Talk:Suleiman the Magnificent

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Former featured article Suleiman the Magnificent is a former featured article. Please see the links under Article milestones below for its original nomination page (for older articles, check the nomination archive) and why it was removed.
Main Page trophy This article appeared on Wikipedia's Main Page as Today's featured article on April 8, 2008.
This article has been mentioned by a media organization:
e·h·w·Stock post message.svg To-do:
  • create more detailed infobox
    • fill in any missing details
  • use correct format for citing sources
  • use Template:cite web for online sources
  • provide more print or journal sources
  • re-write/expand cultural achievements
  • re-write/expand relationship with Roxelana
  • More on Ibrahim pasha and his death
  • More on succession
  • More on legacy
  • Privide proper references for the printed sources with ISBNs and all the necessary data

Really worth a GA status? - not really[edit]

Referring to this old but justified comment written by Nedim Ardoğa, in 2013. This article is currently still, some three years after said user placed his remark, in a state that does not merit for its GA status, in my humble opinion. It lacks significant amount of depth and content quality, I have to say. - LouisAragon (talk) 18:46, 9 February 2016 (UTC)

I totally agree with that - this article is a good example of Turkish self-promotion at a time when the supreme ruler of Turkey - Erdogan - is pushing for a Suleiman-like empire. It lacks a critical stance towards the information, it provides. Somebody: Please correct it and lock it. A very good example of why Wikipedia should not be recommended students. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Medievhistories (talkcontribs) 08:45, 22 August 2016 (UTC)

Legacy and Decline[edit]

I'm removing the final paragraph of the "Legacy" section since it's nothing but an encapsulation of old and outdated stereotypes about Ottoman Decline. However it's very well attested that modern historians of the Ottoman Empire do not believe that the empire declined after the the death of Süleyman the Magnificent, and thus that paragraph needed to be removed. Chamboz (talk) 19:00, 10 September 2016 (UTC)

Suleiman's Mother[edit]

Hafsa Sultan wasn't the daughter of a Crimean Khan, this myth apparently originated from an uninformed sixteenth-century European writer but is disproven by archival evidence, as Alan Fisher notes in his essay on Suleiman's early life, which I have cited in the article. Chamboz (talk) 21:47, 14 September 2016 (UTC)

This article relies on some bad sources[edit]

Two sources which are used frequently throughout this article - Kinross' The Ottoman Centuries and Clot's Suleiman the Magnificent, are not reliable. Both of these authors were not professional historians, and even if they had been their books are now very much outdated. All citations of Kinross and Clot should be replaced with citations of modern academic historians, and the information in the article updated accordingly. Chamboz (talk) 00:40, 15 September 2016 (UTC)

Why is this article still an FA?[edit]

Adding to Chamboz's comment above, I think it pertinent to raise an obvious question: why is this still rated as a Featured Article? It achieved that status in 2007, at a time when Wikipedia's standards for promoting articles to FA were a great deal more lax than they are now. Frankly, if I were reviewing this article (in its current state) at GAN, I would probably fail it; it does not easily meet the criteria for a Good Article, let alone a Featured one. There are unreferenced statements throughout, and as Chamboz points out, even some of the sources used may not be ideal. There are multiple problems in the formatting of the citations, and some of the copyright explanations on many of the images could do with some work (with particular reference paid to Turkish copyright law). Perhaps it is time to think about sending this one off for a Featured Article reassessment. Midnightblueowl (talk) 20:16, 25 September 2016 (UTC)

I would contact A. Garnet, the editor who was responsible for originally nominating this as an FA, to see if they could make some improvements, but it seems that they ceased their involvement with Wikipedia in 2009. Midnightblueowl (talk) 20:26, 25 September 2016 (UTC)
I agree. This article has a decent foundation, but needs a lot of work and source verification to really be considered high quality. Chamboz (talk) 20:28, 25 September 2016 (UTC)

New information about Suleiman's wives[edit]

In the following source, on Academia.edu new information about the wives of Suleiman is mentioned. Sultan Suleyman I. und seine Frauen by Salomé Woronzow-Daschkow Retrieverlove (talk) 5:34, 29 November 2016 (UTC)

This is merely unpublished OR. You must stop using this kind of fringe sources on wikipedia and use reliable sources instead, for everyone' sake.--Phso2 (talk) 14:31, 29 November 2016 (UTC)

Harold Lamb[edit]

Despite the cultural significance of Harold Lamb's novels, my understanding is that it is a (good) historical fiction - as it is fiction I don't think it should be used as a source. It seems the unreferenced anecdote about Suleyman being "influenced" by Alexander the Great is also from the novel, so I would like to remove that also. There are much stronger sources for the claim that Suleyman admired Alexander the Great (Royal Historical Society) Seraphimsystem (talk) 09:30, 2 April 2017 (UTC)

External links modified[edit]

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