Talk:Liam Neeson

Nationality

Aside from the fact that one's own opinion on nationality does not qualify someone as that nationality, if Neeson cam be argued as Irish he can certainly be argued as British. If he is stated as being an 'Irish actor' there is absolutely no reason why he should not be also stated as a British actor.Bunnyman78 (talk) 23:14, 13 January 2012 (UTC)

"I'm still a proud Irishman, of course, but I've become an American citizen". No mention of being proud to be British is there? Since the Good Friday Agreement gives people the right to be Irish or British, he is quite entitled to be Irish. Therefore I have removed the infobox field addition. O Fenian (talk) 12:09, 19 December 2010 (UTC)

In addition, this Interview with Liam Neeson (2004): 'LIAM: Well that seems vulnerable to go into because it’s personal. But let’s just say, I’m Irish. I grew up in the 1950s. Religion had a very tight iron fist.' Captain Fearnought (talk) 14:31, 19 December 2010 (UTC)

That's how it works in the UK. You have the English, Welsh, Scottish and Irish. Few people refer to themselves as British. The Good Friday agreement has no standing in law and does not mean that you're an Irish citizen as just because you call yourself Irish. There is no evidence that he has claimed Irish citizenship. The fact is that he accepted an OBE in 1999 and they are only awarded to British citizens. Eckerslike (talk) 15:05, 19 December 2010 (UTC)

Read. The. Good. Friday. Agreement. Then. Read. What. Liam. Neeson. Says.

Or if that is too difficult for you. "Irish actor Liam Neeson" versus "British actor Liam Neeson", standard Google search. 288,000 for Irish (372 unique, which is the better measure), 88,900 for British (40 unique). Google News search including archives. 172 for Irish, 4 for British. Google Books search. 68 for Irish, 0 for British!

If you want to claim there is no evidence he has Irish nationality, I will point out there is equally no evidence he still has British nationality.

The sources are overwhelmingly clear, as is Neeson himself, he is Irish. O Fenian (talk) 16:05, 19 December 2010 (UTC)

Eckerslike, you're completely wrong about OBEs being awarded only to British citizens. See the thread below. -- Jack of Oz ... speak! ... 16:58, 19 December 2010 (UTC)

"Scottish Actor Sean Connery" [1] 88,900 and British [2] 28,600. "Irish politician Ian Paisley" politician Ian Paisley%22 gives 509 and with British politician Ian Paisley%22 0 results. Need I go on or should shall we agree that Google is crap way of establishing facts. It is up to you to prove he has renownced his British citizenship. Eckerslike (talk) 17:09, 19 December 2010 (UTC)

Ian Paisley was born in Ireland, whats your point?Sheodred (talk) 09:32, 27 October 2011 (UTC)

Wrong. It is up to you to obtain consensus for the change, and since Liam Neeson does not identify as British that will not happen any time soon. O Fenian (talk) 17:14, 19 December 2010 (UTC)

Eckerslike, you're confusing various things. Sean Connery is a United Kingdom citizen, but his nationality is Scottish, because he self-identifies as such. Liam Neeson is or at least was a United Kingdom citizen, but his nationality is Irish, because he self-identifies as such. But the awarding of the OBE or any other British honour does not, of itself, mean anything about either the recipient's citizenship or their nationality. -- Jack of Oz ... speak! ... 17:21, 19 December 2010 (UTC)

As I have pointed out the term Irish can ambiguous. It needs more than one reference to establish context.

• When he received his Honourary Doctorate he stated that "Northern Ireland will always be my home".
• During this Q&A he referred to the "President of Ireland" not "the president".
• When asked about the abolition UK Film Council he repeatedly referred to "we", "our" and "the government". (Note: Dara O'Brien despite being a British resident of several years still refers to "Your" when talking about British institutions).
• He received an OBE from the Queen in a ceremony involving all the bowing and ridiculous procrastinations that I doubt a republican Irishman would go through (I wouldn't).

