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Oversimplification regarding Druze identity

Yes, a Pew article on Christians says "most of Israel’s Druze population also identifies as ethnically Arab", which is cited for the page saying that a majority identify as ethnically Arab. But although Pew is RS it is known for simplifications on matters of identity especially, and both Druze identity and Arab identity are complicated things, so of course the intersection of them is even more bamboozling. The mainstream view is that Israeli Druze (as opposed to say, Lebanese or Syrian Druze) do indeed of Arab linguistic and cultural traits -- as do many Israeli Jews, including even Israeli Ashkenazim who nowadays have elements of Arab material culture with some speaking Arabic for practical purposes -- but whether that makes them "ethnically Arab" is a contentious question. Of course there are many views here -- (1) "all speakers of Arabic are Arab", (2) Arabians and those descended from them are Arab, (3) Arab-speaking Muslims are Arab, (4) Arab-speaking Sunnis are Arab, (5) parts of even the Sunni populace of certain Arab countries may identify with the pre-Arab cultures to varying degrees, the more intense of which do come at the expense of Arab identity, although (6) pan-Arabism views these as all Arabs in denial and attributes it to the influence of non-Arab forces. Of course it gets worse as this is all tied up with sectarian, regional and territorial politics. I can source dump, I'm sure you can too. Here's a few that hold the alternate viewpoint that Israeli Druze do in fact have an identity that cannot exactly be simplified to "ethnic Arab" as it also differentiates itself from "Arabs" -- [[1]] [[2]] (both Lisa Hajjar and Oppenheimer do attribute the development to the Israeli state, to varying degrees) and then also this [[3]]. If we're going to have such a controversial statement on the page it would need to be balanced, but of course balance requires sourcing and more rebalancing and personally I don't want an unsightly oversourced coatrack-- so the high road is just to avoid making oversimplified statements like that.--Calthinus (talk) 16:30, 6 December 2017 (UTC)[reply]

You have removed a statement referenced by a reliable source, on the basis of your own synthesis of other, non-cited, sources. This is unacceptable. In addition, your latest edit appears to breach the arbitration ruling that "Each editor is limited to one revert per page per 24 hours on any page that could be reasonably construed as being related to the Arab-Israeli conflict. If an edit is reverted by another editor, its original author may not restore it within 24 hours." I urge you to revert your edit, and to await the outcome of any discussion following your remarks above. RolandR (talk) 13:35, 7 December 2017 (UTC)[reply]

I will revert myself momentarily. "Synthesis" is entirely acceptable and encouraged on talk pages (unlike the mainspace-- as an established editor, I expect you to be familiar with this). I have presented many sources that challenge the oversimplistic view that the page is presenting. I will respect 1RR-- my bad, I thought 24 hours had passed, so I'm now reverting -- but please actually engage with what I'm saying rather than throwing around accusations like "synthesis" whne I have not added any such thing to the mainspace.--Calthinus (talk) 18:16, 7 December 2017 (UTC)[reply]

What appears to have happened here is that a reference was inserted to the wrong page in the source document. I have replaced this with a reference to the appropriate page in the same Pew Center report, which states that "Virtually all Muslims (99%) and Christians (96%) surveyed in Israel identify as Arab. A somewhat smaller share of Druze (71%) say they are ethnically Arab. Other Druze respondents identify their ethnicity as “Other,” “Druze” or “Druze-Arab.”" This is certainly a strong reference from a reliable source, and should not be removed. If you have other sources which offer a different assessment, you are welcome to add them - but they cannot be used to cancel out this source. — Preceding unsigned comment added by RolandR (talk • contribs) 00:36, 8 December 2017 (UTC)[reply]

Wrong title. Article includes non-citizens...

