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Using templates and what does " draft " mean?

Trying to use a template for a chart in my articles titled "Jennifer Gates " and "Amanda Gates" . I feel I have followed the template but can not produce the same chart( only part of it). One of my articles is listed as a "draft" the other is not. Wondering why. My "Jennifer Gates " article has a list of Transclusions at the end of it. Trying to understand what that means. All help appreciated. Thank you.Suegates (talk) 23:27, 9 April 2016 (UTC)

Hello, Suegates, and welcome back to the Teahouse. The pages you are referring to are Draft:Amanda Gates and Jennifer Gates. A "draft" on wikipedia is a would-be article that is not yet ready for our main article spaces. Many such pages have names that start with "Draft:", and are said to be in "draftspace". Some instead have names that start with "User:" and are said to be is userspace. The rules that apply to drafts are somewhat different from the rules that apply to pages already published as articles. In particular, drafts are less subject to speedy deletion. Many (but not all) drafts are under the auspices pof the Articles for Creation project. These carry a box that says "Review waiting" (as Draft:Amanda Gates does) or "not currently submitted for review". Once a draft is "submitted", and after some delay because there are many drafts, an experienced editor will review it. The editor may accept the draft, and move it to the main article space, sometimes called "publishing" it. Or the reviewer may decline the draft. In this case the reviewer will give a reason for the decline, and may well give additional comments about what the draft needs to be accepted. After this the draft can be edited to correct the problems that the reviewer found, and perhaps to otherwise improve it. It can then be resubmitted for another review. The hope is that eventually it will be accepted. DES ^(talk) 00:23, 10 April 2016 (UTC)

Oh I think I asked you before, are you in fact related to the people you are writing about, Amanda Gates and Jennifer Gates? If you are you have a conflict of interest. You should declare it, and edit particularly carefully, if you do. DES ^(talk) 00:23, 10 April 2016 (UTC)

I am not sure, Suegates, what you mean by a template to produce a chart. Do you refer to the infobox produced by {{Infobox curler}}?. That will produce a formatted list of facts. What facts it lists depends entirely on what parameters are specified (from the list that the template supports). It should only list facts that are supported by reliable sources, or could easily be so supported. It should also only list facts that are relevant to the particular article. What would you like listed that is not currently listed? DES ^(talk) 00:36, 10 April 2016 (UTC)

Hello and thank you for your help. This is much more difficult than I thought it would be so your input is much appreciated. I have just submitted the article entitled "Jennifer Gates" so I am hoping it will also get a "draft" designation. Is this what I should look for? I did declare the conflict of interest on my user page using the designation you mentioned and then was contacted by a fellow contributor who suggested I use a different designation. Not sure which one is best. Wasn't sure if I needed to declare this somewhere in the article itself. I have made some edits to my first article, trying to include only facts and I hope that I did a better job in my second article. Navigating in here is certainly challenging. Yes, I do mean the infobox. I was trying to include a few more facts ( current team name, team members and positions, medals won representing Canada ) and for some reason this middle section did not reproduce. Facts I listed at the end did appear as you can see. I continue to work through this. Also still having trouble with referencing but will go through the help sections again ( referencing a newspaper article, duplicate references, etc.) A work in progress and learning a lot. Thanks again. Suegates (talk) 01:04, 10 April 2016 (UTC)

Suegates, I must have been unclear, and I apologize. A "draft" is the early, unfinished, not-ready-for-prime-time version, it is sort of like playing in a junior league. Not as much is demanded. when the "draft:" prefix is removed from the page name, it is being moved to the major leagues.

I will be happy to help you with any specific issues you are having a problem with, and so will others here I am sure. Just let us know what the problems are. I fixed some header formatting on the "Jennifer Gates" article in this edit.

You have declared that you are a long-time fan of curling. But your user name "suegates" suggests that you family name is "Gates" which in turn suggests that Jennifer Gates and Amanda Gates might be actual relations of yours, in which case three is a larger conflict of interest than just being a fan of curling would create. You have not answered this, or if you have I have not seen it. You don't have to disclose your real name, but please indicate if you have a strong conflict of interest over these two articles or not. DES ^(talk) 01:25, 10 April 2016 (UTC)

@Suegates: One further point to bear in mind is that there were many links from curling articles to Jen Gates, which showed as redlinks because an article with that title did not exist. I have created a redirect from Jen Gates to Jennifer Gates. I do notice that the referencing in Jennifer Gates leaves a lot to be desired. Many of the refs are presumably intended to point to websites, but aren't formatted as links; many look as if they point to the top page of a website, rather than a specific page which provides the relevant information about the subject to support the statements you have made in the article. You ought to read WP:Referencing for beginners, among other pages. --David Biddulph (talk) 06:40, 10 April 2016 (UTC)

Heads up for regulars or anyone

As you know, we get many questions about maintenance template removal – people not knowing they are not automatically removed and related issues. I've proposed a new process to address this. Please see Wikipedia:Village pump (proposals)#Implementing Help:Maintenance template removal. (Please excuse the indulgence of posting this here – I've found the talk page relatively ineffective to reach the eyes of many in the past.)--Fuhghettaboutit (talk) 02:12, 10 April 2016 (UTC)

Thanks for a great idea, Fuhghettaboutit. Lots of people think bots do it, when this is almost always a task for intelligent human beings. Maybe a bot could remove stub tags on articles that have tripled or quadrupled in length since being tagged. Cullen³²⁸ Let's discuss it 06:58, 10 April 2016 (UTC)

Hey Cullen328. Thanks for looking and commenting here and there! It really does seem to come up here and elsewhere a lot and boy do we need help with the gazillion tagged articles out there. Even removing stub tags might be rejected for automation since the stub guideline states that relatively long articles may still at times remain stubs. Apparently, though, "AutoWikiBrowser is frequently set to automatically remove stub tags from any article with more than 500 words".--Fuhghettaboutit (talk) 13:39, 10 April 2016 (UTC)

Question?