Given this context it seems that when he was saying he is a "proud Irishman" he was not referring to the state. Given this the use of Irish in the lead without reference to the fact that he is from Northern Ireland and is a British citizen is misleading. Eckerslike (talk) 20:27, 19 December 2010 (UTC)

The word Irish in the lede links to Irish people, not to any particular politico-sovereign state. That's as it should be and doesn't need any elaboration, because people from both parts of the island can legitimately call themselves "Irish". But I've added Northern Ireland to his place of birth to make it absolutely clear where he happened to be born. -- Jack of Oz ... speak! ... 20:37, 19 December 2010 (UTC)

Read. The. Good. Friday. Agreement. Oh and I will add that considering he's an American citizen him using "President of Ireland" means nothing, last time I checked America has a president too.. O Fenian (talk) 20:34, 19 December 2010 (UTC)

Clearly it is ambiguous as even some editors were under the impression that he was of Irish citizenship. And yes I have read the Belfast Agreement (have you). It states:-

[The participants] recognise the birthright of all the people of Northern Ireland to
identify themselves and be accepted as Irish or British, or both, as they
may so choose, and accordingly confirm that their right to hold both
British and Irish citizenship is accepted by both Governments and would
not be affected by any future change in the status of Northern Ireland.

It does not give any details as to how the individual establishes a citizenship of each country. In fact the very next paragraph states:

The participants also note that the two Governments have accordingly
undertaken in the context of this comprehensive political agreement, to
propose and support changes in, respectively, the Constitution of Ireland
and in British legislation relating to the constitutional status of Northern
Ireland.

International agreements have no direct legal relevence. It is up to the government to implement the statuary requirements (in this case using the Northern Ireland Act). If they fail to do so the they are in violation of the agreement and we go back the table. The Belfast agreement does not mean that someone who says they are Irish becomes Irish by default. The normal rules of citizenship still apply.

My understanding of the legal situation according to the laws of each country is that everyone in Northern Ireland is a dual British/Irish citizen until they renounce either one. Technically, Liam Neeson is now a American/British/Irish citizen but that is a bit too complicated for the first sentence. An actor from Northern Ireland who now holds American citizenship would be a far simpler explanation. Eckerslike (talk) 21:32, 19 December 2010 (UTC)

It may be going a bit far to say that "everyone in Northern Ireland is a dual British/Irish citizen until they renounce either one". We'd need a specific source for that. Btw, the word you want is "statutory" (which pertains to statutes and laws), not "statuary" (which pertains to monuments and statues and garden gnomes). -- Jack of Oz [your turn] 22:15, 19 December 2010 (UTC)

The relevant part is "identify themselves and be accepted as Irish or British", and it is clear which choice Liam Neeson has made. The part about citizenship in the agreement is a red herring since before it people were free to hold dual citizenship. Liam Neeson has chosen to identify himself as Irish, and should be recognised as such. O Fenian (talk) 22:23, 19 December 2010 (UTC)

I quickly found about three articles saying he took American citizenship. The same articles are pretty clear that he self describes himself as an Irishman. In the absence of a WP:RS that says he had British citizenship then it should be Irish in the infobox along with American. --Eamonnca1 ^TALK 02:42, 19 August 2011 (UTC)

@O Fenian: The relevant part is "identify themselves and be accepted as Irish or British", and it is clear which choice Liam Neeson has made. "Identifying" oneself as Irish (which people have always been entitled to do - the GFA fluff makes no difference) is not the same as being a citizen of the Republic of Ireland. Mooretwin (talk) 11:29, 19 August 2011 (UTC)

This seems pretty clear-cut. As stated by the UK Border Agency, 'if you were born in the UK before 1 January 1983, you are almost certainly a British citizen. The only exception is if you were born to certain diplomatic staff of foreign missions who had diplomatic immunity'UK Border Agency's Offical Website and as stated by the Republic of Ireland's Department of Foreign Affairs, 'every person born on the island of Ireland before 1 January, 2005 is entitled to be an Irish citizen'RI Department of Foreign Affairs Official Website. According to the law of both these nations: when the Good Friday Agreement was created, he was officially made a citizen of both the UK and the Republic of Ireland due to the fact he was born in Northern Ireland. He is legally a British Citizen and a Irish Citizen and unless he renounces one of them, he always will be. We have a convenient term for people in this category: Northern Irish although it isn't usually used in any real capacity, apart from describing someone within Northern Ireland. He also took American Citizenship and therefore has three different citizenships. He is British Irish American in Citizenship, If he has truly described himself as Irish, then that is his race or Ethnic Ancestry. He is by all accounts, an Irish, British Irish American. --OJSlaughter (talk) 03:32, 5 September 2011 (UTC)

He's entitled to ROI citizenship, but we have no source to indicate whether or not he has taken up this entitlement. Therefore we can only say that he is British and American. Mooretwin (talk) 13:30, 5 September 2011 (UTC)

