Jump to content

Wikipedia:Village pump (technical)

From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
 Policy Technical Proposals Idea lab WMF Miscellaneous 
The technical section of the village pump is used to discuss technical issues about Wikipedia. Bug reports and feature requests should be made in Phabricator (see how to report a bug). Bugs with security implications should be reported differently (see how to report security bugs).

If you want to report a JavaScript error, please follow this guideline. Questions about MediaWiki in general should be posted at the MediaWiki support desk. Discussions are automatically archived after remaining inactive for five days.

Article preview showing completely different article[edit]

The page preview, which for some reason links to a different article
The article itself, which shows that the page previewer is jacked up

I was working on an article, Downtown One (which is not a redirect), when I realized that the article preview links to a completely different article, which is List of tallest buildings in Albania. A redirect from the former to the latter did exist at one point in time, but was deleted in 2023. The bug should be visible to others, if it's not just let me know, I can post an image up. This is a relatively serious bug aswell, because it basically removes the ability to visit that page, effectively eliminating the purpose of Wikipedia. I've never seen this before, so I thought I'd let yall know. (Also I attempted to report it over at Phabricator, but for some reason the ver. email link never sent). At least one person over at WP:TEAHOUSE is completely clueless as to why that happens, and honestly so am I. Thanks :) Sir MemeGod ._. (talk - contribs - created articles) 03:32, 6 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]

I failed to reproduce the problem. Graeme Bartlett (talk) 05:17, 6 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
It just fixed itself. That is the weirdest thing. Sir MemeGod ._. (talk - contribs - created articles) 05:20, 6 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Sir MemeGod ._. (talk - contribs - created articles) 05:23, 6 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
The redirect existed for 15 hours on 7 August 2023. Page Previews uses caching. I guess the cache was never updated after the deletion. I don't know whether this is normal for deleted redirects or pages. Page Previews doesn't activate on red links so it wouldn't normally affect users but it did when you recreated the page with other content. The cache was apparently updated between your first and second post, meaning between one and three hours after page creation. There are reasons for caching but 11 months is too much so I would call this a bug. PrimeHunter (talk) 10:33, 6 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Page previews don't get actively purged on delete/revert/move/etc, only on edit. And then they still are cached for 24 hours (not sure what the exact value is). This is a known issue (or rather two of them). So what happened is that when you recreated the article, it used the OLD information (as it was still somewhere in the database), that got cached, edits were made causing references to update in the databases, and then 24 hours later the cache expired and it used the new information from the edits. —TheDJ (talkcontribs) 11:03, 10 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
So, say someone creates a vandalistic page containing an objectionable image. The page gets deleted as G3. Later, someone creates a legitimate page at - or moves an existing page to - the same title. Is the preview going to show whatever picture that was previously on the vandalistic page? That could cause some surprises. Home Lander (talk) 20:00, 10 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Fixing the random article buttons on each level in vital articles[edit]

On each level of the WP:Vital articles pages, the random article buttons somehow stopped working. I tried this on my laptop and phone, and it doesn't work. What happens is when I press the button, I get an error that says the tool is down. I was wondering what caused this and how I can fix it so that it works again. Interstellarity (talk) 13:40, 8 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]

It looks like that uses the RandomInCategory tool, which is maintained by Ahecht. --rchard2scout (talk) 15:44, 8 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
@Interstellarity, Rchard2scout: Thanks for the ping. I'll look into that later when I have access to my home computer. --Ahecht (TALK
16:06, 8 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
@Interstellarity, Rchard2scout All set. The webservice just needed a kick, and had a little trouble starting the first time -- probably something to do with the gridengine shutdown. --Ahecht (TALK
18:03, 8 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
@Ahecht: Thank you for fixing it. Interstellarity (talk) 00:43, 9 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Tech News: 2024-28[edit]

MediaWiki message delivery 21:29, 8 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]

How are repeated references numbered?[edit]

When you use the same reference more than once, the individual instances get assigned tags a, b, c, etc. Once you get past 26, it wraps around to aa, ab, ac and so on up to az, then picks up with ba, bb, and so on. As part of a tool I'm writing, I need to be able to generate these. My first thought was "its just base 26 using "a" through "z" to represent 0 through 25 in each column". But its not (he says after beating his head against the wall writing some python code to do base 26 conversion). If it were, then after "z" would come "ba" for "1 in the 26's column plus 0 in the 1's column". So what is this sequence? Is there some standard name for it? RoySmith (talk) 15:49, 9 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]