Is there any permission to edit our own page badly? ~~(…MA.Tay.CA…)~~ (talk) 16:14, 10 April 2016 (UTC)

Hello, ~~(…MA.Tay.CA…)~~, and welcome to the Teahouse. Every one is expected to edit every page as well as he or she can manage. Good faith efforts should normally be accepted with good will, and help and corrections should be offered politely. Who is "we" in this context? Wikipedia accounts should be for single individuals. Note also that as per WP:OWN, no own "owns" any particular page, in the sense of controlling it. Can you be more specific about what you wnat to do and where? DES ^(talk) 16:26, 10 April 2016 (UTC)

Draft:Abdulbaqi Jari (2) and a new editor

I reviewed Draft:Abdulbaqi Jari (2) (more than once) and declined it for various reasons, including not having a properly formed lede sentence and being very badly overlinked to common English words. Another reviewer declined it as not showing notability. The author referred in one version to IHAME as a source of notability of its subject, but without clarifying what that was. In the current draft, IHAME appears to be an orthographic movement concerning the Hausa language. I don’t understand any more than that, probably because the author’s English, while better than my non-existent Hausa, is not good. I advised the author to ask for help with English at WP:WikiProject Nigeria, but the author says that it is not active.

The author, User: Dantunkuran, has now asked me on my talk page for help, writing:

Hello Robert. Please guide me so that i can finish creating the article i am currently creating. Please point the errors so that i can know where to specifically correct. The Wiki Nigeria project has only 53 people, which mostly have not been around for some time. I intend to create many articles to help enrich searches from Nigeria. This is my first one, i will definitely improve after succeeding on this one. . Sometimes the advice to an author whose English is poor is to contribute to the Wikipedia in their native language. Unfortunately, the Hausa encyclopedia has only 1362 articles and 5490 editors, few of them active. I have a question. Would the author still do well to compose his article in Hausa and add it to the Hausa Wikipedia and then request its translation into English (rather than trying with difficulty to write it in English)? If the IHAME movement is not included in the Hausa encyclopedia, it probably should be, and maybe should also be translated into English. I see that the author has removed the excessive overlinking. I see that the author is enthusiastic about improving the coverage of the English Wikipedia about Nigeria. However, enthusiasm is no substitute for fluency with respect to the English Wikipedia, and he will need help. Enthusiasm is also not a substitute for formal neutrality of tone. Can anyone help the author, either with advice in general, advice about the article, or improvement to the article? Robert McClenon (talk) 17:30, 10 April 2016 (UTC)

Ashtanga vinyasa yoga page: Wikipedia re translation of India English

I edited >>>Ashtanga Vinyasa Yoga<<< page and have a question which revolves around an Indian Guru's use of the word "take" in advise re bandha - near the end of the article. He used the word take which may be confused as employ - regarding two bandha. I practise yoga and feel he means to "take one's attention" to the two bandha mentioned, mulbandha and the 2 inches below the naval one, which I don't recall. Activating those locks is different than "taking" ones attention to the areas where they are applied. Currently I have edited using the term "apply" (the bandha) while walking etc but wish to get an opinion so I may revert the quote to take and just add that little more, so readers do not get the wrong advise which for beginner yoga students may push them over the edge. I will adjust the quote meanwhile to keep it more as it was. Sudaama90 (talk) 10:28, 10 April 2016 (UTC)

Hello, Sudaama90. I'm afraid I have no idea what your paragraph above means, and I suspect that few of the people who read this page will understand it. In general we say that this is not the place to discuss the content of particular articles; but where it is something as specialised as that, there really is no point. The place to discuss it is on the talk page Talk:Ashtanga Vinyasa Yoga; if you don't think there are enough people who look at that, WT:WikiProject Yoga would be a good place to discuss it. Alternatively, if your first thought was that you were improving the article with your edit, you could very well leave your edit there and see if anybody disagrees. This is the fundamental way that Wikipedia works: see WP:BRD. --ColinFine (talk) 17:58, 10 April 2016 (UTC)

HELP: Publishing my first article in Wikipedia

Hi,

I am trying to submit a new article (name: "LeonRaper"). This is the first time I have done this. My page is located at:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User:LeonRaper/About_you

I would also like to finish it up such that it acceptable to be added to Wikipedia. I could add my page to a Wikipedia Template, but I don't know how.

I would be happy to hear any suggestions you may have.

I have created many web sites that you can see starting at http://www.Raper.com

Thanks,

Hubert Leon Raper <contact info redacted>

Hubert Leon Raper 14:13, 10 April 2016 (UTC) — Preceding unsigned comment added by LeonRaper (talk • contribs)

Hello LeonRaper, and welcome to the teahouse. What you have there isn't an article, I'm afraid, and it is not very likely to become one, I'm afraid. Autobiographies are discouraged here. Real articles must be written from the neutral point of view. They must be supported by citations to relaible sources. Above all, they must be about notable topics, topics that multiple independent published sources have covered in some detail. Please mread Your first article and Wikipedia's golden Rule. DES ^(talk) 14:47, 10 April 2016 (UTC)

Hi DES HELP: I'm really confused, I can remove some family information, but why do you say to remove biographical information. Most of Wikipedia pages for sports people, actors, writers and directors contain some biographical information. I am trying to create a Wikipedia page that lets them know why someone should become a dancer. Go to any doctor and they will tell you that dancing is one of the best types of exercise. I was one of the first on the internet providing dancers with information. HELP: Please tell me how to correct my attempted web page: LeonRaper —Preceding undated comment added 15:01, 10 April 2016 (UTC)

I am not saying that bibliographical detail should be deleted, LeonRaper. If there is to be a page about you such detail would be wanted. What I am saying is that an AUTObiography, a page about you and by you, is discouraged, see WP:AUTOBIO. I am saying that uncited articles are not a good idea, and this looks like an attempt at an article. I am saying that unless it can be established that you are notable, there should not be an article about you on Wikipedia at all. And that even if there was one, it should be neutral and factual, not a promotional piece.

Also, please sign your posts on discussion pages with four tildes (~~~~). The software will convert them into a link to your user page and a timestamnp when you save your comment. That will also make pings in your comment work, pings only work in comments signed in the same edit.

Also, please do not include your off-wiki contact info. Any respoinses will be made here on the wiki, in this page or on your user talk page, or you will be pinged to notify you of them. DES ^(talk) 15:35, 10 April 2016 (UTC)

LeonRaper, in general Wikipedia has almost no interest in what a person (or a band, or a company or ...) wants to say about themselves. It is only interested in what other people, who have no connection with the subject, have published about them. If other independent people have published in-depth material about them, then we say they are "notable" (in Wikipedia's special jargon), and there may be an article about them, based almost entirely on what these unconnect people have published. If there is hardly any such material, then it is impossible to write an acceptable article, and attempts to do so get stopped. --ColinFine (talk) 18:03, 10 April 2016 (UTC)

First time creator of an article in Wikipedia

Hi, I am trying to submit a new article (name: "Areopa"). This is the first time I have done this.