Liam Neeson is entitled to an Irish passport or a UK passport. However regardless of whether he holds 1 or both it is still correct to refer to him as Irish. You can be Irish AND British - much in the same way as you are Scottish and British (see Sean Connery as an example) Sue De Nimes (talk) 08:09, 6 September 2011 (UTC)

Aye, but the infobox entry relates to citizenship. Hence this discussion. Mooretwin (talk) 12:34, 6 September 2011 (UTC)

Irish American

I've taken the liberty of amending the opening sentence to read "Irish American". The Wikipedia article on Irish Americans defines them as "citizens of the United States who can trace their ancestry to Ireland", which fits here. Being first generation American (i.e. naturalised) still meets that definition. Maybe this can also put to rest the earlier discussion about how to describe his nationality and/or heritage. Wikipeterproject (talk) 06:42, 23 May 2011 (UTC)

He is not Irish American. He is an Irishman who holds American citizenship, as the article notes. The two are not the same. O Fenian (talk) 08:16, 23 May 2011 (UTC)

Ummm...you just provided the definition of an Irish American. An American citizen who is Irish. I think any Irish person can be rightly proud of being Irish, but the fact is this guy is an American (citizen) who has an Irish heritage and, therefore very neatly meets the definition of "Irish American" as per the Wikipedia article on Irish Americans, albeit one with only a short American association. Note, for comparison, that Rupert Murdoch is described as an Australian-American. I'm not going to get into an edit war here, but some discussion towards a consensus might be good... Wikipeterproject (talk) 19:12, 23 May 2011 (UTC)

Irish American is a label almost exclusively applied to people born in American with Irish ancestry, not Irish people who have recently obtained American citizenship. O Fenian (talk) 07:41, 29 May 2011 (UTC)

Here's a reliable source that describes him as Irish-American. It also appears his full and proper name is William: http://www.britannica.com/EBchecked/topic/407938/Liam-Neeson Ivor Stoughton (talk) 19:11, 30 May 2011 (UTC)

I agree with him being stated as Irish-American in the lede; he undeniably is after all, if he indeed has American citizenship. I may change this at a later date, if no further objections are made. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 82.20.58.89 (talk) 22:13, 30 June 2011 (UTC)

No, just no! The whole X-American thing is a bit of a joke. It means nothing outside the US. Liam Neeson is most certainly not an Irish American. Wiki guidelines state that nationality should be what the subject held when they became notable. It is clear Neeson was notable long before he obtained American citizenship. As an aside if your parents were born in America you are American - not Irish American. Sue De Nimes (talk) 08:28, 15 August 2011 (UTC)

Where is the guieline? I don't disbelieve you, but would like to read it. Wikipeterproject (talk) 21:48, 16 August 2011 (UTC)

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Manual_of_Style_(biographies) Sue De Nimes (talk) 15:03, 18 August 2011 (UTC)

I'm against fighting over tags to apply to people in the first line of bios, but he is clearly an Irishman who took American citizenship. You're playing a bit with the definition of "Irish Americans", which has a different meaning relating to communities which descended from 19th century immigrants. That's as much about identity as anything as else. Regarding his name, Wikipedia doesn't cite other encyclopaedias, and Britannica style is to use the Anglicised version of the name. We don't do that here. Best,--Ktlynch (talk) 07:44, 19 August 2011 (UTC)

I accept that Irish American is best suited to long-term American citizens with Irish ancestry and therefore may not properly apply here. Wikipeterproject (talk) 15:51, 27 October 2011 (UTC)

Neeson was born in the United Kingdom. GoodDay (talk) 13:25, 27 October 2011 (UTC)

This is a ridiculous situation, wikipedia is not a platform for individual nationalists. The fact of the matter is that Liam Neeson was born in Great Britain. Using quotes where he identifies himself as an Irishman, does not change that fact. The Good Friday Agreement DOES NOT give anyone a carte blanche to change their citizenship by dialogue. Saying Neeson is Irish is not even an interpretation of facts, it is just not a fact at all- it's an opinion. If Neeson has been quoted as saying he is Irish or British is should have nothing to do with the factual parts of the wikipage, but instead can be included in the article if it is so extremely important.Bunnyman78 (talk) 22:27, 5 January 2012 (UTC)

I stopped reading your ill-informed shite after you said "The fact of the matter is that Liam Neeson was born in Great Britain". The real fact of the matter is that Ballymena is not in Great Britain. 2 lines of K₃₀₃ 10:35, 6 January 2012 (UTC)