@RoySmith See Bijective numeration#The bijective base-26 system. --Ahecht (TALK
15:57, 9 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Here is some quick python code to do the conversion:
def bijectiveHexavigesimal(n):
  outStr = ''
  while n != 0:
    outStr = chr((n - 1) % 26 + 97) + outStr
    n = (n - 1) / 26
  return outStr
--Ahecht (TALK
16:10, 9 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
(for the archives: this takes 1-based numbers, and the "/" should be "//" for Python-3) — Preceding unsigned comment added by RoySmith (talkcontribs) 17:36, 9 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
I'm curious, why do you want to generate reference numbers? Legoktm (talk) 16:08, 9 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
@Ahecht Cool, thanks!
@Legoktm I'm not sure exactly where this is going, but I'm working on something to make it easier to do reference spot-checks for GA and FA reviews. So you'd be able to say something like "pick 10% of the statements in the article and show me what they're sourced to" Using the current version of Oceanic whitetip shark), it might tell you that It is eaten fresh, smoked, dried, and salted and its skin made into leather is cited to reference 6-k. I can dig out of the generated HTML <sup id="cite_ref-FAO_6-10"> but I don't want to show that gibberish to the user.
This has been a frustrating project so far. It's been a series of, "Oh, all I need to do is..." false starts, foiled by the reality of just how perverse everything related to wiki text is. Not to mention how we don't have one uniform referencing style I can target. RoySmith (talk) 16:33, 9 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
I hope that you stick with it. A tool like that would be very helpful to those of who do spot-checks and might create an easier learning curve for new reviewers. Firefangledfeathers (talk / contribs) 19:19, 9 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
You would think that it's some clever algorithm, but actually, there is just a big list at MediaWiki:Cite references link many format backlink labels. Matma Rex talk 19:12, 9 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
And which article was it that required more than 702 repeated uses of a reference, and pushed MediaWiki to use three-character ids? Or was it just paranoia? -- Verbarson  talkedits 19:18, 9 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
This edit from 2010: [1] refers to List of allied military operations of the Vietnam War, which is today mercifully a list of lists, but the 2010 version: [2] re-used a reference a cool 1037 times. Matma Rex talk 19:25, 9 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Oh, my RoySmith (talk) 20:39, 9 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
I see you and raise you List of marine bony fishes of South Africa, with 1,378. I found it the same way I found the previous record holder. Graham87 (talk) 03:23, 10 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Which was right on the limit. Via search/replace all I thought it was one less than the limit (because there were 1,379 instances of the ref name), but the other one turns out to be because of list-defined references. I'd added more ref labels to the MediaWiki page before realising this; if someone really wants to revert my edit there, be my guest, but I can't think of a good reason to do so at this point. Graham87 (talk) 03:45, 10 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
What actually happens when someone adds more repeated refs than the list provides for? -- Verbarson  talkedits 07:35, 10 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
See the end of User:Graham87/sandbox30, which apparently answers your question; in this case it says "[[#cite_ref-test_1-2054|]]" before the ref text, which is "Test ref". I created this file by adding the first line with the ref declared, then writing the next line with a named ref, copying it to the clipboard and pasting it, copying and pasting the resulting two lines, then the resulting four, eight, sixteen, etc. ... lines, all the powers of two. Graham87 (talk) 09:00, 10 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Graham's Special:Diff/1233634000 added "baa" as the first new label. The error on the page User:Graham87/sandbox30 links to Help:Cite errors/Cite error references no backlink label. The section "Examples" there ends with "baa". It seems intentional, plus last update of Help page example correlates with previous update of the MediaWiki page.
It seems that the Help page needs to be updated to generate the error for demonstration purposes. —⁠andrybak (talk) 04:37, 12 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
I'm confused. Is this list actually used in some way when rendering citations on pages? RoySmith (talk) 13:37, 12 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Yes. These letter combinations are used in backlinks on the side of references, when a reference is used multiple times. See section Help:Cite errors/Cite error references no backlink label#Examples where a reference is used over 1300 times. —⁠andrybak (talk) 14:14, 12 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Oh my. RoySmith (talk) 14:22, 12 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]

I need help![edit]

I recently left a standard WP:ARBPIA alert on User talk:EliasAntonakos. Apparently I didn't get it right (I'm a bit rusty at the moment; I am mostly on wiki-break), as no messages after that shows up on their page. (see talk-history for futher messages) What did I get wrong? Huldra (talk) 21:10, 9 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]

There's an unclosed <!-- from the original notice causing everything after it to be hidden, need to close it with -->. Indagate (talk) 21:16, 9 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
User:Indagate; thanks! It worked! Huldra (talk) 21:20, 9 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
@Huldra: How did you make the original post? You were supposed to write {{subst:alert/first|a-i}} per Template:Contentious topics/alert/first#Usage, but that should automatically include the closing --> with no way to delete it in the same post. Did you instead try to copy-paste the message from another page? PrimeHunter (talk) 21:27, 9 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
@PrimeHunter: Indeed I did (copy-paste the message, that is). As I said above; I'm a bit rusty at the moment (mostly on wiki-break until the end of the year), Huldra (talk) 21:34, 9 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Dark mode for logged-in users on desktop coming this week![edit]

Hey, this is a continuation of the topic "Dark mode for logged-out users coming soon", specifically about desktop (the Vector 2022 skin).

In that previous message, we announced that dark mode on desktop would be rolled out in one step, for both logged-in and logged-out users, in the week of July 15 (that is, next week). However, we'd be more comfortable to enable it for logged-in users first. Articles here on English Wikipedia look very good in dark mode, and again, thanks to everyone who is contributing to it!

We are going to enable dark mode on desktop just for logged-in users this week. If everything goes well (it has been going very well so far!) we will enable it on desktop for logged-out users next week as we previously announced. It's gonna be exciting :D Thanks! SGrabarczuk (WMF) (talk) 01:35, 10 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]