The process to do this seems very complicated - one of those cases where you need to be familiar with the approach to understand all the advice.

Can I speak to someone on the phone or Skype by any chance?

Thanks, Paul Warspite987 (talk) 09:13, 10 April 2016 (UTC)

Hi Warspite987, you can get "chat" help from experienced editors at WP:IRCHELP. -- Roger (Dodger67) (talk) 09:17, 10 April 2016 (UTC)

Hi Warspite987. To submit it, just add {{subst:submit}} at the top and click save page. However, the content of Wikipedia articles must be verifiable in reliable sources and the notability of a topic demonstrated through such reliable sources that are secondary in nature, which are independent of the topic and treat the subject in substantive detail (not just "mere mentions"). It is therefore certain to be rejected on the basis of lack of sources (if not on others, such as that it contains promotional language like "Areopa is a global leader...") Best regards--Fuhghettaboutit (talk) 13:59, 10 April 2016 (UTC)

Hello, Paul. I sometimes wonder why it is that new editors so often plunge straight into one of the hardest tasks there is on Wikipedia, creating a new article, rather than learning the ropes by working on existing articles for a bit.

But I wanted to address your comments on notability: please understand that notability means something a bit different on Wikipedia from its usual meaning. It is not whether the subject is significant (which is what your claim amounts to) or popular, or famous, or influential, or respected: it is solely on whether people unconnected with it have published in-depth writing about it; and it is those independent discussions of the subject which should form the basis for nearly the whole article. --ColinFine (talk) 17:50, 10 April 2016 (UTC)

Hello, Warspite987. According to your comments at Draft:Areopa, the organisation has been recognised in some sense by the European Commission. If you could cite some Commission publications in the draft, that might help contribute to establishing notability. Cordless Larry (talk) 18:06, 10 April 2016 (UTC)

Page removed

I am writing about EasyShiksha, it has been removed three and four times. There are many pages with same content and subject on Wikipedia why only my page is removed??? — Preceding unsigned comment added by Priya2255 (talk • contribs) 18:07, 10 April 2016 (UTC)

Hello, Priya2255, and welcome to the Teahouse. The reasons EasyShiksha was previously deleted are outlined in the messages left for you on your user talk page, User talk:Priya2255. The current deletion discussion is taking place at Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/EasyShiksha, where the nomination rationale is set out. If you want to respond to this nomination and argue for the article to be kept, you should do so there. Cordless Larry (talk) 18:19, 10 April 2016 (UTC)

Hello, Priya2255. This is happening largely because no independent published relaible sources that discuss EasyShiksha in morfe than a brief passing manner have been found. All cited sources are to the EasyShiksha site itself, or very closely associated sites. If you can cite independent reliable sources that discuss EasyShiksha in some depth, please add them to the article and list them at Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/EasyShiksha. DES ^(talk) 21:21, 10 April 2016 (UTC)

Subpage

How do I get a subpage ?Lucy (talk) 22:36, 10 April 2016 (UTC)

I have moved this question from the bottom of the page, where Lucy naturally put it, to here, as required by the weird rules of this and only this page. Maproom (talk) 22:52, 10 April 2016 (UTC)

Hello, Lucy, and welcome to the Teahouse. A subpage of your user page (which is the most common meaning of the term here on Wikipedia) is any page starting with your user name and a slash. For example, i have created a page User:DESiegel/Tools. You could create a page called User:Lucy idegwu/Test or User:Lucy idegwu/New topic. Each of these would be subpages. A subpage is a common place to put a userspace draft, where you can work on an article until you are ready to request review by an experienced editor. You request review by adding {{subst:submit}} to the page. To mark a page as a userspace draft, add {{Userspace draft}} to the top of the page. This will also add a button that you can use to submit a draft for review when you are ready. Not all subpages are for drafts. Some, as my page linked above, are for lists of links, others are for notes. They can be fore anything relevant to working on Wikipedia. DES ^(talk) 23:24, 10 April 2016 (UTC)

another sandbox

Hello Teahouse I am working in my sandbox on one article and would like to start a second, related, article. I see that i can have sub-pages of this sandbox. Is it OK to start another article on this page? TIA Greensaulberg (talk) 14:41, 9 April 2016 (UTC)

You can move User:Greensaulberg/sandbox to User:Greensaulberg/Michael Bolus, for example, and then you can either replace the resulting redirect at User:Greensaulberg/sandbox by new content, or start User:Greensaulberg/new article title or whatever. --David Biddulph (talk) 14:52, 9 April 2016 (UTC)

Hi David, thank you for your response.

I have found an article that shows how to move a published page but not the sandbox, can you send me to correct instructions please. Greensaulberg (talk) 15:23, 9 April 2016 (UTC)

The link I gave you to WP:move applies to pages in all namespaces, not just articles. Read what it says. --David Biddulph (talk) 15:30, 9 April 2016 (UTC)

I have 'read what it says' and there is no 'more/move' button in my sandbox. The article 'wpmove' suggests the 'the page is most likely protected from moving'?Greensaulberg (talk) 15:50, 9 April 2016 (UTC)

The way the menus are presented may depend on your preferences and option settings. When I look at your sandbox I see "Move page" as an option on the "Page" menu. The tabs I see are "Read", "Edit", "View history", Watch (shown as a star), "More", "Page", "User", and "TW" (the latter because I have Twinkle enabled). What tabs do you see at the top of your sandbox page? --David Biddulph (talk) 16:05, 9 April 2016 (UTC)

Haha, now i see 'move', what did you do? Thanks for whatever it was!Greensaulberg (talk) 16:13, 9 April 2016 (UTC)

Greensaulberg, I'm afraid I've had to remove a large part of User:Greensaulberg/Michaelbolus because it was apparently copied word-for-word from other websites. Please understand that that is not acceptable here, as it is against our copyright policy. I've left a message on your talk page about this, with several links to pages you should read. Please ask either here or there if you have questions. Justlettersandnumbers (talk) 00:00, 11 April 2016 (UTC)

Article title

I would like to change the title of an article, is this something that i can do or must it be requested of senior editors? Greensaulberg (talk) 14:43, 9 April 2016 (UTC)

Wikipedia:Moving a page should tell you everything you need to know. Long story short: Make sure the move is appropriate, since you probably don't have the rights to move it yourself yet, you could request it here --Nfreaker91 (talk) 14:56, 9 April 2016 (UTC)

Correction User:Greensaulberg, you are autoconfirmed, so you should be able to use Special:MovePage (normally accessible through the "move page" option within the Page tab between More and the search bar. Please do check out Wikipedia:Moving a page though, to make sure your move is a good idea. If you cannot move a page it may be protected, in this case you should request a move using the link above --Nfreaker91 (talk) 15:05, 9 April 2016 (UTC)

Thank you Nfreaker91.

