Talk:Arab citizens of Israel

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Here are some tasks awaiting attention:
  • Expand : Muslims, Christians sub-sections: Please add a little about institutions, history, and towns
  • Verify : Please add reliable sources for all of the information (do not delete info please, look for verification)

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External links modified[edit]

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External links modified[edit]

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Oversimplification regarding Druze identity[edit]

Yes, a Pew article on Christians says "most of Israel’s Druze population also identifies as ethnically Arab", which is cited for the page saying that a majority identify as ethnically Arab. But although Pew is RS it is known for simplifications on matters of identity especially, and both Druze identity and Arab identity are complicated things, so of course the intersection of them is even more bamboozling. The mainstream view is that Israeli Druze (as opposed to say, Lebanese or Syrian Druze) do indeed of Arab linguistic and cultural traits -- as do many Israeli Jews, including even Israeli Ashkenazim who nowadays have elements of Arab material culture with some speaking Arabic for practical purposes -- but whether that makes them "ethnically Arab" is a contentious question. Of course there are many views here -- (1) "all speakers of Arabic are Arab", (2) Arabians and those descended from them are Arab, (3) Arab-speaking Muslims are Arab, (4) Arab-speaking Sunnis are Arab, (5) parts of even the Sunni populace of certain Arab countries may identify with the pre-Arab cultures to varying degrees, the more intense of which do come at the expense of Arab identity, although (6) pan-Arabism views these as all Arabs in denial and attributes it to the influence of non-Arab forces. Of course it gets worse as this is all tied up with sectarian, regional and territorial politics. I can source dump, I'm sure you can too. Here's a few that hold the alternate viewpoint that Israeli Druze do in fact have an identity that cannot exactly be simplified to "ethnic Arab" as it also differentiates itself from "Arabs" -- [[1]] [[2]] (both Lisa Hajjar and Oppenheimer do attribute the development to the Israeli state, to varying degrees) and then also this [[3]]. If we're going to have such a controversial statement on the page it would need to be balanced, but of course balance requires sourcing and more rebalancing and personally I don't want an unsightly oversourced coatrack-- so the high road is just to avoid making oversimplified statements like that.--Calthinus (talk) 16:30, 6 December 2017 (UTC)

You have removed a statement referenced by a reliable source, on the basis of your own synthesis of other, non-cited, sources. This is unacceptable. In addition, your latest edit appears to breach the arbitration ruling that "Each editor is limited to one revert per page per 24 hours on any page that could be reasonably construed as being related to the Arab-Israeli conflict. If an edit is reverted by another editor, its original author may not restore it within 24 hours." I urge you to revert your edit, and to await the outcome of any discussion following your remarks above. RolandR (talk) 13:35, 7 December 2017 (UTC)
I will revert myself momentarily. "Synthesis" is entirely acceptable and encouraged on talk pages (unlike the mainspace-- as an established editor, I expect you to be familiar with this). I have presented many sources that challenge the oversimplistic view that the page is presenting. I will respect 1RR-- my bad, I thought 24 hours had passed, so I'm now reverting -- but please actually engage with what I'm saying rather than throwing around accusations like "synthesis" whne I have not added any such thing to the mainspace.--Calthinus (talk) 18:16, 7 December 2017 (UTC)
What appears to have happened here is that a reference was inserted to the wrong page in the source document. I have replaced this with a reference to the appropriate page in the same Pew Center report, which states that "Virtually all Muslims (99%) and Christians (96%) surveyed in Israel identify as Arab. A somewhat smaller share of Druze (71%) say they are ethnically Arab. Other Druze respondents identify their ethnicity as “Other,” “Druze” or “Druze-Arab.”" This is certainly a strong reference from a reliable source, and should not be removed. If you have other sources which offer a different assessment, you are welcome to add them - but they cannot be used to cancel out this source. — Preceding unsigned comment added by RolandR (talkcontribs) 00:36, 8 December 2017 (UTC)

Wrong title. Article includes non-citizens...[edit]

... - see Golan Druze. East Jerusalem Arabs are also permanent residents and Israeli ID card bearers. Suggest "Arab Israeli population" or alike. Arminden (talk) 07:35, 21 February 2018 (UTC)