@SGrabarczuk (WMF): What do you mean by "We are going to"? I thought it was enabled for logged-in users already? Nardog (talk) 06:29, 10 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
It was only Logged in users with the beta option enabled before. —TheDJ (talkcontribs) 07:31, 10 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Oh. Does it mean "Accessibility for Reading" will no longer be a beta feature, or just the dark mode? Nardog (talk) 07:38, 10 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Yes, exactly. SGrabarczuk (WMF) (talk) 11:05, 10 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
@SGrabarczuk (WMF): Yes, what? That was not a polar question. Nardog (talk) 11:10, 10 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Oh, sorry, I wanted to give a quick answer and misread :D Dark mode will no longer be a beta feature. Font size control will continue to be a beta feature. SGrabarczuk (WMF) (talk) 11:39, 10 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Correction: The font size control is already available by default. The beta feature will disappear from the list because after this rollout, all options will be available for everyone. SGrabarczuk (WMF) (talk) 18:31, 10 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
What happens to people (like me) who don't use Vector? Will dark mode still be available in MonoBook? — Preceding unsigned comment added by Nigel Ish (talkcontribs) 19:04, 10 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Dark mode is supported only in Minerva and Vector 2022. Izno (talk) 21:30, 10 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
So the existing dark mode (that does work in MonoBook) will stop working. Wonderful.Nigel Ish (talk) 21:43, 10 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
If by "existing dark mode that does work in Monobook" you mean the gadget? No, that will continue to function. Izno (talk) 21:45, 10 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Eww, this one caught me by surprise... The contrast doesn't seem quite right at the moment. I don't think "dark mode" should be black, it should be off black for the best ease on the eyes. Hopefully the WMF will get these things right in due course.  — Amakuru (talk) 21:36, 10 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
It's flicking black/white off-and-on for me. Page loads in dark & then seconds later turns white. The next page loads in white & seconds later flicks to black. Plus the diffs aren't visible in black. Instant migraine for me. Safari 16.6. Victoria (tk) 21:49, 10 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Same. On my end, it was enabled by default and I had to go into preferences to enable the toggle just to turn it off in the interface. Now it flickers every time the page loads. Viriditas (talk) 22:10, 10 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
I turned off the toggle in preferences, emptied my cached, restarted the machine. Still happening. Now the white pages render with the dark colors before turning completely black after about 5 seconds. I took screen shots. It seems to take 3 to 5 seconds to flick from white to black & then back again. Victoria (tk) 22:37, 10 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Yeah, one wonders if this is causing seizures. "For 3% of people with epilepsy, exposure to flashing lights at certain intensities or to certain visual patterns can trigger seizures." Viriditas (talk) 22:50, 10 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
This is true which is exactly why I'm unable to upload the screenshots. This is very very bad. Victoria (tk) 22:53, 10 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Makes me wonder why nobody else is reporting it or is the least bit concerned. I've got a brand new computer as well. Viriditas (talk) 22:57, 10 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
I switched to Vector legacy in preferences as a workaround. Viriditas (talk) 23:00, 10 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Hey there! I've added this to our FAQ. If you are seeing a flick from white to black, you have enabled the gadget AND have attempted to try out the new feature (possibly via preferences when it was in beta or via the new preference that now appears in the preferences page).
The number of people using the gadget is quite low compared to the number of viewers so I am not concerned that this is impacting a large amount of people. Jon (WMF) (talk) 23:01, 10 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Hi Jon (WMF), please re-read my message. I disabled the gadget, doublechecked that it's gone, emptied my cache, restarted my machine. It's still happening. I will have to log out to override this. If you would like to see screen shots taken with the gadget disabled I'm happy to send them on, but you'll have to contact me. Victoria (tk) 23:21, 10 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
That's what I initially thought, but the gadgets were all unchecked when it went live. Now, I get dark mode by default unless I check the preferences. I'm in Vector legacy to avoid all of it, because I can't fix it. Viriditas (talk) 23:05, 10 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Note, the dark-mode-toggle-pagestyles gadget is hidden on user preferences so it is possible you still have that enabled (it doesn't show up in preferences)
A few questions which will help us get to the bottom of this:
  • In legacy Vector are you seeing the dark mode gadget toggle in the top right?
  • If you enable Vector 2022, do you see the message "You're using a dark mode gadget". If yes, what happens when you click it and the page reloads?
Jon (WMF) (talk) 23:17, 10 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
In legacy Vector are you seeing the dark mode gadget toggle in the top right?
If you enable Vector 2022, do you see the message "You're using a dark mode gadget".
No, unless I'm missing it. How do I fix dark-mode-toggle-pagestyles, if that is the problem? Viriditas (talk) 23:26, 10 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Okay, I found it. There are two toggles for dark mode in preferences >> gadgets. One under "appearance" and then another one all the way under "utility". Both have to be turned off. Mine was still turned on under utility. The flickering only stops when they are both turned off. To find the control for dark/light mode now, one has to go to preferences >> appearance >> color. Color?? Seriously? In the meantime, Jon (WMF), I sent an email with screenshots, but it's now irrelevant. Victoria (tk) 23:54, 10 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Yeah, that's in "gadgets", and doesn't work for me. I have both off, and I'm still in dark mode. If I switch them on, and then turn off dark mode, I get the flickering. If I switch them off, I'm in permanent dark mode. Viriditas (talk) 00:12, 11 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Oh, Victoria is right, that worked. I had to change appearance > color to "light". Problem solved. Viriditas (talk) 00:20, 11 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Hmm really not a fan of this new default setting. Has this even been tested by a broad group of people including casual users (not just people heavily involved in Wikipedia?
The "dark mode" is ironically way too bright because this is a text-heavy site. So, what you get now is a mass of white text, not a dark page. It almost seems *more* white. The drastic differences between the colors make it difficult to skim. (I don't mind it so much when I'm reading closely, but skimming is important, too.)
Also - this is a little pet peeve, but important for research. The color of already-clicked links doesn't change in info boxes (sorry I don't know the exact term but in a bio page, it would be the box on the top right with basic info like DOB, city, parents, etc.). This isn't a browser issue because it works in Vector legacy. Jim0101 (talk) 04:17, 11 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
@Jim0101 "new default setting" The default will remain light mode, the only thing changing is that you get an OPTION to set dark mode... —TheDJ (talkcontribs) 12:20, 11 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
K well it switched to dark mode without me choosing that option. So that's naturally why I assumed it was the default setting when it did in fact default to that for me. Jim0101 (talk) 12:23, 11 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
I am using a script which highlights different type of pages in different colors (sorry do not remember the name), this gives me as default blue on black, and this is not readable. I generally like the dark background, but here I had to switch back (using the appearance tab in the preferences). I can not switch off the script because I work a lot with category deletion, and categories need to be tagged.--Ymblanter (talk) 05:59, 11 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
User:Anomie/linkclassifier? Nardog (talk) 06:25, 11 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Yes, I think so. Ymblanter (talk) 06:31, 11 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Yes, re contrast and readability I concur. I used it for a bit last night and my eyes were hurting by the end with some of the text impossible to read. Per Ymblanter above, I think this needs to go out to a proper group of test readers and full feedback taken on board before we roll it out as a default.  — Amakuru (talk) 08:00, 11 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
The linkclassifier script's colors are easy to customize if you know CSS. The default User:Anomie/linkclassifier.css isn't even required to be used. If someone wants to suggest a full set of colors for dark mode, that could be useful to incorporate in the default. Anomie 11:40, 11 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Has anyone raised an issue with new notifications background going from white to dark background upon read? The text is unreadable. – robertsky (talk) 06:37, 11 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Thanks for your report @Robertsky! I'm wondering if you could give a bit more detail on where you're seeing this? Are you talking about notifications on the Special:Notifications page? Or within the menu in the top right? If possible, a screenshot would be really helpful as well so we can identify where the issues is. Thanks again. OVasileva (WMF) (talk) 11:25, 11 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
I've noticed that If you open "Notices" and then have new messages "from other wikis", that block in your notices shows a baby blue highlight color for 2 to 3 seconds or something, which is not yet dark mode compatible. —TheDJ (talkcontribs) 12:09, 11 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
@OVasileva (WMF) as what @TheDJ described. Apologies for the delay, but here's a screen recording
Screen recording of notifications in dark mode 20240712
– robertsky (talk) 15:52, 12 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
The same also happens to the Thanks notifications. – robertsky (talk) 07:34, 13 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
going to https://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Template%3ADiff&veaction=editsource, the codes are rendered with white background and a light coloured text. – robertsky (talk) 09:24, 13 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Does dark mode give you the Willys 77[edit]