Addition of OBE after his name

Wikipedia's policy on this issue is here and is quite clear: 'Post-nominal letters, other than those denoting academic degrees, should be included when they are issued by a country or widely recognizable organization with which the subject has been closely associated. Honors issued by other entities may be mentioned in the article, but generally should be omitted from the lead.' This does not apply to Neeson who is Irish born and bred, lived in Dublin for years where he acted in the world-famous Abbey Theatre and, most importantly, defines himself repeatedly as Irish, not British. His only connection with Britain is the same as John Hume or Gerry Adams, namely continuing British rule over Irish nationalists in Ireland. Under international law, people in Northern Ireland have the right to define themselves as Irish only. This should be respected in this article. As such, this award by Britain should be placed in the article alongside his many other awards from other countries, and indeed from his home country. The OBE should be, to quote wikipedia policy, 'mentioned in the article, but generally should be omitted from the lead'. Captain Fearnought (talk) 14:50, 19 December 2010 (UTC)

He is definitely British as confirmed by the awarding of the OBE. See above. See also [3]. Note the use of "we", "our movie council" and "the government". Eckerslike (talk) 15:05, 19 December 2010 (UTC)

Incorrect on both counts. 1) The OBE is awarded to very many people who aren't British. Similarly, French, US and other awards are often given to people who aren't French, American etc. A person who accepts those awards does not implicitly accept they are of that nationality. That would be silly. 2) If you have evidence of Liam Neeson describing himself as British, you should produce it. Until you do, in line with Wikipedia policy his repeated self-definition as Irish stands. Captain Fearnought (talk) 16:42, 19 December 2010 (UTC)

Agree with (1). The mere acceptance of a British honour does NOT, in itself, mean the recipient is ipso facto British. See List of honorary British knights and dames for many names of non-British people with even higher awards than OBE. -- Jack of Oz ... speak! ... 16:55, 19 December 2010 (UTC)

You are talking about Honorary OBEs. He recieved a full OBE as evidenced by his entry in the London Gazette [4]. Eckerslike (talk) 17:12, 19 December 2010 (UTC)

OK, but I wanted to demolish your theory that OBE automatically = British citizen. It does not. -- Jack of Oz ... speak! ... 17:24, 19 December 2010 (UTC)

No. You assumed that he received an Honourary OBE. I was talking about the full OBE he actually recieved that can only be presented to British citizens. Eckerslike (talk) 17:29, 19 December 2010 (UTC)

If you look at the London Gazette list, you'll find there's no such thing as an honorary OBE/Officer of the British Empire, which is what Neeson received. There is, however, an honorary KBE which is awarded to non-British recipients. You appear to be confusing both. Captain Fearnought (talk) 19:15, 19 December 2010 (UTC)

That is because honourary awards don't get gazetted. You won't find any reference to honourary knighthood either (unless it gets substantiated). Try finding Robert Geldof, Gerard Houllier or William Gates. Eckerslike (talk) 20:44, 19 December 2010 (UTC)

Note, Captain Fearnought is a confirmed sock-master of Dunlavin Green. -- GoodDay (talk) 19:22, 19 December 2010 (UTC)

I have never heard Liam Neeson being referred to as British-always Irish.--Jeanne Boleyn (talk) 19:26, 19 December 2010 (UTC)

Sock or not, the points raised by Captain are correct and I concur with what they said. Mo ainm~Talk 19:34, 19 December 2010 (UTC)

The content is irrelevant to me. GoodDay (talk) 19:37, 19 December 2010 (UTC)

If Liam Neeson objected to being given an OBE he was of course quite free to reject it. He did not, nor has subsequently done so. There is no good reason not to list it after his name. E. Fokker (talk) 20:37, 19 December 2010 (UTC)

Infobox - proposal to change Nationality to Citizenship parameter?

