Talk:Israeli torture in the occupied territories

This is the talk page for discussing improvements to the Israeli torture in the occupied territories article.
This is not a forum for general discussion of the article's subject.

Put new text under old text. Click here to start a new topic.
New to Wikipedia? Welcome! Learn to edit; get help.

Article policies

Find sources: Google (books · news · scholar · free images · WP refs) · FENS · JSTOR · TWL

Israel

This article is within the scope of WikiProject Israel, a collaborative effort to improve the coverage of Israel on Wikipedia. If you would like to participate, please visit the project page, where you can join the discussion and see a list of open tasks.IsraelWikipedia:WikiProject IsraelTemplate:WikiProject IsraelIsrael-related articles

???

This article has not yet received a rating on the project's importance scale.

Project Israel To Do:

Here are some tasks awaiting attention:

Assess : Rate the Unassessed Israel-related articles and Unknown-importance Israel-related articles.
Categorization : Diffuse articles from Category:Companies of Israel.
Cleanup : Cleanup listing for this project is available. See also the list by category and the tool's wiki page.
Collaborate : Participate in WikiProject Israel Palestine Collaboration.
Copyedit : Timeline of the Israeli–Palestinian conflict in 2005
Deletion sorting : Participate in discussions at WikiProject Deletion sorting/Israel.
Expand : Ayala Procaccia, Diamond industry in Israel, Edna Arbel, Levin Kipnis, Rami Kleinstein, Sephardic Haredim, Zman Tel Aviv, Nachum Heiman, Public Defence (Israel), Prisoner of Zion, Trial of Benjamin Netanyahu, Day to Mark the Departure and Expulsion of Jews from the Arab Countries and Iran, Pre-Modern Aliyah
See also Articles needing translation from Hebrew Wikipedia.
Geographical coordinates : Add geographic coordinates to Israel articles missing geocoordinate data.
Infobox : Add infoboxes to Israel articles needing infoboxes.
Maintain : See Israel articles needing attention.
Map : See discussion at Module:Location map/data/Israel. Add maps to articles in Wikipedia requested maps in Israel.
NPOV : Jewish exodus from Arab and Muslim countries
Photo : Add pictures to articles in Wikipedia requested photographs in Israel.
Stubs : See Israel stubs.
Update : Basic Law proposal: Israel as the Nation-State of the Jewish People
Other :
- Translate to Hebrew : David Bar-Hayim, Guy Bavli, and Guy Oseary.
- Merge Nahal Rafiah (draft, heb) into Nahal as requested by Wikipedia authority

Israel Palestine Collaboration

This article is within the scope of the WikiProject Israel Palestine Collaboration, a collaborative, bipartisan effort to improve Wikipedia's coverage of the Israeli–Palestinian conflict. For guidelines and a participants list see the project page. See also {{Palestine-Israel enforcement}}, the ArbCom-authorized discretionary sanctions, the log of blocks and bans, and Working group on ethnic and cultural edit wars. You can discuss the project at its talk page.Israel Palestine CollaborationWikipedia:WikiProject Israel Palestine CollaborationTemplate:WikiProject Israel Palestine CollaborationIsrael Palestine Collaboration articles

Palestine

	Palestine portal This article is within the scope of WikiProject Palestine, a team effort dedicated to building and maintaining comprehensive, informative and balanced articles related to the geographic Palestine region, the Palestinian people and the State of Palestine on Wikipedia. Join us by visiting the project page, where you can add your name to the list of members where you can contribute to the discussions.PalestineWikipedia:WikiProject PalestineTemplate:WikiProject PalestinePalestine-related articles
???	This article has not yet received a rating on the project's importance scale.

Warning: active arbitration remedies

The contentious topics procedure applies to this article. This article is related to the Arab–Israeli conflict, which is a contentious topic. Furthermore, the following rules apply when editing this article:

You must be logged-in and extended-confirmed to edit or discuss this topic on any page (except for making edit requests, provided they are not disruptive)
You may not make more than 1 revert within 24 hours on any edits related to this topic

Editors who repeatedly or seriously fail to adhere to the purpose of Wikipedia, any expected standards of behaviour, or any normal editorial process may be blocked or restricted by an administrator. Editors are advised to familiarise themselves with the contentious topics procedures before editing this page.

Further information

The exceptions to the extended confirmed restriction are:

Non-extended-confirmed editors may use the "Talk:" namespace only to make edit requests related to articles within the topic area, provided they are not disruptive.
Non-extended-confirmed editors may not create new articles, but administrators may exercise discretion when deciding how to enforce this remedy on article creations. Deletion of new articles created by non-extended-confirmed editors is permitted but not required.

With respect to the WP:1RR restriction:

Clear vandalism of whatever origin may be reverted without restriction. Also, reverts made solely to enforce the extended confirmed restriction are not considered edit warring.
Editors who violate this restriction may be blocked by any uninvolved administrator, even on a first offence.

