# Talk:2009 flu pandemic/Archive 5

## 92%

A Detroit newspaper claiming that "...92% of the 109 U.S. infections came without travel to affected areas, the U.S. Centers for Disease Control and Prevention reported." [1] I can't find any other source carrying that claim. Is this more media misinterpretation? Rmhermen (talk) 14:54, 4 May 2009 (UTC)

I don't see anyone backing up that number. But I do see this: As of 2,May NYC Health Of all the cases in NYC (then 62), there is only one case not known to be associated with the outbreaks either in Mexico or the St. Francis Preparatory school in Queens. St. Francis had a number of students recently return from Mexico. --PigFlu Oink (talk) 16:50, 4 May 2009 (UTC)
As an added benefit, using neither name saves us from arguing about which name is better. If we get a second notable flu outbreak in 2009, we can figure out how to name them at that time. Cross that bridge when we get to it. Right now, this is the only one, so the title is utterly clear and correct. Jehochman Talk 20:37, 4 May 2009 (UTC)
Why did you move the article? We haven't reached a consensus yet. Pleas do not move articles around without checking the talk page for discussions on the topic.Drew Smith 22:38, 4 May 2009 (UTC)
I think his comment above was misplaced in the discussion page. It was a mistake on his part regarding the indefinite move restriction placed on the page, and was corrected by another admin. Flipper9 (talk) 22:41, 4 May 2009 (UTC)

## "Swine Influenza" or "Swine Flu" (A/H1N1-2009)

The virus was initially DETECTED in Mexico... Not originated in Mexico.

Also this virus is a MUTATION of the euro-asiatic influenza virus already knew years ago and from which Mexico never had cases of infection... i mean the virus scientifically named as "Influenza A virus subtype H1N1", responsible for the 1918 flu pandemic, that killed some 50 million to 100 million people worldwide (A/H1N1-1918).

Now, if you refer to the "swine flu" (A/H1N1-2009) as "mexican flu"... also there are many people who refer to it as "American flu" (refering to USA) or "North American Flu" (refering to the region of North America) or "A/California/2009" or "hog flu" or "pig flu"... so add these too or just refer to it as "swine flu".--. 18:05, 4 May 2009 (UTC) —Preceding unsigned comment added by OyashiroSama (talkcontribs)

## U.K. update

27 are ill in the U.K. now, including victims in Gloucestershire, Merseyside, Dulwich, Redditch and Oxfordshire. [2]!--86.29.246.3 (talk) 19:38, 4 May 2009 (UTC)

## Portuguese update

Another Portuguese bloke has fallen ill now- [3]

Bloke? --PigFlu Oink (talk) 00:26, 6 May 2009 (UTC)

## Guatemala update

The map should be updated for El Salvador and Guatemala.[4] (in Spanish)--Vrysxy ¡Californication! 22:11, 5 May 2009 (UTC)

## video attached

In this video, Dr. Joe Bresee, with CDC's Influenza Division, describes the symptoms of swine flu and warning signs to look for that indicate the need for urgent medical attention.
Wikipedia isn't giving advice. The CDC is. --PigFlu Oink (talk) 02:20, 5 May 2009 (UTC)
the caption reads as it tells the user what to do, advice. --200.106.22.152 (talk) 04:40, 5 May 2009 (UTC)

## Name?

I read the source of the information about "scientific name" of the new flu strain and I really could not search any "California" within this page. Also there were described a "vaccine" from South Hemisphere; and as everybody knows I began in the North Hemisphere. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Hedleypanama (talkcontribs) 03:18, 5 May 2009 (UTC)

## Antibiotic vs. antiviral drugs

My purpose to remove the use of antibiotics for "dual infection" is to reduce confusion and not foment the popular misconception of using abtibiotics to treat viral infections. I am aware that the "dual infection" mentioned in this article implicitly referred to bacterial pneumoniae + flu virus, however, one can not expect a casual reader to know that or to understand that the word pneumoniae could be a pathology or a bacteria, especially without the article explaining this and while the article is focused on a virus. If somebody feels the compelling need to compare treatments of viral pneumonia with a bacterial pneumonia, Fungal pneumonia, Parasitic pneumonia co-infection, please explain so in the apropriate section or article and remark that the use of antibiotics by itself is not effective against any virus, especially the H1N1. Cheers,BatteryIncluded (talk) 06:50, 5 May 2009 (UTC)