I wish to move Phillip King(artist) to Phillip King(Sculptor) I have followed your instructions and found this note on the move page: 17:34, 18 January 2013 ErikHaugen (talk | contribs) moved page Phillip King (artist) to Philip King (sculptor) without leaving a redirect (History merge; back in a bit) (revert) ErikHaugen has tried to do this before but it didn't stick, why was this? TIA Greensaulberg (talk) 15:28, 9 April 2016 (UTC)

Please provide wikilinks for the pages to which you are referring, so that readers can easily click and see the pages to which you are referring. You can't move to Phillip King (sculptor) for the reasons explained at Wikipedia:Moving a page#Moves where the target name has an existing page; read the instructions there as to how to do it. Technically the page could be moved to Philip King (sculptor) but as that is an incorrect spelling the move would be reverted as incorrect. --David Biddulph (talk) 15:39, 9 April 2016 (UTC)

All the change requests is changing artist to sculptor, i dont see the incorrect spelling? Greensaulberg (talk) 15:58, 9 April 2016 (UTC)

He probably means that it would be an incorrect title, rather than an incorrect spelling. As you can see Wikipedia:Article titles is very long and describes how to find the best title for an article. Category:Wikipedia naming conventions makes it even more complicated. Relevant here is Wikipedia:Naming conventions (people), in particular the Disambiguating section. Basically you should use (artist) as long as there is only one artist of the name. If there were two, one would become (sculptor), the other (painter) or something similar. It's not supposed to be as descriptive as possible. --Nfreaker91 (talk) 16:40, 9 April 2016 (UTC)

If you don't see the incorrect spelling, try counting how often the letter "l" occurs in the first name. --David Biddulph (talk) 16:58, 9 April 2016 (UTC)

The correct Phillip King(artist) has 2 x L and is correctly spelt on Wikipedia entry. I am not sure i understand what David Biddulph is saying?

Thank you Nfreaker91, that makes sense.Greensaulberg (talk) 17:26, 9 April 2016 (UTC)

Originally you had two questions, one about how to proceed in renaming an article, the other about an entry in the articles (move) history. I answered the first one, David noticed a detail about the second I hadn't noticed before: As it turns out, the article was moved from an incorrect spelling (Philip) to its correct place, Philllip. User:David Biddulph told you why that move didn't stick and why it shouldn't be moved back there. --Nfreaker91 (talk) 17:37, 9 April 2016 (UTC)

In your message of 15:28 UTC you referred to Philip King (sculptor) with a single "l", and to the move to that title which ErikHaugen made in 2013 (and which was of course subsequently corrected). That is why I mentioned that title, and said that it would be incorrect. --David Biddulph (talk) 17:41, 9 April 2016 (UTC)

OK Thanks to you both. My 1 x L was a misspell, thank the gods for measured volunteerism )) Greensaulberg (talk) 17:56, 9 April 2016 (UTC)

Greensaulberg, I've added a {{db-move}} template to Phillip King (sculptor). Assuming the reason I gave is accepted, the deleting admin may or may not also move the page there (some do, some don't). Justlettersandnumbers (talk) 00:09, 11 April 2016 (UTC)

Why an article was deleted

Hello, I was hoping you could help me understand why an article I helped edit was deleted. The article was about a Korean singer named Im Jae-Bum or JB (singer). I had thought that the article was similarly written like any other Korean singers' articles I had searched up, so why was his deleted? JiSky (talk) 01:24, 11 April 2016 (UTC)

Welcome to the Teahouse, JiSky. That article was redirected as a result of the discussion at Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/JB (South Korean musician). Perhaps Drmies, who nominated the article for deletion, can add more information. I also suggest that you read our notability guideline for musical performers. Cullen³²⁸ Let's discuss it 01:57, 11 April 2016 (UTC)

Thank you Cullen. Typically, individual singers in a group don't get to have their own articles if they are not notable outside of that group. I suppose that knowledgeable K-pop editors and hardcore fans like Random86 and Dr.K. can tell you more. I think I saw K at a Babymetal showcase last week. Drmies (talk) 02:01, 11 April 2016 (UTC)

How to fix this article

Hello, I need to get the conflict of interest disclosure statement corrected for this article (I am the inventor and CEO):

Also, the reviewers suggested I come here to get help with it.

thanks! Longfamily417 (talk) 19:49, 10 April 2016 (UTC)

You have been given feedback in the 9 review responses on the draft page (with 6 additional comments there), and in similar responses on your user talk page. Many of those responses have useful links. You need to read those and respond to the points raised. --David Biddulph (talk) 20:22, 10 April 2016 (UTC)

Longfamily417 To declare your conflict of interest properly, you should copy something similar to your above disclosure to your userpage, User:Longfamily417.

Something along the lines of "I have a conflict of interest with Draft:SageTea because I am the inventor & CEO" would suffice. Joseph2302 (talk) 21:27, 10 April 2016 (UTC)

I noted that, and also contacted someone else to write the article. Its clear I cannot do this myself, although I can offer comment if asked. I spoke with the realtime chat support and this is what they said I needed to do. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Longfamily417 (talk • contribs) 21:49, 10 April 2016 (UTC)

No, you didn't, I said you should put it on your userpage, User:Longfamily417, whereas you added it to the draft, Draft:SageTea. Also, as explained at the MfD discussion, Wikipedia doesn't want another COI/paid editor to update it for you, so you hiring someone else won't help.

Also, clearly WP:NOTHERE. Joseph2302 (talk) 21:57, 10 April 2016 (UTC)

Ok, I am still learning the interface (I am on day #2 here and learning as fast as I can). I will repost that note. Just to reconfirm, the new none COI author I asked is not being paid by me. He worked at SageTea a long time ago, but doesn't now. He knows the topic, although to a lesser extent and is free to put it in his own view. He may need some help as he is also new to Wikipedia. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Longfamily417 (talk • contribs) 22:00, 10 April 2016 (UTC)

In that case, Longfamily417, he is not a paid contributor; but if he used to work there, and is editing at your request, he probaly still has a COI. This does not forbit him from working on the Draft, but he needs to be aware of our guidelines on COI. --ColinFine (talk) 10:10, 11 April 2016 (UTC)

Differences between style sheets when logged in and logged out?