After being warned, contentious topics procedure can be used against any editor who repeatedly or seriously fails to adhere to the purpose of Wikipedia, any expected standards of behaviour, or any normal editorial process. Contentious topic sanctions can include blocks, topic-bans, or other restrictions.
Editors may report violations of these restrictions to the Arbitration enforcement noticeboard.

If you are unsure if your edit is appropriate, discuss it here on this talk page first. When in doubt, don't revert!

Archives

no archives yet (create)

This page has archives. Sections older than 30 days may be automatically archived by .

Requested move 19 March 2022[edit]

The following is a closed discussion of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on the talk page. Editors desiring to contest the closing decision should consider a move review after discussing it on the closer's talk page. No further edits should be made to this section.

It was proposed in this section that Israel and torture in the occupied territories be renamed and moved to Israeli torture in the occupied territories.

result:
Moved per discussion below. Thanks and kudos to editors for your input; good health to all! P.I. Ellsworth - ed. ^put'r there 22:34, 19 April 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Move logs: current title · target title

This is template {{subst:Requested move/end}}

Result:
Moved per discussion below. Thanks and kudos to editors for your input; good health to all! P.I. Ellsworth - ed. ^put'r there 22:34, 19 April 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Israel and torture in the occupied territories → Israeli torture in the occupied territories – Per article titles rules, the use of the word "and" in article titles should be avoided, especially when it creates the impression of bias. There is no credible source that says that Israel has not tortured anyone in the occupied territories, so the article should be renamed accordingly. (t · c) buidhe 05:06, 19 March 2022 (UTC) — Relisting. Extraordinary Writ (talk) 21:32, 26 March 2022 (UTC)[reply]

The problem with that is that both the Palestinian National Authority and Hamas have resorted to torture in those territories - in the former case it is very much a delegated extension of Israeli practices. The proposed title change would require that any reference here to violent Palestinian abuses of human rights be excised and relocated to a new page Palestinian abuses of human rights in the occupied territories. The 'and' allows us to cover both on the one page, which is appropriate since they are intimately connected.Nishidani (talk) 07:55, 19 March 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Currently, there is just a one-sentence mention, with a separate article torture in the Palestinian territories, so I assumed that the article's scope was just torture by the Israeli authorities. If indeed torture by the Palestinian authority is delegated by Israel, it should be covered in more detail here regardless of the name change. (t · c) buidhe 08:25, 19 March 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Alternate proposal: Move to Torture in the Israeli occupied territories. Title is more natural because here we're being clear that it's Israeli occupied territories, and there isn't something called Israeli torture as was proposed. This title also allows scope to include torture by other organisations in the said territories. —CX Zoom[he/him] ^{(let's talk • C • L)} 16:28, 10 April 2022 (UTC)[reply]
Because this RM is already in the backlog, pinging @Buidhe and Nishidani: for opinion. —CX Zoom[he/him] ^{(let's talk • C • L)} 16:30, 10 April 2022 (UTC)[reply]

I think Buidhe's proposal more viable. (The article, compared to the massive literature on this, is still underworked). Whatever abuses the PA and Hamas have engage in over 55 years of occupation, they are dwarfed to relative insignificance by the Israeli record over 55 years of occupation- If terror, as it is often defined in the political literature, is a form of violence calibrated to destroy the morale of an adversary, what we observe there is the resilient application of terror as implicit in Jabotinsky's realist prescription in 1923 that Zionism could succeed only by reducing the indigenous population to a pervasive sense of absolute despair, which is the only way of interpreting the persistence of a high tolerance for their diurnal suffering as caused by settlement and military harassment or insouciance to what we all observe daily on youtube.Nishidani (talk) 19:13, 10 April 2022 (UTC)[reply]

The discussion above is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

Palestinian torture[edit]

As this article is about Israeli torture, the sentence "Torture is also practiced by the Palestinian authorities in the West Bank and the Gaza Strip." has no place here. Notably, there is no equivalent sentence in the article on Palestinian torture. Mcdruid (talk) 04:18, 12 September 2022 (UTC)[reply]

I second that notion. The sentence referring to Palestinian authorities is misplaced in this article. CraigoGiarco (talk) 15:31, 3 May 2023 (UTC)[reply]

Title query[edit]

@Buidhe: A query about the previous move. It occurs to me that often when Israel detains Palestinians, it takes them to jails within Israel, so is this covered and should it be? And if the latter, should it be "in the occupied territories", or is this article really about "Israeli torture of Palestinians" or "Torture of Palestinians by Israel", i.e. along the same lines in terms of scope as, and presumably a child article of, Human rights violations against Palestinians by Israel. Iskandar323 (talk) 16:25, 25 March 2024 (UTC)[reply]

I would support that move because I think you're right, the torture does not necessarily occur within the occupied territories although it sometimes does. (t · c) buidhe 17:18, 25 March 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Falaqa[edit]

Please explain this revert of my adding a wikilink to an uncommon term. - Altenmann >talk 00:19, 27 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]