Thanks for giving Wikipedia a dark mode option! The settings page says Experimental version, high likelihood of experiencing issues--am i being helpful if i say i think i've found one?

Do we have (or should we have) a central thread where all of the discussions about the launch of dark mode should be in one place?

i've visited maybe a half dozen pages where dark mode seems to work, but the Willys 77 page still won't turn to the dark side, even after i:

  • reload the page,
  • close and reopen the tab,
  • open a new tab and type the URL into the address bar,
  • create a new link to that page (as in this post) and use that to open the page,
  • change settings back and forth a few times,
  • or retry the methods listed here, but in a different order.

Additionally, Wikipedia:Help desk is mostly dark. i'm not sure if it's the same issue mentioned here, but this part: Welcome...
(Am I in the right place?)...
For other types of questions...
Do not provide your email...
New editors may prefer the Teahouse...
[Ask a question]
show/hide Wikipedia help pages
this part stays white.

Wishing everyone safe, happy, productive editing.

-- (talk) 22:23, 10 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Willys 77 turned black. -- (talk) 23:13, 10 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Hello, thank you for reaching out here! I'm glad to see that the article turned black. It always takes a few days for new changes to be propagated across all pages because of caching. When we started running banners inviting logged-out users to switch to dark mode, the cache of just a few percent of the articles wasn't refreshed.
When it comes to the Help desk, I'm sure English Wikipedians will soon fix it. It is challenging, though. There are so many pages formatted with the assumption that the only mode is light, and there's a lot of special formatting on non-article pages. But reports like yours help technical editors prioritize their work.
Thanks again, for pointing at these issues, for your patience (so many steps to solve the problem of the persisting light mode), and kind words! SGrabarczuk (WMF) (talk) 00:32, 11 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
I have fixed all of the dark mode Linter issues at Wikipedia:Help desk except for the ones caused by {{Collapse top}}, which is fully protected. – Jonesey95 (talk) 14:28, 11 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]

New dark mode is less readable[edit]

The default foreground color for text is way too bright/white and more than a few page elements on certain pages are as bright as light mode. Overall, it does not seem like an improvement on the old beta dark mode. I'd simply disable it and stick with the old beta dark mode for now, but if I do that, there's a white flash at the start of every page load and page refresh, which defeats the purpose of using a dark mode.

Here's several screenshots to show before vs. after.

Also, is there documentation somewhere describing the changes to the CSS? .client-dark-mode stopped working. Thanks. Daniel Quinlan (talk) 07:40, 11 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Not having used the beta, the new version looks superior. A wp:village shrine should be erected to mark the occasion of implementation.
Though, the contrast issue may be a thing. Fiddling around with my monitor-settings, it feels like the default could be reduced quite significantly without other issues. JackTheSecond (talk) 09:10, 11 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
It's not just about what looks good, it's about reducing eyestrain and improving legibility. The new white text is simply far too bright at #EAECF0 rather than the previous text color in the beta, which was #DFDEDD. If you refer to Material Design's recommendations for dark theme, you'll see they recommend 87% opacity on #FFFFFF for "high emphasis" text (their term for the main text), which equates to #DEDEDE, essentially the same as the beta. The new experimental dark mode seems to overlook decades of user design research. Daniel Quinlan (talk) 21:17, 11 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Dark mode turned on for me yesterday evening, and I found it very difficult to read, especially the watchlist page, where I had great difficulty seeing which changed pages I had already looked at. I managed to turn dark mode off, except that each page loads in dark mode, and I have to wait several seconds until it switches to light mode. At least dark mode is not popping up this morning. Donald Albury 12:07, 11 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
WRT to documentation, See mediawikiwiki:Recommendations_for_night_mode_compatibility_on_Wikimedia_wikis. —TheDJ (talkcontribs) 12:14, 11 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]

dark text on dark background[edit]

templates that automatically change text colors from default settings?[edit]

i tried to make this clear, then i accidentally erased part of it and had to rewrite it. i hope it's (still) clear (again).