Hi! I just have a small question. I've noticed that when I'm logged into Wikipedia - which I am permanently these days because of edits - the font settings change and the page I'm looking at no longer looks the way it does when a normal user looks at it. Being an old web developer from way back, I find it irritating that I can't see a page from the user's viewpoint without either constantly logging in and out or getting my hands dirty trying to customise stylesheets, which have changed a lot since my day. So my question is this: why, oh why, I ask with tears in my baby blue eyes, do the stylesheets automatically change because I'm logged in? And is there an answer to it that doesn't involve one of the two solutions I've mentioned? Thanks! Cadar (talk) 09:49, 11 April 2016 (UTC)

Welcome to the Teahouse, Cadar. The situation you describe isn't typical, and I suspect that it has something to do with your account's appearance settings, which you can access at Special:Preferences. Others might have more specific suggestions for what setting it might be that is causing this. Cordless Larry (talk) 09:54, 11 April 2016 (UTC)

Hi, Cadar. I suspect that what you're seeing is different skins: one that you have (deliberately or not) selected for your account, and the other the default. I remember a couple of years ago, Wikipedia changed the default skin, and it may be that you kept the old one for your account.

The existence of skins indicates that you cannot and should not try to micromanage the appearance of Wikipedia pages, because the reader may have a different skin again. See WP:Skins. --ColinFine (talk) 10:16, 11 April 2016 (UTC)

Thanks for the responses.

I've made no changes to the appearance at all, or picked skins - don't believe in them, and this is exactly why - so perhaps it's due to site changes since I joined WP. I've had an editor account for almost 12 years, so there's bound to have been changes in that time. The thing is, given that there likely has been changes, why would my account not have migrated to the new version automatically, since I didn't even know I could make any changes and certainly haven't messed around with the settings? A look at my Appearance tab under Preferences shows my skin is set to something called "MonoBook", with no indication of what the default is. Any ideas? Cadar (talk) 10:39, 11 April 2016 (UTC)

The default setting is Vector, Cadar. Give that a go. Cordless Larry (talk) 10:41, 11 April 2016 (UTC)

Correction! Seems "Vector" is the default. That seems to have fixed the issue. Thanks for the input!

Cadar (talk) 10:44, 11 April 2016 (UTC)

Vector was introduced in 2009 and took over from MonoBook as default in 2010. Accounts were automatically changed to Vector but many users chose to go back to MonoBook. I guess you did that many years ago and forgot about it. PrimeHunter (talk) 10:55, 11 April 2016 (UTC)

Simple question

How to add pictures to article.? ~~(…MA.Tay.CA…)~~ (talk) 12:40, 11 April 2016 (UTC)

Here's instructions on how to do that: Wikipedia:Adding images improves the encyclopedia#Adding an image to an article. Onel5969 ^{TT me} 12:49, 11 April 2016 (UTC)

Would a new approach help?

Good day expert writer, I've been on a long quest to publish an article on Maia Chung, a Jamaican woman who has given most of her adult life to the autism cause. She is the founder of the Maia Chung Autism and Disabilities Foundation. A stub has been approved for the foundation but I have failed in achieving similar result for the woman due to a number of challenges cited by expert wiki reviewers. Draft:Maia Chung Would it make sense to try to highlight both in one wiki article, that is the foundation and the founder? Most of the newspaper articles that could be used as reference highlight the work of the foundation and references the founder, Maia Chung. Would an attempt of this sort bring greater success in documenting her and her foundations achievements? The foundation wiki stub: Maia Chung Autism and Disabilities Foundation. I gather reviewers are required to mention only the most egregious errors, if possible I would also appreciate a list of all the weaknesses a reviewer may identify just in case I missed something else. KDT73 (talk) 08:41, 11 April 2016 (UTC)

Welcome to the Teahouse. Rather than using URLs for Wikipedia, it is better to use wikilinks, such as Draft:Maia Chung and Maia Chung Autism and Disabilities Foundation. --David Biddulph (talk) 09:59, 11 April 2016 (UTC)

Hello, KDT73. While the founder could and perhaps should be mentioned in the article about the foundation, i do not advise trying to create a single combined article about both. The major problem with Draft:Maia Chung seems to be the issue of notability. I have only briefly reviews the draft, but there seems to be no cited significant coverage of her in her role with the Foundation, but the article makes this the central aspect of her life. The formerly badly promotional language seems to have been removed or rewritten, which is good. I will try to review this at a greater depth over the next few days. DES ^(talk) 15:02, 11 April 2016 (UTC)

Need help.

I have a small question. I want to change my username from ~~(…MA.TAY.CA…)~~, to ~M~, because it,s soo difficult for me, so please tell me how to change? OK :-) ~~(…MA.Tay.CA…)~~ (talk) 11:05, 11 April 2016 (UTC)

See Wikipedia:Changing username. Onel5969 ^{TT me} 12:46, 11 April 2016 (UTC)

That sounds like a good idea, ~~(…MA.Tay.CA…)~~. ~~(…MA.Tay.CA…)~~ is quite an unwieldy username. Cordless Larry (talk) 15:38, 11 April 2016 (UTC)

"peacock lang"?

Can somebody please help me with regarding this page: Draft:Sophie_Villy After 4/5 edits, I simply cannot see where there are peacock phrases. Please take a look at the comments yesterday + I'll be happy to cut/paste here the comments I left yesterday's reviewer 17:11, 11 April 2016 (UTC) — Preceding unsigned comment added by Dmacfady (talk • contribs)

Hi, Dmacfady. I've changed your external link to a Wikilink above: it was to the mobile version, which made the article look very strange on a computer. I don't think it has huge problems with peacock language now, but there are some dubious cases. For example "She also became the first artist from either Georgia or Ukraine to play at the SXSW festival in Texas", where the reference does support that she played at that festival, but says nothing about her being the first artist from Georgia or Ukraine to play at it. Whether this counts as Peacock language, or as original research, I'm not sure, but I am sure that it doesn't belong in an article: it is a promotional claim that is not supported by a reference. I haven't looked for any other examples. I similarly went to check whether 'Civic themes soon became evident in a politically charged single, entitled “Position” and dedicated to “all people striving for freedom and independence.”' is supported by the reference, but that Ukrainian reference doesn't seem to work.

