian "special military operation", there is near-unanimous calls for "restraint" from the rest of the world. RPI2026F1 (talk) 04:45, 19 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]
There already is an article about the conflict itself and full war is not certain yet, so I think for now it is fine. Flemmish Nietzsche (talk) 04:45, 19 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]
The name of this article should be changed. The first “actual” retaliatory attack article is titled “2024 Iranian strikes in Israel” without mentioning “retaliatory” word at the title and how come this article can be titled as retaliatory? People will say that Wikipedia is biased to Israel.
I don’t think this is a retaliatory attack as Israel provoked Iran first and the “actual” retaliation is done by Iran not Israel. Grabup (talk) 05:06, 19 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Yes, they both were retaliations, as the two countries seem to be wrapped up in a big retaliation cycle, and don't show signs of wanting to stop it. I agree with the name change but there should be a RM first rather than moving without consensus. Flemmish Nietzsche (talk) 05:09, 19 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]

The background section is brobdingnagian as it is –I'm tempted to collapse it. There's no term that's commodious yet accurate enough (which we can cite) that covers everything from the initial bombing of the Iranian embassy compound to this... quadrocopter infilitration‽ kencf0618 (talk) 12:58, 19 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Change HEADLINES

The 2024 Israeli strikes was NOT a missile attack, there was no proof of a missile attack whatsoever, Israel conducted a limited strike I'm gonna cite an article from the Atlantic Council , yet the first two lines report a missile "strikes" even though a US official *claimed* one missile struck Iran, so it wasn't "Strikes" just a strikes without including the Drone strike of course and interestingly the article's security has been upped by an Administrator, so I kindly request the Wikipedia how are authorized to edit this page, to update the information and according to Wikipedia standards

Regard, Mujiwins (talk) 14:26, 19 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Please anyone counter it, if you have reliable sources. Grabup (talk) 14:57, 19 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Bloomberg and Reuters reported these strikes as limited strikes and only mentiones drone strikes. Grabup (talk) 15:14, 19 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Extended-confirmed-protected edit request on 19 April 2024

3 missiles

It was

https://abcnews.go.com/International/live-updates/israel-gaza-hamas-war/?id=108860743 37.255.74.35 (talk) 16:24, 19 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]

 Not done: it's not clear what changes you want to be made. Please mention the specific changes in a "change X to Y" format and provide a reliable source if appropriate. GrayStorm(Talk|Contributions) 17:07, 19 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]

None reliable source, Edit request

An editor just made this very weird edit removing a sourced content by CNN and replacing it with an entirely new contradicting content citing a twitter post from an unknown unverified twitter account (completely not WP:RS in the first place). I suggest speedy undoing this edit.

Edit: the times of israel cited and recycled the same post on twitter but the post itself was deleted by the same user who made it. 

Stephan rostie (talk) 20:59, 19 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]

CHANGE type of attack to Drone strike

The article states that Israel conducted Airstrikes which was changed from Drone strike, the actual attack was a drone strike as reported my multiple sources including Reuters Drone strike is any strike conducted via drones, while airstrike is a strike in general it MAY include drones, but I don't understand why a more specific term would be changed to a broader term for no reason. I do acknowledge that a US official claimed 2-3 missiles were launched but considering a statement from ONE official of ONE country as fact is just not how Wikipedia works, I kindly Wikipedia editors who are authorized to edit this article to edit this page and to update the information in accordance with fact and not claims made my countries.

Regards, Mujiwins (talk) 18:39, 19 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Early reports said it was a drone attack but latest reports from US and Israeli officials say it has been an airstrike launched by Israeli aircraft. Citations are located in the article. Ecrusized (talk) 20:53, 19 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]
When did Israeli officials say it? cite it please because I only heard a US official "claiming" it Mujiwins (talk) 22:59, 19 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Iranian radar hit?