In dark mode, some sections of the Wikipedia:Manual of Style have dark text that's nearly invisible on the dark background. i can just barely read it when i zoom in, but i can read it, so it's not exactly the same color... but it's much too easy not to see it at all if you don't know to look for it. It's darker than gray or dark grey text, but the blackground is slightly darker (and apparently black black text is even darker than that). Some of the red and green text can be hard to read on the dark background, too; they might actually use dark red and dark green instead of red and green. These non-default colors seem to be products of templates; i am not very "fluent" in the use of templates. (For instance, in the examples transcribed below, are "Correct" and "Incorrect" two different templates, one green and one red? Are "Correct", "Accepted", "Acceptable", "Better", and "Clear" all versions of the same green template?)


Correct: Oranges are an...
Incorrect: Oranges are a...
Accepted: "Life is short, art is long." (two brief clauses in an aphorism; see Ars longa, vita brevis)
Accepted: "I have studied it, you have not." (reporting brisk conversation, such as this reply of Newton's)
Unwieldy: Oranges are an...
Better: Oranges are a...
Confusing: Sales offices are located...
Clear: Sales offices are...
It was obvious...
Meaning: It was obvious...
(sub-era, not subera)
Incorrect: 9-mm gap
Correct: 9 mm gap (markup: 9&nbsp;mm gap)
Incorrect:    9 millimetre gap
Correct: 9-millimetre gap
Correct: 12-hour shift
Correct: 12 h shift (markup: 12&nbsp;h shift)
Incorrect: Her album reached #1 in...
Correct: Her album reached number one...
Correct: Her album reached No. 1 in...
Correct: Her albums Foo and Bar reached Nos. 1 and 3.
Correct: Her albums Foo and Bar reached numbers one and three...
An exception is issue numbers of comic books, which unlike for other periodicals are conventionally given in general text in the form #1, unless a volume is also given, in which case write volume two, number seven or Vol. 2, No. 7. Another exception are periodical publications carrying both, issue and number designations (typically one being a year-relative and the other an absolute value); they should be given in the form 2 #143 in citations, or be spelt out as Iss. 2, No. 143 in text. When using the abbreviations, write {{abbr|Vol.|Volume}}, {{abbr|Iss.|Issue}}, {{abbr|No.|Number}}, or {{abbr|Nos.|Numbers}}, at first occurrence.
Incorrect: Slovak returned to the Red Hot Chili Peppers in 1985 after growing tired of What Is This?.
Acceptable: Slovak returned to the Red Hot Chili Peppers in 1985 after growing tired of What Is This?
Better: Slovak, having grown tired of What Is This?, returned to the Red Hot Chili Peppers in 1985.
Incorrect: He made several films with Sammy Davis Jr..
Correct: He made several films with Sammy Davis Jr.
aside: Would He and Sammy Davis Jr. made several films together. be better?
  • Honorable mention for dark mode (light text on dark background) including phrases of dark text on light background, as seen in MOS:AFFIXDASH (EDIT: i just realized this particular issue must be with the ‹template Cat is being considered for merging› bit, not the Manual of Style itself):
The form of category names follows the corresponding main articles, e.g., ‹The template Cat is being considered for merging.› Category:Trans–New Guinea languages.
However, the principle is not extended when compounding other words in category names, e.g., ‹The template Cat is being considered for merging.› Category:Tennis-related lists and ‹The template Cat is being considered for merging.› Category:Table tennis-related lists both use hyphens.

Honorable mention also for viewing a Difference between revisions, where the revised portion of the article appears in light text on a dark background, but the editor's name/IP address appear with select stats as dark text (well, blue links, mostly) on a light background. For example, the diff for the most recent edit to this page shows mostly in dark mode, but shows

Lowercase sigmabot III

on a light background... and i didn't realize until i did that copy-paste that EDITS is there in text almost as light as the background.

Thanks to the people working on this.

aside: For my own amusement and future reference, i have been using my talk page (Learn more about this page) to test what names of colors work with this Wikipedia code (and which do not). Maybe that could help someone see which colors work best for light mode, dark mode, or both?

-- (talk) 19:26, 11 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]

I have fixed all of the Linter dark mode issues at Wikipedia:Manual of Style, so it may display better now. However, the green text generated by {{xt}} appears to be #006400, which, when placed on the #202122 "black" background of dark mode, results in a contrast ratio of 2.16:1, a failing score. The red text generated by {{!xt}} appears to be #8B0000, which, when placed on the same black background, results in a contrast ratio of 1.61:1, another failing score. I'm not sure what to do about that. Either someone needs to find a green that works with both, or a style sheet could be created to deliver different greens and reds in light and dark mode, or something else. – Jonesey95 (talk) 22:21, 11 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Thanks, Jonesey.
If i'm going to keep reporting these issues, maybe i should learn how to fix them myself, but i don't even know what questions to ask or if i'd understand the answers. For example, what's Linter?
-- (talk) 09:19, 12 July 2024 (UTC)[reply], see Wikipedia:Linter. — Qwerfjkltalk 09:38, 13 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
...Huh. From MOS:HASH again:
they should be given in the form 2 #143 in citations, or be spelt out as Iss. 2, No. 143 in text. When using the abbreviations, write {{abbr|Vol.|Volume}}, {{abbr|Iss.|Issue}}, {{abbr|No.|Number}}, or {{abbr|Nos.|Numbers}}, at first occurrence.
"2 #143" and "Iss. 2, No. 143" seem to be dark green in both light mode and dark mode, but "{{abbr|Vol.|Volume}}", "{{abbr|Iss.|Issue}}", "{{abbr|No.|Number}}", and "{{abbr|Nos.|Numbers}}" are dark green in dark mode and black in light mode? -- (talk) 09:37, 12 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]

dark text on light background in dark mode[edit]