By the way, don't put links to other-language Wikipedia articles on the subject in the External Links section: they'll get handled as interwiki links via Wikidata, once the article has been accepted and moved into main article space. --ColinFine (talk) 17:48, 11 April 2016 (UTC)

Thanks ColinFine, very much. I have fixed a couple of dead links you noted, altered the SWSX statement to a fact (not a claim), and amended the quotation regarding the song "Position." That should cover the issues you kindly mentioned. Hopefully that's enough to send this small text on its way. I have no professional connection to the artist, but am a scholar of the region––hence my interest. If anybody happens to mention notability (who knows?! :), then we need to be culturally specific.

In other words––I forgot to mention that in the post-Soviet context, centralized or state-run media sources, which––say, in the UK––would be a source of *objective* journalism/notability, are in fact the opposite, i.e, dubious in their bias. Russia would be a fine example: objective information regarding a cultural phenomenon would not come from major press outlets, which are fiscally bound to their governmental sponsors. Truth instead is more likely to be found in minor, peripheral publications. Those same lesser outlets are obliged to fund themselves, of course, and will have more ad copy surrounding them (as banners, pre-roll video, etc), giving the *visual* impression of ephemeral and less trustworthy information! Sadly, the juxtaposition in Eastern Europe between state-run and "underground"journalism, for want of a less dramatic phrase, has not changed much.

The singers and songwriters on state TV/radio are only aired because they pay for their airtime. They are, therefore, not actually famous in the true sense, but merely able to bankroll their primetime presence and therefore cultivate an air of artistic impact and/or import. Hence the need to document, explain, and foreground other performers. Thanks again!! Dmacfady (talk) 18:32, 11 April 2016 (UTC)

Dmacfady, you have changed the SXSW sentence to "Also in 2015, she played at the SXSW festival in Texas, representing both Georgia and Ukraine". However, as far as I know, musicians do not "represent" countries at SXSW (it's not the Eurovision Song Contest!). Cordless Larry (talk) 18:37, 11 April 2016 (UTC)

Dmacfady (talk) 19:15, 11 April 2016 (UTC) Thanks,Cordless Larry. I can fix that. I meant it in the sense that most artists from that part of the world come with some government subsidy, and those governments do limit their support to one or two artists. Those same performers are spoken of at home in terms of national representatives, since they (hopefully) will drive commerce back to the home nation. I agree, however, that the verb was ambiguous and will change it now! Thanks.

If she was funded by one or both governments, that might be worth mentioning, Dmacfady, but the source cited doesn't support that claim so you'd need to find one that does. Cordless Larry (talk) 19:18, 11 April 2016 (UTC)

You're absolutely right, Cordless Larry - that was an unproductive confusion, and I've now chopped the sentence in half, in the name of clarity. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Dmacfady (talk • contribs) 19:20, 11 April 2016 (UTC)

Two articles got declined

Hi teahouse!

I'm trying to publish two articles that have now have both been rejected. They're reputable as one is an up in coming artist that I like who is touring, and the other is the label that represents them where I've found a lot of other artist I love! Some even already have a wiki page. So how do I make it stick?104.162.218.49 (talk) 19:21, 11 April 2016 (UTC)

Hello, and welcome to the Teahouse, IP editor. It would help if you told us the names of the articles that you tried to create, as there is no record of them in your contributions history or of their deletion on your talk page. Cordless Larry (talk) 19:47, 11 April 2016 (UTC)

Hello, IP editor. Probably you don't (make it stick): Up and coming artists do not usually meet the criteria of notability, which is not fame or popularity or repute but simply whether people unconnected with them have so far chosen to write in depth about them in a reliably published place. --ColinFine (talk) 20:42, 11 April 2016 (UTC)

How to update content for accuracy on Wikipedia pages on behalf of professional organization

I am writing to inquire about 2 issues on behalf of my professional organization regarding information on Wikipedia. The two issues are:

1 - updating content on the Wikipedia page for "intellectual disability" to increase accuracy of information presented. 2 - providing support for the requests to combine the pages "adaptive behavior" and "adaptive behaviors" while also updating and combining content to increase accuracy of information presented.

I have looked at the information provided on the Help pages regarding making edits to Wikipedia, but we still have a couple questions.

Related to issue 1 above: I have seen the level of protection on the "intellectual disability" page as well as the procedure for becoming a confirmed editor. However, as we are an organization, we were not sure the best way to go about making edits or communicating these edits as well as becoming a confirmed user by making edits to other Wikipedia pages or content (as this may be outside the scope of our organization to edit other content). Is there another way to communicate the changes that we would propose to this page for consideration? Or is the traditional procedure of figuring out a way to become confirmed the best way for us to make edits? Or is there any other procedure for becoming confirmed that we should pursue?

Related to issue 2 above: several users have proposed and agreed that the two pages mentioned above should be merged or combined. We agree. Do we need to create an account to express our agreement on the Talk page (or somewhere else)? Or is there a way in which this proposal can be accepted and these pages combined/merged? Also, since the content will likely need to be adjusted, this may be another page that our organization would have suggestions for the content to improve accuracy. If the pages are ever merged, would the traditional editing procedure be the best for this or would this page have some level of protection as well?

Any advice or guidance would be greatly appreciated as our organization considers how best to address the 2 issues mentioned above through the content presented in Wikipedia. I am happy to provide additional information or clarification if needed. 70.62.84.86 (talk) 21:10, 11 April 2016 (UTC)

Hello, 70.62, and welcome to the Teahouse.

First of all, any account(s) should be strictly for individuals, and not for any organization, nor should the be shared by more than one individual.

You may post to the talk page (Talk:Intellectual disability in this case) of any article to suggest or request changes to the article. There are several current requests on that page, some of which are not as well formed they might be. Do place {{edit semi-protected}} on the page in the same section as any edit request. An experienced editor should respoins and evaluate and act on the request. Note that the action may be to reject it. It helps to provide a link or a citation to a reliable source that support the request.