Much has already been chewed over here, and here, but perhaps time the issue was addressed here? RashersTierney (talk) 01:32, 20 August 2011 (UTC)

I'd have no probs with changing it. GoodDay (talk) 13:24, 21 August 2011 (UTC)

Me neither. Mooretwin (talk) 20:36, 21 August 2011 (UTC)

Looks like consensus. Anyone care to comment before implementing? RashersTierney (talk) 19:23, 25 August 2011 (UTC)

Fine. Done. RashersTierney (talk) 23:01, 25 August 2011 (UTC)

Erm, what? How are people supposed to discuss when it is unclear exactly what is being proposed? I object to the addition of the bare "American" citizenship in the infobox, as other than American it is unclear exactly which citizenships he does or does not hold. Since he may have had to give up other citizenships to obtain American citizenships, there is no evidence he holds any citizenship other than American. Equally there is no evidence there is any evidence he has given up any other citizenships. However this is where WP:BURDEN comes into play. Should I wish to add a sentence saying "Neeson gave up his British citizenship when applying for American citizenship" then I would need a source saying precisely that. Equally, those wishing to add that he currently holds British citizenship need to provide a source proving that is the case as of 2011. Since we don't actually know, it's best if we stick to just dealing with it in the article text which isn't potentially misleading. Only listing one citizenship in the infobox when he may hold more than one is potentially misleading, and in fact potentially wrong. However "In August 2009, Neeson stated on ABC's Good Morning America that he had been naturalized as a United States citizen" is not misleading in the slightest, as it presents the same fact in a way which doesn't suggest he is only now a United States citizen. 2 lines of K₃₀₃ 10:15, 27 August 2011 (UTC)

How is it misleading to state his newly acquired citizenship in the infobox, even though it is clearly ref'd in the main text? He may or may not currently hold other 'citizenships', but these would need to be referenced in the usual manner. His acquisition of US citizenship is highly notable as is clear from multiple news reports, and there is no valid reason for its removal against consensus. RashersTierney (talk) 12:35, 27 August 2011 (UTC)

Birthplace

We've got Scotland, UK at Sean Connery, why not Northern Ireland, UK, here? GoodDay (talk) 21:03, 21 August 2011 (UTC)

Probably because there is a critical mass of editors who don't want to recognise that Northern Ireland is in the UK. Mooretwin (talk) 21:52, 21 August 2011 (UTC)

What's the standard usage for these British bio infoboxes? we appear to have inconsistancies. GoodDay (talk) 21:55, 21 August 2011 (UTC)

I think we have a critical mass of editors who want to obliterate from wiki any mention of the fact that there are people from Northern Ireland who consider themselves Irish. --Eamonnca1 ^TALK 23:11, 29 August 2011 (UTC)

Unfortunately this page is infested with Irish nationalists that do not want to acknowledge that Mr. Neeson was born in the UK and is an American national. 76.125.58.198 (talk) 14:45, 23 August 2011 (UTC)

Though I agree with your edit version (i.e. adding United Kingdom), it would be better to avoid edit-warring. GoodDay (talk) 19:18, 23 August 2011 (UTC)

Three things 76.125.58.198 please try to limit you comments to the edits not the editor, your reference to the page being infested is bad faith. Secondly I don't think anyone here is disputed that fact that Northern Ireland is part of the UK it just that to add it to the address is unnecessary (as can be demonstrated at many other NI related articles) and is also overlinking. Thirdly you could be considered to be edit warring at this article as other editor have also reverted your change. I have reverted to the stable version before GoodDay made the addition of the UK. I suggest that you get consensus here first before making any further changes. Bjmullan (talk) 16:35, 25 August 2011 (UTC)

I've re-added United Kingdom & solved the overlinking problem by merely deleting the county. We've got the city, non-sovereign state & sovereign state, which is all that's required. GoodDay (talk) 12:12, 27 August 2011 (UTC)

GD you may think this is a solution, I don't. Get consensus here before making any further additions. Your edit had been reverted. Bjmullan (talk) 22:46, 29 August 2011 (UTC)

He was born in the United Kingdom, I'm quite certain. There's no need for the addition of the county, city, constituent country, country or city, country, sovereign state (however you prefer to describe'em) is fine. GoodDay (talk) 18:23, 30 August 2011 (UTC)

I'm still waiting for an explanation, Bjmullan. What's your opposition to showing United Kingdom? GoodDay (talk) 21:28, 30 August 2011 (UTC)

I think he said it was unnecessary and overlinking. --Eamonnca1 ^TALK 21:56, 30 August 2011 (UTC)

I removed the over-linking problem, by deleting the 'county'. GoodDay (talk) 22:24, 30 August 2011 (UTC)

Unnecessary, overlinking and what makes this article different from the hundreds if not thousands of Northern Ireland related articles which does without having UK at the end? Bjmullan (talk) 07:50, 31 August 2011 (UTC)