Seems many cells in episode tables (Template:Episode_table) have this problem, as seen on these pages:

i'm still figuring out how Wikipedia tables work and Web colors#Hex triplets go right over my head, but i think Template:Episode_table lets you override some default colors, which still leaves the problem of picking colors that suit both light mode and dark mode, or altering the template so it switches colors when the user toggles between light mode and dark mode. -- (talk) 09:19, 12 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]

I do not see any errors on those pages in dark mode. – Jonesey95 (talk) 14:43, 12 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Timeline for dark mode rollout[edit]


[...] In that previous message, we announced that dark mode on desktop would be rolled out in one step, for both logged-in and logged-out users, in the week of July 15 (that is, next week). However, we'd be more comfortable to enable it for logged-in users first. [...]

We are going to enable dark mode on desktop just for logged-in users this week. If everything goes well (it has been going very well so far!) we will enable it on desktop for logged-out users next week as we previously announced.

Is "next week" on WP:THURSDAY? Could you please give dates for these? There are at least three relevant places on mediawiki.org:

—⁠andrybak (talk) 22:35, 13 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Did footnote popup CSS just change?[edit]

The font size in footnote popups seems to have suddenly changed to dramatically larger font size than previously, and now appears to be significantly larger than body copy in my skin (old-school MonoBook + some personal CSS modifications).

Because the width of footnote popup boxes hasn't changed, much less text now fits on each line, which combined with the bloated font size makes the footnotes now take up like 1.5 or 2x more space than previously. I find the new popups both less legible per se, and also much more disruptive because they cover more of the content below. Footnotes which try to include more detailed material end up fitting worse inside the available popup space.

Was this change discussed anywhere? In my opinion it should be reverted. There is no good reason for footnote popups to ever have a larger font size than body copy. Ideally they would have a slightly smaller font size, but the same size is also okay. (I can't even remember precisely what they were like before.)

jacobolus (t) 05:39, 10 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]

It's MediaWiki talk:Gadget-ReferenceTooltips.js#Update request 9 July 2024, and ‎JWBTH is on it. Nardog (talk) 06:27, 10 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Thanks! –jacobolus (t) 06:52, 10 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
For anybody interested – please join the discussion at MediaWiki talk:Gadget-ReferenceTooltips.js#Update request 9 July 2024 as to how should the tooltip font size correlate with body font size across different skins and text size settings, and whether we should use #mw-teleport-target as the wrapper for the tooltip. Jack who built the house (talk) 07:29, 10 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Problematic page previews[edit]

I found a couple of pages where the page previews isn't working properly: E. O. Wilson and Fiji. I'm guessing that there is some wikitext element (bracket etc) that isn't closed properly, but can't see anything.  —  Jts1882 | talk  09:19, 10 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]

They look fine in mw:Page Previews. The problems are in Wikipedia:Tools/Navigation popups. PrimeHunter (talk) 09:43, 10 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Examining old revisions of E. O. Wilson, Popups failed on [3] which inserted <!-- Work in Progress Lede --> in January 2023 and made Popups only display }}. Popups tries to identify and display text from the first paragraph excluding an infobox and various stuff at the top of pages. If something makes Popups think it has reached the first "real" paragraph then it displays that, sometimes producing an empty display because Popups ignores templates. I don't know why this displayed }} instead of empty when the brackets were correctly balanced. Anyway, I removed the obsolete comment [4] and Popups works well now. Fiji has a long infobox code. Wikipedia:Tools/Navigation popups#Options says: "popupMaxPreviewCharacters | 600, an integer | The maximum number of characters to extract from something approximating the beginning of an article for the preview." The Fiji popup only displays "Fiji ( , ; " with the default 600. That's not an error but just an unfortunate result of skipping templates and cutting off before the closing parentheses and following normal text is reached. It works well with window.popupMaxPreviewCharacters = 6000; in your common JavaScript. It still only gives "Fiji ( , ; " with 5000 so the default 600 is far from reaching a good result here. PrimeHunter (talk) 10:59, 10 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Ah, thanks for tracking that down. I've added the javascript. I suppose for an opt-in gadget the few failures at 600 is probably acceptable. If the main Page Previews had the issue it would be more of a concern. I thought I'd checked that the error was Page Previews, not Navigation Popups, so clearly screwed up there. —  Jts1882 | talk  12:45, 10 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Custom formats of TemplateData[edit]

I have a question concerning the custom formatting options of TemplateData, specifically for {{Episode table}}.

I noticed that when editors edit this particular template in Visual Editor, VE would remove all the spacing between the parameters. To fix this, I added custom formatting of the paramaters into the TemplateData to keep the spacing. It worked! However, with this fix, the new issue is now the removal of just the spacing after the last parameter, which I then need to restore manually.

In these examples linked, every other parameter declaration and value for {{Episode table}} can be displayed inline; however, |episodes= spans multiple lines, and its value should begin on the line after the parameter declaration.