## Historical context

I added a section on historical context to talk about the cyclical nature of influenza pandemics and how this has lead to an increased level of alertness on the part of public health officials. It's a little rough but I think its necessary to put this outbreak in context. Please read it and make it better.--Hdstubbs (talk) 16:39, 5 May 2009 (UTC)

## One more Name Change.

Hello,

Just suggesting another name change. As the WHO is now calling the disease by it's Scientific name Influenza A(N1H1) to avoid confusion with pigs, should the title not be change to 2009 Influenza A(H1N1) Outbreak? Thanks!--gordonrox24 (talk) 11:31, 4 May 2009 (UTC)

Read all the past name change proposals. Let me put it simply. When you searched for the article, did you search for Influenza A(N1H1), or swine flu? Most people would search for swine flu, because that is what most people call it. That is how we name articles here. By their common name.Drew Smith 12:05, 4 May 2009 (UTC)
Actually Drew, this is a great idea! <sarcasm> I can't believe no one thought of it before!?!!</sarcasm> I suggest we discuss this ad nauseum.BFritzen (talk) 12:51, 4 May 2009 (UTC)
Please assume good faith, BFritzen. Sarcasm gets us nowhere in this debate. hmwithτ 17:37, 4 May 2009 (UTC)
When you want info on heart attack do you search for heart attack or do you search for Myocardial infarction? We name medical articles by their medical names not by their common name.   Daniel.Cardenas (talk) 14:34, 4 May 2009 (UTC)
Why not move the article to the proper name, and then redirect from the common name to the proper name? It would then allow both the common name to be used for "common-man searches", and would also reflect the official name? Why the resistance and insistence on perpetuating an incorrect name? Flipper9 (talk) 13:15, 4 May 2009 (UTC)

Looking at the prior discussion above there seems now to be a majority support for changing the name. Regarding "common name", there are a lot of exceptions to the "common name" rule. Like neutrality and ambigouity. Following common name should not conflict with other more specific Wikipedia:Naming conventions which are more important. To quote "Except where other accepted Wikipedia naming conventions give a different indication, title an article using the most common name". One example, the article influenza, not "flu". Another very important example which should be a precedent. Influenza A virus subtype H5N1, Transmission and infection of H5N1, and Global spread of H5N1. Not "Bird flu".Ht686rg90 (talk) 13:25, 4 May 2009 (UTC)