The merge discussion you mention is taking place at Talk:Adaptive_behavior#Merge. You need not register an account to comment, but some editors take comments from registered users more seriously, althoguh they are not supposed to do so. If you do register, you need not be autoconfirmed to comment. If the pages are merged, you could again make suggestions on the talk page if the resulting page is semi-protected, or edit it directly if it is not. Please disclose any conflict of interest that you may have clearly on the relevant article talk pages, and, if you register an account, on your own user page. Feel free to ask additional questions here. DES ^(talk) 21:42, 11 April 2016 (UTC)

picture deleted

Hello, the picture I uploaded to illustrate my article about CS Pacific has been deleted. Not sure what type of licence to use as a tag. The b/w photograph was taken in the early 20th century by a member of the crew and now his son has given permission to use it in wikipedia. Can you help to restore the pic in the infobox? Greetings — Preceding unsigned comment added by M0KLB (talk • contribs) 06:46, 10 April 2016 (UTC)

Welcome to the Teahouse. The owner of the copyright needs to go through the processes described at WP:donating copyrighted material. Note that it isn't enough to say that it can be used in Wikipedia, because Wikipedia's processes allow material to be used elsewhere (with the relevant attribution). --David Biddulph (talk) 06:56, 10 April 2016 (UTC)

Welcome back to the Teahouse @M0KLB:. Actually the image in question might no longer be under copyright, depending on the year and country in which it was copyrighted. If it was taken in Denmark, or elsewhere in the EU, then the copyright on expires 70 years after the death of the copyright owner.

If it the picture is still under copyright, then you would need to get the crew members' son to donate the picture, although as stated above, he would need to release it under a copyright licence that allows it to be used elsewhere as well. Joseph2302 (talk) 10:58, 10 April 2016 (UTC)

M0KLB, unless the father has been dead for more than 70 years, I think you have two options here, depending on what the son wants to allow:

• If he is happy to allow the picture to be used by anyone, for any purpose including commercial use, irrevocably and for ever, then he should upload it to Commons, add an {{OTRS pending}} template to the image page, and e-mail a statement similar to the one here to permissions-commons@wikimedia.org (this will only work if he is the heir to his father's estate, as is likely)
• If he does not want to do that, you could still upload the image to Wikipedia under our provisions for fair use of non-free content, and would then have to construct a fair use rationale to justify the use of the image in that one article; if you already have the image, this can be done without bothering the son again.

Of course, in either case the owner can partially protect his commercial interests (if he wants to) by uploading the image at a resolution good enough for it to be useful, but not high enough for commercial reproduction.

Unfortunately, neither of the two options is totally straightforward. I'm happy to try to help if help is needed, or direct you to someone with real expertise in this area. Justlettersandnumbers (talk) 23:10, 10 April 2016 (UTC)

Correction: if you decide to go for the fair use option, you wouldn't need to upload it again, you can just ask the deleting admin to restore it. You can see who that was here. Justlettersandnumbers (talk) 23:16, 10 April 2016 (UTC)

Thank you Justlettersandnumbers. The fair use of non-free content sounds a happy option. Not sure How to ask the administrator to restore it... M0KLB (talk) 20:45, 11 April 2016 (UTC)

The deleting administrator was BethNaught, who you can contact at User talk:BethNaught, M0KLB. Cordless Larry (talk) 21:50, 11 April 2016 (UTC)

OTRS permissions

Is there an admin that works with the otrs permissions? I would appreciate advice, I sure do not wish to spend another 10 months on this issue. Ths. T Heart (talk) 21:50, 11 April 2016 (UTC)

Hi T Heart. You might have a better chance of finding such an admin at WP:OTRSN or by checking meta:OTRS#Administrators or meta:OTRS/Personnel. -- Marchjuly (talk) 00:49, 12 April 2016 (UTC)

Thank you T Heart (talk) 01:33, 12 April 2016 (UTC)

A quick question...

I'm Matthias Mattheus, and I'm the communication supervisor of JVDG (A new small political party on school level) and we we would love to have a small "article" to be whritten about us. As I said we are a young party, founded by 2 students from SKI Ghent (Belgium) and we want to create a better school environment in Ghent(Belgium). We have a Facebook page, a website, an email and a Twitter account. Please not that we are a Dutch group, so our pages are in whritten in Dutch. Link to our facebook page: https://www.facebook.com/JongeVrijeDemocratenGent/ where you can find the links to our other sites.

Thanks, Matthias Mattheus -JVDG (Jonge Vrije Democraten Gent) MatthiasMattheus (talk) 01:04, 12 April 2016 (UTC)

Welcome to the Teahouse, MatthiasMattheus. Wikipedia includes articles about topics which are notable, as Wikipedia defines that term. That means that the topic has received significant coverage in reliable, independent sources. Have major Belgian or Dutch language newspapers and magazines published in-depth articles about this party? Facebook pages, websites and Twitter accounts are of no value here, since they are controlled by the group. We summarize what independent sources say. Cullen³²⁸ Let's discuss it 03:11, 12 April 2016 (UTC)

User:Sarovaram11/sandbox

I reviewed User:Sarovaram11/sandbox and declined it. I said that the draft read promotionally, and said to focus on independent reliable sources that had written about the company. I also asked whether its name, and therefore that of the article, should be LabelLife.com or Label Corp?

User: Sarovaram11 then asked for my help: Hi Robert! This is with reference to my article The Label Life, that was rejected (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User:Sarovaram11/sandbox). I'm attempting to edit it and I wanted to clarify the reasons for rejection so I know I'm on the right track while making the changes. 1) The language - needs to be more neutral and objective (does this mean not using phrases like 'celebrity stylists' and so on) 2) Sources - I've tried to restrict them to articles from magazines and newspapers (Indiatoday, vogue and open, the magazine - among others) could you guide me on what other sources I should be looking for? Apologies if these questions sound silly, it's my first time and I thought it was ready as I put it on the New Contributor's Help chat before submitting for review. But I clearly missed a lot, anyway, it's all a process right? Thanks very much

As to point 1, yes. That is the problem. Phrases such as “The website aims to provide consumers with a celebrity guided shopping experience.[“” are known as peacock language and will result in rejection. (This is hard for many contributors to understand, because these phrases are precisely what one uses in advertising, but advertising is not permitted in Wikipedia.) As to point 2, it now appears that the draft is well sourced. There doesn’t appear (to me) to be a notability issue. There are still serious tone issues.

I have a question for the author. Are you affiliated (as an employee, an agent, or in some other way) with the company? If so, you must make the conflict of interest disclosure, and possibly the paid editing disclosure.

If you have any more questions, we will try to answer them. Robert McClenon (talk) 16:54, 9 April 2016 (UTC)

hi!

Thanks for reviewing my article, I did know of course that a Wikipedia article cannot endorse the subject of the article in any way. I thought I had made it objective. I was clearly wrong, will take several more looks at it for this before attempting to re-submit it.

Second, no I am not associated with the Lable Life in any way I work in a completely different field. The three figures actresses that are associated with the company are very popular in here, which is how I came to hear of it.

If you have anything more to point out, I would value the feedback.