My question is: how can I add spacing to the custom formatting for just the last parameter, to prevent this sort of removal? -- Alex_21 TALK 10:06, 10 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]

This is not possible. Izno (talk) 21:36, 10 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
That's unfortunate; I did think that might be the case. Does that mean the sort of edit in that last link is not something that can be automatically fixed? -- Alex_21 TALK 01:39, 11 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Bumping this for any other suggestions/opinions. -- Alex_21 TALK 05:34, 13 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Category/template redirect problems[edit]

Can someone with the knowledge apply Template:Resolve category redirect to the whole of Template:Country establishment category by century. Currently the latter is causing Category:Medieval Belgium to be populated instead of Category:Medieval history of Belgium. Thanks in advance. Timrollpickering (talk) 10:31, 10 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]

@Timrollpickering: I currently see no pages in Category:Medieval Belgium and the mentioned templates haven't been edited recently. Please give a clear example of the perceived problem, e.g. a page you saw in a wrong category if that was the problem. Maybe it was automatically fixed by a delayed process rendering the affected pages again and updating link tables after yesterdays move of Category:Medieval Belgium to Category:Medieval history of Belgium. PrimeHunter (talk) 11:13, 10 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]

2022 FIBA U18 Women's Asian Championship[edit]

Please create the following redirect:

I was going to do it myself, but this redirect page is fully protected. Thanks, Maiō T. (talk) 14:12, 10 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]

 Done * Pppery * it has begun... 02:03, 11 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Different kind of redlinked category problem[edit]

The latest run of Special:WantedCategories features a redlinked ‹The template Category link is being considered for merging.› Category:Philippine articles requiring maintenance, populated by the single page Liloan — and while the redlink obviously has to either get created or go away, that's not the only reason I'm bringing it to VPT: the page itself is absolutely buried in blaring red template-error messages, like tables smothered in "Formatting error: invalid input when rounding" and an Economy section that consists entirely of the text "Lua error in Module:Chart at line 301: bad argument #1 to 'max' (number expected, got string)." with no actual economic data, and even an external link that's been drowned in multiple instances of "String Module error: String subset index out of range".

The page was moved within the past 48 hours from the former title Liloan, Cebu, so this may stem from a mismatch between its new title and the title the templates are expecting, but I wouldn't know how to fix that. So could somebody with more skill in that area than I've got look into this page and figure out what's causing the errors? Thanks. Bearcat (talk) 14:52, 10 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]

This came from Wikidata not being properly updated after the move, which I've now fixed. * Pppery * it has begun... 14:59, 10 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Ah, OK. Great, thanks much! Bearcat (talk) 15:00, 10 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Chrome just killed all customization on Wikipedia for me?[edit]


Weird - I just installed Chrome on a new computer, and it is ignoring all my preferences - scripts, etc. No scripts show up (Twinkle, etc.), heck, it even does not allow me to enable visual editor. Heck, even clicking 'add topic' in Chrome on this very page here doesn't work. Microsoft Edge which I used on that computer for few days works fine (all tools/etc. show up and work), and obviously I can post here. Seems like some Chrome issue (not Wiki preferences issue) - any idea what settings to play with? No, clearing cache etc. doesn't work. Piotr Konieczny aka Prokonsul Piotrus| reply here 12:08, 11 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Sounds like maybe you have Javascript disabled ? Did you install/restore a chrome extension that maybe has that as a default ? —TheDJ (talkcontribs) 12:15, 11 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
@TheDJ Good call, NoScript reset its settings and was murderizing stuff - fixed. Piotr Konieczny aka Prokonsul Piotrus| reply here 12:05, 12 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Getting "A warning has occurred while searching: Deep category query returned too many categories"[edit]

Appears to have been a problem in 2020. wp:Village pump (technical)/Archive 186#List of companies. Search criteria:

Suggestions? Thank you Adakiko (talk) 19:44, 11 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]

The answer to this question on StackOverflow suggests using https://petscan.wmflabs.org/ (meta:PetScan). I tested:
- in the first tab, Categories, I put Wikipedia policies and guidelines in the categories field;
- in the Page properties tab, I unchecked mainspace (the blank one) and checked Wikipedia;
- in the Other sources tab, I typed "unchecked" in the search field and enwiki in the field to the right of the search (and clicked "from categories" in Use wiki);
Searching that shows differing amounts of results depending on the depth value in the first tab (Categories), but doesn't error.
Does that work for your purposes? – 2804:F1...B0:83D1 (talk) 21:56, 11 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
@Adakiko: If you use the advanced search form with "Pages in these categories" then the search automatically uses Help:Searching#deepcategory: which fails if there are too many subcategories. The form doesn't appear to have a way to omit deepcategory when the categories field is used. You can avoid using the field and instead use Help:Searching#incategory: by writing incategory: and a category name in quotation marks in the search box. It doesn't search subcategories and gives no hits for Category:Wikipedia policies and guidelines [5] but three hits for Category:Wikipedia policies [6]. PrimeHunter (talk) 22:52, 11 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Thanks for all your help and advice. I would think that searching for a policy page on Wikipedia should be easier. I often remember the gist of some policy, but can not easily find the policy. I'll stick with wp:List of policies and guidelines, wp:List of policies, wp:List of guidelines, wp:Manual of Style/Contents, Wikipedia:Simplified ruleset. I'll add them to my user page. Adakiko (talk) 23:11, 12 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]

CharInsert and dark mode[edit]

When I have the CharInsert gadget enabled on the English Wikipedia (which is on by default), the buttons for individual characters are still white when I also have dark mode enabled (which it is for me because of my operating system settings). First reported on mw:Talk:Reading/Web/Accessibility for reading, but Jon (WMF) said to report it to the "gadget author". The user preference links here for troubleshooting, so here I am. -- Beland (talk) 06:44, 12 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]

The fix probably needs to happen at MediaWiki:Gadget-charinsert-styles.css. The centralized discussion page for it is MediaWiki talk:Edittools. —⁠andrybak (talk) 22:23, 13 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Need tool to copy link in Wiki format[edit]

Editing with Windows 11 and Firefox, if I right click the "About Wikipedia" in this page's navigation panel, then select "copy link" I get https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:About in my clipboard.