An important difference with bird flu is that unlike H5N1, H1N1 is also found as regular seasonal flu, so something like Influenza A virus subtype H1N1 would not be suitable.--Pontificalibus (talk) 13:28, 4 May 2009 (UTC)
In that line of thinking, so is "Swine Flu"...it is a generic category to refer to a group of particular strains of influenza virus. While the common man calls it "Swine Flu" or "Pig Flu", there is little gained by perpetuating the common-man term in an encyclopedia article other than to list those common names that are used and ensure that the proper redirects are in place to ensure the "common man" or anyone else can find the appropriate article. Flipper9 (talk) 13:35, 4 May 2009 (UTC)
I think of it as Wikipedia being "educational", informing the public about what is considered correct about a topic and presenting facts as best that we know them. The WHO wanted the name change because of the slaughter of pigs and the erroneous public perception that pigs and pig meat will give them the flu. Perpetuation of a name that many sources are using seems to be the wrong course. I do agree that there is a lot of confusion, even amongst the "official sources". I wish they'd standardize the name like other virus strains used in flu vaccines, such as "A/Brisbane/59/2007 (H1N1)" (part of the current flu vaccine in N-America), but there is no source that I know of that's come up with such a specific name (if someone could find that, it'd be great). I'd just stick with what the WHO designates it as the official name, and then list and redirect all of the varied common names currently in use or sadly we'll just have to wait until one official name is found. Flipper9 (talk) 13:51, 4 May 2009 (UTC)
Looking at the prior discussion above there seems now to be a majority support for changing the name. The only summary I've seen is in one section that said there were 16 editors in favor of changing the name, and 12 opposed. That's a majority, but not the desired "rough consensus" for a change. And it's not clear that the editors in favor of a name change agree as to what that name change would be.
It would be very helpful if someone wanting a change were to put together a subpage that including links to all the talk page sections (including those archived) where the name change had been discussed), and listed the editors in favor and opposed to such a change. -- John Broughton (♫♫) 14:04, 4 May 2009 (UTC)
Wikipedia isn't a vote. As WP:COMMONNAME is superseded by MOS:MED, it may be prudent to discount any COMMONNAME-based opposition. Sceptre (talk) 14:42, 4 May 2009 (UTC)
You can't just discount any argument you disagree with. At this time, the name used by the preponderance of reliable sources is still swine flu and that should still be the name IMO. Regardless of how you stack-rank naming guidelines, common sense trumps them all. Oren0 (talk) 17:21, 4 May 2009 (UTC)
There is no common sense. "Common sense" is really only used as an argument when people don't have any others left. Sceptre (talk) 22:47, 4 May 2009 (UTC)
Diving through Pubmed and Genebank, they entitle sequences for the various strains sequenced from this viral outbreak, they are using the term "2009 H1N1 influenza outbreak" [5][6]. That's a sourced, official name from those that track the sequences available for testing. Flipper9 (talk) 14:15, 4 May 2009 (UTC)

I don't see the problem. All it would take is a page move and a redirect.--gordonrox24 (talk) 04:58, 6 May 2009 (UTC)

The problem is that not everyone agrees on the correct name for this page. Thus it could just be moved back and forth forever. Besides causing unnecessary confusion, this would break dozens of redirects as double redirects don't work properly. --ThaddeusB (talk) 05:08, 6 May 2009 (UTC)

## North African update

So Tunisia, Algeria and Morocco and Egypt have prepared for the worst and are screening any on coming from Mexico. Egypt has also seen riots over the resent pig culling- [7] / [8] / [9]!

The Egyptian health ministry said on Thursday "That the decision to cull quarter of a million pigs was not a measure against swine flu but a general health measure." "[10]"--86.29.248.49 (talk) 03:50, 6 May 2009 (UTC)

Well of course they say that now. Egyptians never like looking like complete morons. --PigFlu Oink (talk) 03:53, 6 May 2009 (UTC)

I agree, the Egyptians never like looking like complete, hysterical, morons!--86.29.248.49 (talk) 03:57, 6 May 2009 (UTC)

See- [11] [12]--86.25.55.164 (talk) 09:40, 6 May 2009 (UTC)

## Update image

Hi. Please update the image with the following:

Change to red
Change to orange
• Malaysia

Thanks. ~AH1(TCU) 22:44, 3 May 2009 (UTC)

It is a great difference between whole China and China Hong Kong okay? Please stop doing this, it is quite threatening to the zh-wiki users --Ryusakura (talk) 14:25, 4 May 2009 (UTC)
In that case, please at least paint Hong Kong in red. Anyone with a good knowledge of geography and the correct software should be able to do that. ~AH1(TCU) 19:55, 4 May 2009 (UTC)
There's also a difference between the whole of France and a few localised outbreaks, and there's a difference between the whole of the UK and outbreaks in a few towns. Perhaps we should just do dots? Is that what you're suggesting? --79.65.74.154 (talk) 18:54, 5 May 2009 (UTC)
No, but they really are basically different countries. It is a little like making France red when French Guiana has a confirmed case of swine flu. Hong Kong and China are not the same place. Same governments, technically, completely separate societies, passports, and healthcare systems. In tracking an epidemic a case in China means something very different from a case in Hong Kong. --62.69.130.82 (talk) 12:00, 6 May 2009 (UTC)