Now Wikipedia editors are relying on citing twitter posts? This isn't up to Wikipedia standards, this edit should be reverted immediately

Regards, Mujiwins (talk) 23:08, 19 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Add "Alleged" to the title of the article

Add "Alleged" to the title of the article. Neither Iran nor Israel acknowledge that there has been any attack by Israel in Iran. Iran even provided proof that there has been no attack. What anonymous U.S. official said shouldn't be given so much weight. Crampcomes (talk) 00:06, 20 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]

There certainly was an attack done on Iran by somebody, and even if Israel denies it, missiles/drones were certainly shot down, and Israel is the only country that would reasonably attack Iran at this point, so adding "alleged" seems a little bit biased. A week or so ago the Israeli bombing of the Iranian embassy in Damascus was "allegedly" done by Israel, but there was little room for arguing to say anyone else had done it, and Israel later confirmed it.
Additionally, please do not move the page at this point without achieving consensus as you just did. Flemmish Nietzsche (talk) 00:14, 20 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Was it not confirmed by multiple reliable sources? RPI2026F1 (talk) 01:14, 20 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Requested move on 20 April 2024

2024 Israeli strikes on Iran → 2024 Israeli retaliatory strikes on Iran - change name to 2024 Israeli retaliatory strikes on Iran 

98.110.81.233 (talk) 04:01, 20 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]
 Not done: page move requests should be made at Wikipedia:Requested moves. '''[[User:CanonNi]]''' (talk|contribs) 04:08, 20 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]

ITN headline update

Why hasn't it been updated that Israel is retaliating? Brudelman (talk) 11:40, 20 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]

The place to suggest changing that headline would be WP:ITNC. SilverLocust 💬 00:35, 22 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Requested move 19 April 2024

2024 Israeli strikes on Iran → 2024 Israeli strikes in Isfahan – This is a retaliation to a retaliation, but that article was not named as a retaliation. So the same should apply here, and it would get more confusing if Iran retaliates to this attack. It would be weird to call such article a retaliation to a retaliation to a retaliation, this hasn't been done before. Bigfatman8766 (talk) 05:14, 19 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]

