Talk:Alica Schmidt

This page was proposed for deletion by Joseph2302 (talk · contribs) on 5 July 2021.

A fact from Alica Schmidt appeared on Wikipedia's Main Page in the Did you know column on 5 August 2021 (check views). The text of the entry was as follows:

Did you know... that German runner Alica Schmidt (pictured), who is running in the Women's 4 × 400 metres relay at the 2020 Summer Olympics, has won multiple European junior relay medals? (This was an error: she had at an earlier stage been selected, but did not in fact participate)

A record of the entry may be seen at Wikipedia:Recent additions/2021/August. The nomination discussion and review may be seen at Template:Did you know nominations/Alica Schmidt.

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DYK appearance

Not going anywhere but further down the drain. TBAN hopefully precludes future additions, but to prevent others chiming in on ... anything ... Kingsif (talk) 01:34, 7 August 2021 (UTC)[reply]

The following discussion is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

Completely false. She was not in the German squad for that event; she was a non-competing substitute in the mixed 4x400m which was completed several days earlier. Oh dear. Kevin McE (talk) 13:44, 5 August 2021 (UTC)[reply]

It's what sources said. You've not even added a source for this anyway. Rather than complaining, you could have updated the article days ago or raised it then. Why would it be expected that people would know exactly how team squads change? Joseph2302 (talk) 14:40, 5 August 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Also, this wasn't the wording of the approved hook, so go complain to whoever changed the wording. She was selected, which is what the DYK should have said- that is true even if she is unselected later on. Joseph2302 (talk) 14:45, 5 August 2021 (UTC)[reply]

I didn't see it until it was on the Main Page: is that not the purpose of the Main Page, to bring people's attention to articles? You are evidently far more involved in the DYK process than I am, so why didn't you change or challenge it?

I know she was selected: I rewrote the sentence retaining that part of it which is correct. You then removed what is also true.

"Why would it be expected that people would know exactly how team squads change?" Well the Wiki editors at the linked article knew better than to have Schmidt listed, as did those compiling Germany at the 2020 Summer Olympics, and I am sure that especially on German-focused sports pages or athletics interest presss it was easily found. I found it: why should those who want to put it on the Main Page of Wikipedia in search of maximising attention not be expected to apprise themselves of the facts?

"It's what sources said" Blatantly untrue. The sources said that she had been selected. Anybody with any understanding of sport at all knows that myriad things can happen between selection and an event, but the DYK team did not check whether the truth on 5th August matched the expectation on 7th July.

You are someone involved at DYK, and yet you are having a go at me over the abject failure of the DYK project. I see from your contributions page that you have not addressed the issue with them. How about you shoot the guilty party instead of the messenger? Kevin McE (talk) 15:40, 5 August 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Your proposed hook, replaced at DYK, was materially wrong in stating that she had 'qualified' for the relay. National teams qualify, individuals are selected (and sometimes later deselected). Kevin McE (talk) 15:57, 5 August 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Am I right to concluded that it should have said "was to selected to run" instead of "is running"? ... cause it still "runs" on DYK Germany. --Gerda Arendt (talk) 17:06, 5 August 2021 (UTC)[reply]

That event is over, she didn't run in it (or anything else at the Olympics), so both the verb and the tense are wrong according to what you report (Later edit: Re-reading, I suspect you mean that the story runs, rather than that it uses 'runs'. But I see it is not there now, possibly at your instigation) . I don't read German, and have not researched at what stage the original plan to put her in the Women's 4x400 was changed to her being sub in the mixed 4x400. But the official site of the games only has her as unused in mixed relay. Kevin McE (talk) 17:40, 5 August 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Even later edit: I thought you meant de:Schon gewusst?, I hadn't thought of Portal:Germany having its own DYK. Kevin McE (talk) 21:57, 5 August 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Sorry, I meant "runs" indeed for the Portal German DYK in English, - where I changed to "was selected" which seems to have been true. If you mean that she disappeared from the Main page, that was normal turn-over after 12 hours, - I noticed the whole thing only afterwards. Busy all morning, I added her to the portal only afterwards. --Gerda Arendt (talk) 18:37, 5 August 2021 (UTC)[reply]

ps: I'll remove her on the portal altogether, - too problematic. I wonder if this top and the DYK archive should at least come with an open note that it was wrong. --Gerda Arendt (talk) 18:42, 5 August 2021 (UTC)[reply]

I have added a note to the DYK note on the top. Kevin McE (talk) 21:03, 5 August 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Well the Wiki editors at the linked article knew better than to have Schmidt listed It would have been perfectly reasonable for them to change it here too. Rather than you blaming me for not changing it because I'm away and don't spend my life checking the German Olympic Commitee website. At the time I wrote this article, it was up to date (selected rather than qualified being a side issue). There are millions of editors, any of them could have updated it- stop blaming me personally for this. You could have fixed or raised this yesterday, as could anyone else. Joseph2302 (talk) 19:18, 5 August 2021 (UTC)[reply]

It looks by indenting as if you talked to me, but I didn't blame, - just asked questions. --Gerda Arendt (talk) 20:54, 5 August 2021 (UTC)[reply]

In this case, the DYK process failed due to new information, and that's unfortunate. But I feel like I'm being directly targetted for this, which isn't fair at all. Last I'll say on this, but this was a mistake in the process, rather than any individuals being at fault. Joseph2302 (talk) 19:21, 5 August 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Exactly how wide do you think the overlap is between those editing Olympic event participation pages and those involved in the preparatory stages of, or aware at any given time of the future contents of, DYK. It is the responsibility of those compiling DYK to make sure that it has a standard of accuracy concomitant with its position on the Main Page, not editors of athletics articles.

Quote one, just one phrase, in which I have held you at all responsible for this. And if you can't do that, then retract your accusation, apologise, and grow up. Kevin McE (talk) 20:49, 5 August 2021 (UTC)[reply]

@Joseph2302:: still waiting for you to try to justify your accusation... Kevin McE (talk) 10:01, 6 August 2021 (UTC)[reply]

I have nothing more to say to you on the matter. Joseph2302 (talk) 16:29, 6 August 2021 (UTC)[reply]

And considering this is being discussed at WT:DYK (and apparently many other places too), I don't feel a need to engage here. Joseph2302 (talk) 16:46, 6 August 2021 (UTC)[reply]

If you would rather answer in one of the other talk pages related to this, that is fine. But I hope you do not consider it to be acceptable behaviour to make an accusation (that I am blaming you for this mess) and then neither substantiate nor withdraw it? My own opinion is that to do that is the height of irresponsibility, inconsistency and cowardice. Kevin McE (talk) 18:42, 6 August 2021 (UTC)[reply]

This is at ANI now, and that's the only place I will discuss your conduct towards me. Joseph2302 (talk) 22:38, 6 August 2021 (UTC)[reply]

The discussion above is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.