It would be useful to have an option to "copy link in Wiki format", and get Wikipedia:About instead.

Ideally it would substitute spaces for underscores where apllicable. It would be good if it could also handle section links.

Does anyone know of a tool (Firefox extension?) or script that will do this? Or does anyone have the skills and time to make one? Andy Mabbett (Pigsonthewing); Talk to Andy; Andy's edits 07:53, 12 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Does User:Nardog/CopySectLink suit your needs? It doesn't support right clicks but allows you to copy wikilink-ready text in one click once you open the page. Nardog (talk) 08:41, 12 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Thank you, that is useful, but I still want to be able to copy from links, using right-click. Andy Mabbett (Pigsonthewing); Talk to Andy; Andy's edits 09:35, 13 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Brief "Fatal exception" error[edit]

While looking for articles related to the Euros, about 09:27 GMT, I got this error:

MediaWiki internal error.

Original exception: [ebc9f8bd-c439-4ead- b15d-875110252bc0] 2024-07-12 08:27:16:

Fatal exception of type "Wikimedia\Rdbms\DBUnexpectedError"

Exception caught inside exception handler.

Set $wgShowExceptionDetails = true; at the bottom of LocalSettings.php to show detailed debugging information.

It was brief and appears to be working now, but what happened? Fantastic Mr. Fox (talk) 08:33, 12 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Just a brief outage, happens all the time on the internet. Sjoerd de Bruin (talk) 08:36, 12 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
I looked up the error code: [7] The error was: "Database servers in extension1 are overloaded. In order to protect application servers, the circuit breaking to databases of this section have been activated. Please try again a few seconds." and occurred while the software was trying to mark one of your notifications as read. ("extension1" is a database storing information that is shared across all wikis, such as notifications.)
It seems that there was a small spike of these errors between 08:26 and 08:28 today, but I can't find any Phabricator task or incident report about it, so I would guess it wasn't too serious of a problem. Matma Rex talk 14:13, 12 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Bot activity problem[edit]

DannyS712 bot, a bot which is supposed to look after various daily or weekly maintenance tasks, hasn't made any edits since July 1, including failing to update Wikipedia:Database reports/Polluted categories (2) in eleven days despite that being a thing that's supposed to happen weekly, but the bot's maintainer says on their own userpage that they're not around much lately, and they haven't made any Wikipedia edits at all since July 3, so there's no way to know when they'll be back in order to look into it if I approach them personally (especially in July, when any editor could very well be on vacation for a couple of weeks). So could somebody take a quick gander into whether there's a problem with the bot, and maybe jumpstart it again if there is? Thanks. Bearcat (talk) 15:53, 12 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]

@DannyS712 is pretty active in other areas of the wikiverse and I suspect they will see this ping. It certainly doesn't hurt to try. https://toolsadmin.wikimedia.org/tools/id/dannys712-bot states they are the only maintainer, so there's nothing anyone can do to help (unless they are a Toolforge admin). MusikAnimal talk 19:48, 12 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
It's a straightforward query without any postprocessing, so if DannyS712 doesn't respond or can't easily fix whatever's gone wrong, the report can be run at will on Quarry and it'd be trivial to migrate the WP:DBR subpage to {{Database report}}. —Cryptic 20:08, 12 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
I saw the ping, and have been meaning to get to this, but am aware of the issue - hopefully I'll have time this weekend, and sorry for the delays --DannyS712 (talk) 21:07, 12 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]

What are notifications of "A link was made from X to Y"?[edit]

I made a new list article (Scientology properties) and now am getting "notifications" with a message like "A link was made from Dianazene to Scientology properties." Here are screenshots of 3 I received. What are these? I cannot find any wikilinks within the source of these articles pointing to my new article, and none of these 3 articles should wikilink to this article. How is this happening? What does it mean? How do I research these... and remove such links? Or are they related to Template:Scientology and some bot just hasn't gotten around to telling me the other hundred articles which are now linked together? But what kind of "link" is this?   ▶ I am Grorp ◀ 23:38, 12 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]

@Grorp: It's wikilinks like [[Scientology properties]] whether they are in the source or made by a template like {{Scientology}} and {{Scientology properties}}. The three examples in your screenshot transclude {{Scientology}} and were recently edited.[8][9][10] I don't know whether such notifications will always be delayed until the next edit. You can mute further notifications with a click in the notification or by using the box at the bottom of Special:Preferences#mw-prefsection-echo. You cannot say that you only want notifictions of source links and not transcluded links from templates. User:PrimeHunter/Source links.js gives a way to search for source links to a page. It doesn't currently find any in articles.[11] PrimeHunter (talk) 00:32, 13 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
@PrimeHunter: Thanks! I think you're right that the next edit to an article using {{Scientology}} will generate another one of these notices... except when I make the edit. I guess I get the notices because I'm the page creator.   ▶ I am Grorp ◀ 02:04, 13 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
@Grorp: You can turn off these notifications in your prefs by deselecting all three checkboxes at Preferences → Notifications → Page links. --Redrose64 🌹 (talk) 07:54, 13 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Issues with Twinkle[edit]

Hello, I am having an issue with Twinkle. It was working fine a few days ago but now the only option I see is 'config'. Could anyone help me fix this? Thanks!

Script request[edit]

Hello. I would like to have a script that highlights whether an edit is the current version of a page in the recent changes page and the watchlist, the same way that "m" is displayed if an edit is minor or "N" is displayed if it's a new page. "current" should be displayed if an edit is current. I mainly edit via the mobile website so it should work on mobile as well. Thank you for answering. Uricoh (talk) 07:37, 14 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]