The overlinking problem has been solved. You still haven't explained your opposition to using United Kingdom, so I'll have to assume it's a WP:IDONTLIKEIT situation & leave it at that. GoodDay (talk) 10:05, 31 August 2011 (UTC)

GoodDay I couldn't give a flying fuck what you assume. Just keep stirring the pot. Bjmullan (talk) 22:36, 31 August 2011 (UTC)

Stop being a dick, for once. GoodDay (talk) 22:51, 31 August 2011 (UTC)

Unless I'm missing something, there's still no good reason been given for not listing UK in the infobox, only uneccessary cursing. What's the deal-io? JonChapple^Talk 09:22, 1 September 2011 (UTC)

I don't see the issue with his birthplace being listed as Northern Ireland, UK. 76.125.58.198 (talk) 00:14, 1 September 2011 (UTC)

The overlink concerns were answered by me. What's the latest reason behind the continued oppostion to adding United Kingdom? Pull up a chair & wait, like me, though it may take awhile. GoodDay (talk) 00:16, 1 September 2011 (UTC)

I think we should go with this edit. [5] --Eamonnca1 ^TALK 01:26, 1 September 2011 (UTC)

Might be well to remember that pointy edits aren't very convincing and can lead to a block. RashersTierney (talk) 02:20, 1 September 2011 (UTC)

I fail to see why having United Kingdom is such a problem, though. GoodDay (talk) 09:39, 1 September 2011 (UTC)

Eamonnca1 that's a brilliant idea. Wait, also that he evolved over millions of years into the primate he is today, to give a clear indication of his true nationality represented by Ethnicity, seeing as he's not an Irish or British Citizen, what's the harm, and yes I'm religious but also an evolutionist, maybe he'd agree if he was the same? (Bjmullan you clearly have a problem with UK being added, and GD you clearly think it's allot more important than it is, so ergo, boys boys) this discussion is probably the dumbest thing I have ever read on Wikipedia. --Τασουλα (Almira) (talk) 23:54, 14 September 2011 (UTC)

He was born British & that can't be retroactively changed. GoodDay (talk) 14:40, 9 October 2011 (UTC)

Honours/Honors

The "Honours" section was created in this revision on December 8th, 2010. Today a new user 68.106.220.11 (talk · contribs) is insisting that the spelling be changed to "Honors". This change has been reverted by Bongwarrior, Bjmullan, Pointillist (me) and most recently Hot Stop. Do we have a consensus to stick with the "Honours" spelling? - Pointillist (talk) 23:16, 14 September 2011 (UTC)

I don't think there is any other consensus needed, I've been through this kind of bickering before and won on another major entry, my reasoning, and citation of the MOS: Retain standards are quite clear and therefore require that the entry maintain a level of consistency in the spelling. Mr. Neeson has no British origin and therefore the spelling of a minor part of the entry should not be changed to a British English standard. 68.106.220.11 (talk · contribs)

Yet more ridicules edit warring. Maybe we should get ArbCom enforced here? British English is used because he was born in Britain, spent his early life there and such, he would of been taught with British English while at school perhaps?. This edit summary made me giggle, honestly - "Spelling correction to "Honours". This is the English version of Wikipedia, not British English" Durr-hurr I have news, it's also not the American English Wikipedia too! Why don't you go around changing every spelling to American English (Not "English" as you call it) then based on that logic? =.= --Τασουλα (Almira) (talk) 00:04, 15 September 2011 (UTC)

Yea, considering he was born in NI it seems obvious to use British English. Hot Stop talk-contribs 00:21, 15 September 2011 (UTC)

Citizenship issue.

It just says "American" in the info-box which is fine and correct but, does he have any other citizenship? Did he/or does he have Irish Or British citizenship? If so, it should be mentioned alongside American, and yes, British too if he is. I will not tolerate nasty little nationalist editing. --Nutthida (talk) 20:11, 27 November 2011 (UTC)

Citizenship field is usually current citizenship. As a living person, Neeson made a choice to become an American citizen. Technically, this requires renouncing previous alligiances. We put "Irish" in the lead sentence, as specifiled by WP:MOSBIO, because that was his nationality at the time he achieved notability. And it's listed in the infobox as his nationality. But the citizenship field is quite correctly "American", and no additional information is needed, since as a living person, we respect and report his latest citizenship choice. If he abandons the US and becomes a citizen of yet another country, we will then change it, not add to it. Yworo (talk) 20:29, 27 November 2011 (UTC)