... - see Golan Druze. East Jerusalem Arabs are also permanent residents and Israeli ID card bearers. Suggest "Arab Israeli population" or alike. Arminden (talk) 07:35, 21 February 2018 (UTC)[reply]

"right to apply for citizenship, are entitled to municipal services and have municipal voting rights" not supported by cited source

"right to apply for citizenship, are entitled to municipal services and have municipal voting rights" is not supported by the cited source. I guess it will stay that way. Keith McClary (talk) 04:50, 19 August 2018 (UTC)[reply]

Requested move 2 September 2018

It has been proposed in this section that Arab citizens of Israel be renamed and moved to Palestinian Arab citizens of Israel.

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Arab citizens of Israel → Palestinian Arab citizens of Israel –

Most RS use equivalents of this term: (1) Asʻad Ganim (16 May 2001). The Palestinian-Arab Minority in Israel, 1948-2000: A Political Study. SUNY Press. ISBN 978-0-7914-4998-1.; (2) Shourideh C. Molavi (28 June 2013). Stateless Citizenship: The Palestinian-Arab Citizens of Israel. BRILL. ISBN 978-90-04-25407-7.; (3) Alexander Bligh (2 August 2004). The Israeli Palestinians: An Arab Minority in the Jewish State. Routledge. ISBN 978-1-135-76078-6.

Our article's section on this group's self-identification (Arab citizens of Israel#Self-identification) shows the importance of the Palestinian identity within this population group, so it seems perverse for us to exclude this word from the group's nomenclature on Wikipedia. Both terms Palestinian and Arab have continued relevance amongst the group, which appears to be the reason why most RS use both.

This issue feels particularly in need of change after reading a widely reported letter published earlier today by the parlimentary representatives of 82% of this population. In the letter they described their group five times: "Palestinian Arab citizens of the state of Israel... Palestinian Arabs constitute about a fifth of Israel’s citizenry... Palestinian citizens of Israel... As part of the Palestinian people... Palestinian parliamentarians".[4]

One quick side note - this would not give us a problem with the small Arab population of the Golan (c.25,000 people who are Syrians, not Palestinians), since, as we say in the article, the vast majority of them do not have Israeli citizenship so fall outside the title of this article already.
Onceinawhile (talk) 23:30, 2 September 2018 (UTC)[reply]

Oppose. The proper term is Israeli Arab - which is used by more sources. Furthermore, some Arab groups such as Bedouin (who speak a totally different variant of Arabic from the farm or city dwellers) and Druze's identification as Palestinian is very much contested by many if not most members of the Druze and Bedoin community.Icewhiz (talk) 11:13, 3 September 2018 (UTC)[reply]

"The designation “Israeli-Arab” aroused great opposition in the focus groups."[5] Wikipedia is not in the business of arousing resentment in large groups of living people. Onceinawhile (talk) 17:36, 3 September 2018 (UTC)[reply]

Do you want to split Bedouin and Druze out of this article? Both groups unambigously identify as Arab - but many do not identify as Palestinian (very few Druze do. In the Bedouin community its complicated and variable (time, different groups within).Icewhiz (talk) 17:44, 3 September 2018 (UTC)[reply]

Support pr nom, Huldra (talk) 20:59, 3 September 2018 (UTC)[reply]

@@ Line 95: / Line 95: @@
 :::''"The designation “Israeli-Arab” aroused great opposition in the focus groups."''[http://www.kas.de/wf/doc/kas_51217-544-2-30.pdf?171228130254] Wikipedia is not in the business of arousing resentment in large groups of living people. [[User:Onceinawhile|Onceinawhile]] ([[User talk:Onceinawhile|talk]]) 17:36, 3 September 2018 (UTC)
 :::: Do you want to split Bedouin and Druze out of this article? Both groups unambigously identify as Arab - but many do not identify as Palestinian (very few Druze do. In the Bedouin community its complicated and variable (time, different groups within).[[User:Icewhiz|Icewhiz]] ([[User talk:Icewhiz|talk]]) 17:44, 3 September 2018 (UTC)
+*'''Support''' pr nom, [[User:Huldra|Huldra]] ([[User talk:Huldra|talk]]) 20:59, 3 September 2018 (UTC)