  • Support - The name of this article should be changed. The first “actual” retaliatory attack article is titled “2024 Iranian strikes in Israel” without mentioning “retaliatory” word at the title and how come this article can be titled as retaliatory? People will say that Wikipedia is biased to Israel. I don’t think this is a retaliatory attack as Israel provoked Iran first and the “actual” retaliation is done by Iran not Israel. Grabup (talk) 05:19, 19 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]
    As @Bigfatman8766, said the attack is also targeted Iraq and Syria. I will suppor the alternative name given, “2024 Israeli strikes in Iran, Iraq and Syria” for now, if anyone came with better name then maybe I support it. Grabup (talk) 06:08, 19 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]
  • Support - As said, this is not the first retaliation and as such should not be biased to be the only retaliation which names such in the title. The title "2024 Israeli strikes in Iran" (or Isfahan) is far more neutral and does not put the blame on Iran for being the igniter of this retaliation chain. Flemmish Nietzsche (talk) 05:22, 19 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]
  • Comment - Now there is confirmation that some hit Iraq and Syria as well. Should the title include these as well? Maybe 2024 Israeli retaliatory strikes in Iran → 2024 Israeli strikes in Iran, Iraq and Syria? Although does seem a little too long, is there any other suggestions? Bigfatman8766 (talk) 05:59, 19 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]
    What about 2024 limited Israeli strikes on Iran? I think it sums it up good and blasts the conspiracy theorists? Mujiwins (talk) 15:37, 19 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]
  • Support for alternative As per Bigfatman8766, the strikes is not only directed at Iran itself. 2024 Israeli strikes in Iran, Iraq and Syria will work best. Yxuibs (talk) 06:05, 19 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]
  • Support for 2024 Israeli strikes in Iran,Iraq and Syria , that name suits more as strikes were not only in Iran but also Babylon and Baghdad in Iraq and Daraa and Sudais in Syria as well M Waleed (talk) 06:28, 19 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]
  • Support as "retaliatory" in this article but not for the Iranian drone strikes implies that Iran did it unprovoked, which is false GLORIOUSEXISTENCE (talk) 07:46, 19 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]
  • Support for 2024 Israeli strikes in Iran,Iraq and Syria pretty much blankets and futureproofs article. Fantastic Mr. Fox (talk) 08:11, 19 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]
  • I've went ahead and removed "retaliatory" from the article name, because of the many requests to do so, and because it was clearly inconsistent with the other article name and against NPOV. – Asarlaí (talk) 08:56, 19 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]
    Comment: Any Idea if there will be a name to the entire strike? RΔ𝚉🌑R-𝕏 (talk) 09:21, 19 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Should I move it to 2024 Israeli strikes in Iran, Iraq and Syria M Waleed (talk) 12:30, 19 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]
I think there is a consensus doing so already Fantastic Mr. Fox (talk) 14:40, 19 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]
@M Waleed, You are not allowed to close this move discussion as you are involved. See WP:RMCI. Grabup (talk) 15:04, 19 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Okay M Waleed (talk) 15:25, 19 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Comment anything but Isfahan. Kind of implies that they are an independent state. Borgenland (talk) 15:29, 19 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Support for alternative What about 2024 limited Israeli strikes on Iran? I think it sums it up good and blasts the conspiracy theorists? Mujiwins (talk) 15:35, 19 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Support for alternative What about 2024 limited Israeli strikes on Iran? I think it sums it up good and blasts the conspiracy theorists? Mujiwins (talk) 15:35, 19 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]
  • Change to 2024 Israeli airstrikes on Iran or 2024 Natanz airstrike. While this was initially reported as a drone strike. New reports from senior US officials indicate that this was an airstrike, launched by Israeli aircraft that fired missiles from outside Iran.[1] Ecrusized (talk) 16:41, 19 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]
    2024 Israeli airstrikes on Iran - is looking more factual and famous. Also it will be good if we see other targets, mentioned above Iraq and Syria. Grabup (talk) 17:31, 19 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]
  • Oppose Chaning "Iran" to "Isfahan" in the title is WP:OVERPRECISION. There is only one such 2024 Israeli strike in Iran, so there is no need to specify the exact location. Gödel2200 (talk) 21:46, 19 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]
  • Oppose change to "2024 Israeli strikes in Isfahan", but "2024 Israeli strikes in Iran, Iraq and Syria" appears correct with what information is available at the present.--Surv1v4l1st ╠Talk║Contribs╣ 22:17, 19 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]
  • Keep the article to what it currently is, 2024 Israeli strikes on Iran. It is not confirmed that Israel attacked Iran and Syria, unlike what I thought earlier. Bigfatman8766 (talk) 22:23, 19 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Support move to 2024 Isfahan airstrike, otherwise keep for now Most orthogonal and shortest name. "Israeli" can be in the short description. RadioactiveBoulevardier (talk) 00:21, 20 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]
  • Oppose change to "2024 Israeli strikes in Isfahan" and keep it as 2024 Israeli strikes on Iran. Gödel2200 sums it up well - there is no need for such precision. PhilKnight (talk) 15:12, 20 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]
  • Oppose change to "2024 Israeli strikes in Isfahan". Keep it as 2024 Israeli strikes on Iran. --Nicola Romani (talk) 17:11, 22 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]
  • Oppose Isfahan was not the only hit location. Marokwitz (talk) 19:38, 23 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]

References

  1. ^ "Israelis fired 3 missiles in limited strike". ABC News. 19 April 2024. Retrieved 19 April 2024.

I suggest we make a new article to cover the attack on Iraq's PMU base

This article is for the Israeli strikes on Iran on 19 April, not on Iraq on 20 April. I feel it's more appropriate to report it separately because it's two different countries and there's still no confirmation on who perpetrated the strikes whether the U.S. or Israel.

Also the attack on Iraq has been gaining media traction because an Iraqi PMU soldier was killed and many were injured. RamHez (talk) 07:17, 20 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Source Grabup (talk) 07:37, 20 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Note, the references in the article make no mention that this airstrike was carrier out by Israel. While Israel is the probable suspect, this appears to be original research. Ecrusized (talk) 14:27, 20 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]

An earlier version of the Reuters article did mention Israel carried out the attack. I've tried using the Wayback Machine to look at a cached version of it, but only the earliest version seems to be available. David O. Johnson (talk) 18:36, 20 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]
I changed the wording of both mentions of the blast to say "allegedly" and added the CNN article that was mentioned, should no longer qualify as WP:OR. Flemmish Nietzsche (talk) 18:43, 20 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]

The "Requested move 19 April 2024" discussion shouldn't have been archived

It hasn't been seven days yet. David O. Johnson (talk) 20:44, 21 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]

 Done. Unarchived and changed the auto-archiving settings for this page to be longer than one day. Facepalm Facepalm SilverLocust 💬 00:16, 22 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Thanks. David O. Johnson (talk) 04:21, 22 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]
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