Becoming an American citizen doesn't require renowncing any previous citizenship (see Naturalized_citizen_of_the_United_States#Dual_citizenship). It has to be assumed that he remains a British citizen unless there is a reliable source states otherwise. Eckerslike (talk) 21:20, 27 November 2011 (UTC)

You're welcome to provide a source, but typically we don't assume such things. We require a source. Yworo (talk) 02:50, 28 November 2011 (UTC)

It's not an assumption though. Hot Stop talk-contribs 05:25, 28 November 2011 (UTC)

How do you provide a source for something he hasn't done? Articles with the headline "Liam Neeson still British citizen" wouldn't garner much intrest. Eckerslike (talk) 13:40, 28 November 2011 (UTC)

"It's not an assumption though" after "It has to be assumed"? Don't think so! The burden of evidence, particularly in relation to living people, is quite clear. It is up to editors who think Liam Neeson still holds British citizenship to show that is in fact the case, the threshold for inclusion in Wikipedia is verifiability, not truth—whether readers can check that material in Wikipedia has already been published by a reliable source, not whether editors think it is true. 2 lines of K₃₀₃ 14:30, 28 November 2011 (UTC)

Agreed. If "it's an obvious assumption", we don't need to state a thing. The reader already knows it based on the birthplace. But without a source, we simply can't state it. For all we know, Neeson stomped into the British consulate angry over some personal matter, turned in his passport and renounced his citizenship. If neither he nor the consulate saw fit to report this to the news, we'd never know. We can't state as fact that which is not reported in sources. Unless a source specifically reports that he kept his British citizenship or is a dual citizen or some such unambiguous language, we remain silent about it. Yworo (talk) 15:22, 28 November 2011 (UTC)

By your logic how can the article claim anything. He could have stomped into the American consulate an renowned his American citizenship. He could have changed his name and not told anybody. Have you any evidence that he is still a film star and not quit the industry in the last 24 hours? You're making the far larger assumption of fabricating events that could have happened but you have no evidence for. Eckerslike (talk) 15:55, 28 November 2011 (UTC)

WE have sources that say he is an American citizen, we have sources that say what his name is and we have sources that say he is an actor, if you want to say otherwise to any of these claims then you need a source for it. We don't work on assumptions. Mo ainm~Talk 16:09, 28 November 2011 (UTC)

Yup he could of, and we can't report any of those theoretically possible things either. You've just established why we can't claim anything about his British citizenship status. We don't know, and we don't have a source for it. It would be just as made-up as any of the ridiculous examples you just proposed. What you are proposing is doing original research or synthesis based solely on potentially inaccurate knowledge of various countries citizenship rules applied to a living person without specific sources. We can't even use original research in an article about a scientific subject or a deceased person, WP:BLP is quite clear that we can't do it for a living person. If you can provide a source that specifically states the fact without inference or synthesis needed, we can state it. If you don't have a source, we can't. It's that simple. Yworo (talk) 16:13, 28 November 2011 (UTC)

Since we know he got American citizenship, and since we know that you don't need to renounce past citizenship to gain US citizenship, wouldn't the extraordinary claim be that he renounced his British citizenship? Hot Stop talk-contribs 00:11, 2 December 2011 (UTC)

Except we're not wanting to add any content that says he's renounced British citizenship, the onus per WP:BURDEN is on those wishing to claim he still has British citizenship to prove that is indeed the case. 2 lines of K₃₀₃ 11:17, 2 December 2011 (UTC)

And this, my friends, is why I hate the way wikipedia is run at times. A critical mass forms and blocks everything else. How tiresome.Gaius Octavius Princeps (talk) 04:16, 18 December 2011 (UTC)

1972? - 75

You have not mentioned that between 1972 (not sure if that was when he started) and 1975 Liam attended Saint Mary's College in Fenham near Newcastle-upon-Tyne where he studied to be a teacher. I lived next door to him in the houses of residence in "Hilds" corridor" and we spent many an evening drinking Guinness and chatting in his room. The last time I saw him was on an Underground platform in London in June 1975. We had been performing a play by Richard Cooper called "Flowers to the Rebels" in a small theatre in Leicester Square. He had the lead part as Fabio Torres and I was the leader of the rebels. I believe that he was leaving to start work at the Lyric theatre in Dublin. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 86.150.15.182 (talk) 20:56, 4 January 2012 (UTC)