Thanks Sarovaram11 (talk) 04:38, 12 April 2016 (UTC)

How can we show a real notability for a person?

How can we show a real notability for an actor, songwriter, singer and dancer that he has some articles in some newspapers such as: 1, Houston Chronicle (Houston, Texas, USA) 2. Los Angeles Times (California, USA) 3. Revista Carrusel Periodico El Tiempo (National), Bogota, Colombia 4. Semana News, Houston, Texas, USA 5. The Seattle Times, Washington, USA 6. Las2orillas (National), Bogota, Colombia 7. Vanguardia Liberal, Santander State, Colombia and other comments in magazines and interviews at TV shows. Our draft is https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Draft:JC_Gonzalez Thanks Olivety (talk) 03:40, 12 April 2016 (UTC)

Hello, @Olivety:, and welcome to the TeaHouse. The best person to discuss your question with is the reviewer, SwisterTwister. However, I took a quick look at some of the reference links and they redirected me to other pages which did not even mention the subject, J.C. Gonzalez. Wikipedia needs reliable, independent references that discuss the topic in depth to establish notability.--Gronk Oz (talk) 05:36, 12 April 2016 (UTC)

RfA

Okay, I've read WP:NOTNOW, so I know better than to go and run for RfA right away. But my ultimate goal is to become an administrator. Why? I've gotten addicted to vandal fighting (ironic I suppose, for someone whose first two edits were vandalism), and more than once I've come across someone who needed to be blocked, and I notice sometimes there's quite a backlog at WP:UAA. What steps should I be taking now to put myself in the right position for an WP:RFA in the future? ♥ Kailey 2001 ♥ ^{You just got reverted by a high school cheerleader. ♥} 03:40, 12 April 2016 (UTC)

Hello, Kailey 2001. I had a search about and found Wikipedia:Advice for RfA candidates, which might be helpful (especially the part of the page on "Preparing yourself for adminship"). Cordless Larry (talk) 06:48, 12 April 2016 (UTC)

Requesting feedback on an article

I have created my first article in wikipedia about a school here - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Delhi_Public_School,_Greater_Noida

I want to submit it for peer review, and understand that it can be done at teahouse.

Senior editors and admins, please share your views.

Mridubhattacharya (talk) 06:15, 12 April 2016 (UTC)

Hello, Mridubhattacharya. As far as I am aware, the Teahouse is not the place to request peer review (though you can ask questions and get advice about editing Wikipedia here, so we can help to some extent). The peer-review process is explained at Wikipedia:Peer review, but there is currently a backlog there, so any request is likely to take a while to complete. I've taken a quick look at the article myself and the main problems with it are that it is written in an overly promotional style and that it is insufficiently sourced. Wording such as "The school sprawls over 15 acres of land in lush green surroundings" and "A 400 m Athletic track and an impressive lawn tennis court are the school's pride" are not acceptable in a Wikipedia article, especially when expressed in Wikipedia's voice. Please review Wikipedia:Neutral point of view on this point. As for the referencing, you have cited some sources, but our policy Wikipedia:Verifiability requires that any material likely to be challenged must include an inline citation that directly supports the material. Cordless Larry (talk) 06:39, 12 April 2016 (UTC)

Can I also ask whether you have a personal connection with the school? If you, you need to read Wikipedia:Conflict of interest and follow the instructions there on declaring any conflict of interest. Cordless Larry (talk) 06:43, 12 April 2016 (UTC)

Hi Larry, I'm not associated with this school in any manner, but I live in the neighborhood. I don't think that would fall under the "Conflict of Interest". I'm trying to improve the article by updating its sentence structures and by removing promotional type words. Thanks for your feedback. Mridubhattacharya (talk) 07:21, 12 April 2016 (UTC)

Declaring conflict of interest

Hi Teahouse convenor, I'm new to editing Wikipedia. In fact it was because of a task assignment through a course on Wed Media I'm doing through Curtin University that I put my hand to trying to edit to the Evangelical Members of the Uniting Church page, and then consequently (not part of the assignment) forming a new page on the Assembly of Confessing Congregations (ACC) which has since been merged. I didn't really understand about conflict of interest in me doing that but since I am part of the national executive of the ACC I wanted to ask how I can declare a conflict of interest now. I appreciate very much that Wikipedia has this stance on neutrality because there is something inherently good in this and I encourage all Wikipedia leaders etc in your endeavours to continue to protect neutrality. I don't know whether the Wikipedia page on the ACC (merged from EMU page) that has emerged through joint collaboration with Paul should now be deleted or not or conflict of interest declared, or perhaps everything should revert back to what it was. I won't continue to work on this site as I see that it has problems. Thanks for your help to a newbie.

Annehibbard (talk) 21:35, 11 April 2016 (UTC) Anne Annehibbard (talk) 21:35, 11 April 2016 (UTC)

Hello, Annehibbard, and welcome to the Teahouse. There are instructions on how to declare a conflict of interest at Wikipedia:Conflict of interest#Declaring an interest. This involves placing the code {{Connected contributor|User1=Annehibbard|U1-declared=yes}} at the top of the relevant article's talk page. You should also explain your conflict of interest on your user page, User:Annehibbard. Cordless Larry (talk) 06:28, 12 April 2016 (UTC)

thanks for your help Larry. I think I did it correctly as you described. If you had a few moments to check I'd be grateful. kind regards Annehibbard (talk) 10:22, 12 April 2016 (UTC)AnneAnnehibbard (talk) 10:22, 12 April 2016 (UTC)

Draft

Hi!I made a draft article and i want to put my article to common article space,my article is Draft:list of jatt clans. ~~(…MA.Tay.CA…)~~ (talk) 08:27, 12 April 2016 (UTC)

Hi ~~(…MA.Tay.CA…)~~, are you aware that there is a Category Category:Jat clans? That it seems to me is a better way to handle the subject than a list. —teb728 t c 08:41, 12 April 2016 (UTC)

I visited Draft:list of jatt clans and clicked on a few links. Agni appears to be a deity, Abusaria a surname, Achara redirects to Adjara, a republic of Georgia, Aujla is a jat clan, Atri is a scholar, etc. I think the list needs some work! Cordless Larry (talk) 08:48, 12 April 2016 (UTC)

I have added a box with a submit button and some links. The current version will probably be declined if it's submitted. PrimeHunter (talk) 10:28, 12 April 2016 (UTC)

Ok. ~~(…MA.Tay.CA…)~~ (talk) 11:19, 12 April 2016 (UTC)